Was Nat Turner justified in using violence to free black people?

I do think his overall efforts actually made the slavery situation more pernicious and the life of enslaved blacks worse in the long term. As a result of his uprising Southerner treatment of slaves became more brutal, and more limited. Slaves were no longer allowed to be educated, and the fear that abolition would lead to the massacre of white plantation families made the South more resolved than ever to preserve the status quo.

It didn't work and made the stereotype of black people being animals stronger. So no.

Killing civilians is always wrong. That said, Nat Turner was a lot more justified in his violence than Han Xin or Julius Caeser or Christopher Columbus or Andrew Jackson or a whole host of other "great heroes".

That's because there's nothing more disastrous than a failed revolution.

>gang violence and drugs are worse than slavery
No thanks, I'd rather live in even a shithole like Detroit than be a slave.

Agreed. Keeping the kids alive would have also given them bargaining power via hostages.

Killing white people is never okay even if it was for a good reason.

Do you think Nat Turner knew about the French Revolution? What about the Haitian?

He seems to have been a pretty smart guy, but I'm wondering how worldly even a particularly intelligent enslaved person could be.

Yes.

Any man born into slavery has the right to use violence to free himself of that opression.

Or are you saying the Spartacus rebellion wasn't justified?
Or when G-d himself used his power and presence to free the Israelite turks from the ancient Khanate of Egypt?

Which is why it's up to the slaver to keep the slave from fucking revolting by being the stronger entity.
But as we know the white race are incapable of this cause of their inferior nature and lust for Big African Zulu spears.

Difficult to answer. Turner's grand motivations aren't known, but it can be assumed he wanted the abolition of slavery across the South and believed violence was the means by which should this be done. Nat Turner really was Lenin writ small, or perhaps a less successful Spartacus born 1900 years later.

Impressed by this thread, by the way. Really glad that Hiro gave us an alternative to /pol/

>DAE le ghetto is worse than slavery
Truly the most hilarious "logic" that only someone living a ridiculously sheltered life would even consider. Why don't you go to a poor black neighborhood and ask any of them if they'd rather be in slavery?

No. Violent resistance to slavery is futile and ultimately self-defeating. Slavery is the natural order of society and is justified through necessity. Slavery has existed ever since the Upper Paleolithic in every society in the world more advanced than the band system, and is responsible for the creation and preservation of all civilizations in history, including our own in the present day. The clothes on your back and the iPhone you're reading these words on right now were made by slaves. Would some Falun Gong in a Chinese concentration camp screwing together the case on the next gadget you order from AliExpress be justified in stabbing his overseer in the neck with the screwdriver? Does it even matter to you?

>"le moral relativity"
Easily the most plebian opinion

You can tell when someone truely had no idea how hellish black majority places in America are.

Nowhere near as hellish as slavery.

Yes user because getting stabbed to death in daylight at any moment is worse than slavery, or how about if you are a woman getting molested or raped all the time raped so much that the police dont even bother to investigate them anymore. How about you trying to do a good thing and here are random packs of blacks that start messing with you and kill you for fun. That is what living in Detroit is like today you stupid sheltered suburban liberal fuck.

Is the average lifespan in Detroit 18? No? Than get fucked retard, slavery is worse.

Your paranoid fantasy does not in any way equate with the very real horror of what slavery was like.

Well yeah

Just like Brevik saving white people

I'd take being a slave on a cozy antebellum plantation earning my living through honest outdoor labour over being a crack-addicted gangbanger in the projects sucking up food stamps any day, but if I was black at all I'd probably just kill myself to make the world a slightly better place.

Lifespan in Detroit depends whether you live in an area police care about.
Living around your kind is a horror show its unbelievable we have allowed you wild animals to destroy our societies to the extent you have done. Slavery created stability and peace for your kind, your just a savage wild beast thats why you desire your chaotic violent life to stability and direction like any nigger beast.

You would break down crying in five minutes if you had to pick cotton in the Southern Heat.

Why would break down crying from picking cotton you stupid fucking nigger? Your kind is adapted to high heat so what do you care your just a dumb animal looking for excuses to do stuff your animal instincts dont approve of.

Also this is the most recent armed robberys in Detroit.

>Getting stabbed in daylight
Yes, because slaves on the plantation lived a life fee of any form of physical violence.

>Women getting molested or raped all the time so the police don't even bother to investigate them

You're comparing this to slavery, where enslaved women could be raped by their owners without any consequences whatsoever.

>Doing a good thing there and random packs of blacks kill you for fun
Do good things in slavery like try to release people from slavery and you get murdered too.

And in all of this there is the difference that in Detroit you are in a miserable condition but still are free and technically can improve oneself and work one's way upwards, but in slavery you're eternally enslaved. One can see the difference in lifespan alone; the average slave might expect to live to little more than 20 years at birth; I doubt even the average Detroit resident faces such a miserable life.

Nobody argues that places like Detroit aren't miserable shitholes, but your sanity is severely in doubt if you place SLAVERY as better than them.

>kill myself to make the world a slightly better place
you should start now; no need to wait to be black

Blacks were actually able to function and even contribute to society under slavery. Now?

Why are you giving a serious response to bait? It's just a /pol/fag looking to waste everyone's time.

Careful what you wish for. Without white people paying your welfare check you'd starve.

Society is a spook.

>Yes, because slaves on the plantation lived a life fee of any form of physical violence.
Oh shut up nigger you treated slaves far worse than us.
>You're comparing this to slavery, where enslaved women could be raped by their owners without any consequences whatsoever.
Your women should be glad to have white dicks thrusted into them.
>Do good things in slavery like try to release people from slavery and you get murdered too.
Slaves are property what you are doing is like taking away someone's tools.
>And in all of this there is the difference that in Detroit you are in a miserable condition but still are free and technically can improve oneself and work one's way upwards, but in slavery you're eternally enslaved. One can see the difference in lifespan alone; the average slave might expect to live to little more than 20 years at birth; I doubt even the average Detroit resident faces such a miserable life.
You blacks are better of as slaves rather than terrorist psychotic beast that ruin America every fucking day.
>but your sanity is severely in doubt if you place SLAVERY as better than them.
The black crime rate was nonexistent during slavery negro.

>A nigger doesnt care about civilization
Expected

And spooks should have no place in society.

top kek

you passed a black person at the supermarket once when when you were buying coke zero and doritos and you think you know about ghetto life now. your delusions would be funny if i thought you were trolling, but this is so pathetic i think you are serious

Your that autist from the other thread, aren't you?

>Against slave patrols, militias, and overseers

Yes, that is more than understandable.

>Against women and children of masters and unarmed passer-byers
>To forward the cause of abolition

Hell no.

I cannot understand why people continue to admire this man considering how his actions led to an extreme crackdown on the rights of free blacks and the derailing of abolitionist efforts in the state of Virginia (the 1832 referendum to abolish slavery failed by just a single vote) and elsewhere.

Nat Turner not only failed to achieve his goal and caused the deaths of hundreds of slaves killed in retaliation, but confirmed the long-held suspicion that blacks were violent and could not be trusted or considered equals to whites.

At least with John Brown, he went out of his way to avoid killing anyone unless they got in his way.

James Hammond... Is that you?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mudsill_theory

>I'd take being a slave on a cozy antebellum plantation
>cozy
>only 4/100 slaves made it to age 60
>live in a shack with 20 other slaves
>have cholera and malaria year-round

nigga.

>Nathan Bedford Forrest
Opinion on slavery discarded.

>only 4/100 slaves made it to age 60
>have cholera and malaria year-round

To be fair... If you were White and rich, you'd be lucky to make it to 60 yourself. Disease does not discriminate.

You trying to say something nigga?

Do you realize that rape by owner and overseer was a constant reality for most

Why do you think 40% of African American parental ancestry is northwest European?

>trading food, shelter and clothing for regular murder, rape, and an inability to feed oneself.
Yes. The current standard in Africa and the inner cities is much, much better than the former. Absolutely no contest. You really got my noggin joggin.

>was a constant reality for most
That is false. I'm not saying it didn't happen, but it absolutely wasn't common.

>free black people
Nothing can justify this
>inb4 /pol/
"Wy'all niggas had places to eat, sleep, and work before Lincoln free'd yo black asses". -based Youtube Black guy

Genetics say otherwise.

No.

Genetics doesn't tell you whether conception happened because of rape or not.

Women who are property have literally no means of providing consent

Yeah, but not all southern slave owners were complete assholes who mistreated their slaves whenever they wanted. Many were basically friends/family with their slaves. There were slaves who even willingly joined their master to war when they had to go since they genuinely liked their master. And then there were events like that:

>"Numbers of wealthy planters serve as privates side by side with the professional man, the shopkeeper, the clerk, the labourer; and all go through the ordinary fatigue duties incident to camp-life. We saw a poor Negro servant actually shedding tears because his master, on being told off to dig a trench round a battery, would not allow him to 'lend a hand.'"

>no you don't get it they liked being beaten

The image of the southern slave owner abusing his slaves is just propaganda. It happened a lot more rarely than you think, because they all the inhuman monsters that you picture when you think of them.

The patriarchy regards all women as property. All heterosexual intercourse is rape.

I'm pretty sure Chicago is worse. Also, why would you assume he's black? He could be Vietnamese for all you know.

first post best post

Yep

Violence is never justified, though, the circumstances make the case understandable (though still uncondoneable).

Not in Christian ethnics, but in basic, primal concerns, certainly. Why would he feel anything but enmity toward participants of a society which conceived of him and his race as mere appliances and enshrined this status in law and enforced it with torture and death?

I hope you feel the same way about bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

>Now?
Now they have one of the most dominant cultures on the entire globe.

thats a fucking excuse

Einstein never wanted to kill Germans after the Holocaust and what happened to his people

but i guess Einstein is just intellectually more mature than Nat Turner

Explain how Nate Turner would free slaves and keep them freed using only peaceful methods.

explain how Einstein didn't react to killing Germans

of course this is comparing the greatest physicist of all time to a low iq nigger

Nice, answering a question with a question. Profound stuff bro.

Eisten was a physicist first, and a man of jewish heritage second. Not everyone is born to be a fighter. I'd love to see your pussy ass watch your family being taken away in chains.

What about not making their lives more miserables with a futile attempt at revolution?

So apathy is your answer.

Einstein is arguably the greatest physicist...yet he never seeked vengance against the Germans

mr. low iq turner did however against whites

Not doing anything sure beats doing something poorly and making everything worse.

Einstein was an introverted man in his 60's and fat. General S. Patton sought to destroy both Germans and soviets. I can cherry pick examples, too.

In a way, Einstein did the greater revenge in leaving the grip of the Nazis and providing his brilliance to american causes.

I am white, have lived in the ghetto, and not a single thing happened to me. You are living in a delusion. It is a low income area, and as long as you dont get involved with gangs, be an ass for no reason, be racist AF, or stare at people like a weirdo, nothing fucking happens. If you get robbed, just go with it. Call the police after, and most of the time they actually find the guy. Please know what you are talking about before you respond.

You're talking about *after* the fall of the Reich. If a Jew, during the Reich's tenure, led a rebellion and killed a bunch of Germans, could you really say it's not justified? Without invoking Christianity?

living in unsanitary conditions does.

>nothing fucking happens
>If you get robbed

your disrespect to Einstein shows your anti-science and you are unaware of his accomplishments

Ya got me. I hate science. Fuck this computer. Being all well designed and shit. Who the fuck does it think it is?

>if you get robbed, just to with it
Holy fuck, what a cuck
>>>/leftypol/

>liberty
>death

Pick one faggots.

the only right move was sending the slaves back to africa
too bad they killed lincoln though

Sure.

Although I think he mostly used violence because he was severely mentally ill.

john horse was more justified in his war

>dat k/d ratio

Why can't niggas fight?

Absolutely

No social or political movement has ever succeeded without the use of violence or the fear of violence despite the bullshit that's been taught to people by the elites.

>treated like chattel deprived of any form of self-determination who could be murdered, raped and sold at will by owners
>"At least they got clothed and fed when they were slaves"

That's some retarded logic your using.

Bait

Einstein wasn't immediately being oppressed by Germans

Horseshit

The only ones who loved the masters were the house negroes who had a stake in the survival of the system. Every single freed slave post Antebellum period interviewed about their life as slaves and thought fondly about their captivity were either house negroes or under duress to say good things about their former masters.