Is Europe's diesel car trend coming to an end?

Is Europe's diesel car trend coming to an end?

Other urls found in this thread:

bbc.com/news/business-37287129
politico.eu/article/europe-looks-to-electric-cars-after-diesels-dead-end/
fortune.com/2016/09/06/renault-diesel-engines/
livescience.com/52284-volkswagen-scandal-clean-diesel-challenges.html
biofuelsdigest.com/bdigest/2015/09/28/noxgate-expands-93-of-diesel-vehicles-tested-fail-to-meet-euro-6-nox-emission-standards-average-is-7-times-over-the-limit/
theguardian.com/business/2016/apr/23/diesel-cars-pollution-limits-nox-emissions
theguardian.com/environment/2016/apr/22/mayoral-candidates-tighter-controls-london-traffic-pollution
motorauthority.com/news/1104265_volvo-sees-hybrids-replacing-diesels-even-in-europe
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

Hope not. Diesels are much better for long distance travels

Maybe. The increasingly tough emissions standards due to smog are going to drive up prices. With all the existing vehicles making shit on the roads under older standards that were more lenient and huge cities like paris choking on it, they're probably going to get increasingly restricted from city centers from a passenger car perspective.

never

No

and this

>they're not gonna switch the taxation of diesel and gasoline
>they're just gonna make diesel as expensive as gasoline

bbc.com/news/business-37287129
>Senior Renault executive Thierry Bollore has said that tougher emissions standards and testing methods would make diesel engines uneconomic to make.
>He told a meeting of Renault bosses in July that diesel engines had already been removed from the company's smallest cars, such as the Twingo, even before the Volkswagen scandal.
>By 2020, when more stringent EU emissions standards come into force, larger Renault cars such as the Clio and the Megane are unlikely to have diesel engine variants.

politico.eu/article/europe-looks-to-electric-cars-after-diesels-dead-end/
>In the wake of the VW scandal, life is only going to get more difficult for carmakers relying on diesel.
>Tougher tests on the road, due to become mandatory from next year, as well as requirements to further reduce nitrogen oxide emissions, make diesel engines “prohibitively expensive, especially in small vehicles,” [Greg Archer, clean vehicles director at Transport & Environment, an NGO.] said.

fortune.com/2016/09/06/renault-diesel-engines/
Renault and alliance partner Nissan assume the next wave of emissions rules, Euro 7, could halve NOx output limits again to 40 milligrams per kilometer, senior powertrain engineer Alain Raposo told a technical conference this summer.

smog kills cities who won't want them anymore
the tightened emissions controls to combat smog production in diesels makes them too expensive for automakers to make at a price that consumers are willing to buy them at.

here
here's the problem: diesel was a meme because lower CO2 emissions, so Europe bet on diesel, not realizing the smog problem it would cause. over time, the smog problem is realized. europeans start to tighten the emissions standards but do so slowly out of fear of hurting european automakers.

meanwhile, unlike the US where the government tests, the EU allows automakers to contract labs for emissions results. This allows automakers to "shop" around on who can make the lowest result.

Volkswagen gets greedy and says they have clean diesel without a urea (adblue) system. they get caught in the US. this gets general scrutiny in europe. Tons of others are caught with their hand in the cookie jar too (not necessarily defeat devices like volkswagen, but real world output of NOX far in excess of the results from tests).

As euro6 regulations hit in 2014 making the targets even harder economically, then the scrutiny due to volkswagen in 2015/2016 makes it worse. the tests are more standardized and cars are retested. then automakers are told that the current target that they have to cheat to hit and can't hit in real world use will be halved AGAIN to an even lower target in 2020.

economic diesel is going to die in the EU because nobody is going to be able to make the shitboxes cheap enough compared to petrol engines where people will buy them.

No idea mate, Daimler AG recently invested 3 billion euros in a diesel engine factory. It also heralds their returns in I6 engines, but they said they wanted to make it modular, e.g. 3L I6, 2L I4, etc.

here
livescience.com/52284-volkswagen-scandal-clean-diesel-challenges.html
>"The temperatures and pressures under which a diesel engine runs the most fuel efficient and the most peppy are also the conditions that will convert the maximum amount of oxygen and nitrogen into NOx," Herner told Live Science.

biofuelsdigest.com/bdigest/2015/09/28/noxgate-expands-93-of-diesel-vehicles-tested-fail-to-meet-euro-6-nox-emission-standards-average-is-7-times-over-the-limit/
>NOxgate expands: 93% of diesel vehicles tested fail to meet Euro 6 NOx emission standards; average is 7 times over the limit

theguardian.com/business/2016/apr/23/diesel-cars-pollution-limits-nox-emissions
>Ninety-seven percent of all modern diesel cars emit more toxic nitrogen oxide (NOx) pollution on the road than the official limit, according to the most comprehensive set of data yet published, with a quarter producing at least six times more than the limit.

this has lead major city candidates and politicians to want to ban diesels altogether:
theguardian.com/environment/2016/apr/22/mayoral-candidates-tighter-controls-london-traffic-pollution
>Mayoral candidates in London, the city with the worst air quality in Britain, have seized on the Department for Transport’s study of vehicle emissions to call for tighter controls on traffic pollution – including a ban on diesel cars.

motorauthority.com/news/1104265_volvo-sees-hybrids-replacing-diesels-even-in-europe
>Electrified cars still cost more than comparable diesels but Samuelsson said this will change in the coming years as emissions standards become tougher.
>“Diesels will be more expensive, they will have much more advanced after-treatment with additional fluids that have to be filled not once a year, but probably every time you refuel the car,” [Volvo CEO Håkan Samuelsson] explained.

if you don't see that diesel is dying in europe, you're delusional.

Hope so. It's way shittier than petrol with emissions, and entirely useless for cars.

thanks for all the info and links user

Absolutely not.

I bought a Focus ST recently and every single conversation I've had about it went something like:
>So it's a diesel right?
>PETROL?!? BUT WHY?!
>b-but muh fuel efficiency
>muh mileage

Most car makers don't even offer higher end models as petrol anymore. It's diesel automatic all the way. If you want a manual petrol car you're looking at the barest of bones basic version most of the time.

But with high end models the exhaust cleaning technology doesn't up the price that much.

Smaller diesel cars like your focus would become uneconomical to buy.

I'm not convinced there's gonna be enough of a price increase to dispel the notion of diesel = cheaper that's taken root in the general mindset. Maybe that's just a German thing rather than European as a whole but people here will already go to great lengths financially to get a diesel over a petrol. If you tell someone you've got a new car they pretty much assume it's a diesel until told otherwise. I think I'm literally the only person I know who doesn't drive one.

Muh em pee gees > all

The diesel over petrol prefference is considerably more widespread across Europe, not only in Germany.

And unless it's a relatively old car (

swissfag here, can confirm. from cheap shitboxes to 70k mercedes and bmw's everyone here likes diesel. the taxi companies are the only ones who push hybrids as their way to promote green technology.

They did that here in Uruguay, it sucks

Diesel sucks, new lpg/cng cars are pretty awesome.
Even trucks/buses are switching to cng in europe.

Prices where I live.

diesel 1.428 €
gasoline 1.579 €
lpg 0.615 €
cng 0.970 €

Hybrids are really good if you do lot of urban driving.

>here's the problem: diesel was a meme because lower CO2 emissions, so Europe bet on diesel, not realizing the smog problem it would cause. over time, the smog problem is realized. europeans start to tighten the emissions standards but do so slowly out of fear of hurting european automakers.

Co2 meme was really bad for europe, they also bet on woodchips pellets (carbon neutral but more smog than heating oil) as well as memetier solar panels and wind turbines subsidized to hell.

The signs are definitely starting to show now.

I hope not, petrol variants are cheaper because of plebs scrambling and driving up the prices of used diesels.
No one seems to comprehend the break even point being years away even with the fuel cost gap while petrol is more fun and responsive.

Honda is selling civics with LPG pre installed here. It is charming tbqh. Cuz they don't sell diesel.

Good fuck small diesels