We live now in an age of things like "Transgenderism" were the arguments given by trans people tend to differ one of which is mainly that they are "born into the wrong gender"
When I ask them why they wish to change their gender they state "because i am really a woman" and often when i ask them to define what a woman is, they can't, they then go on to say that "gender is fluid" and that you don't have to wear female clothing to be a woman, yet they identify themselves with these rigid terms like "woman" and wearing such "societally formed" clothing
Surely this is all a contradiction and an example of language and linguistics being dangerously used to push ideas?
Surely philosophy is now needed more than ever to study the usage of words and these ideas?
Grayson Miller
I hate to pick a side when it comes to these lunatics, but technically the trannies are saying that gender identity and gender roles are 100% biological and it's the result of your brain structure, which they think is messed up.
They don't push the meme that gender is a social construct, it's the feminists who do that. So yeah they're both fucking crazy but different types of crazy.
Noah Sanchez
You are completely correct.
Eli Young
Increase the fund first then
John Taylor
As above, so below still holds true.
Philosophy is in its most advanced stage yet, and to complement that, we're seeing some of the lowest forms of decadence so far.
Increase in global poverty awareness - incredible technological progress in other parts of the world.
On a much smaller and somewhat trivial scale, you have the internet now which lays out a vast amount of information to the connected world, and then you see more and more people of the connected world actually becoming lazier and stupider for it. Younger generations look everything up and don't know a damn thing on their own, because there is nothing that compels them to anymore.
As above, so below still holds true.
Julian Garcia
OP u right desu
Xavier Thomas
How would philosophy help to combat these issues?
Adrian Powell
Recognizing cognitive dissonance I guess. Learning the importance of consistent reason and dissecting arguments to scan for flaws.
In my experience though, even among people who know better, they can throw away their philosophical ideals if it suits their political or personal agenda.
Some philosophical training, say as a junior or senior in high school, might help those out who pay attention but I'm not convinced it would make any big societal difference.
Josiah Adams
>gender identity and gender roles are 100% biological
>X,Y >X,X
Why are people so autistic?
I mean honestly, is there any actual evidence to indicate that the structure of their brain is causing the to identify as a woman? Or is all just "muh fee fees"?
Austin Allen
>I mean honestly, is there any actual evidence to indicate that the structure of their brain is causing the to identify as a woman? Or is all just "muh fee fees"?
Yes. Studies have shown that the brains of MtF transgender people are more similar to brains of women than brains of men, even before hormonal treatments, which only make them even more similar.
There are also things like cis men who have their penis removed due to something like cancer or an accident have about a 50% rate of phantom limb syndrome for their lost penis. Transwomen who undergo sexual reassignment surgery have a near 0% rate of phantom limb syndrome.
Gabriel Wood
This is just semantics. You have one opinion, make up some facts that support it, and then use these facts to contradict people who disagree with you.
So you think transgenderism is a mental illness. So? The only thing you get out of this is trying to change the definition of illness to make your opinion, that it's a mental illness, true. You don't actually accomplish anything, other than changing the definition of a word to be able to say your initial statement was right.
Parker Collins
thats literally ops point
hes saying you need to really analyze and be a thinker when it comes to these things
Liam Sanchez
It's all a spook.
James Diaz
It doesn't fucking matter what we accomplish about ourselves.
We're not fucking analysing ourselves, we're using philosophy to show these mentally ill morons that they're fucking wrong.
Jacob Phillips
But they aren't. Philosophy can never prove anything right or wrong, it can only bring arguments that can try to convince people they are wrong.
And by the general definition of mental illness, they are right.
The only thing you can do is to try to change the definition of mental illness to mean transgender people.
What even is your interest in saying transgender people are mentally ill? Why is being able to say this phrase important to you.
Brody Mitchell
>all these fucking mental gymnastics
Kys
John Campbell
> I hate to pick a side when it comes to these lunatics, but technically the trannies are saying that gender identity and gender roles are 100% biological and it's the result of your brain structure, which they think is messed up. Tranny here. It's basically split down the middle in the Trans community as different ways to come to understand the meaning of it all.
> We're not fucking analysing ourselves, we're using philosophy to show these mentally ill morons that they're fucking wrong. Sophistry, in other words.
Matthew Nelson
Good point i'm sure you win all the arguments in your class
Andrew Garcia
>another tranny on Veeky Forums Never thought I'd see the day.
Anyway yeah, what that user said. To elaborate, people generally either think of their transgenderness as nothing more than a preference to present, look, act like, etc like a member of the opposite sex, in the same way that someone may prefer putting tomatoes on a sandwich, or they view it as some sort of brain malfunction that makes them want to present, look, act like, etc as the opposite sex. The "gender is a social construct" people and the "I was born as the wrong sex" people are usually two different crowds, conflating the two as some sort of hypocrisy is ridiculous.
Gavin Carter
Hello friend. To be fair, a lot of people DO conflate the to, but that's just the usual pleb thing of not thinking about where your ideas come from.
Ryder Cook
The solution is not philosophy but rather a technological one.
Once we can vat grow artificial vags and futanari dicks, then trans people can be whatever the fuck they want.
Then trans will be just as good as the real thing.
You too can have an artificial womb and birth real babies with your former female partner who now has a functional dick.
I sure wish the /pol/ meme would die on this board already, you have your containment board and should stay on it, you're not too clever for the rest of them.
Philosophy won't prove or disprove scientifically validated points about transgender people, such as the studies about differences in brain structure between trans and cis people etc. However there are worthwhile ethical questions that need to be asked; you can see pretty obviously rolling through society that there *are* differences between the sexes and the point at which transgender people can be treated as though they were the sex they want to be in different areas of life is definitely important. It hardly seems ethical for instance, for a 7ft tall male prisoner to say "yah I'm trans, like" and be transferred to a female prison right away. Nor does it seem fair that someone who has a mostly female body after years of hormone therapy should be thrown in the slammer with a bunch of violent male robbers to fend for themselves. Where do you draw the line? Also questioned to be asked about subject like national service in countries where that is an accepted thing.
Bentley Stewart
>and an example of language and linguistics being dangerously used to push ideas? What?
Brody Ortiz
Can I get a source on that? Actually an interesting idea if that's true.
Chase Wood
>is there any actual evidence to indicate that the structure of their brain is causing the to identify as a woman?
You mean apart from the fact that it's literally your genes that determines that you're even human?
Landon Murphy
Everyone is born with a different set of attributes some of which would be considered masculine and feminine. For a start, abstract reasoning is considered masculine and emptions feminine, but every single human being experiences both of these faculties. Then most people are born with one biological sex, with which comes a plethora of expectations from your society. This social identity paired with sex is what we call gender. The thing is our gender roles are basically caricatures, and everyone experiences a discomfort with them. We worry about not being feminine or masculine enough. If you relate with attributes associated with the other social role, you might try to take it on. My criticism of transgenderism in that regard is that it doesn't move past the conventional level and accept that everyone is actually androgynous, but this is a step culture has to take as a whole. Why someone in the current climate might not associate with the gender they've been given is perfectly understandable.
Zachary Gonzalez
Can you provide examples of how the philosophy saved us from overuse of crazy ideas in the past? I am a bit sceptical about majority of the peoples reading niche philosophical topics.
Robert Reyes
We need to practice empathy and love and understanding.
Henry Martin
Yeah, a big problem I have with liberalism is, liberalism seems to posit that there's an "essential" quality to people.
In all case, always, forever, be skeptical when people imply something has an "essence" instead of observed or phenomenological characteristics.
The implication of liberalism is that, people are coherent, distinct individuals with coherent individual desires and "true selves" that are limited by oppressive structures. Right wingers usually can't combat it because they're big babies who believe in other essential qualities, which are usually worse.
In every single case ever, a "true self" is a made-up construct. Nobody understands themselves. Does that mean we should stop transsexuals? Probably not, but I'm skeptical that they have a magical "inner" self that knows it's female, I think that's horse shit.
Jack Price
>We live now in an age of things like "Transgenderism" were the arguments given by trans people tend to differ one of which is mainly that they are "born into the wrong gender"
>When I ask them why they wish to change their gender they state "because i am really a woman" and often when i ask them to define what a woman is, they can't, they then go on to say that "gender is fluid" and that you don't have to wear female clothing to be a woman, yet they identify themselves with these rigid terms like "woman" and wearing such "societally formed" clothing
It's not a contradiction because there's different people saying different things. The biggest problem I have with people who oppose social justice is they view social justice like some monolith of thought which from the top down dictates to people how things are to be.
People who believe in essential sexual characteristics or not are in opposition within social justice itself. It's like picking different schools of capitalism, finding a single contradiction and thus claiming all capitalism is stupid.
