How meme-able are this cars?

Model 3:

It's not out yet, so not much to say, but i will say a few things.

It starts at 35k, which is the base model. I guess the base will be bare bones as fuck,and i predict that getting the model that does the 6 second acceleration and all the bells and whistles will be closer to 40k maybe more.

Same range problems.

Autopilot is still there so it's cool.

Basically it's a model S for people who can't afford a model S. Which is fine, like i said, it's a car that appeals to a niche market so you may like it a lot.

But again, if you want a DD that's good on gas, you'd be better off with another compact car.
If you want a sporty compact, there are better (manual) cars.

Tesla is a car that appeals to the kind of person who likes a tesla. Yes i know that's a shitty statement, hear me out.

Tesla doesn't offer anything in the way of a car that other manufacturers don't, except the acceleration in a midsize.

What it does offer is a name and a promise. Tesla is the only solely electric car manufacturer on the market. It offers a GREEN future (even if it's BS but ignore that). And it backs this up by having a 80 something MPG (a measurement based on American electric production), and a midsize that feels sportier than you'd think. So it appeals to the kind of person that doesn't really care about a car that's reasonable, but don't want a car that's wholly unreasonable. They have 80k or whatever the monthly payment is to blow, and want to stand out driving a tesla. The same kind of person you see driving a new Corvette or mustang or whatever is now also looking at a tesla. Yknow, the middle aged guy who drives more responsibly than a corvette should be driven. That and hipsters who think it's the car of the future and GOOD FOR THE ENVIRONMENT even if it's not.

Decent analysis, tesla is definitely riding on brand name in the same vain apple does. Are their products objectively better? They are worse than a gas car in my opinion, but they are different.

That is all you need to sell a tech product now days, stand out from the crowd with a stylish, low maintenance package. bonus points if you are """saving the polar bears""""

>They are worse than a gas car in my opinion, but they are different.
Just wanna say something on what you said.

They are worst than a gas car for the same price. Or even for anything costing over 50k.

They're WAY better than a Toyota corolla, or any kind of family budged car, but they're really not worth their price.

The only place Tesla shines is pure straight line acceleration, better than any car out there in fact. It can't REALLY do twisty turns, or off road rallies. And it falls behind in about 3 minutes of full power: insideevs.com/expected-tesla-model-s-fails-lap-nurburgring-full-power-video/ same thing happened at Mazda speed way, against a MX5.

Anyway, Tesla's not really a sports car. It's not really a luxury car. It's not anything. It's just a Tesla and it's not something everyone likes.

I REALLY don't wanna say it's bad, but it's not the greatest thing ever. It's totally the apple of car companies, even appeals to the same kind of people, but it doesn't make soft ware to force you to buy a new phone every year so that's a plus.

I'm a whole hearted blue blooded American try hard here. If I could supplement my trucks diesel fuel for Copenhagen spit and dear piss I would. I grew up with the mindset there's no replacement for displacement. So the first time I saw a tesla at work run a low 11 second and take the stripe and tree on an outlaw 10.5 car, I fainted and simultaneously jizzed at the same time. It was weird. I still don't know what happened

Are you some magazine writer? If in that case, it's actually really useless if you type that much in a website where the content gets deleted after a few days and most people are TLDRs.

tldr

>bitches about somebody making quality posts
This is why Veeky Forums is the worst board on Veeky Forums these days

Bro Veeky Forums is FAR from being the worst board

Not to mention charging for software updates/autopilot and then having autopilot literally kill people because safeguards are shit and consumers are dumb.

Ive done my research into these cars a bit but not as much as you i'd also like to add

>Battery life and aging is abysmal
You lose .50% of your 'range' in 5+ years and the remainder in the next 2+ years

So you will have to buy a new battery every couple of years if you hammer on the thing, recharge/discharge cycle it alot.

Then to add insult to injury Telsa and Elon Memesk seem like a horrid company they just feel evil.

They also have zero competition from other EV's and this is bad, there's no innovation or replacement battery tech thats actually viable at this stage either so they have a monopoly on that.

also

>Battery/electical fires are 1000x worse then gas fires
in addition to burning to death at super high temps you also get electrical shocks strong enough to melt you in a crash/battery pack failure

NOPE the vehicle

granted its a great idea but for me its all it will ever be until some serious muscle and innovation finds its way into the EV side of things its a fucking gigantic meme

Also despite their 'green' image ev cars are horrible for the enviroment because of their batteries manufacturing process and disposal

Also not having solar panels built into the car is a huge wasted oppurtunity so you have to use their meme stations instead of trickle charging it

>They also have zero competition from other EV's and this is bad, there's no innovation or replacement battery tech thats actually viable at this stage either so they have a monopoly on that.
Protip: Tesla doesn't make their batteries. You don't know shit. The rest of your post is probably a massive lie too.

They make the best EV on the market.

As a car they are ok, Acura/Infiniti tier.

They don't use Stealerships.

Musk's hubris and drive will bring us cars with neat features. He delayed the Model X release for 18 months to have Falcon Wing Doors and ultrasonic senors that can look through aluminum.

Tesla is making some of their own batteries now.

Will be making the majority of their batteries in the future.

>Not to mention charging for software updates/autopilot and then having autopilot literally kill people because safeguards are shit and consumers are dumb.

Safer than humans if you look at the miles driven and it will continue to improve. Also, you're right, consumers are dumb which is why the only 2 that have died with autopilot weren't paying attention with their hands on the wheel like they agreed to when installing the beta software.

>Ive done my research into these cars a bit but not as much as you i'd also like to add

All you have done is scratch the surface of the basics in a nutshell in a nutshell without even researching to see if your 'facts' are even true or if they are speculated by either people who hate electric vehicles, thus take absolute worse case scenarios and apply it to everything, or outright lie.

>>Battery life and aging is abysmal
You lose .50% of your 'range' in 5+ years and the remainder in the next 2+ years

This just isn't true, where the hell did you get this? A typical model s will still hold about 92% of it's charge after 100,000 miles. greencarreports.com/news/1096801_tesla-model-s-battery-life-how-much-range-loss-for-electric-car-over-time

>So you will have to buy a new battery every couple of years if you hammer on the thing, recharge/discharge cycle it alot.

No, Unless you get ridiculous, in which case you could apply that to any car, it will last you around 10 years which is around 10,000 dollars in gas savings in that time period, which is around what a battery replacement costs.

>They also have zero competition from other EV's and this is bad, there's no innovation or replacement battery tech thats actually viable at this stage either so they have a monopoly on that.

They have competition from ICEs which is why they work so hard at making the best EV on the planet to compete with gas cars that already have a leg up, and the Tesla ends up being just a pretty good 'car' while being a great EV.

>Software problems
To be fair, software problems haven't been that big of an issue. Only 3 autopilot related accidents have happened.There is a safety concern with software entirely controlling a vehicle, like jeeps software hacks, but so far Tesla hasn't had that problem. My concern is Tesla's marketing autopilot as something that you can just let drive the car, unlike say Mercedes systems that still need you to be at the wheel. It's really irresponsible. And yes software has the potential to fuck up big time, especially in a car like a Tesla.

>Battery life
Yes, Tesla loses their battery over time. Thankfully their warranty is really good, and so far has replaced batteries at each of the yearly multi point checks. This is not a sustainable practice, Tesla can currently afford to do this because they are still a small company.

The battery problem can never be solved, it's just an inherent thing with all batteries, save for single use chemical batteries.

>Tesla as a company and Elon
Elon musk is undoubtedly a good business man, i won't say anything about his character because i only have a public impression of him and i don't like it.

There are plenty of things surrounding Tesla, such as hiring out of state and illegal workers for factories, moving key component manufacturing to different countries, but these are just the environment of most large companies now.

The largest claim of unfair business practice, is that Tesla sells cars directly to consumers. This is simply not how every other car company works, in most of the world. Dealerships are traditionally franchises, and there are many complex reasons for this, which have to do with morals, intellectual property, costs, and economic feed back. Tesla simply selling directly to customers, is a bad business practice. Tesla is lucky no one has retaliated.

Continued

>>Battery/electical fires are 1000x worse then gas fires
in addition to burning to death at super high temps you also get electrical shocks strong enough to melt you in a crash/battery pack failure

True, a battery fire is way worse than a gas fire, but you would still feel an incredible amount of pain either way IF you got cought in one. You are around 5 times more likely to have a gas fire than a Tesla fire if you look at the numbers on both sides.

>granted its a great idea but for me its all it will ever be until some serious muscle and innovation finds its way into the EV side of things its a fucking gigantic meme

The roadster was kinda of a meme along with shitty EVs that were bought just because its ''green for the environment'' but the model s is a good car and the model 3 will definitely not be a meme, it can't beat a gas car in range, or beat a car in the same price range in luxury, but over all it's an amazing 4 door family dd. There are plenty of benefits there that are only going to get better but if you hate the flaws it does have, that's completely fine by me, but its definitely not a meme.

>Also despite their 'green' image ev cars are horrible for the enviroment because of their batteries manufacturing process and disposal

Holy shit no. Hippies are definitely deluded in thinking that they are super green and will save the world but they are absolutely slightly better for the environment in comparison to gas if you wanted to get nit picky. The electricity you get from a gas power plant is around 60% efficiency in comparison to an ICE's 20-30% and if you ran on straight, dirty coal, would still be equivalent to around 30mpg which isn't bad.
The battery material creation process is greatly deluded and exaggerated by people all the time. (that dumbass picture of a copper mine being accused as a ''lithium mine'') Please provide some evidence to show that its worse than mining for other things relating to gas cars. As for the disposal

kill yourself, elon

I don't know about other shitty electric car companies, but Tesla recycles their batteries.

>Also not having solar panels built into the car is a huge wasted oppurtunity so you have to use their meme stations instead of trickle charging it

That's a stupid fucking idea. Solar panels can exist in society, but they are way to slow and heavy for what they produce for it to be worth it to install it into your car so you could get some incredibly small amount of charge back while your driving. If they were way more powerful then this might make sense. As for the ''meme'' stations, one, you don't have to use them, you can trickle charge it at home every night before you go to sleep, and they serve a crucial purpose. With superchargers, you can finally actually go on road trips with an EV because the range is decent enough now where you can go for 250 miles and stop for like 40 minutes to get a bite to eat and go to the bathroom.

How come when someone says a Tesla is bad, or just "meh", someone is always there to defend it?

The last part of the post is fucking stupid. It doesn't matter how much others bitch and bitch about someone not ''playing fair'', if a company has found a way to be more efficient and gets a leg up because of it, then good for them and fuck the rest for trying to nerf the free market by outlawing them.

Because 90% of the time is misinformation.

>They also have zero competition from other EV
Not entirely true, they have very little competitions but there's a really good reason for that. Only competition it has is the Nissan leaf, most other electric cars are gas cars modified to use electric. Electric cars are really not wanted by most people, that's why despite now there being a low end option to the Teslas high end, it hasn't sold nearly as well as any gas segment.

Tesla is like, if in some alternative universe electric cars where the norm, (late 19th century btw) and some business man created a Audi S8 to show how great gas cars are. It's not practical for the average person and the people who like it are inclined to like it.

Tesla unless it starts pulling an Apple where they patent round app corners, already has competition as the leaf is outselling anything Tesla, but until electric cars become more viable, they won't have competition in their home turf, which is the sedan segment.

>Safety
Before i go on, the meme that Tesla was so safe it broke a machine, is bullshit. If you've ever changed a coil spring shock in a car, you'd know how dangerous that spring is when compressed. The shear amount of energy stored in there is dangerous as fuck. Same thing with this machine that applies force to a structural part. It has a limit after which it stops working because the energies involved are simply too much.

On that note, Tesla is VERY safe for it's segment. However we won't see how safe it is until they're more than 1% of the US market, and thus have been through more varied situations.

And yes Tesla is not green, over 10 years. Also considering most gas cars (though maybe not newer ones) can be regularly maintained for decades of use, and Tesla need major replacements, they probably aren't significantly better in the longer run either.

What is worst?

Cos it's like Apple, a religion

At least when people shit on apple, they are actually using facts and not spreading dumb bullshit like 90% of Tesla hate. Stating facts about how a model s doesn't hold up in luxury is perfectly fine, its true. What makes people go into autism defense force 2025 is when people shit out incorrect bullshit that spreads misinformation.

>auto pilot
>consumers were acting dumb
What else is new?
Regardless if they agreed to be attentive at all times, the reality is - autopilot disengaging is to avoid liability.
They do this by saying the consumer had direct control, and by forcing consumers to agree with the t's and c's in that you are agreeing to use the feature in a strictly supervisory category.

You think you're gunna take the wheel in the 0.5 seconds before your car gets you blindsighted by a truck?

It's not some stupid moral code thing, it's a very important part of how vehicle sales are handled and in most states it is illegal.

Car manufacturers used to just sell directly, the problem was when a lot of corruption and shady shit was involved when a large company can just directly sell to it's customers.

The law that all dealerships must be franchised, is a measure to prevent shady business practices.

unidroit.org/english/guides/2007franchising/country/usa.pdf

Same reason people get defensive about more specific car brands, because customer loyalty. When you spend a lot of money on a product, you really feel invested in that product.

It's not very cost effective to recycle Lion batteries yet. Most battery recycling involves removing valuables like cobalt and the like from the battery, before tossing the rest away. Maybe this will improve once EVs become more common.

consumerreports.org/cro/news/2013/10/what-happens-to-electric-car-batteries-when-the-car-is-retired/index.htm

>unless you get ridiculous
Driving more than 30 miles in one session is ridiculous ey?
>muh savings! Muh 10,000k I fuel pricing!
And yet, being restricted to 15 miles in one direction, and 15 miles back wouldn't actually use all that much fuel up, would it? If you don't have your ego dildo blaring low power warnings at you in a normal car you would probably use more fuel, right?

>Regardless if they agreed to be attentive at all times, the reality is - autopilot disengaging is to avoid liability.

Absolutely

>They do this by saying the consumer had direct control, and by forcing consumers to agree with the t's and c's in that you are agreeing to use the feature in a strictly supervisory category.

Yeah

>You think you're gunna take the wheel in the 0.5 seconds before your car gets you blindsighted by a truck?

You're supposed to have you hands already on the wheel which takes 0.0 seconds and be alert as if you were driving yourself in which case, if he was aware of his surroundings as if he was driving, he wouldn't have to bare the imperfectness of his developing autopilot, and if his awareness while actually driving was parallel to what he should have been showing on the road with autopilot and it still wasn't good enough to avoid that crash, then he would have been dead either way and we all just have to shrug our shoulders.

>he shills this hard for free

no no no I meant going pedal to the metal every single time you accelerate. Driving distance is perfectly fine, which is why I mentioned the 100,000 mile number.

So you're straining against the autopilot to avoid the truck, having pre-empted it, and are not operating under the impression this self driving car could manage simple traffic, like it's marketed as being able to do

>You are around 5 times more likely to have a gas fire than a Tesla fire if you look at the numbers on both sides.
based on what numbers

>People spreading this much misinformation deluding most that read it.

>Greenland and Iceland.
>Canada

There are about 150,000 car fires per year according to the National Fire Protection Association, or about one vehicle fire for every 20 million miles driven. At the time, this compared to one fire for every 100 million miles driven for Tesla. But this statistic has undoubtedly improved for Tesla since 2013.

They're not perfect. They're having to jumpstart an entire industry. Things'll get better.

But honestly it's a matter of personal preference. What do you value more? Saving money and the environment? Or the quality of certain aspects of the car?

Biggest issue rn is range and lack of charging stations (depending on where you are and where you go). If you only move around a certain city and rarely take long trips outside of it, you'll probably be fine.

Teslas are far safer in a crash compared to non-electric cars.

It's being marketed as being able to manage simple traffic while also being in beta mode which makes it clear that it is always improving and it's not a perfect, autonomous vehicle, which means you have to be completely ready and responsible for the imperfectness of beta. In the truck situation, it was a truck sideways on the street of a small highway which the driver should have saw and either braked immediately to avoid a collision at all, or brake a half second after he realizes his model s isn't braking in which he could still be alive. What he did was let his tesla continue all the way until the top of the car hit the bottom of the truck.

this is some grade-A autism

They can be reliable but Tesla has decided that they need to shoehorn as many useless gimmicks into their cars as possible, like motorized doors, and it's hurting their reliability. Older Model S models care gud tho. Likely the Model 3 won't be so overly complicated so that'll probably be their most reliable model.

Yeah, but at least it's correct.

Has the study adjusted for number of EVs vs Gas cars, cause of fires or age of the vehicles involved?

I have dads friend who's old 1980s suzuki shit box caught fire when a fuel line ruptured or something, but it happened in 2003 when most people weren't driving 1980s shit boxes. But that would be counted into a vehicle fire.

Also that statistic says 1 for 20 million of all gas vehicles, while comparing it to a specific car manufacturer. What is the fire rate among say Ford and Toyota?

I've not read the study myself since you didn't link it.

>Saving the environment
Tesla doesn't help the environment. The emissions needed to make a Tesla plus to run one (with the US electric production mix) A Tesla is Almost as bad for the environment over a span of 10 years as a car of equal price.

And since it's a new company who knows how it does in the really long run.

If you care about the environment, use the mark I legs, and take a bus. Or even a bicycle.

Tesla is marketing as autopilot though, read through the website and you'll find it being explained as though it's an autonomous vehicle. Even the name autopilot implies an autonomous vehicle.

It's a marketing technique obviously, and i don't really fault them for it, but it does harm the consumer who doesn't know better and clicks through the warnings as they upgrade.

Infinitely meme-able. Memes for days yo.

> The largest claim of unfair business practice, is that Tesla sells cars directly to consumers. This is simply not how every other car company works, in most of the world. Dealerships are traditionally franchises, and there are many complex reasons for this, which have to do with morals, intellectual property, costs, and economic feed back. Tesla simply selling directly to customers, is a bad business practice. Tesla is lucky no one has retaliated.

Franchise dealerships are what's killed the dominance of the American auto companies. The franchise dealership model adds *no* value to the car buying process. Franchise dealerships are 100% responsible for the varied service quality within the same brand. Franchise dealerships are protected *by law* in every state in the union.

I would buy direct in a heartbeat, if available.

About the gas fire vs EV fire, here's the link fool.com/investing/general/2016/01/04/tesla-motors-incs-model-s-catches-fire-should-inve.aspx

You make a great point on different brands and old vs new cars so the 5 times more likely number could be lower but my main point to the first guy that made the true statement that a battery fire is worse than a gas fire, is it's much less likely to happen and even more so now because they added a thick under body shield and will always continue to improve.

About the marketing, from what I'm reading on the website about the autopilot update, they mention all of the self driving capabilities it has but also says ''Tesla requires drivers to remain engaged and aware when Autosteer is enabled. Drivers must keep their hands on the steering wheel.'' in the middle of it and the name autopilot was named that based on an air craft's autopilot. The pilot still has to be ready to take over and the plane can't do everything.

The last statement is absolutely true.

It's not about adding value to the car buying process, it's about preventing shady business practices. Cronyism and so on.

It's why you can have the same owner selling different car company brands. It also creates competition within dealerships to provide the best service.

Without dealerships, it would be like Saturn where it was like a fixed price for a car, no negotiation, just pay and leave. That opens a lot of opportunity to sell at an insanely high price and companies working it out between each other to create certain products. Like what's going on right now with the American telecommunication industry, with service providers providing the same shit service while charging the same crazy amounts.

What is wrong with Infiniti? I've never been in one, so I don't understand the hate.

lol at you not even reading the last post. fuck yourself

I do agree that a battery is less likely to burn than gasoline, but a battery burning is generally more dangerous. Especially something like Lithium Ion but i am impressed Tesla battery didn't explode when it burned.

Anyway, we won't REALLY know how good Tesla is compared to normal gasoline cars, until it's at least 10 years old and it starts falling into the hands of people who didn't pay for it. See how safe it is in the hands of someone who has a lead foot, and the battery heats up.

Currently people who own a Tesla aren't willing to push it to the limit, they're usually driven by middle aged men mostly safely. They're also still mostly under warranty, in fact they're no longer under warranty this year if you bought your model S in 2012.

>Autopilot
The thing is, people are gonna read the marketing stuff and not pay any real attention to the 'Tesla requires drivers to remain engaged' part. It's going to be the same as the warning on drift mode ford has on the Focus RS to not turn it on at improper times. But who doesn't drift in their RS whenever they can?

It's like the Horsepower wars of the 60s and such, put more power in that V8, it doesn't matter if the guy behind the wheel can actually handle it or not.

Again i don't blame Tesla for it, i don't even really think the autopilot issue should be brought up at the level to say Tesla doesn't have enough warnings. It's just a side issue of should there be more legal measurements on a car company for new beta features?

It's kinda a meme, but it's also kinda true.

Long story short, Infinity is a 'Luxury car company' who wants to be a company, but is supposed to be putting president on volume sales. It's a company with no identity, and not very high sales, as such it's components are becoming noticeably cheaper with a whole slew of problems in recent years.

Nissan almost shut down Infinity, but they have a quota to fill in 2017 to see if they're worth keeping around.

Or, it would be like tesla. Pretty good service.

Dealerships do nothing other than drive up costs to the consumer-- dealer has to make a profit right? Where do you think that profit comes from fanboy?

Richest people in town are usually the family the owns the dealerships...

/v/

Service varies dealership by dealership.

And you're actually retarded, they'res a reason these franchise laws exist, they prevent shady business.

And yes, dealerships do have to make a profit they're businesses after all. But great thing about dealerships is that prices can be haggled, especially if you visit multiple dealers. But haggling is a skill a lot of people don't have, so they have no choice but to get taken advantage of by a business.

Tesla would have franchised dealerships too, problem was that it was too risky of a business and no one wanted to take that. That's why Tesla has manufacturer owned retail stores instead.

>Fanboy
You use that word, you don't know what it means.

Yeah, I didn't read that last sentence and still it's a useless thing to do.

They're botnet

Buy a leaf

>Be glad you have no freedom, it means no shady dealerships, and no rip offs
>This is a better solution than actual consumer protection laws

You want to make a meme about a good car brand? I don't see anything to make fun of.

A

FUCKING

>Consumer protection law already in place
>NO I DON'T WANT ANOTHER PERSON MAKING MONEY!!! EVEN IF IT MEANS THE CONSUMER IS BETTER PROTECTED!

They're the safest cahs......................IN THE WURLD.

LEAF

>CRAZY range loss in Canadian winter, up to 60% in Ontario. Reports of 80% loss from Greenland and Iceland.

>Owning an electric car in countries that receive white bullshit all the time.

This is one of the best discussions Veeky Forums has ever had in a while. I thought id deserved a screenshot. I hope I covered the most important parts.

If you feel like editing, here's the PNG copy.

also the fact that it's upgrade are literally "on-disc-dlc". there is no additional components that need to be installed, like turbos, etc. if you upgrade to the better performance package you just get a download key that unlocks that feature on the car.

i was driving a Tesla Model S (the one with a little under 400 HP and rear wheel drive) for around 3 months, 70 hours a week.

ask me stuff if youre intrested

well, tell us about it. compared to comparable gas cars, howd you find the touchscreen console, etc. what are your impressions on it compared to a similar normal car?

it was pretty nice to be honest.
i hear so much shit about
>"but the interior is shit isnt it"
but thats straight up a lie. the interior is fine. the display is maybe a little annoying at first, but if you turn down the brightness its really not a problem and after a bit you dont even notice it anymore. and i drove the nightshift, so its also really alright at night. the navigational system is amazing, so are all functions of the bordcomputer. after an update we even had spotify in the car which was just amazing, i love that.

regarding handling and comfort, its a sports car, the suspension is stiff and some customers bitched about it a little, especially on shittier roads, but fuck'em. handling was amazing imo, and i really drove kinda fast. nearly deja vued into a bus once, kek

the traction control is very liberal, but what annoyed me is that if you switch it off, the time between turning tires and not-turning tires anymore after you let go of the pedal is too long. it takes a while for the drivetrain to lose momentum after you let go.

there was an update once and it fucked our bordcomputer, kept crashing and such which sucked because no navigational system. we fixed that by resetting the car.

>there was an update once and it fucked our bordcomputer, kept crashing and such which sucked because no navigational system. we fixed that by resetting the car.

thats something that i just cant reconcile. i dont want to deal with the same kinds of problems my PC deals with, but on the road at 30MPH

I guess its just a personal preference thing, but ive been very against the computerization of cars in general.

Something like an electronic parking brake that is just a little switch or button just feels unnecessary. I guess thats why i always had a softspot for 80's/90's 'digital" stuff on cars. because a digital speedo is really still just an analong speedo, but with a digital readout.

if theres one thing i do really like about the model S, it's the styling. you can argue till the cows come home on the business, the performance, and all that shit under the hood, but as far as exterior styling goes, it does look quite nice. surprisingly simple and sleek, not too many unnecessary lines or overly angry headlights.

and i do like what they did with the door handles. it seems like something that can and probably will go wrong , but at least stylistically, the flush handles when retracted look nice

the bordcomputer im talking about is in no way connected to the driving aids and the driveability of the car in general.
you can easily restart the whole thing while driving by pressing two buttons on the wheel.

>I guess its just a personal preference thing, but ive been very against the computerization of cars in general.
me too

the handles are fine, but the outer driver side handle of one of our cars died after i think 180k kilometers. it was warranty though.

Well, you're paying 100% for the battery. Exterior is plastic, interior is subaru quality garbage. The suspension is weak and ball joints are constantly breaking if you hit a pothole. One person even went down a gravel road and had his wheel fall off. Touch screen is gimmicky, and the steering wheel leather is just as good as a $20,000 car. It's fast, definitely, and it handles corners well, but that's only for about 150 miles unless you baby it you can get the full 250 miles. Then it has to recharge for a few hours so it's basically useless for a long trip. It's for driving around close to home either to and from work or sometimes going to a close mountain road and then realizing that the car just isn't fun to drive except for in straight lines. Letting your foot off the accelerator (idk what to call it since it's not throttle) the car just engine brakes super hard and doesn't coast in the slightest. There may be a setting to change that, but the way it's setup is stupid. Oh, door handles also freeze over in the winter and either don't work, internals break, or they shoot ice at your face at pretty high velocity.

As of now, it's a meme car. I heard one guy who owned a tesla say "Teslas are powered by the intelligence of their owners!"

If you don't do an LS3 engine swap on your Tesla, you're not a real man.

insideevs.com/tesla-model-s-fitted-chevrolet-ls3-v8-engine/

That's scum bag as fuck, that's like a DLC that's on disk but you have to pay to unlock. What's that game company that did exactly that?

>but thats straight up a lie. the interior is fine
You've clearly never sat in a real luxury car then.

It's not a bad interior, it's just not an interior one would expect on a 80 thousand dollar car.

>its a sports car
You've clearly never driven a sports car before either. Its suspension isn't all that stiff it's the low down weight placement that makes it feel that way. It's not at all a sports car.

tons of them user