Hey carfags and bikefags, I would like to take a second to deviate from the normal shitposting and attempt to have a real discussion on the future of motorcycles (and by extension also cars) with regards to speed power.
For your carfags that do not follow the industry, buckle up, because it's kinda interesting. Motorcycle manufacturers have intentionally hamstrung the development of motorcycles with regards to speed and power since the early 2000s. As the lore goes, Suzuki put out the 1999 Hayabusa which had a top speed of 194mph and the manufacturers came together to quietly agree not to engage in a "speed war" and catch the attention of governments (European governments were getting nervous at the time) so they agreed to cap their speeds at 186mph/300kmph which is why every street legal commercially available sport bike you see is limited to those speeds. Furthermore, the engine power itself is limited. I think 185 crank horsepower is the limit they have agreed upon as well.
So get this: for the last decade (more desu), there have been ZERO changes to the power production of sport bikes. These companies have managed to continue their sales by making pointless changes year after year to bikes in an effort to make them seem like they are new and redesigned. Styling changes, the addition of electronics, weight reduction, etc... ANYTHING but actually making more power or the bike's faster.
So my question is: how much longer can they keep this shit up before consumers say enough is enough and stop buying their shit? It's not like the physics of the gyroscopic effect changes from year to year. Sport bikes are literally the same geometry-wise today as 10 years ago. There is no reason to buy these new bikes.
The only way around this I can see (as seen in the Ford GT and some other newer model cars today) is the addition of a "track mode" which is an electronic setting that unlocks more power from the engine. Through servos in the exhaust and probably the intake, a higher air flow is accommodated and changes to the fuel table unlock this additional power. Ducati does something similar with the Desmosedici and the Panigale I think where they can advertise a particular crank horsepower but you have to install the "race exhaust" for the maximum performance which is included with your purchase.
Gabriel Taylor
And a lot of this obviously boils down to emissions and other government regulations. These manufacturers have to accommodate the lowest common denominator when putting out a new model so they don't have to reinvest in redesigning it in a few years. Just imagine how much more leeway these companies would have if they didn't have to meet California's requirements and instead just met the requirements of the 49 other states. Just imagine if they didn't have to meet the requirements of Euro4 AND didn't have to anticipate the Euro5 changes either.
Justin Martin
>California and Europe pussyifying everything as usual Every board I visit, its quite literally the same thing. /out/, Veeky Forums, /k/, Veeky Forums, /pol/, and even /tv/ theres always some stupid bullshit that comes from these hellholes.
Jaxon Perez
t. the country of 65 mph highways and mandated 20 airbags for new production cars
Austin Hernandez
i like fast bikes as much as the next person, and being able to go three times the upper speed limit on the freeway is cool but there's no good argument that supports making them infinitely faster adding weight and power until you have a flightless airplane doesn't make sense for consumer use in public space
Connor Lewis
>there have been ZERO changes to the power production of sport bikes. >what is the kawasaki h2?
You're sort of wrong. They've made changes, but the biggest thing is that they limit the top speed to 186mph/300kmh from the factory.
Also there are numerous bikes making over 185hp.
Landon Butler
Take a wild guess as to which state pushed for these the hardest.
In Texas (my state) you have to drive for hours sometimes to get from town to town. This is why we have limits that go up to 85 (which everyone goes over anyways) and we push a lot for friendly driving too, so that we reduce road rage faggotry.
Cali on the other hand... They're well aware that their retarded population will refuse to stop growing, so seeing as most idiots who live in that state are used to being stuck in stand-still traffic for hours, either because some moron crashed or there's some minor repairs being done to the road, they choose to leave road speeds slow and force lower emission cars on their population because they can't imagine where in the entire state you would need to go over 60mph. They're under the impression that they are the trendsetter, when its clear as fucking day that no one has really followed in their footsteps (on anything really) because no other state is willing to spend money for on something no one is asking for, not even New York.
Camden Mitchell
>muh Texas >muh libtards >muh responsible fast driving
It's not about top speed. You can't even get to the top speed on a race track before you get to turn 1. Sport bikes are budget race bikes that are designed with circuit racing first and then starbucks. The parts are cheap, but most mortals can't utilize or afford the best stuff. They're designed to be "good enough" and hit a price point.
I think you also run into the physical barrier of usable power. Tires are only so good and even the best liter bikes have electronic for mortals to not send the bike to the moon. More power will really just melt the tires. Look at MotoGP. Million dollar bikes that go 200+MPH. Unicorn blood tires that play significant role in races where some people blow their load early and lose positions slowly later as their tires are toast.
I realize you mean production normiebikes, but higher top speed is masturbatory in most cases. In order to put more power into the machines you reach a problem with severe diminishing returns with cost:power. You could go buy the Desmosedici or one of those 200k WSBK machines from honda or whomever that was. The new BMW HP4 or whatever made from unobtanium and weighed in somewhere around 300lbs was neato.
However, if all you want to do is hit the top speed on the freeway, air strip, or whatever then you're a colossal faggot anyway,
Oliver Morris
Just so you know as a Californian nobody actually follows the 65mph speed limit and highway patrol doesn't pull you over unless you're driving like a retard weaving in and out of lanes or going over the double yellow into the carpool lane. Also I'm a motorcyclist so at least I can split lanes unlike you losers.
James Kelly
>For your carfags that do not follow the industry, buckle up, because it's kinda interesting. Motorcycle manufacturers have intentionally hamstrung the development of motorcycles with regards to speed and power since the early 2000s. As the lore goes, Suzuki put out the 1999 Hayabusa which had a top speed of 194mph and the manufacturers came together to quietly agree not to engage in a "speed war" and catch the attention of governments (European governments were getting nervous at the time) so they agreed to cap their speeds at 186mph/300kmph which is why every street legal commercially available sport bike you see is limited to those speeds. Furthermore, the engine power itself is limited. I think 185 crank horsepower is the limit they have agreed upon as well. >So get this: for the last decade (more desu), there have been ZERO changes to the power production of sport bikes. These companies have managed to continue their sales by making pointless changes year after year to bikes in an effort to make them seem like they are new and redesigned. Styling changes, the addition of electronics, weight reduction, etc... ANYTHING but actually making more power or the bike's faster. LMAO did you forget when BMW came out with the S1000RR and blew all that jap shit away you worthless weeb fanboi.
Justin Gonzalez
I dunno OP, why do you need to go over 186mph on the streets? You can already get away from the police with a 600cc supersport.
Ryan Myers
>185 hp limit The RSV4 has 201hp
Bentley Richardson
Who fucking cares? All of BMW's bikes, like their cars, are shit.
Anthony Torres
>being this much of the weeb Is that why the S1000RR was bike of the year when it came out and raised the bar far beyond what any of the jap shit did at the time. You're the worst kind of fanboi.
David Rogers
BMW bikes are pigfat and ugly.
Hunter Perry
>theres always some stupid bullshit that comes from these hellholes. It's California and their meticulous testing that caught Volkswagon and Audi with their MPG cheating scandals. You don't hear of the other 49 states catching anything with their testing.
Easton Reed
Wow, what a service they provided in doing that! Truly, California is our savior!
Liam Davis
>muh cheating >muh evil nazis
>meanwhile every full size SUV barge generates more emissions than a cheater VW compact through double the fuel usage alone >meanwhile soot-blasting brotruckers roam free in the majority of states >meanwhile public emissions testing is lax as fuck and everyone knows a place they can bribe
Jason Cox
Can't help it that many people approve of cheating. Hell, they probably copied homework and cheated/cribbed their way through high school and college exams. To them, cheating is acceptable.
Brayden Williams
Groms are changing everything. Soon the entire younger generation will have one. Get ready, faggots.
Aaron Richardson
Groms are fucking awful.
Camden Johnson
solid post
to me, it seems a bigger problem on the horizon for bikes will be the push for driverless cars. As states start pushing for more driverless cars on the road, there's no way they'll just let motorcycles stay on the road. The nanny state at its finest
Cooper Bennett
That's why they swept the super stock at TT for the last couple of years?
Parker Ortiz
Emissions are retarded.
Elijah Wilson
I'm personally really excited about ABS becoming a standard feature on moderately priced bikes. I've never before considered a new bike, but the safety benefits of ABS have me following the new market closely now so I can hopefully get a good deal on a two or three year old model in two or three years.
I'm not sure how I feel about the mainstreaming of slipper clutches though. I get the safety benefit, but I'm an instinctual engine braker (from riding a lot of dual sports and third world bikes with shit brakes) so think it'll throw me off.
Isaac Davis
The magic of the new Ford GT is that it physically swaps out the suspension in track vs. street mode.
Different power mappings has been done for a long time on cars and bikes.
Thomas Thomas
This, at some point the power becomes useless, no matter how many computer nannies you have trying to keep the bike under control.
The current crop of superbikes is plenty fast enough for the average person, trust me. Having 500whp is great on paper but in reality there just isn't much need for it, no matter how hard you try and justify.
>inb4 bikes aren't about justification
You're justifying why you need 500hp.
Outside Bonneville there isn't really many other places you can safely use that kind of power so there isn't much point for manufacturers to build machines that have it.
Not to mention there is more to bikes than power and speed.
Liam Butler
Lots of bullshit in here. The big four not the euros had a preemptive agreement to limit top speed to 300kph because the 12R was going to put the smack down on the busa...which in turn had just whooped the blackbird. They were worried about governments getting involved so they imposed limits. They are not limiting chp, that's bullshit. Metering it out yes but not specifically limiting it. This is because supers had a life cycle of every two years for a while. The H2R is dynoing at 325whp or so. Many current literbikes are quoting 200chp+ and no the S1000RR Carbon doesn't weigh 300lbs. Groms aren't changing everything...they are just a cheap basic toy to play with. And to say that LSR is for colossal faggots just shows me you know dick. Just because you can or wont use a specific type of bike to it's full potential doesn't mean that others don't every day. That's nonsense. Saying that there is no good argument for making bikes faster is a dumb statement. The same arguments that are presented for cars applies to motorcycles and more encompassing all vehicles. And no it isn't about justification.
If I want a 1000whp turbobus for a daily rider I will because fuck what you think. Don't like them don't ride them. OP you contradict yourself. When you change the hp/wt ratio you improve performance. And yes the top speed might be limited but the acceleration has changed so your only gripe can be the top speed stock. Because gearing changes are SO hard with a bike right? As for the same geometry for bikes...what? They have been an evolving geometry for years and as such have been further and further optimized as new versions of models present themselves by those who develop them. So there are changes made as different groups present what they feel is the optimized bike. It's cyclical...they evolve/devolve into perpetuity. So a new version is presented again and again ad infinitum.
