Why is Japan and Germany just sitting on their asses while American muscle is rapidly approaching in the rear view mirror?
>GT350 is a god machine
>new Camaro is a god machine
>Viper is a god machine
>C7 Grand Sport is a god machine
>American cars in general are vastly improving with every passing year
Why aren't they stepping up to the plate and putting these (supposedly) lolcantturn dinosaurs where they belong?
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Chevrolet have comprehensively ruined their image in Europe by selling rebadged Daewoos for years, and as far as I know no American models are officially for sale here. Also the Viper is being discontinued and the only reason the Mustang is selling well is because it's cheap, not because it's good.
>Approaching
American muscle was "approaching" in 2009, at this point it's right beside or even slightly ahead.
As for why they don't care, muscle cars are just too expensive and carry a large stigma in Europe and especially Japan, they aren't super practical and don't sell very well.
But they are fucking perfect for America, there's a reason they are goddamned everywhere.
>chebby
They sell Opels and Vauxhalls and they are literally everywhere. Haven't seen a rebranded daewoo car in ages there.
Literally irrelevant outside burgerton.
So literally irrelevant outside the only relevant part of the world? Sounds fine to me.
Snek is the only god machine in that list. As legit as it gets though.
>>GT350 is a god machine
its expensive, overplayed and its garbage in terms of reliability and performance for the price.
Its only good in a straight line
>>new Camaro is a god machine
Literally another straight line machine.
>viper
impractical and out of reach for most, you won't see these like you don't see ford GT's on the streets
>c7
its garbage like the camaro, all that screaming horse power and it doesn't do anything but go in a straight line.
>american cars improving
hogwash, the reliability is a huge aspect in car owners desires. Foreign cars especially japanese are notoriously more reliable than GM and Ford shitboxes made of flimsy plastics and poor gas mileage
GM sell Opels, not Chevrolet. And Opels are German developed and actually so good for burgertard standards that they're sold as Buicks in the US. Which is hilarious because my dad's last two cars were Opels also available as Buicks, and they were pretty bad.
The C7 Grand Sport is better than a 911 Carrera S.
In what way?
I know. That is what i said
GM is the one who gets chevy to rebrand shit. Now chevy is making companies rebrand their cars. IE Cruze, Sonic, Spark.
More fun to drive, sounds better, faster, looks far more exciting than the 911's flattened beetle shape.
>Camaro
>straight line
>Using Cadillac's alpha platform which is widely praised for its fantastic handling
>Zl1 Camaro just put down a nurburgring time a second off of a McLaren MP4-12C
And it's also a cheaply fitted, rattly, loud shitbin that also breaks down constantly, sucks to daily drive and screams "I have a midlife crisis but I couldn't afford something decent".
But none of those things are true
>European non-econobox cars
>reliable
All modern ones are basically unrepairable throawayboxes.
>More fun to drive,
No sure about that. But I guess FR car would be better if it's not front heavy.
>sounds better,
Doesn't matter.
>faster,
I'm sure it would be. ANd it would be faster than so many cars unless it's a highly techical course with just it's HP.
>looks far more exciting than the 911's flattened beetle shape.
Subjective.
Also 911 feels like a huge luxury in the USA, but in Europe a top-trim Corvette would be a bigger luxury. In any case, neither of those approaches Viper (for me).
>memes
>memes
>so I guess all expensive cars suck?
>memes
If Motortrends BDC 2016 proved anything, it's that American muscle is slow in straight lines and fast on the track.
>GT350R 2nd last place is drag, beat NSX, M4 GTS, and GT-R in lap time
>Camaro 1LE last in drag, only a tenth of a second behind M4 GTS despite having street compound tires and lacking aero
>the only cars faster than the C7 Grand Sport around Big Willow have 600HP or more, when it only has 460
At least hate for the right reasons you memespouting sheep
American cars will never be a thing in EU until you guys catch up on refinement also. Even european cars sold in USA are different than the cars we get over here. I was shocked at the build quality you guys get over there when I visited.
And is not only that but also about how your high performance car act on normal roads with bumps and uneven surfaces. They are not as comfortable or fun to drive as european counterparts.
On top of that there is also the taxes we have over here. In most countries you pay a tax based on engine volume and CO2. Couple that with petrol being over 1 euro per liter ( about 4.4 dollars per US gallon) and running costs alone will drive you mad.
The only muscle car that I constantly see is the new Mustang GT500, but even that is like 1 for every 50 Porsche 911.
>in Europe a top-trim Corvette would be a bigger luxury
No, it is not. Stop lying to yourself and stop lying on the internet. Just because you do not see one everyday does not mean is a luxury. Having a sports car within itself is somewhat of a luxury but not owning a Corvette.
>GT350
>Its expensive
Even with the HUGE markups, the GT350 is still cheaper AND faster than the NSX, GTR, and a shit ton of other much more expensive cars. This was a test done around a circuit too so no, it isn't only good in a straight line
>Camaro
>Straight line machine
The new camaro is faster around a track by a large margin than the GT350, so no, it's not just good in a straight line
>impractical and out of reach for most
Impractical, yes, out of reach for most? nada
>c7
you're right, it is garbage.
I do not have the GT350 where I live but there is the V8 5.0L and for one of those we pay about 47k dollars for a base model, no extras.Add to that green tax and dealer markup and you look at a 55k dollars car.
After you got your base mustang V8 you start thinking about running costs and when your car does 15 MPG and petrol is 4 $ per gallon it gets expensive really fast really soon.
Wanna know how I know you are American?
It's because the GT350 is North-America only for the time being.
How is it expensive to buy in EU when is not even available?
>Japan
>build cheap reliable econoboxes
>Korea
>build even cheaper unreliable econoboxes
>Germany
>build semi-reliable econoboxes and unreliable luxoboxes
>Italy
>build niche unreliable econoboxes and expensive memewedges
>America
>try to do all of the above
>American muscle
Only relevant in America because literally every other country in the world has roads that require the car to be able to turn.
thumb nail made it look like a tc
Let's be honest, Europoors wouldn't know what to do with over 400hp either
t. assmad fordshill
Tbqhfam america is literally #1 at everything
Found gm's marketing team
Call me when gm wins a single race at lemans.
We sure as hell know what to do with 1200hp. Legally driving 240mph+ on public roads.
Pull up a list of supercars and count the American ones ever made. Protip Ford GTs aren't supercars.
>America
>lemans
Others are more than happy to enjoy European cars or Japanese cars or Australian cars on their own while Americans drool over pigfat muscle cars with styling and names done by 12 year old transformers fans.
America is relevant if you're an American, sure the rest of the world is interested in America to an unusual extent, but you're not so important that people die from not hearing about you for months, and nobody except Americans think that America is truly an interesting country - you can study the place all you want from the other side of the planet.
Fail at all of those things except for the unreliability. Americans testicles tend to drop only by the time they hit 40, so they continue to like mustangs and gm products for most of their life.
>american manufacturers throw barely street legal tires and massive carbon brakes on shit box
>can literally only do one fast lap
>huur DUUR we make gud cars I swear!
Meanwhile the 911 can limiter launch repeatedly all day long while the corvette shuts itself down into limp mode after giving it some on the highway
Americans can't build cars
Or the slr mclaren can drive to the nurburgring, do several hot laps, and then drive home with no problems while having a 5spd automatic and McLaren racing spec tires and brakes that catch on fire.
When will seppos learn?
pls no bully
>alpha playform
>straight line machine
Are you retarded?
Because as soon as they see that the American cars are catching up to them, they'll move to the next big thing. It's like how men invented shit and waited for women to catch up so they can move on and not worry about women being so far behind, understand?
this is funny to me due to GM ceo being a femmie
this explains everything
dubs of truth
as an american i can tell you if a normy wanted to spend a lot of money on a sports car they would more than likely get a mustang, or corvette, or camaro and thats pretty much it subarus (wrx/sti) are getting like crazy popular here as well
sucks but its true
>Chevrolet have comprehensively ruined their image in Europe by selling rebadged Daewoos
>Implying regular Chevrolets are any better
ITT: Amerifags think they are catching up to Europe
>throw barely street legal tires and massive carbon brakes on shit box
But the M4 GTS is basically that on top of a roll-cage and it was barely faster than a camaro with no wing, inferior tires and less power. (gap was like 0.11)
I like how Europeans like to boast the supercars even though they will never drive them.
I rather have affordable fun than just have nationalistic bragging rights. Have fun in your 1 liter hatchbacks
>american "cars"
HAHAHAHAHAHA
AHAHAHA
HAAAAA
Because automobiles started in the US. US automobile has a long, experienced, and successful history in this country and we're heading back to where we belong, at the top.
No rice eating gooks and poor cuckolded euros are going to beat us.
>automobiles started in the US
No they did not. Put down the fast food and pick up a book.
The M4 GTS uses Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 tyres though
Also it has water injection and more track focused suspension
>Japan
>Build cheap reliable econoboxes and expensive reliable luxury cars.
>Korea
>Copy every single other manufacturer design and spam 10 year warranty everywhere.
>Germany
>Decently reliable econoboxes and expensive moneypit high performance luxury cars
>Sweden
>Decently reliable stripped down econoboxes and decently reliable bland luxury.
>Italy
>JUST tier all around except for the high performance models
>Britain
>JUST
>America
>Copy everybody like Korea and have hit/miss reliability.
>Copy
America has been making pony cars before most of those countries even had an auto industry.
Automobiles "in any good, usable, and commonly available form to normal people" started in the US
>countries even had an auto industry.
Kek this
>Its only good in a straight line
Literally stopped reading there.
And they still took the bait.
Here's your (You), but you're still a faggot.
Except all of those supercars are only attainable for rich arabs.
This. A regular europoor drives a 1.2 liter shitbox until they are old and boring enough to be able to afford a diesel 3 series. No wonder they get assmad about Americans in their teens driving 90s-2000s sports cars before being able to reasonably upgrading to something like a GT350 or Camaro ZL1. Displacement tax, insurance, and gas prices make any good European car out of reach for most Europeans.
t. amerifag who never visized Europe
Come to Germany. We have more 911s here than you guys have hothatches there.
Have you ever drove a VW you Chevy shill? VW and BMW handle and drive infinitely better than any American piece of shit.
Thats because we dont drive hot hatches... we have better vehicles
the american cars are insanely expensive in europe/japan, why should they care
american """"cars""""
>Have you ever drove a Chevy you VW shill? Chevy and Ford handle and drive infinitely better than any Kraut piece of shit.
i think that because american buys car even if they can't afford it
plus american cars aren't really a thing in europe
BMW sells luxury so not their problem
audi does the same
porsche as an very good image so they will sell anyway
>implying this isn't better in every way than one of your precious """"""""""""""""hot"""""""""""""""" hatches
>even peugeot won le mans
TOP KEK
I went to Italy this summer. It had to be the most depressing place I've ever seen to be a car enthusiast. Terribly cramped roads, and almost everyone drove either a tiny city car (even in more rural areas) or rode a moped. Maybe 1/100 vehicles was a big ostentatious luxury sedan.
>Terribly cramped roads
>no big ostentatious luxury sedan
well you just pointed out why
Maybe at killing people on sidewalks.
have you never experienced the joy of going way too fast around a windy italian road in an old fiat 500? Also, if you want to see supercars hit the riviera
>needs tunned mustang that costs nearly 60k to compete with 20k shitboxes
Are you even trying?
>Moving the goalposts
Even if there is a reason beyond economic, it doesn't chaange the fact that a European """""man""""" drives either a moped or sewing machine.
But that's still not ideal. If you need to go to a specific area just to see rich Arabs and Asians with supercars, that can't be said to reflect how the majority of the populace lives.
I've owned both. My VW was easily the best car I've ever owned. I've driven my friends BMW and that thing was quicker and more nimble than any boat Chevy piece of shit
>I have been in an italian city with cramped roads and never seen one luxury car
>the whole of europe must be poor
>If you need to go to a specific area just to see rich Arabs and Asians with supercars
Well user if in America you can find supercars in certains area than it's the same fucking situation. I really doubt if you go in red neck country you will find any lambos or ferraris. The same goes for us: if you go to a poor zone of a city or to a cramped city you won't find supercars.
>Ford GTs aren't supercars.
Cheapest Mustang is like 37000, I don't really know. I doubt it turns much worse since newer models have separate rear suspension and it has the advantage of not being FWD/AWD. And I doubt fast versions of those econoboxes are that cheap. I don't really see how can you even compare them.
Japan has a lot of economic problems at the moment. Not just with the car industry. They have an old and increasingly ageing population. Not many people having babies either.
In Europe you have people trying to lead the world in saving the planet. It's a big problem, which will cost a lot of money to fix but these people believe they can do it. And if they get it right, there is a lot of money to be made. Maybe that's why they're so keen.
I'm a car enthusiast who loves big NA power but as someone who drives in city traffic 95% of the time, the I3 is fucking excellent, apart from its styling. It looks like a pig from the front... =/
...
the MSRP for GTIs is about 22k in burgerland
Also if you never test drove the new mustang you should go and try it. It still drives like shit despite it's new rear suspension.
The Shelby tuned ones are a lot better than the base models from what I can gather.
>Why is Japan and Germany just sitting on their asses while American muscle is rapidly approaching in the rear view mirror?
maybe there's a corner ahead
The ZL1 just took a giant shit on top of some of Europe's finest and it isn't even a track car (it's a drag car)
>europe's finest
Like what?
M4 GTS, for example.
Name one European/Japanese car that can compete with a comparably price to these:
C7 Corvette
GT350R
Camaro ZL1
Dodge Viper ACR
Protip: you can't.
BTFO
>comparably price
in europe?
or americaß
fucking retard
In the relevant part of the world, of course.
They set the standard and they are waiting for you guys to finally catch up before they raise the bar even higher they day you start celebrating.
Merc, Porsche, Alfa Romeo, Audi, Nissan are some of the brands.
Also it came in 1.6 seconds shy of beating the McLaren MP4-12C. so for the ZL1, which is a drag car, to score this good a time god only knows what the Z/28 is going to do.
It's going to lap Ferrari, McLaren, Nissan and Porsche again, I'll tell you that much now. For a CAMARO to make it into Nurburgring top 25 is incredible.
>they set the standard
Yes, this is true. But one thing you are forgetting is America is trying to compete with these times while making an affordable car. The difference between America and Europe is that we are trying to make cars that are god machines while making them achievable.
If Chevy wanted, they could design and build a Corvette costing an upwards of 300k or more that I bet would spank some serious European ass. I'm not bragging, I am trying to tell you the goals of America and Europe are different in terms of performance cars.
Europe - Highest quality materials but for most of the population the car is not achievable.
America - Cheaper quality parts for our interiors and we don't have a million different kinds of rare metals throughout the car, but we are still achieving record times for an affordable price.
...
>comparing time done by german Sportauto or Autozeitung magazines who have only few laps to go in press car which they would rather not risk crashing, with time done by manufacturer backed by few engineers to tune car, lot of time for it and no validation of car being stock.
For instance Porsche 918 did 6:57 vs 7:13 in Supertest, Aventador SV did 6:59 vs 7:15 etc
McLaren 12C could do 7:15 easily.
>tuned car
jesus this meme is hilariously desperate why not just read the specs and find out why it does as well as it does
handi.tech
The ZL1 is slower than the GTS though, lmao
i'm a 20 year old european male and I've owned 8 vehicles so far and all of them have been superior to all the 90s-2000s "sports cars" american teens drive
Amd I'm not even rich
Stay salty americuck
>superior to all the 90s-2000s "sports cars" american teens drive
Doubt it. If you go to a high school in a middle or upper class neighborhood the parking lot is full of new Camaro's, Mustang's, lifted bro trucks and BRZ's.
I don't drive new pony cars, such cars are pointless and overpriced here. I drive german luxury and sports cars only.
Not even parents money btw
Base model 3cyl BMWs don't count as "German luxury and sports cars".
The new Camaro is a sports car, faggot and no longer pony.
i've never owned a car with less than 6 cylinders
gtfo
>the whole thing about small engines being inferior
Japan might make a comeback, you know