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Here are the proposed rules according to the EUHVA (European Union Historic Vehicle Agency) - the world's foremost governing body on Historic Vehicles. They are not yet final. The final guidelines are expected to be announced at the end of the month.
This series of rules are expected to be coming into effect in all EU states by 2020, intended to curb the use of inefficient high emission vehicles that do not meat EURO III standards. Vehicles not meeting EUR III standards will not only see a major increase in taxes, but also limitations to where and when they can be used.
A concession will be made for Historic Vehicles that meet the guidelines below.
If your car fails to meet these simple guidelines, it is NOT a Classic or Vintage, and not worthy of preservation for Historic purposes.
- Must be 35 years or older. - Exterior must be in well cared for and in good condition, with no rust, dents or faded paint - Interior must be well cared for and in good condition, with no cracks in the dashboard, or tears in the upholstery. - The chassis and suspension system must be to factory specification. - Paint color must be one that was a factory color, or close. - Paint must be the same level of "Gloss" as factory. - Interior must be within factory specification. - The engine must be a period factory option.
Continued in part 2
Ethan Reyes
Allowances: - Aftermarket wheels are allowed, as long as they are period appropriate. - Modern aftermarket tires are allowed. - "Off-road" tires are allowed as long as suspension remains within factory specification. - Period modifications are allowed, as long as the vehicle can easily be returned to factory specification. - Non numbers matching chassis/body and engine. - Engine from a different trim level, as long as it is of the same period, and a factory option. - Engine may be of a different make, as long as the same type. - LPG conversion, as long as factory or period Carburetor or Fuel Injection system is used - Engine modifications are allowed, as long as the originality of the Vehicle is preserved. - Restored Vehicles are allowed as long as the restoration is to an adequate standard. - Engines from a different make are allowed, as long as the type of engine was a factory offering. - Water based 2K paint instead of Poly based 2K - Catalyst/Self curing Acrylic or 2K Polyurethane paint instead of self curing Oil based as long as the same stage of finish is used. - Paint that was applied using a "Bristle brush" from the factory, may be repainted using a "Spray system". - Automotive club badging is allowed, as long as the can easily removed.
continued in part 3
Benjamin Bell
Instant disqualifications: - Single stage paint when factory was 2 stage - Paint applied using a "Roller brush" when the factory paint application was done using a "Spray system" - Metallic, Flake, Matte, Candy or similar paints that were never a factory option - Any out of period modification, including audio systems - Speaker holes in door cards. - Aftermarket seat covers - Rust of any kind - Poor condition of paint - Poor condition of body - Engine that is out of period - Engine that is not a factory option - Diesel conversions - Leaf to Coil spring conversions, unless a factory option. - Air bag or Hydraulic suspensions, unless a factory option. - Lowered suspension - Modifications to chassis and body - Conversions from station wagon to pickup, and similar extreme conversion, even if factory offered a pickup version. - Modifications that alter the manufacturer's intended use of the vehicle - "Facelift" conversions - Large out of period wheels - Stickers on body, or window tint film
Elijah Johnson
>Aftermarket Seatcovers >Stickers on body, or window tint film
Ok, these two seem pretty ridicolous t b h
>Rust of any kind Show me one 35+ year old car without ANY rust
Brandon Harris
Put the EU into a gas chamber, that's all.
Joseph Roberts
WHY IS Veeky Forums ALWAYS RIGHT.
There have been tons of threads about how old cars will get kicked from the streets by making them too expensive to run but many just said "bullshit" and didn't want to believe it. Fuck this gay earth, seriously
Zachary James
By the way there are no useable Google results on EUHVA or a European Union Historic Vehicle Agency, so OP is likely just pulling this out of his ass.
Blake Gray
>curb the use of inefficient high emission vehicles
It's just mindblowing how lefties still don't want to get that driving a 20 years old car with a 2l inline 4 that only needs like 8l or less for 100km is several times more eco-friendly than buying BRAND NEW ECO CARS EVERY 5 YEARS.
It's not fucking rocket science, fucking dammit.
Colton Turner
Pretty much this
Eli Wilson
but it's still beliveable sadly
For example in germany, you can register your car as a historic one when it's more than 30 years old but it's somewhat heavily restricted. And some of these restrictions actually match the ones from OP (especially the restrictions when it comes to the engine).
Adding to that the whole thing of Paris banning cars made before 1997 makes it even more believable
>inb4 there will be even more extreme restrictions than what OP came up with
Colton Rodriguez
Unlike the strict overall inspection requirements I fully support the limitation on H plate registrations in Germany.
Why should you have a claim on a lower flat tax rate if your car can't be considered a piece of motorhistorical value and is just a hacked up old car or in bad condition?
If your old car is hacked up you can still register it normally, you'll just likely have to pay more taxes for it.
As a matter of fact there's a second type of plate for historic vehicles in Germany called the 07 plate where it'll never see an inspection again and you can hack it up as much as you want, but you can only take it on test drives, maintenance drives and to meets anymore.
If you can't find a registration type between normal plates, H plates and 07 plates to suit you, you can't be helped.
Isaiah Gutierrez
>tfw your car would actually pass all of these because you're an enthusiast and not a broke kid
Easton Perry
There is no such a thing as EUHVA. But these rules do seem eerily leftytard, what EU would like to do, maybe in some directive. - Any out of period modification, including audio systems This is the stupidest thing I have heard. If you do it correctly it will look totally ok. >- Stickers on body, Stupid to be honest, if the car was a rally car shouldn't you be allowed to keep original rally stickers? >Aftermarket seat covers This is stupid. You use aftermarket seat covers to protect original seats of the car in original condition, besides most aftermarket seat covers are removable so what's the issue
Cooper Peterson
The problem is these rules affect far more than rust buckets and hacked up turk mobiles. According to these guide rules, cars must be almost show quality.
Unrestored vehichles (pic related) that are original and well maintained, but not perfect would likely get sent to the crusher or taken off the road and left to rot.
If these vehicles are worth preserving why not preserve them in their original unrestored state.
Nolan Howard
Too bad you guys don't live in the US. It varies state by state but the policies usually look like this.
>Vehicle is 25 years old >Vehicle is registered and insured >Vehicle exists
Then you get a vintage place and tell emissions to fuck off because you feel like your 70's era 454 (7.4L) powers your 3,000lb pickup just fine.
Carter Phillips
By the current rules H plate cars are damn well allowed to have adequate patina for their age.
Adrian Anderson
And I don't mean those forced rotrods either.
I'm taking about genuine oldtimers that have not had their originality ruined by restoration.
If this is really about preservation, why not preserve cars in their original state. In this case, restoration would actually lessen its historical value.
Also, some cars its almost impossible or not economical to find certain spare parts for.
And some cars, especially English ones came with badly designed parts from factory. Is it ok to use substitutes?
>engines must be original or same type
How same is same? If a factory switched the engine in their Whatever mk II from 3 main bearings to 5 main bearings in 1970, can you use a 5 bearing engine in your 1967 Whatever mkII that originally came with the 3 bearing crank?
>no facelifts How about a 1970 grill in your 73 Challenger? Or maybe vice versa since 1970 grills cost so much.
I think a lot of these guidlines are lacking in detail and will have to be "clarified" ie: made worse.
Angel Williams
IM SO SORRY EUROPE
HURRY UP AND MOVE HERE TO AMERICA
WE WOULD NEVER IMPOSE DRACONIAN CAR LAWS LIKE THAT
Jonathan Wood
I know, but these rules will change that even for current H cars. Or maybe a new category will be added but I don't see what that will actually achieve.
Right now they are extremely vague in what is acceptable, but highly specific in what is excluded.
The brush painted one is pretty specific and outright bizarre.
Also club badges are allowed but stickers are not. Can the badge be a sticker?
If the car is from the 80's then club badges like pic related are put of period. Stickers are more period correct.
I guess this was done to avoid people with animu stickers turks with arabic inscriptions on their bmw windshields and I don't really disagree with that.
There needs to be an allowance for period rally or racing inspired replicas too.
Alexander Kelly
Of course, since banning imports for 25 years is totally sensible and pro consumer.
Isaac Phillips
These rules are made up and there's no credible source for them. Just ignore the OP post altogether.
Aiden Parker
>If this is really about preservation, why not preserve cars in their original state. >Also, some cars its almost impossible or not economical to find certain spare parts for.
sometimes if something is working badly but still working its best to leave it like that there is a high risk of breaking parts just to gain a temporarily better condition unless ofc you have so much money what you end up with is a space frame with modern running gear but covered with antique body panels
>If a factory switched the engine in their Whatever mk II from 3 main bearings to 5 main bearings in 1970 like putting an a+ engine from an Austin Metro into a Morris Mini-Minor or is that a brige to far ?
Ryder Edwards
>like putting an a+ engine from an Austin Metro into a Morris Mini-Minor or is that a brige to far ?
Pretty much.
But I was actually thinking of when Land Rover upgraded the 3 Series from 3 to 5 bearings in 1980.
Then things like the Kent X-flow from the Escort or Capri in an Anglia or MkI Cortina. The difference between the Anglia/Cortina is not too drastic. They are still the same series and period.
This was an extremely common swap back in the day and I bet a lot of these swaps were actually done over 35 years ago.
And Transits aa well. That old 2.4 diesel that required 4 big batteries and half a can of starter fluid to get running on cold mornings. 98% of those motors those have been sold for sceap value and replaced by the 2.5di from the newer Transits. Supposedly they are the same series of engine too.
Or the old sidevalve motors that used gravity or whatever the fuck to circulate water trough the system. Can you put a slightly more modern but same series motor with a waterpump on those cars?
How about 6v cars that were converted to 12v?
How about old bog roll oil filters? Are conversions to modern filters allowed.
Is adding electronic ignition not allowed aswell?
This is getting more fucked up the longer I think about it.
Brayden Miller
well some cars and engines just don't have any staying power like the fiat uno 45e that came with the 903 cc from an old fiat 127 that was in turn adapted from a fiat 850 sport hardly any of them were fitted as such and even fewer are running today despite the more often used fiat sohc having a tendency to shred cam belts
but what really changes things is if the engine you put in is too heavy for example a 160A2.000 is fine in that car but a 160A8.046 will only be good for a strait line or if the chassis changes so much that nothing of the original is left bearing any load
as I live in nz most of the og features only show up in museums the cars that do see use on the road have all the well known bodges and aftermarket parts in place some times the fixes were done when the car was new aftermarket steering boxes are one eg