>Current Cup: implyingrigged.info/wiki/2016_Veeky Forums_Autumn_Babby_Cup Qualifiers Date: October 7th Autumn Dates: October 28–30; November 4–6, 12–13
>Previously: Autumn Logo Poll up: goo dot gl/forms/f9nmwHPcBbBpFtIf1 Otherwise the usual bullshit
Reminder to always treat the Keksandra fairly when you rig /s4s/ by dosing her.
Facefuck carefully
Kayden Lewis
>you will never felch straight bourbon out of your 4CC waifu's purple asshole Why live
Jordan Ward
I don't think you can completely dismiss it either. If all the teams run insane shit then it should really balance out somewhat.
Besides the point was never to make it an 'impulsive' decision. That's why the test cups are needed/being run in the first place.
Ryder Gray
>155798941
Why indeed, you should probably kill yourself
Chase Miller
That was uncalled for I'm alone and could really use a (You) right now
Owen Brown
>155799802
Starve
Owen Collins
>page 8
Kayden Rodriguez
>Let's ignore the glaring problem that is gold medal vs retarded GK and stupid defence >Let's leave golds as they are, because of some shit called >Gold Playstyle, even when said "playstyle" enables PES16 retardation even further >Let's buff GK instead! +3 to every stat! That's how they are meant to be. >That did fuck all, why are people yelling at us? It's Pes fault! Pes is retarded! Not us and our conservative judgement. I mean, older versions of pes worked fine with 99 gold, so we need to keep it that way and ignore everything. Traditions, son!
That's you, /rules/ That's the impression I got.
Jackson Baker
It's not an impression, it's literally rules and "muh gold playstyle!"
Grayson Martin
>That's the impression I got.
That's what they actually are, they cry about "muh retarded Moeshit formations" but their own testing did FUCK ALL
"Muh serious testing" that was supposed to reduce the amount of goals managed to fucking increase it from Spring
Cameron Kelly
t
Jacob Lee
Okay, then show us the Moeshit tournament run on current settings as well as with compressed stats, so we can assess how much difference new stats made.
Adam Sullivan
But I'm not saying anything about a total stat compression. I'm talking about nerfing golds, who are the captains of pes16 retard-cruise. Leave non medals as 77, maybe adjust silvers to fit newly nerfed golds or maybe not. Just please kill the abusive demigods who play by their own rules.
Ian Johnson
There is absolutely no evidence that Moeshit teams are babby-tier or anything other than invitational garbage tier.
Everyone was told "We need evidence of these settings using real teams", but nobody was willing to actually play tests out with them. You can goof off with your meme teams or you can generate real results to compare to. You can't have both.
Kevin Morales
I feel like the most >fun suggestion for a new ruleset would be something like: Make every player a base 77 as it is now. Give the teams 100 points (or any amount) to spread across the players as they wish, with maybe some bracket restrictions like height has now. Suddenly, way more tactical options! Maybe you will even see some better defending?!
But that's probably too much freedom :^)
Luis Reyes
I'll facefuck her as hard as I want. Her throat is tight as fuck
Kevin Adams
This kills the subs
Robert Gray
Sometimes I want these radical changes /4ccg/ constantly and desperately whines about wanting to actually be implemented so when the exact same stupid bullshit happens they'll feel fucking stupid and shut up for once
But then I remember that it doesn't matter because everyone will just keep bitching and blame everybody else
Caleb Stewart
We'll figure something out
Jack Evans
It's almost like /4ccg/ doesn't actually care about making any changes, they just want to make noise and complain.
If each person that whined set up half a dozen tests on a proposed new ruleset, we'd have hundreds of games to make a go/nogo decision against.
Joshua Garcia
Thats out because in order to be valid by 4ccg standards it has to be streamed, all settings shown, #toplad approved, tits or gtfo, and a valid credit card.
Luke Cooper
>implying there's much difference between cup teams and invitational teams, if at all
/kanker/ was a serious invitational team, /p/ was a meme cup team, dismissing Moeshit as "meme" is running away from the fact that golds are the root of the problem and that nerfing them are required to bring SOME sanity back to PES 16
Because buffing the GK by 3 completely crashed and burned
Michael Nelson
Or none of those, considering the /rules/ tests weren't streamed and /merit/ still took those. They did include images of test results and collected stats (Which /4ccg/ literally accused of being photoshopped because they're insanely paranoid).
Or maybe the problem is that nobody here has actually ever run any tests, or they tried to pass off a gut feeling as evidence?
Cooper Gray
>that many people putting in any more effort than is needed to make below average quality posts on /4ccg/ Putting too much faith in this general
Daniel Edwards
So where are the comparison tests using regular 4CC teams? Considering that's what Lear/Boris said was going to be required to make a decision all the way back before Spring?
Tyler Gonzalez
Sou sait fuck it and gave up on doing those
Josiah Davis
Cool. What about all of the other people that wanted rules to be changed? The shitposters here? Myuer, who was so happy to take credit for wanting things changed but didn't actually do anything to make it happen?
Robert Brooks
Here are the facts:
Spring and Summer: 5 goals per match Moeshit: 3>5 goals per match
Now their interpretation:
Given the variety of formation in both the cups and Moeshit, the difference most likely can't be attributed to the formations, but the stats. This theory is supported by all available evidence (namely recorded footage and stats of both Cups)
I will also add this: the way /rules/ tested is objectively terrible and they should kill themselves if they think of doing another rule change the same way
Bentley Bennett
>the way /rules/ tested
Oh? Tell me about that in more detail.
Levi Murphy
I don't know, I only know the result: a complete failure to achieve what was attempted
As such, whatever MO used should be binned
Thomas Green
>The way they tested was terrible >Because they didn't get the results I wanted
>Moeshit rules are good and should be used >Because I said so
I don't throw this out often, but kys my friend.
Isaac Martin
>kys my friend. I don't throw this out often, but you should consider suicide, friend.
Matthew Bell
>The way they tested was terrible >Because they didn't get the results I wanted
No, because they didn't get the results THEY wanted themselves
If /rules/ was looking to fuck with PES even more then it would be a resounding success, but it wasn't the case
Wyatt Nelson
whut why my house?
Julian Torres
Remove Australian-tans from the Cup
Aaron Fisher
I now remember the post by someone from /rules/ mentioning that they ignored "pes goals", like throughballs and gold curlers, or something along those lines, when getting the results. I'm sure it is somewhere in archives
Grayson Campbell
You've already made it clear that you don't know anything about their testing, so I'm not sure why I bothered engaging you.
It'll take more than that to kill me I can survive on nothing but magic Helpfully supplied by my waifu via my urethra
Ian Evans
Tell me more about your "I didn't get what I want, so /rules/ must be dumb" argument, though. I think you need coffee :)
Joshua Evans
That is not exactly it, that wasn't a post by Lear.
But: >but it made the games worse to watch
Really? Who judged that? Where are the streams?
Talk about arbitrary
Logan Collins
What I said, was "/rules/ failed spectacularly at what they tried to achieve, so they should trash their MO forever"
Jordan Bennett
Not to sound like MIDF but Myuer never actually claimed he was able to either stream or test extensively in his spare time. Also you're twisting things to fit your narrative; Myuer stated several times that he gave up trying to change things simply because /rules/ were too conservative and dismissive of actual changes that he thought it was worth fighting for.
Call him a quitter if you want, but don't glorify what /rules/ did, because it was basically fucking nothing.
Matthew Morales
At least they did something, and have evidence to show that they did. It's more than you or /4ccg/ can say.
Lucas Edwards
you are loved
Justin Morgan
You see, you design an experiment or a series of tests in order to either validate or refute a hypothesis you have. Hypothesis was that general quality of matches can be improved by introducing some meaningful changes in the rules or format. There were several ideas of doing that, yet none of them provided positive results, and none was left hanging or unchecked. Negative results that do not fit your hypothesis are legit results too, and you have to take them into account. If you want to be taken seriously, you don't bend reality to make it fit to your theory. That's what creationists do.
Camden Wright
What I'm calling him is a hypocrite. He was VERY quick to pop in here when people were assuming nice things of him, to take credit for it. But when it came time to do anything, to put his evidence where his mouth was, he was conveniently busy.
Not that i'm saying anything nice about /rules/ here - I'm looking through the list of people that were there, and it really looks like a group for one person to recommend changes and the rest of them to rubber stamp them.
Blake Martin
>they did something,
They fucked up and need to admit their methodology is not adapted to how the the cup works
Adam Phillips
Again, you and I are just going to end up agreeing to disagree here. I say "This group of volunteers tried to make the cup better, but may have been flawed in that a lot of them were just there to validate their own hypothesis (that PES 16 is inherently broken).
You're saying "Nuh uh they sucked".
Justin Jenkins
>research based on a scientific method failed to produce a cure for cancer before 2000, thus it should be trashed forever this is how stupid you sound like. Actually even worse, as you have not a slightest idea on how were those tests conducted (and it wasn't a classified info or something, you could have, and still can, ask anyone involved for validation), yet you whine and moan about them.
Thomas Lee
>You see, you design >you design
This right there is the original failing: /rules/ are not terrible managers thinking like not terrible managers, so their experiment are not representative of how a cup runs
The closed council idea needs to go, you need various people, both good and terrible, doing things on their own, because that's how a cup actually works out
What you did was more akin to internal council testing
Sebastian Taylor
Because there's a massive difference in time and involvement necessary. Come on, don't act like posting once or twice in /4ccg/ is even near as time consuming as running an entire test cup. You might spend all your time here, but that doesn't mean everybody else does :^)
Jackson Robinson
are you sure we are on the same plane of reality right now? Because on mine, /rules/ was group as open as possible, accepting absolutely anyone who approached Lear and said "I'm ready to waste several hours of my life on testing changes". >you need various people, both good and terrible, doing things on their own In other way, everyone tests what he wants, however he wants and presents results in whatever way he wants? Now that would turn into a clusterfuck of dozen people pushing for dozen ideas while shouting at each other for sure.
Here is how it worked. Reasonable idea that sounded good on paper (i.e. stat compression, boosting defense prowess on all players etc.) was put on table. Then, at least a few people tested it on their own machines (because we all know how PES can act wildly different depending on PC, just look at Cups streamed by Boris and streamed by Sou for example), but using exact same set of teams and specified amount of games. Then everyone talked about both raw data and subjective observations before moving to another idea. This method is as simple and trustworthy (limiting your controlled variables, focusing on single suspect variable) as possible.
Xavier Foster
>In other way, everyone tests what he wants, however he wants and presents results in whatever way he wants?
I mean in a single cup, with one set of settings, so various people experiment things on their own
Carson Taylor
The Veeky Forums banner submissions are this week.
Noah James
Make one for 4ccg
Samuel Cox
>Moeshit: 3>5 goals per match You need to disprove the null hypothesis for this to mean anything. I maintain that if Moeshit were run under current 4cc rules, it would still have 3-4 goals per match. Unless you can show otherwise, this "test" was meaningless.