Veeky Forums

I really like the new mustangs and explorers, but I never owned an American car and I'm scared of shitty UAW "quality"

Yep. They hadn't changed design or parts a whole lot, so they are pretty safe.
Lots of aftermarket support.
Just no ecooost, please.

I'm looking for a more broad opinion.
I do like the Ford product. The trucks are so much nicer than most, and I find the cars just aren't as "tinny" as other japanese shit buckets.
We've improved quality a lot over the past 8 years.

Stop hating yourself and your fellow countrymen.

My 2012 focus has the shuttering transmission issue that had a recall on it. Have you given any deals for trading these in? Just wondering if you have dealt with something similar to this. Mine went out at 67k miles and it has been doing fine so far, currently at 80k.

Do you make a decent wage working there?

You hitting your metrics op?

I'm sorry for you buying that.
There's a widespread tranny issues for a few years now
>will be fixed in the 2018 Focus

And no, no trade in deals. Ford has put in place an unlimited warranty on transmission issues, so as long as you like the car, it's free to fix the tranny as much as you would like.

No, we make peanuts if we sell 8 cars or less
>small town, but busy store

You start to see bigger money when you're selling around 12-20 cars. Other wise, you're getting a check for a whopping $1198 every month.

I'm doing alright...we're a fairly well review dealership with a lot of repeat business, so I don't have to have a fight everytime I make a deal.
Happy customers.

I just don't think I can live with the fact that when you buy murrican, a kang has touched your car before you have.

It's actually kinda fucked.
I sold a $91,000 Lincoln Navigator, and my commission was $250.

>mfw

nah Apple in Columbia

Now that's fucked

Well make sure you find your wife before she leaves highschool because if you meet her after collage age, the Kangz have had their way with her already.

How? Is your commission not based on front end gross profit? Or was the deal super fucked and there was no profit because you went stupid money on a trade? I need to know more. I have sold cars for 10 years and that's the worst commission for big money car I have ever hears of.

Yea thanks man, I paid only $200 for the $1600 transmission job. The car is a solid daily driver except for that one problem, but the rebuilt tranny is doing a lot better than how it came new.

We get 25% of gross profit.
So our GM will sit with us and go over our commission sheet at the end of the month...and apparently we made $1000...
Doesn't include holdback, so yeah, doesn't make sense.

Why does this dodge employee look like a black Slavic pimp? Explain.

grew up on fords, have owned at least one ford through my adult life.

now i own a 74 f100 and a 08 335i

the only chevy i've ever owned gave me nothing but problems, worked on the damn thing constantly just to keep it running.

ford is patrician taste at plebeian cost. except new cars, all new cars are too fucking expensive.

My opinion of Ford is that they have no cars that are of any interest to me.

What interests me are sporty rear-wheel drive cars (not hatchbacks) with design features they can call their own.

When I look at a sedan Fiesta or Focus, all that I see is a car. There is nothing special to it, there's nothing appealing about it, there's nothing to get passionate about. A Focus sedan looks like a car, and nothing more than a car. It's no more appealing than any other generic car that any other manufacturer makes, it's just a car. The only thing that might be unique to it are the stylings of the front and rear end, which is shared with every other Ford car just like how other manufacturers tend to share the same front and rear end design elements on most of their cars. Ford also put angry faces on every single car they sell, which I can't stand.

The Mustang is an exception to some of that, but the Mustang is a Mustang and I'm just not interested in Mustangs.

How much would you say a 92 foxbody is worth if I were to trade it in? It's in decent condition with either 107k or 207k miles
And also a 96 f150 with 238k miles with good paint and a pretty straight body

The euro guys look like they're part of a kraftwerk cover band, that fuck each other off stage.

Do you want a gay car, because that's how you get a gay car

You'd be better off selling those privately.
They wouldn't be worth shit to us - right off to auction.

We're only looking at year, mileage, condition. Maybe a few other bits of equipment.

>spotless modern factory
>actual uniforms
>newer tools and machines
>white
versus
>dirty shithole
>wear whatever you want
>old shit
>nigs

Yeah I thought so, thanks
The f150 is an xlt and has practically all the options, the fox isn't really all that, it needs a lot of work before I even consider selling it

never been a ford guy - bowtie all the way. but I can respect ford for what it's brought to cars.
presently I find them uninteresting - shitting out crown vic trim-ups and weird ugly bug shaped crossover things puts it very well.
their trucks are ugly and don't really offer me anything new that an older truck doesn't offer.
triton V10s suck ass to work on and powerstrokes knock like fuck. I really only like old fords because either they had good styling or they were retard simple with no mixing of SAE and metric (fuck you, GM).
ford is just bland to me, really.

Personally hate FORD, awful designs plus their infotainment system is powered by Microsoft.

Also, KIA Mitsubishi service advisor here

The new Sync 3 infotainment system is soooooooo much better than most cars.
>the old system was Microsoft powered, and dogshit.

So much better voice recognition than most luxury vehicles.
But the designs are a little uninspired. But so are Kia and Mitsubishi...

I've only ridden in my sister's '16 Escape once, but it's a nice ride. The engine shut down and start at intersections would be a HUGE turn off for me. I'd be really worried about how much that will shorten the life of whatever system it's utilizing to do that. I think she's really happy with her car so far though.

Only other experience I have with Ford was a 90s Explorer my mom drove when I was a kid but I don't remember anything about that car other than it was green.

god that "fuel save shutoff" shit pisses me off so fucking much. I don't get the point - wouldn't you spend more fuel and wear starting and stopping the engine every time rather than idling for like 90 seconds? a traffic jam would be a fucking nightmare.
also, fordbro, mind putting on a tripcode so we know who's who?

Stop'n'go systems are retarded, I agree. They supposedly come with special alternators and batteries. However, with KIA, when battery is just a bit low, system just stops working. We have a lot of people who don't even remember that their car should shut off at stops

My '10 has the original Sync
Voice recognition is still good, and it's simple with no touch screen and has never given me issues, the stupid Sony sound system however, that goddamn DSP makes it expensive as fuck to get actual power out

>op here
it's part of adhering to the government's stricter emissions regulations.
Fords with the stop-start feature have upgraded alternators and starting motors to compensate for the constant on-off.
Also, none of the infotainment or climate controls shut off when the car stops. It will turn back on when it needs to, for battery reasons.

But it's not about voice recognition that I'm complaining, It's the whole system. Last time I was in a ford, it was so frustrating to go through trip computer even. Plus that whole volvoesque whole phone number keypad is just ridiculous.

Why did they keep selling Ford Focus with the crap dual clutch transmission? Did you ever tried to convince people to get the manual model despite it being available only in the cheapest trims?

>op here
They tried to fix it...but it was an error in the PCM. Computer wants to makes shifts smooth, so it rides the clutch.
That wears out super fast and causes stuttering.

For customers looking for a Focus....only very few were even open to the idea of a manual.
>I personally am mmr
Their loss. I'd offer, but no...they want nav, leather, heated everything, sunroof, etc....all for $200 a month, after rolling in the $8000 they still owe on their last car.
>Fucking retards

I used to have a 2000 Mustang. I looked at the new Mustangs and the Fiesta ST when I was looking for a new car, but I didn't end up getting either. I'm sure I'll get another Mustang eventually though, they're a lot of fun.

I'm glad I dodged a bullet there then. I bought a '13 SE Sedan for cheap, with the good old MTX-75 5-speed. I've never had any major problem with the car, only some issues there and there mostly my fault due neglecting maintenance a bit.

Hey user, I bought a car today. From my experience with car dealers, there are three types of dealers.

>Type 1: beta males who are low pressure, but don't say the right things to make the sale. One dealer, when he didn't have what I wanted in stock (SUV with 4WD under $10,000), just said "uhhhh okay, y'all have a good one" and got up and left the table. We were inside at the desk, too.
>Type 2: super alpha Chad salesmen who are way too aggressive. This one dealer was trying to see if he had a particular car on the lot, and he asked my dad how he was doing. My dad said, "Fine, how about yourself?", and the guy responded by yelling (indoors), "LET ME SEE IF I CAN FIND THIS CAR." Way too aggressive. He didn't have what we wanted, and even if he did, he probably would have fucked with us on the price.
>Type 3: These car salesmen have the Midas touch. They know when to be assertive, and they know when to back off and let the customer think. Usually a much older gentleman, who has been in the business for a long time. My dad has bought two Chevys from a salesman who certainly falls into Tier 3, and the salesman that I bought my vehicle from today knew when to chill/when to be assertive, as well.

Not really a question, but just some of my observations about how car dealers operate, and what it takes to be successful. It's surprising how many shitty ones there are out there, given how cut throat the industry is. Have a good one, desu

Do you have a Lincoln dealer? Are there plans to make standalone lincoln dealers like they are in Canada?

My experience with more recent Fords has been decent.

1999 Ford Explorer Sport - Shit, but that whole generation was bad
2003 Ford Taurus - FWD fleet vehicle. Under-powered, transmission issues (AWLS? pin)

More current vehicles have been decent.

2009 Ford Expedition Limited - Seat adjustment track popping, transmission software is mediocre. Spark plugs are an issue on 2008 and earlier Triton V8's.
2011 Lincoln MKS - EcoBoost is direct injection, but Ford has no process to decarb the valves. The PTU is a weak point.

We bought the 2009 Expedition Limited at 64K miles, and is now at 145K. Has had plugs, a transmission software update, brakes, and tires. Used to tow horses around the state.

The 2011 Lincoln MKS was purchased with 55K miles, and has 117K now. It's gotten: Plugs x2, rotors, tires, two coil packs, a gauge cluster, NAV screen. It gets 1K miles week, is fun enough to drive, comfortable for distances, and gets 25MPG when I'm not making excessive boost.

I like Ford trucks. I've owned a 1998 F-150 and now own a 2010 F-250. My parents on the other hand are die hard Dodge fanboys. Growing up my parents had a Diplomat station wagon, Intrepid, and currently own a Caliber. Surprisingly all of those Dodge cars were solid as fuck. They ran for years and the only time they sold one was because they wanted something new.

Stop making fun of our nigs, euronigger

They have a good performance lineup at a decent price.
My dad likes his Lincoln too so there's that.
So I guess as of right now they're ok.
I'd like to see them put their v8 in something other than the mustang though. I'm also concerned about the future of said performance lineup...

I've got bad news for you user. They're making cars in China soon and shipping them here. It's only gonna get worse.

How do you feel about the killing of the fiesta? Was it ever a big seller, or was it was waste and the killing justified?

For me, I've always been a Japanese car guy, but my family did have a crown Vic a long time ago. It was pretty cool, but man, those things are big. Even compared to our 1997 Accord it seemed big.
I like their recent cars, not enough to ever buy one though. I'd rather buy a Civic. Ford trucks have always been awesome. If I ever needed a truck for actual hauling, it'd be up there with Toyota for me.

I'm in the market for something more like a roadster for the moment. Ford doesn't have much to offer there.

Kind of a shame because you'd think with domestic pricing an access to MURICAN engine lines they could put something together to corner some of the market share.

Shit cars that are just copy-paste versions of far superior designs.

Literally china: the company

>wouldn't you spend more fuel and wear starting and stopping the engine every time
During the EPA mileage test, stopping the engine when the car is not moving boosts the MPG. It's gaming the system. But the method causes more wear and tear on the engine and starter, but that is transferred to the customer. And hey, if the engine fails sooner, that means more new cars will be sold.

>However, with KIA, when battery is just a bit low, system just stops working.
That prevents sulphating of the battery. In my GM car with start/stop, the second battery seems to have sulphated. It doesn't seem to hold much of a charge anymore. The main battery is fine though. The stop periods last about 10 to 12 seconds before the second battery runs low enough for the computer to switch the engine back on.

I had a mid-90s Ferd Ranger. It was more or less trouble free until I bumped the oil pan and the rear main seal went out on it. After that got fixed, it was more or less trouble free again. Kept up on oil changes the whole time. That 3.slow though - all the fuel economy of a V6, and all the power of an I4. Rest in peace you crappy Vulcan.

Consumer Reports consistently ranks Ferd as average in reliability over the years from what I've seen and sometimes when Ferds go on sale, they'll recommend them.

I find it amusing that Ferd has been able to make DOHC V8s (Modular) since almost forever but GM tried and failed and hasn't tried again (Northstar).

Ferd's philosophy is that the Mustang can do it all, if they can just find the right parts from the parts bin for the application.

They have supposedly fired Microsoft and rebuilt their infotainment software from in-house. Consumer Reports says it's now OK. Not great, but OK.

Sales shits can't do anything but lie, since that's the entire job in the first place.

Proof:
>ford
>435,000
>km

My perception of Ferd is that their trucks and the reputation of their trucks are what they care about the most. Everything else gets some attention but it's at a lower priority best effort kind of level.

fordtransmissionsettlement.com/

Theres a lawsuit going on currently with these transmissions. not over yet but I received a notice in the mail for it. the website I linked has all the information about what you may be eligible for. There is fine print on how much they will be willing to give you, but it sounds like you would probably get a good trade in credit based on the shit you've had happen.

>op here
There is talk about splitting them up, like Toyota and Scion did, but we don't have the market up here
>Canada
It wouldn't make any business sense.

>op here
I totally know what you mean.

There are times when someone might coming in for a super ridiculous car which I KNOW we do not have
>"Uh, yeah, do you have any used Focus RS around? I've got a budget of $250 a month"
>me: "Used Focus RS...? Ok, and are you looking to finance for 100,000months? Because $250/month (over an average finance term of 60 months) is only $15,000"
I usually take down their information and tell them we get lots of cars coming in on trade - we'll call you when we have something suitable.

And yeah, lots of shit head dealers around. I've been to other Ford stores in town, in plain clothes, and was appalled. Half the guys don't know what the fuck their talking about....
>was told some F-150's have cooled rear seats....not true at all
>Only the 502A Lariat and up have heated rear seats
>only the Lincoln Continental (with the rear seat package) and MKT with a special rear seat package, can get cooled rear seats....

If there's one single thing a salesweasel can do to justify his existence - KNOW YOUR PRODUCT.

I have a salesman in the family and he says the internet age is like a godsend because now he gets people coming in who know exactly what model they want and about what it should cost so he doesn't have to waste as much time on bullshit and can just move inventory.

>op here
I'm Canadian...? We use kilometres

The internet is a blessing and a curse.
I KNOW my product. Cold. I pride myself on that...I'm young, so I'm not a fucking dinosaur salesman who never needed to know anything.

That being said, I love it when customers (most) come in thinking they know everything about the vehicle they're looking at, yet have never actually driven or put hands on it. There's a tonne of things to point out that you cannot know without driving or touching. Trust me. It helps a lot when you show knowledgeable customers little things they can't find online
>However, some nerds just know fucking everything (usually Mustang and Focus RS and ST guys)

The curse of the internet:
customers come in having built out their PERFECT vehicle on ford.ca or ford.com. Then, when they come in to buy, and we don't have the EXACT fucking vehicle in their configuration, it's impossible to talk them into something else on our lot, even if it's a nearly identical vehicle. It's frustrating at times.

Decent value depending on the model. Reliability could be better, if you want that and it might be more worthwhile, see the Jap's. Leagues ahead of GM though in most cases.

Steer clear of bigass SUV's from any manufacturer because they're stupid vehicles and reliability can be shit, also fuck Mexico Fiesta's.

And if there's one thing about selling I hate, it's people wasting your time. I can understand why a lot of them turn to drugs and alcohol to cope with it.

Then just tell them you can special order it from the factory. It's the same commission on the sale, whether it's on the lot or not, right?

>op here
Exactly. My dealership is located in a shitty part of a metro area, so we get a lot of dogshit foot traffic from crackheads that have no idea what they're doing by walking our lot.
>they'll have fucking grocery bags in hand, and our sales manager will be still yelling for salesman to go and talk to them...like, we know they're a fucking doper. It's a waste

Last time I went to a stealership there was some mess to do with buying out of state and having to wait a day for some insurance technicality. Otherwise the deal would have been closed within an hour of walking in and announcing I wanted to test drive a car they had on the lot that I'd found on the internet.

While sitting there I had to listen to hours of like a group of four people (what?) trying to haggle over loans and upgrades and options like it was kindergarten or something. I felt bad for the dude trying to get them to settle on fucking anything and trying to help them. I had to stifle a laugh when he finally got mad and told them that if they left and came back tomorrow all deals would be off the table and he would just screw them over instead.

Is there a reason the chucklefucks in service don't know about mountune?
I've gone to two dealers and neither service department knows a thing about it.

There's nothing too special about the service department at a dealer, other than maybe some sooper speshul tools and some sooper sekrit computer software. The techs themselves are no better and often worse than the indies. Always read the Yelp reviews of a dealer's service department before going there.

It depends on the time of year. Earlier in the year, the factory is still making 2017's, but this time of year, all 2017 has stopped back in June/mid July. Also, we're always going to be more inclined to make a sale which would count for that month.

If not, then it's into locates...from other dealerships, which sucks. Some dealerships don't cooperate and will try to fuck you (the dealership) with bullshit.
However, if the car is super fucking whacky, then we have no choice. But it's often someone wants a silver, black, or white car, but won't be willing to spend an extra $800 for one option that we have in one of our cars on our lot. Fuck.

wow so you basically get 0.25%+ commission?

>op here
I couldn't comment - I'm in sales...there are lots of knowledgeable, passionate techs down in service....but there are people that just work there. You know?
They don't know or care about aftermarket or performance parts.

I've since decided to go to a shop for what i want done, I was just surprised that they didn't know about it.

Ah yes, making the monthly numbers. So the sale doesn't really count until the car comes in, I take it?

Now that's something I didn't really know. So if you are going to special order, best to do it in mid-January to June then. I'll have to keep that in mind.

The sale only counts for the month it was delivered: customer has driven the car off the lot.
Plus, there is a million and one ways for a deal to die. I've seen so many sure deals not happen...couldn't get financed..."my cat died, I can't buy the car now"...I'm a nigger who didn't realize what I was signing for"....I've seen enough shit happen.
So yeah, we want to sell off the lot - less time for things to go wrong and make the sale for the month.
Some customers just won't budge on what they want. Which is a headache, but understandable. A car is a big purchase.
>but not going for a car because it has $400 more equipment than you want....that's $6.67 a month over 60 months....commonnnnn man

He's probably doing that to ensure that the dealership won't get a reputation for not dealing with blacks

Are people receptive to the notion of the time and expense it would take to get a car because it doesn't have the $400 option, and that changing the tires and buying gas and whatever else is going to swamp that in the long run?

Maybe I'm just too rational, but I jumped on something all kinds of shit I wouldn't normally pay for, but it was priced to move and the best available easy option. Now I have heated seats and fancy stitching in the interior and I don't have to fumble with keys and buttons, which, ok, I guess the heated seats are neat in the winter. Whatever.

They'll only step foot on the lot for 10 seconds, and he's yelling. They're usually gone in under a minute lol.
We've got community housing (read: government funded ghetto) right next to the dealership. We know where they fucking live.

>07 expedition
Had an 08 and the transmission died right when i was pulling into the dealer to trade it in. Thank god for warranties.

Not always too receptive. When we have to explain that we have to hire a driver to go and get the car, pay gas, pay for a new PDI (pre-delivery inspection), etc, the customer might come around.
And: there's no guarantee that the other dealership will sell it to us.
>"Nope, we've got a deal on that car, sorry"
I've heard that many times, which is likely just bullshit, or the dealership protecting it's inventory

Isn't that what the sales contract is for though? If someone decides to welsh out of the deal, they get dinged for it?

This, their heavy vehicles are solid af. I've driven newer focuses, my brother has a 2010 Merc Milan and a friend has a 2011 Edge. They have been reliable, comfy, and they both handle remarkably well

In a KIA there is only one battery with that system. Problem is, here in Florida batteries go in about two years and nobody wants to buy a $300 battery until it fails completely. So they just drive on a slightly discharged battery with the system off.

kinda defeats the purpose

>"I only like sporty RWD cars"
>Ford makes sporty RWD for years
>"I dont like it"
You dont like sport cars. I would even argue that you dont even have a car.

>dodge factory
>representing USA

Know of anyone who got fucked over after ordering a GT only for the dealership owner or manager to decide to take someone else's toy out on the road to play with lecturing the owner with "it still counts as new and we had to make sure it worked" bullshit?

I think Ford would straight buttfuck the dealer if the customer found out.

Not ferd, but I had more than one worker at the stealership complain to me as a matter of smalltalk that I'd scooped up the car before they'd all gotten a chance to trounce it around.

To be fair, it was used. But that's telling of the mentality. Even the guys who move them around for shipping beat the hell out of them because why not.

Well it's pretty normal for high-end sports car dealers to take the customer's car that he ordered a year, two, or three years ago out to play with.

Just look at this dealer letting her fitness instructor play with someone else's car that customer is no doubt still waiting on:

youtube.com/watch?v=6opg_iqCzRU

The car is NOT hers; it never was. It belonged to whoever bought it before it was even built, and was made for that specific person who requested every detail on it.

And I am glad that at least Ford doesn't put up with that shit. It adds respect points for me.

>mfw salesmen fuck over customers wit their bullshit fag tactics and then turn around and get their paychecks fucked over by their bosses with the same bullshit fag tactics

It's a circle, I guess