What to do if your parents are poorfags with poor financial decision-making?

My parents aren't financially literate, or they "think they are", but they never do any investments. I think they own like 3 shares in total in 3 different oil companies that pays them like $0.05 or some shit in dividends.

However, they do have great credit, but they waste money. We haven't paid off our $170k mortgage, and our family income is $120k, and, it's been 8 years since we took on the mortgage, and the mortgage is currently at $145k.

We spent $50k doing our basement (utterly useless, no one goes down there) and then $20k outside "landscaping", but we don't even do white people barbecues.

Then they blame each other for spending all their money, but then they take vacations to Asia every single year and spend like $10k - $20k for one person.

I mean, they're not going into hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt, but they aren't exactly looking to "pay off" their debts, and they only carry really $150k in debt, with incomes almost 100% of that.

Think about it, $170k mortgage, $120k income, that's $960,000 they made over 8 years, but they couldn't pay 17% of that to the mortgage.

I guess we're better than most people, but it's just sad when I think about it and reflect on it. We could be living debt free and driving some NICE cars, but because of the mortgage, we don't even have the ability to drive what our income range should allow us to drive via financing or leasing.

I mean, financially, it makes sense to own the car or buy it out right, but a lot of times, leasing or financing makes sense "enough", to drive something new and raises our "status", which people might say they don't care about, but it really matters in life.

As for my advice, OP, being that I'm only 20 (21 soon), I would stay with your parents, as long as they're not dragging themselves deeper into debt and keeping up their payments on whatever, they're doing "fine", and since they're not charging you rent, you could save that money. Just look for a job, any job, and start stock piling your cash. Just endure it for a couple of years, and you'll have enough money to move out with comfortably when you secure a better job somewhere further away from them.

Don't cut off contact though, they might be financially illiterate, but they know "enough" to be able to house you and feed you and live with you until now. Also by cutting them off, you risk loosing whatever inheritances you might have, and you could even loose access to their life insurance or whatever insurance pay outs they get at death.

Think about it as just business, with a tough client. It's a long pain staking sale, but the closure of this deal will result in you having something to kick start a small business with, or even buy a business, and make your life better in the future, and it will definitely give you a better future for your family someday.

>my parents are bad with money
>we could be driving nice cars instead

Who the fuck is "we"? It's their money not yours, and nice cars are a terrible financial decision.

>We could be living debt free and driving some NICE cars, but because of the mortgage
Assuming there is a low interest rate on the mortgage, there should be no rush to pay it off. That is "good debt." Also, "NICE cars" are rapidly depreciating assets. Why do you think that would be a good use of your parents' money?

>I mean, financially, it makes sense to own the car or buy it out right, but a lot of times, leasing or financing makes sense "enough", to drive something new and raises our "status", which people might say they don't care about, but it really matters in life.

I have my own income, and like I said, they're not financially illiterate, however, they could be living quite differently if they didn't have the mortgage.

Nice cars are also not a terrible decision, a variety of cars are bought at MSRP and then driven for a year and sold at MSRP again on the used market, cars like the Porsche Macan, or the BMW 535i / 550i.

Nice cars can actually be cheaper to run, than a cheap economical car, since a variety of nice cars don't depreciate as quickly as a Honda Civic does, and in many cases, some nice cars actually appreciate in value due to lack of supply. Also insurance on nicer, more high end vehicles is a lot of the times cheaper than your average Civic.

The rate is about 3.5%, and I know it's good debt, but the thing is, it pushes money away from other things, basically it limits the amount of disposable income you have.

Our mortgage works like this;

The bank provided us a line of credit worth $275k when we bought the house, however, we only required $170k for the mortgage, so we "have" access to $275k, and we have "used" $170k of that.

Every time we make a payment, the number goes down from $150k, to $149k, for example, but then they spend $1k more that month, and it goes back up to $150k.

The interest is nothing, it's negligible at the end of the day, but it ties up money that could be used elsewhere, and it's not just cars, I have asked them to buy a lot of stocks before, $10k on NFLX back when it was $20 a share, $10k in FB when it had it's IPO, and $10k on TWTR when it had it's IPO. They simply said no, because they didn't trust it. Turns out, every time, all of those companies went up, and they still don't care. Could have had millions of dollars by now if they were interested in making money, but they aren't, and would rather just make enough to pay their bills, but not do better than that.

Read the end of this for why a variety of nice cars are not always depreciating assets, and can actually cost less, or the same, to run as a Civic.

protip: in the grand scale of things if their literacy is a 1, yours is a 2-3.

get gud, and then make then gud

>Nice cars are also not a terrible decision, a variety of cars are bought at MSRP and then driven for a year and sold at MSRP again on the used market, cars like the Porsche Macan, or the BMW 535i / 550i.
Did you just make that up?

No, I actually do market research on the vehicles in my province and surrounding cities, and these are just 2 of the vehicles that are bought at MSRP, then driven for 20,000 km, or even 40,000 km, and sold at prices at MSRP, and sometimes even above MSRP, because the demand is high and the supply is low.

People who buy these cars are able to drive them for free essentially, save for insurance and fuel, and then sell them, and not lose anything.

You sound financially illiterate. Any money extra you put towards a sub 3% mortgage could just go in the market and make ~7% back a year on average. If you were to intelligently invest it, you might make a lot more.

Even with just the 7% you might earn from an index fund, the difference can be hundreds of thousands of dollars by the end of the mortgage term.

>NICE cars

lol

If demand is that high, dealers will sell the new cars above MSRP.

>move
>move
>move out of your parents house

For god's sake, people. Have the balls and just kill the fucks. The house will go to you anyway after they die, better have it now at the age of 30 before you grow old and wrinkly at 60 and your kids inherit the house and so on.

A Porsche Macan S here starts at $59,200, this is with 0 km's, totally brand new. It is currently selling in the used market, at $59,900, with, guess how many kilometers, 75,000.

A Macan starts at $52,700. This is the absolute base model, with 0 km's. There is one here brand new, at $59,859 from a Porsche Dealership, but it's 2-3 hours away from the major city. There are 3 more from the same dealership at $67,xxx. The thing is, there are also 3 Porsche Macan S's, granted they are 1 year older, in the used market, for $59,900 - $61,000, with 45,000 km's on them.

The Macan base has 250 HP, while the S has 340. The GTS with 360. The base is rarely sold, the S is the one people want to buy and have bought.

I am not going to sit here and tell you everything I know, you can do your own research. However, in my province and in the surrounding cities where I live, including my own city, there are cars that are sold exactly at MSRP, or with extremely low discounts in the 1% - 3% range, or with $500 above MSRP, that are driven for 1 or 2 years, and then sold with 40,000 kilometers, for thousands of dollars above the original purchase price, and this is because of the lack of supply, from Porsche itself, and the dealers are not marking up the price by 20%, or 30%, because that would make it stupid to purchase compared to other luxury SUV's in that category.

Porsche also never discounts any of their vehicles, and when they do, it's only for those who have repeatedly purchased vehicles from said dealerships, and even that discount is only a few hundred dollars, or the waiving of some fee in the few hundred dollar range.

We are done here.

7% is not guaranteed, and the real withdrawal rate is barely 4% after various fees, and/or taxes.

Index funds are for idiots.

I can buy one car, drive it for a year, sell it, and earn 16% back on the purchase price, and be left with 12% after closing costs, and use that to leverage my way into a more expensive vehicle, and repeat the process. That is way better than earning barely 4% in an index fund, and it's "fun".

Stop shilling things you know nothing about.

How much is "enough" that I need to save would you say, though?

Just as much as possible?

What country bro? Always interested in how different businesses work in different countries. I heard that in brazil you pay msrp but negotiate on accesories/upgrades.

Get rid of your Netflix plan, get rid of Spotify, get rid of your phone bill if it's over $15 - $20 / month (get a simple unlimited text/call plan, no data), and get a job earning whatever you can, and work as much as possible.

A good amount is something you can sustain yourself with for a few months, even if you have a job lined up, because moving somewhere costs money, and there can be mess ups with your paycheck the first month or two.

I would say $30k in 3 years, or $20k at minimum. That way, you can afford rent in case something goes wrong, and you can afford to eat, and you can also afford to secure a line of credit from a bank in the $100k range, if it's needed, because you have "cash" on hand.

I would actually advise getting that line of credit while you live with your parents, so you can use their income as your combined household income and secure even more credit.

Then you'll be ready to move out, and have a solid backing in case your job doesn't fall through or something happens.

But essentially yes, save as much as possible, for the first year, and then you can up some of your fun stuff like get NFLX again, or a Spotify.

Aiming for $25k - $30k is a good bet, and having a line of credit will be very helpful.

Also, try and get one of your parents' cars, just randomly ask them and put the thought into their mind. Unless you have your own already.

Canada.

And yes, they don't negotiate on the vehicle, but they can heavily discount accessories that are Port Installed or Dealer Installed.

The reason Porsche's work like this is because they artificially create this demand, by limiting supply, and then they force you to pay MSRP at purchase, but when you go to trade in, they also give you a "decent" amount, for your next vehicle. It's their way of upselling new Porsche buyers, and bringing them back to Porsche for new vehicles.

It's working extremely well for Porsche as well.

>parents talking about cryptocurrency

Okay thank you user

Any advice on finding a proper deal on rent?

my dad felt for a Nigerian Prince's scan in 2002.

Just don't deal with them and bootstrap yourself

>cryptocurrency
>financially illiterate

Ok then whatever your sayin m8eO

If there's a college where you live, or are planning to move to, check their Facebook groups for the current year class in your age range, and find some student rentals, those are around $300-$400 a month max, any more and you're getting ripped off or more than you need because you only need a place to sleep, since you should be working as much as you can right now.

There will also be groups of kids who band together and lease a house for $1k or $2k a month, and split the cost, this will be a good option too, if you can find one. The house will be way more decent than a student rental room or apartment.

I am in college but I just live with my parents and commute there

Then that makes it way easier to find a place.

Actually you do not understand how Porsche operates. The listed MSRP on Porsches is a long way off what people pay. Typically Porsches will be loaded with 10s of thousands of dollars of optional extras. That is actually how they make their money, not 'artificial scarcity'.

The Macan S that you see listed with a used price of $60k may have cost close to $100k new given the optional extras. The dealership base price will not reflect those extras. It is just a price to get you in the door.

Practically every car depreciates rapidly from sale. A very select few cars get to be considered classics and will recoup some or more than the initial value.

This.

Although from what I understand that's exactly how Ferrari works.

They can't sell way over MSRP new so they are owned for a few months by the first owner then sold for profit.

my parents are worse. they can't save for the life of them they always spend whatever amount they have. and if they don't have any money they just "borrow" some from me.

This sounds like a Veeky Forums version of that Veeky Forums pasta that gets posted all the time over there.

>Keep telling me about the newest MLM and cryptocurrency and all this shit

Your parents must be rich then.. I've only made mad profits off crypto

Lmao i created both

Sounds like your parents are living a fantastic life. You're just mad they aren't hoarding it all to leave for you in the will.

Make your own fortune and leave your parents alone.

So bait or you just save a copy and throw these up?

My comparison was between dumping all excess money into the mortgage vs what is considered a bare minimum amount of returns you can make with the same money. You originally said your parents were dumb for not having paid of their mortgage and I was giving you an example as to why that was not the case. Obviously, they could potentially see better returns if they more actively manage the money.

As for your other stuff about making money selling one year old cars for 16% more than you paid for them that sounds like a pretty dumb investment strategy and I'm skeptical it will pan out the way you expect it to but if that's something you can really accomplish then good luck.

Youre a nigger and just want them to think your way.

hnngh

Dude, seriously? Then you posted the Veeky Forums one like, at least a year ago. Why are you so angsty over your parents. Why have you still not just gotten a job and moved out yet.

I don't know man

I kind of fell into a depressive slump

they're spooked as fuck, you'd have to be a master psychologist to get through that mess

pull the plug

lol dude leasing a car is a terrible idea...who told you that was a financially literate thing to do? Your parents?

My girlfriend's parents are full on getting sucked into an MLM. Feels bad man.

she might have inherited their inferior genetics, be careful

There's so many good people sucked into MLMs, honestly.

They seem nice enough but fuck they're so retarded. Ya know what I mean?

Parents bought a house for a good price around 2005. Right before the housing market crash they did a bunch of expensive renovations to the house, accumulating a total of 3 mortgages. Then the house got way underwater but they didn't foreclose or qualify for special housing programs.

Then they decided to move to another house and rent the underwater house at a loss. They hemorrhage $2000 a month to this day. Literally money just thrown away.
I suppose parents are role models in that they teach their children what not to do.

Is that a cock?

It's Naomi Woods' sexy little pussy

because back in the day you had upward ladder mobility and you could work somewhere regardless of crap like "dynamic attitude" or "vibrant personality".
back in the day you could present an idea and people would follow along, nowdays if you make any unwanted noise you get fired on the stop.

>she might have inherited their inferior genetics, be careful

she herself is actually very financially literate, frugal and a good saver. Though I worry it might present future financial issues, say, if her mother tries to borrow money from her. Or it might put pressure on the relationship, if her mother starts harassing my family to join or something

>They seem nice enough but fuck they're so retarded. Ya know what I mean?

I sat through one of their presentations. It's fucking insane. It's like a cult. You literally cannot critique them without getting an overload of perfectly canned responses. And all the while they "neg" you if they detect any sort of scepticism in you.

e.g.
"Oh, it's okay, some people just are slow decision makers. That's ok."

I said the last thing you should ever do with your money is be hasty, and I got scoffed at like a petulant child, and they started attacking me personally, albeit subtly. Crazy stuff. It's shocking to see this woman who masquerades as a fun-loving mum suddenly become a ruthless cunt before your very eyes.

They are talking to their audience, not you, so you should do the same thing. Your goal is to keep shooting at their feet and make them dance.

You make plain statements then ask what their response has to do with said statements, taking every opportunity to repeat facts and logic.

And my mom told me to invest in CDs during Christmas.

You can, you know, ignore them.

Like in Christmas CDs?

do those increase in value?

Also, financial protip for when you're buying a car in America:

If there's a hatchback version of whatever car you want, get the hatchback version. They hold their value a fuck ton better.

>ignore or gently nod and shrug at their wacky conspiracy/WWIII/political theories or excuses.
>do whatever job or training you think you need to and try to do it 100%
>take over all chores and start running their house for them
>make it so when you leave they goddam miss you
>prepare your anus for them to call asking for money or help as you grow up and they grow old.
if you're young enough to be nagged about stuff, shift into overdrive and get that study and/or earning so done, do all their housework, cook for them, wash their clothes, sleep 4 hours per day and see what that life makes you into by the time you're 30.
Your post is a squabble about who's the boss, you should be, you're younger and stronger.

>I suppose parents are role models in that they teach their children what not to do.
Older siblings are good for that too

true senpai

I think i may do that. any specific suggestions on what to do when parents complain about stuff idiotically though? They're always pessimistic and annoying as fuck.

Should I just try to constantly keep busy to maximize my time and avoid them too?

I know this is bait, but certificates of deposit.

Given their return, they're only suitable for really old people with 5-10 years to live.

bump

My parents are worse than yours.

My dad worked his ass off, some years even making 6 figures, only to rent a shitty apartment or house over his entire lifetime and spend his disposable income on weed and random bullshit on eBay. Died 8 years ago of cancer which he was unprepared for. The only thing I inherited was a small settlement from a lawsuit after his death.

Mom never grew up and was her daddy's little princess who always bailed her out. Chose to do drugs and live like the world's oldest 16 year old. Can never be somewhere on time even to save her life. No savings of any kind. When her parents died she inherited something like 37k USD which was completely wiped out within 6 months. Now in her late 50's she's learning the hard way.

Learn from the mistakes of your parents OP. If they won't educate you then at least learn from them about what NOT to do in life, if you aren't a complete brain dead genetic failure you aren't doomed to walk down the same path and in fact will help guide you down the right path in life. Living the life my parents chose to live makes me physically want to vomit.

don't you ever wish you took out life insurance policies and then kill your parents?

I honestly feel kind of bad for saying this but I'm hoping that my mom would be put out of her misery because every time I get a phone call from her it's about some depressing shit that was self-inflicted but her ego is too huge for her to realize it.

My dad was way more responsible than her even though he was dumb with his money. At least he had a steady job and worked his ass off to provide for me. My mom was like a grown ass 16 year old.

>buying stocks on home equity credit
you're stupider than your parents

>"our" mortgage
and more entitled

>The bank provided us a line of credit worth $275k when we bought the house, however, we only required $170k for the mortgage, so we "have" access to $275k, and we have "used" $170k of that.

You probably don't know that maxing out a line of credit is just about the worst thing you can do for your credit report, even worse than being in collections

stay in school kid

we need to somehow end bad parents

Hahahaha Jesus Christ

I shut them out of my life by jumping to work right after school and don't come home till 11 (working under the table can boost your legal work hours if underage but watch out) and if you have money after saving pay for a hotel and treat yourself ;)

My mother fell for an online scam and sent away thousands via moneygram to probably some Pajeet. She received six figures in equity after her divorce and it's probably all gone. I don't think it's a coincidence so many here on Veeky Forums have parents with poor financial sense. We want to do well financially because we don't want to make the same mistakes as our parents. We know first-hand the damage they can cause.

At least you're not this guy:
lulz.com/the-joker-brokers-tale-so-stupid-it-cant-be-a-lie-306/

Here's the whole thread if you're interested:
warosu.org/biz/thread/1515048

>tfw your dad is the fix it yourself type and refuses to spend a dike unless absolutely neccesary

I respect him for being frugal but sometimes it is annoying

#rekt as fuck. Fun role playing though. Go pretend to be knowledgeable about anything someplace else

>index funds are for idiots, invest in luxury vehicles instead

Wow someone fucking screen cap this thread. The clueless kid with no marketable skills to get a job and move out from his probably immigrant parents. Enjoy being a wage slave for the next 45 + years. But at least you looked really cool in your NICE cars

leasing can be good if you lease a smal car
for 150$ month
Cars are something that lose their price very fast
if you buy a car and drive it out of the sellers garage it loses 25%
and after some years the electronics die our or some plastic parts break
and reapairing can be realy expensive maybe the part costs 50ct but until they find it you pay hundreds of $

if you lease you dont have to worry about the brakepads, the whipers, the springs oilchange usw

tfw
>i have a uncle that sold his company
> i gues for about 20milion
>he had no kids
>money would have gone to my grandma
> her 3 kids (my mom)
>so ~6m for my mum

Tfw he put all his money into a fundation
and no one will see the money again

no.

why?

not retarded. alot of people can't recognize sales tactics. they don't teach that in hs

Ew disgusting vag
What am I supposed to do with THAT

>What am I supposed to do with THAT
Many things

When this is supposed to make you the smart guy regarding money and investments, I'd put your parents above you right now.