/dmt/ daily manual thread

>if you stop on a hill and use the clutch to stay still instead of the footbrake does it wear the clutch significantly?
absolutely
do it too long and you could completely glaze your clutch

i haven't driven a manual for 7 years now but every time I get behind the wheel of a manual I still manage to doubleclutch easily.
Muscle memory is magical thing

>How long does it generally take to become second nature?
Give it a year. Maybe an extra 6 months for true proficiency.

What is the point of double clutching in your average manual car? Genuinely wondering. I thought you only needed to double clutch on cars with no synchros.

Smoother downshifts

>Fiesta owners need a thread about learning to drive manual

I've noticed a slight rattling sound when my clutch pedal is just slightly depressed. It's not there when the clutch is actually disengaged; it only shows up just before my foot is off the pedal completely. I assume it's the throwout bearing. How long can I avoid having to replace that bitch? (should have replaced the clutch and throwout bearing 6 months ago when I had to replace the leaking seals in my trans/tcase, but oh well). I only use the clutch for complete stops, so that saves a bunch of wear on the bearing.

There is no need to double clutch in a modern car that has a transmission with synchronizers in it. Double clutching will reduce wear on the synchros, however the effect is negligible, and the synchros are meant to be used up.

There are only 2 situations really when double clutching would be beneficial/necessary
>vehicle without synchronizers
>skipping gears ie: trying to go from like 5th to 3rd or 4th to 2nd really quickly (for whatever reason, for example rotary engines are very high revving and it is not uncommon for drivers to drop from 4th to 2nd in them)

In a situation like this double clutching will prevent the synchros from wearing more than normal because the change is so large. Not too sure on technicalities, but I'm fairly certain that in a normal downshifting situation (say 4th-2nd) you would want to row through each individual gear in order to maintain drivetrain speed, (4th - 3rd - 2nd) however if you tried to just go from 4th to 2nd (skipping 3rd) without double clutching the synchros would need to catch up more, wear more and the shift would be slower than if you double clutched, as you are manually spinning up the layshaft when you blip in neutral with double clutching.

What does a burning clutch smell like? Please don't tell me it smells like burning brakes because I have no idea what that smells like either.

cant really describe it its quite distinct. When it burns off its not fucked imediatly but you should get it checked out.

If you have to ask you ain't smelt it, so you don't need to worry.

basically if you have to raise your foot really high to get a some torque your clutch is almost done
so watch out and plan to replace it before it actually happens

cont
In all traditional rev matching is the way to go. For example, say from 4th to 3rd
>clutch in
>move shifter to 3rd
>blip throttle while clutch is still in
>let out clutch
All of this is happening simultaneously, the smoothest way for all this to happen is the timing of the blip; ideally right before the clutch bites, so really you'll be letting out the clutch and blipping the throttle at the same time

Anyway, the reason this works the way it does is because while the clutch disconnects the engine from the transmission for the most part, it is still connected (by the layshaft, I believe) this is why your shifts will be slower if you try to go from 5th to 3rd without double clutching, because when you double clutch you disconnect everything and manually bring everything up to speed.

>Smoother downshifts.
>Fun.
>good sound
>enjoyable
>car jerks less meaning you won't waste grip when you need it

If you like driving there's always a reason to double clutch.

How do I learn to drive and start and stop in hills? I'm getting a manual soon as the first car brought with my own money.

Any other tips with hill/mountain driving?

Would it smell like rotten eggs?

Don't do that, you are only wearing out your clutch. You can do that in an automatic because nothing is wearing down, you are just spinning a paddle in a liquid. But in a manual you are rubbing two surfaces together, like your face on the asphalt when you fly over the handlebars on a bike

It's almost a burning plastic smell but more sharp and chemically

What is the standard procedure for minimal wear on clutch/transmission when coming to a stop?

slowly let clutch out while slowly giving gas, clutch in to brake

repeat until you get good

>see red light/stop sign/idiot stopped on major highway for no reason
>clutch in, brake
>pull out of gear if you're going to be sitting
>clutch out
Holding the clutch in and in 1st while waiting at a light will wear out the throw out bearing

Find an empty parking lot with an incline, or a rarely used road you can practice inclines on.

The trick is knowing when your clutch catches, and applying throttle slowly letting it out. Eventually you'll get to the point where you will barely roll back, if at all. Just don't do:
>clutch in, slowly letting out while giving gas
>roll foward
>let off gas, roll back
>repeat

that will wear your clutch prematurely

Is it bad to put it in neutral and brake to a stop?

ever drive near a commercial truck that locked up the rear brakes? Clutch smells similar to brakes.

I've driven my car for 5+ years now, I bought a replacement clutch like 3 weeks into ownership and it still grabs just fine. 134k miles on the original clutch (original owner got the car repo'd, prev owner bought it at 10k, I bought it at 96k) and I've been to the track 3 times, and I've dragged a few times but on the street.

tl;dr gid gud.

no that's fine a lot of anons here from eurocuckistan will frown on it but really there's no harm.

I just rev match or heel/toe if I want smooth downshifts. No real need to double clutch unless your car is lacking in synchros.

No, rotten eggs are typically exhaust fumes. Check out where your header and catalytic converter meet, I'm willing to bet that there is a leak.

>stop sign ahead
>shift down to a decently low gear, usually 2nd and begin braking
>once you're pretty much stopped (10-15mph) just clutch in and change to neutral, then continue braking, though there won't be much left to do
>leave in neutral while at light or sign and wait

alternatively works, just depends when you want to shift into neutral really. Keep in mind though that when you engage the clutch or go into neutral (all minor technicalities aside) you are disconnecting the transmission from the engine, and will be in less control the the car. This is why it's dangerous to put your car in neutral or put the clutch in at like 40 mph then try to brake; slow down first to around 10mph be it purely engine braking, or a combination of a lower gear and physical braking

I'm and I never double clutch unless its 0 or colder outside. Shifting into 2nd and 3rd when the trans is dead cold will be notchy and will sometimes grind, only REALLY cold ambient temperature days. Havent had it happen this year yet.

pic unrelated

10-15mph is FLYING through a stop sign bro.

I usually downshift into 1st, pull the idle down a little (~500rpm or so) which I consider a stop and take off from there, that's basically walking speed.

nevermind, it turns out my reading comprehension is no.

Usually when the clutch releases earlier or later than it should it is a good sign that it needs replacing. It's hard to notice though as it doesn't happen instantly

When I need to stop in a hill I just leave it neutral and when I'm at the top I just use my handbrake.
Then slowly disengage the clutch while taking of the handbrake and using a little gas (the car should not move backwards when it hits the biting point) and then you're good to go.

This.
My car has worn out syncros on the first and second gears to the point when it becomes impossible to downshift without double clutching

Just got my first manual car (only previous experience with a manual was a 1980 pickup with non- adjusting bench seats, when I was 8)

After ~20 miles of driving I can set off from a stop relatively smoothly ~80% of the time but this process takes 5-10 seconds.

Should I be trying to get faster or will that simply come with time and I should focus on being smooth?

How about using only the clutch to get up very slight inclines like a driveway.

I like to back into my driveway and for the life of me can't do it while using the accelerator. feels like it goes way too fast for me. is it bad to use only the clutch to get moving everytime I go to park.

You cant truly be fast until you're smooth

>insert snarky comment about how I am superior at manual because europoor

I guess I'm just asking if getting faster is something most people put conscious effort into while they're learning or if it's something that generally happens on it's own.

both, however a conscious effort will help you learn faster especially with
quality
>how well/quickly you shift
>quantity
how much you'll learn
>quickness
how fast you'll learn new techniques

Wisdom is gained through experience. Experience is gained from mistakes. Keep at it.

You can do that. However you need to be VERY WELL AWARE of what's the contact point for the clutch. Release too slow = your car will take reverse speed and most likely stall when you release the clutch

release too fast = stalling.

The key is knowing the exact position of YOUR car with YOUR clutch in which the clutch starts to engage.

Get a car with hill assist. Had it on a 2014 Civic Si and now on my 2015 STI. Makes life a hell of a lot easier.

>tfw you don't get the 6 speed

How long are you supposed to slip the clutch when you take off in first? It probably takes 3-5 seconds for me to release the clutch completely when taking off because I'm still learning and I don't want to damage my clutch

Depends on how long until you reach idle speed on first gear and how fast you can do it without stalling the car

>repeat until you get good
git gud

>You cant truly be fast until you're smooth
Quality advice.

I don't know about the others here but hill assist takes away from the purity simplicity of driving manual in my opinion.

To be fair, if you can't manage to learn on your own, find someone who knows and have them passenger up with you and teach you. alot of it is feeling the car, Which you likely wont be able to do until you're comfortable with the car, (not looking at the speedometer or reading your RPMs to know when to shift) you should be able, after a time, to clutch in and shift smoothly just by feeling how fast or slow you are going. I used to stare at my speedo for direction on when to shift my first few weeks. I learned from scratch on a manual truck so it was probably the best case scenario because it was cable and hydraulic everything. none of the electric nannies

My dad taught me by listening to the engine. When it is slower and low pitch then do not shift up. When it starts getting faster and higher pitch then it is time to shift up.

This thread angers me

>Steps to git gud at stick
>Written by a drunk burger

Step 0(Empty space)
>Find an empty parking lot or somewhere with lots of space for you to fuck around
>Even better if it has a flat section and a slight hill somewhere
>Find spectators so they can laugh as you fail to do the next steps

Step1 (Learn bite point)
>let out clutch slowly till car starts to creep forward
>Get car moving on flat surface without using throttle
>Do this without stalling out

Step 2 (Throttle control)
>Now that you know where clutch grabs
>Same as step one but use throttle this time
>Slowly add throttle as you are letting clutch out (how much throttle depends car to car)
>Repeat until you can go from stopped to moving without being jerky as fuck

Step 3 (Hill Starts)
>Learn to do step 2 while on an incline without rolling backwards
>This is pretty much the same as step 2 but you will roll backwards if you are not fast enough
>add throttle while getting to bite point quickly

(Bitchmode Hillstarts)
>Usehandbrake to prevent rolling backwards
>Same as step 3

Step 4 (Downshifting)
>Learn what the RPM difference between gears
>Learn to blip throttle for desired RPM
>Match RPM with gear you want
>Go down 1 gear (5th-4th/4th-3rd)
>I'm almost a racecar driver mode down 2 gears on one blip
>Practice till you can do this not jerky as fuck

Step 5(Pracetice Practice Practice)
>Go drive
>Go drive more
>Keep doing all these things till you can do them without thinking about it

Step 6 (I'm fucking Dagumi now)
>Now that you can drive and are not jerky as fuck
>Heel Toe Dopwnshift
>Same as step 4
>Left half of ball of foot on brake
>While pushing brake either roll side of foot to blip throttle or twist and use heel to blip throttle (depends on car and pedal distance/setup) do whatever works for you there isnt a right way to do it
>Get the gear you want
>you now down a gear/slowed down and ready to go WOT out of the turn.
>foot off brake and onto throttle

it took 75k-ish miles before my car needed a new clutch and i'm fairly certain the previous owner was at least 1/3rd retarded, so they were probably unkind to it.

this

the first time i ever experienced clutch problems it was slipping as i pulled away and *that smell* came with it, hard to describe but if you can smell something awful while your clutch is fucking up, that's what it is.

was that clear? i don't know.

>(Bitchmode Hillstarts)
>Usehandbrake to prevent rolling backwards

that's not bitchmode, that's normalmode

Please remove this thread. I'm a girl, I literally CAN'T drive a manual

Tell me why I shouldn't buy this, Veeky Forums

charlotte.craigslist.org/cto/5993219738.html

I just want a car to learn stick. Guy claims she's in good shape. This model has a timing chain, not a timing belt.

>chrysler

This is my major concern. Lots of complaints for this vehicle. Lots of engine problems.

The guy agreed to $1500 cash after I inspect and test drive.

Not once in my entire life have a used a handbrake on a hillstart. even when I was learning to drive.

>I'm a girl

>1500 for a car with problems
Be wary. If you are gonna do more than spend over a thousand in a trainer vehicle and maybe DD'it. Think about looking over rust and shit.

congrats would like me to bake you a cake

Yes please.

No, seems to me using the handbrake is bitchmode though. If thats how you have to do it then by all means use handbrake

so explain how to do it without rolling backwards?
>start car on hill
>put in gear
>find bite point with gas
>third leg on the footbrake to stop it rolling?

?????????

To clarify: the vehicle I'm inspecting supposedly doesn't have problems. The 2002 Jeep Liberty in general did have a lot of common drivetrain issues.

i'm just messing with you for being a special snowflake. I learned with a handbrake then quickly learned you can do it with only pedals.

>on hill
>1st
>foot on brake
>clutch right near bite point as you're about to take off
>let off brake
>clutch is at biting point
>right foot to throttle and drive like normal (red line every gear is normal)

you can sorta heel toe it if you have lmao no torque.

if you can do that it doesn't sound like an actual hill

Woman detected

>no torque babbies

Is it bad to push the accelerator a small amount as you are letting out the clutch? My shifts are way smoother if I do that, but will it wear the clutch faster significantly?

Pretty much this. You just let out clutch and add gas much faster than you would if you were on a flat surface. I guess it might suck if your car is a gutless shitbox but it's doable

none at all. Its encouraged and a great idea.

sounds like you're ruining your clutch desu

meh
lonely virgin detected

if I'm on an incline and stopped, can I just dump the clutch while already rolling forward or should I do the normal getting moving procedure

Also happens when you live in a city with a lot of traffic with a lot of steep roads like Hong Kong.

You should let your engine at least revmatch before letting the clutch go completely

Assmad GM fangirl detected

If you do it fast there isn't much of a difference than if you used handbrake hill start

Blowtorch some plastic and metal

Just to clarify I mean going from first to second, not from a stop.

Yes. Giving it gas before you let go of the clutch when shifting up to avoid jolts is exactly what RPM matching is about

If my starts are a bit jerky what is that a sign of that I am doing wrong?

>Bottom
your starts are jerky is the sign you are doing it wrong

what part of it am i doing wrong?

clutch to fast, not enough gas one of those things

Usually a catalytic converter when the car is still getting up to temp

No, it wears your brakes rather than your clutch, but obviously you're not using any engine braking, so different characteristics when slowing.

Hard to say, depends on circumstances, but that doesn't sound a million miles off.

If I'm driving around in 4th, what sort of reasoning and when would I shift down to 3rd? or even 2nd gear?

and if my car lugs a bit when I shift what am i doing wrong?

seriously, thank you for putting this into words. this'll help me teach my cousin

>saved for posterity

So rev matching basically makes it so your downshift feels like an upshift? I've been driving manual ute for work which has been fun but I'm still learning.