Are electric cars a meme?

Oil sand is extracted through strip mining dummy.

Stop spreading this information.

cleantechnica.com/2016/05/12/lithium-mining-vs-oil-sands-meme-thorough-response/

Teslas are slightly better for the environment than regular gas cars overall throughout their life time but that doesn't even matter because the top ~15% of cargo ships pollute more carbon than all of the cars in the world combined. Stop giving a shit about the environment in this meaningless way and just buy whatever car you think you would enjoy the most.

misinformation*

where's your study? I think we'd all love to see your source.

In terms of emissions, bikes are actually worse.
If you really cared about the environment, you'd be getting a used vehicle.

So the key is to buy the car that has to travel the least to get to you

the key is to realise that your decision makes no tangible difference at all

There is almost nothing greener then a bike.

a pedal bike or motorcycle?
I may have misread. Motorcycles are actually quite bad.

...

Oh sorry, I didn't know you meant a motorbike, I meant a pedal bike.

Who gives a fuck about being green? When it comes to a car you should consider: Practicality, life expectancy, price

Those are the only three things you should consider when purchasing a car for every day use. Obviously purchasing a leisure vehicle to have fun with will follow different guidelines.

>pretty much the worlds largest copper mine that would have existed anyway without electric cars
>little itty bitty oil site in the middle of nowhere
wow u sure showed me user

Nothing is "green", most of it is just a band-aid at best, or just false advertising to sucker in bleeding hearts who buy shit based on "feels" and how society perceives them.

More people = more consumption of everything

If you were truly green you would not breed and let other breed either. Eugenics is the greenest car.

I havent been near a bicycle in almost a decade. I wonder how much lighter they've gotten.

Or better yet, buy a used car that doesn't consume much fuel. We'd all be better off if everybody bought used 40mpg Corollas. Less new resources spent on building new cars.

I'm Dutch so I'm on one basically every day, and they are pretty light weight and easy to handle.

how common are fancy alloys over there? I see carbon fiber and 'titanium' around my campus occasionally. I want to pick one up and see how heavy they are.

I'm not that into the materials, but in Amsterdam I see a lot of carbon lightweight racebikes.

o good that also means your a cheap cunt with a square head

Motorcycles are worse per litre of fuel but better in almost every other metric. Sportbikes and two strokes excepted (Veeky Forums doesn't know of any other bikes, so...)

That mine was a gold mine In other words, it's been like that already when they started to look for lithium. So in other words, it's recycling the mine as much as the metal.

Or a copper mine. Though there is a Nevada gold mine that is getting re-purposed for lithium.

>assumptions
On weed though.

>Buying a new electric car to go green
>Buying any car to go green

OP, if you're desperate to be an enviro-fag, buy a used car. Literally 100% less environmental waste than any new car whatsoever.

Just like voting

Yeah, those Brexit votes sure did shit

Holy shit you pathetic fucks. Since when did you black dick sucking cucks start caring about the environment. Don't buy a Tesla to save the environment. Buy a Tesla for the amazing torque and plethora of features you'll probably never see in any other car ever made.

as a total car nut who cars not for the enviornment i live in the city so my non car boyfriend can take the train to work you have no idea how much money per year we save we save so much money that i personally own 2 cars here and plan on getting more

Seems like a good idea to clean all that toxic lithium out of the ground. Electric cars is our savior. Oil sands look more like the top pic btw. also a massive cleanup effort.

>using the term """"""""green"""""""" unironically

kys my man

> the top picture is from the Canadian oil sands
> bottom picture is from a recycling plant

> from the ground
Its obtained from water, more specifically wet sand
the biggest lithium " mines " are in bolivia, and theyre tiny as fuck

>describing shit as "giant"
>making it sound worse than it is
Electric car shills gtfo

what the fuck are you trying to say

isnt electricity made mostly by pollution also ?

no, but by far the toyobaru is the biggest meme ever

can you be a bit honest here ?

were that 5.8 is coming from ?

You didn't factor in making a motorcycle though. Don't get me wrong I don't ride to save the environment but if you factor is freight and manufacturing it's a hell of a smaller footprint

The work being done in the oil sands is actually cleaning the area. When people arrived there long ago, oil was seeping out of the earth and was even seeping into the streams.

They stopped that from entering the streams so technically they've made it safer.

It's always been a shithole tho.... Don't tell me that it'll return to being something beautiful because listen up, it was TAR SANDS you know. It will always be tar sands. It's always been shit earth and no animals liked it anyway.

That picture is grossly inaccurate. Bitumen (tar sands) is pit mined.

Yes but the power plants that make the electricity are much more efficient so you're still better off except if you're going off of straight coal which means you'll pollute about the same as if you were just getting 30mpg which still isnt bad.

This

Other than the free ipad for center console and crazy torque, what else does a tesla give me? Impractical doors for a minivan that isnt a minivan?

genuinely unsure here

Can be. Most economic for pure Li is from solution mining brines from salt flats. Can also get Li from the minerals spodumene and lepidolite which are found in similar environment as berylium & rare earth elements.

OP's picture is too big an operation to be Li. Most likely it's either Au or Cu. Electric cars do need a lot of Cu, graphite and rare earths though so not entirely baseless, the picture is fucking stupid though because it makes it so easy to refute the image without actually discussing the total footprint of electric cars. Basically this and at the end of the day this wat

Gold and lithium really don't co-occur

Surface facilities, sure. Actual impact is quite large since it's drawing from the whole aquifer of the lake basin

++++

Mining shill misconception list if you're interested coppernicus.wordpress.com/2016/03/14/correcting-misconceptions-about-mining/

quad and trips of truth

really any playa is a candidate for lithium mining.

**Beware the latest fashion commodity.**

>"Ailing automakers in the United States are pinning their hopes on lithium. One of them is General Motors, which plans to roll out the Volt next year, a car using a lithium-ion ba6ery along with a gas engine. Nissan, Ford and BMW, among other carmakers, have similar projects."

>Where will all the lithium come from? The report continues:

>"The United States Geological Survey says 5.4 million tons of lithium could potentially be extracted in Bolivia, compared with 3 million in Chile, 1.1 million in China and just 410,000 in the United States. Independent geologists
estimate that Bolivia might have even more lithium at Uyuni and its other salt deserts, though high altitudes and the quality of the
reserves could make access to the
mineral difficult."

>The King's Valley Hectorite Clay property in Nevada is a potentially new lithium mine to be developed by Western Lithium Canada Corporation. They said in a January 2009 press release:

>"Western Lithium is working closely with the US Bureau of Land Management and the Nevada Department of Environmental Protection towards the permitting of the King's Valley property for mining and processing of the lithium-bearing clays. The project supports new energy independence policies coming from the new administrator in Washington and the development of energy efficient electric/hybrid cars by domestic and international manufacturers."

>I asked a geologist who is also the head of a junior mining company why he was not going for a lithium mine. He told me that currently (early 2009) lithium is the in-metal, the fad of the day, and that there is already a herd out there stampeding to tie up potential properties, most of which are not rich in lithium. What makes this a tale of caution to the average investor is that at just about the same time as the King's Valley mine permitting was proceeding, there was a spate of reports on the uses of lithium, particularly in green cars, and reports on how little there is in America, and how so much of it is controlled by Latin American dictators. It makes you wonder if this is pure coincidence or the lithium industry churning out news to promote the price of their stock. This is the kind of thing otherwise sober newspapers published:

>"The new Constitution that Mr. Morales managed to get handily passed by voters last month [included a] provision giving Indians control over the natural resources in their territory, strengthening their ability to win concessions from the authorities and private companies, or even block mining projects. ‘The previous imperialist model of exploitation of our natural resources will never be repeated in Bolivia,' said Saúl Villegas, head of a division in Comibol that oversees lithium extraction. 'Maybe there could be the possibility of foreigners accepted as clients.'"

>No doubt if we do move to electric cars, and there is lots of lithium at the King's Valley property in Nevada, the investors will grow rich. But it is hard to predict, so be wary of jumping into fashion and be very careful about all the new lithium deposits that will now pop up like mushrooms. However, it is just as likely that Bolivia will allow mining and so swamp the market, and I would not advise casual investing in Bolivia. Or to raise even more caution, I copy the following from a cynical website—and what they say is generally true of most commodities.

>"Lithium in the earth's crust is not "reserves." It's resources. Reserves are what's known to be mineable. Every last bit of it in the upper crust and oceans is mineable at some price or another. Everything has a price point. People grind up entire kimberlite pipes just to get the occasional diamond. It's not economically extractable except from lithium salts. The word "economically", by its very definition, depends on what price you get for what product and how much it cost you to produce. Reserves are known to be 11m tons. At current prices with current technology. All reserves are relative to a price point. The higher prices rise, the exponentially more becomes economically viable. If you'll buy water in Namibia for a tenth of a penny per gallon, I don't have much I can sell you; it's a desert. But if you'll buy it for a penny per gallon, I can sell you the Atlantic Ocean’s worth thanks to desalination. All resources work this way.

>Extracting lithium from the crust is like saying there's so much water in the ocean that we should desalinate it and grow our crops. You're exactly right! If we were willing to pay ten times as much for our crops, we could do *just that*. If people are willing to pay ten times as much for lithium, they can get it from seawater lithium extraction from reserve circuits in brine extractions with lower lithium concentrations, and from thousands of other sources.

Hold on to your wallet

true but if you compare the environmental "footprint" of a regular car that gets built and driven for 150k miles before being trashed and a hybrid/electric car that needs constant battery changes, has a lot more complicated parts and generally doesnt last as long you will find regular cars come out on top by a wide margin.

And if you REALLY want a green car you get an old used one, fix it up and drive it until it falls apart because that way you only affect the environment by burning gasoline which is almost nothing compared to the environmental damage that building a car creates.

i put $1000 down on a Tesla Model 3
how fucked am I?

>straight up lying
>and then deflecting when someone corrects you

Environmental science major here. Yeah I know it's a meme degree but that's a different story. Green is just a meme buzzword marketing tool used by companies and liberals now to guild people on the buying things are doing certain things in reality we have no idea what a lot of these things really cost the planet because it's so sketchy the definitions of green in eco-friendly are all very vague and have no definitive characteristics it's just a cluster fuck of words that people put together trying to make it sound like they are progressive.

>cynical website

Anyone know?
Market watch or zero hedge?

tarded/10

Misinfo about lithium or not, if tesla/toyota/etc were about the environment instead of luxury they'd be retrofitting honda civics with all the same tech, or at least recycling old cars for raw materials instead of manufacturing them from scratch

But nobody wants to crush their shitbox for a rebate on a tesla. Nobody. It's a luxury item.

And nobody wants to put pressure on actual major polluters, because lobbyists, and because the world relies on them for things like food, electricity, and other goods and services and would lose a lot of time and money replacing them. Meanwhile, the only thing relying on your car is the length of your commute, and the world wouldn't really care if you were forced to ride a bike or take the bus as long as you got to work on time.

>electric vehicles sustaining electric vehicles
Vs.
> oil powered vehicles and oil powered electricity extracting oil to burn and refine

Is it electric vehicle accountable for the state of manufacturing? Clean energy is clean energy, period. The more of it there is the cleaner the earth will be. It's not the electric vehicles fault there isn't much clean energy

Checked

uughh, I sometimes see this pic pop up on plebbook. Talk about misinformation and cherry picking at its finest, and dumb idiots just gobble it up without thinking just two minutes for themselves.

But where do raw materials come from? Do the electric cars spring fully formed from the head of Zeus?

Yes, they're slow and can't compete (just like gm).

Why does the Tesla fall of so hardoff at 0-200kmph and futher on with more torque and more power?

Only 1 gear

Why tho? Wouldn't electric cars also benefit from a transmission? Surely sustaining lower RPM would help the electric rotor's longevity and would be entirely possible, unless it's somethings like the electric SLS where the rotors are mounted directly to the wheels.

Says the guy who has absolutely no idea about modern diesels with urea injection

They're made using unicorn tears, obviously

Not really, electric motors make max torque all the time and don't need to change gearing to prevent it from stalling and to keep it running more efficiently

And realistically not a lot of people are going to be accelerating past 200 km/h