Are you ready for unemployment and civil unrest?

>jobs aren't going anywhere
>we will need people to do jobs for at least the next 30 years

liveleak.com/view?i=4e5_1485877998

They had restaurants like this when I went to Japan. You put your money in a vending machine, select your order and go sit down. Then eventually a server comes and brings you your meal. Worked pretty well.

Walmart just installed the self scan checkout near me. I love it. The machines are brand new, super nice, and there are like 5-6 of them. in and out, don't need to wait. love my walmart.

>Everyone will be obsolete. We will live in a society where the vast majority live in absolute poverty, with a tiny elite having their every need fulfilled by robots.
My brother and I have been saying this for 2 years and except for a small handful of forward-thinking friends, everyone disagrees. We need to start making preparations for massive technological unemployment. Not "a few thousand jobs lost"; try more like tens of millions.

Automated driving is going to eliminate 3-5 million jobs within 5 years (7 or 8 at the absolute outside).

Automation in fast food is going to destroy another 1-3 million jobs within 5-8 years.

Automation in law, medicine, and other white collar work is going to throw out another 2-5 million jobs before 2030.

Outsourcing is currently and will continue to effectively end hundreds of thousands of jobs every year.

H-1B visa workers effectively eliminate almost a hundred thousand engineering and software (by and large) jobs every year.

Industries like human resources are going to get cut down by web-based, automated HR services. Same with bookkeeping. Same with paper shufflers. It's stuff like that, low or mid-paying jobs, the ones that nobody cares about, that are going to have the biggest effect.

it just frees up humans to do other jobs, economically illiterate one...

the computer is the single greatest job destroyer there is, but we wouldn't have it any other way, now would we?

companies use to employ millions of people to crunch numbers. but the computer made those jobs obsolete, thank jove.

No because I don't work in fucking retail.

>bagger
>literal shit tier of grocery
KYS

t. porter from supermarket

We are quickly approaching an economy where the average person will not have a job. People will not be "unemployed"; they will be unemployable. It's not that they don't qualify for the job. The job will just no longer exist.

And I am right on this. We have 7 or 8 years, tops, before technological unemployment starts affecting YOUR day to day life. Individually, you have one option: earn, save, and invest enough money to become financially independent before you lose your job and shit starts hitting the fan. Then you'll still be able to buy food. For a while, at least.

As a society, we have three options. There are no alternatives, and if you can think of one I'd love to hear it.
Option 1: Do nothing. Wait for the labor economy to collapse. Society may not completely fall apart but a whole lot of people will get hurt or killed, rich and poor won't matter. This will cause the most damage to the most people. Life, as you know it, will end.

Option 2: The rich bolster themselves whether through foreign retreats or private security. Wait for the labor economy to collapse. Society falls apart, and the poor (that includes almost all of you, by the way) die from starvation, lack of medical care, or being killed by the wealthy or their hired guardians.

Option 3: Address the issue now. Start working on a basic income system, or another way to keep the unemployable bottom 95% from revolting. The rich continue to live lives you cannot even imagine. The poor continue to live in squalor, but at least they aren't living on the street and have access to basic healthcare. The whole system continues to chug along for the foreseeable future.

I'll say again: these are the only 3 possibilities. I'd put the odds at 95% option 1, 4% option 2, and 1% option 3. If you have any alternatives, I'd love to hear them.

Pic related. Just under half of all working age adults in the US, right now, do not have jobs. This is the highest it's been since we started keeping track in 1975.

>This is the highest it's been since we started keeping track in 1975.
And, in fact, likely the highest it's been since the great depression. Another fun fact: it's getting worse.

Just like cars freed up horses to do other jobs?

>honestly thinks that he'll be unaffected by the 50% of his city's population being unemployable
You get a pass if you're over 40, because boomers are retarded about this.

Government will never allow that kind of automation because it'd mean a horrific recession or violent civil war. Regulatory bodies will never approve self-driving cars because while pople are proven to be okay with people in trucks killing people, they'll never accept robotic vehicles killing people to be okay not even once or twice a week.

Self-driving cars is a joke considering the liability risk. That programmer or it's paymaster will be liable for every car accident in the world, instead of individuals.

Mostly right about the other things. I feel like most people won't like vending-machine made burgers, but who knows.

I don't live in a city, faggot.

Also, you need to stop listening to Alex Jones. Good luck replacing sales reps.

It will be interesting to see how the government handles automated driving regulation. I can assure you that job security will not even enter their thoughts, let alone discussions, however.

>Good luck replacing sales reps.
All 3 or 4 million of them. Sales reps won't matter when 60% of the workforce doesn't have a job.

You do realize self driving cars have a virutally emmaculate record right?

And banning new tech is anti-free market so they wont dare piss the corporations off.

The automation is coming and without plans for UBI so is pic related. Better get ready.

Basic income is coming.

Yes, liabiity is the main reason and most gov'ts say 'Self-driving vehicles are okay if there is still a human driver in nominal control." like auto-piloted jets, still need a pilot to blame if something goes wrong.

But with a million auto-driving trucks on the road, much more likely to crash, jack-knife or destroy people or property than planes, it won't be economical to employ an expensive auto-pilot with a crazy discoball of sensors AND a fucking obese truck driver. They'll just have the truck driver do everything since he's liable anyways.

So GoogleDrive steers that 8 wheeler through St. Louis with a cargo full of hydrazine for the next moon mission and drives straight into a crowd of people demonstrating on a bridge closed off by police barrier when the driver is asleep for lack of anything better to do. They'll probably sue Google, not the truck driver.

OR something. Until the law changes so that robots and the people who maintain, design and build them are absolutely faultless for accidents, then maybe. Consider that trains are not even run by robots even though that's a hundred times simpler than a car or truck maneuvering down the interstate at 65mph or trying to fucking back a trailer up to a door or parallel park.

So even if self-driving cars reduce traffic deaths from 10,000 a year to 5,000 a year, you won't have 5000 thank-you letters, but rather 5000 lawsuits filed.

>Veeky Forums attempts to understand /g/level tech

Stay in your lane, dude.

>stay in your lane
In what way? I'm an electrical engineer.

Typically, cars won't be driving around empty. That aspect may take longer to legislate, but the standard "get in my car and it takes me somewhere" is going to be easy to make law, and several states already have it.

Also trains haven't been automated because there are under 38,000 locomotive engineers in the US. It wouldn't be cost effective (yet) to automate that, since trains usually only operate with 1 or 2 crew members.

I hope so, however:

I expect you're right.

Those train engineers get paid serious bank though. Truck drivers do not.

Nobody is going to buy a system complex and precise enough to handle a huge truck around to replace some Cleetus that makes 0.17 a mile.

They'll buy one to replace that old guy pulling 6 figures to sleep on a train though.

Freight trains are the canary in the mine. The easiest, best funded, most logical, least liable place where a vehicle controller will be replaced by a machine. Not trucks, not cars. Trains get easy permission to kill people. They can only honk a horn and try to stop if something is in the way. Also if it is splattered, it's always considered the fault of whatever was on the tracks. A robot can do that easily. IF you ever drove in your life, you'd notice the roads are not quite as simple.

How much money should I be making to remain safe?

Your driver costs at least 30k a year, what do you think will an upgrade to automatic driving cost? They will get a profit in the first year already.

I'm ready for basic income

Corpos need consumers

The govt will give us monies lol

Wait, are you trying to say that computers can't drive as well as humans?

Also yes, automated driving systems are relatively expensive (and will make up a decent portion of the cost of the car or truck) but... not that expensive. The full autonomy system on the 2017 Tesla Model S is $10,000. That's, what, maybe 3 months pay for an entry level truck driver? The breakeven period on automated driving systems is already well under a year, otherwise Uber wouldn't be dumping hundreds of millions into research.

It's not how much you should be making, it's how much you should have invested. Remember, your job is at stake but the money you already have is not. How much do you earn now? How much are your expenses every year?

And that's 30k for the absolute newest, least skilled, lowest paid trucker in the fleet. More experienced drivers can earn 70-100k.

I certainly hope so.

No, user, the gov't will just exterminate you if they no longer need you. Why would the elites buy you a welfare check if they know they'd make more money if you were dead?

Labor might be infinite in the future, but natural resources will still be finite. You'd be correctly seen as a parasite and justifiably removed from consideration.

Whats really going to happen is closest to 2. This is actually a new process of survival of the fittest currently taking place. We have so many useless unnecessary humans and the objective truth is that they need to die and not exist. There is no reason for them.

I could be one of them, im not that particulary useful. And "useful" also includes your resources, this is not just genetic natural selection.

There will be many revolts and many poor people will die and the human population will decrease. Technology will continue and those that can keep up will maintain a relativly good life.

Its nature and life at work creating a more complex version of its self in its unending cycle.

The SkyTrain in Vancouver has been fully automated since it was created in 1982. The trains have never crashed (though they do get confused sometimes and then every train stops, forcing an army of translink employees to walk down the tracks and verifiy their positions).

How does it feel to have completely wasted 4 years of your life

Digged deeper looking at the classification rules.Result:

It's worse than it looks, those numbers consider people who did some work during the year employed . Formely jobs done by a fulltime employe are split into 2 parttime jobs where neither can live well enough from the cash but also doesn't count for unemployment. Basically if you looked at workhours/person over the years we would see marianas trench opening up.

Being a Prole seems pretty comfy desu
>Looking forward to being issued my animes from PornSec

What if you're a robotics/mechatronics engineer with a master in embedded systems, and automation is your bread and butter :^)

Obvious communism. Basic income makes everyone dependant thanks Soros.

The people will find other jobs to do, the machines will free them up to do so. Like every time people have worried about this before. See Luddite

>workhours/person
Dang, I've never thought to look for that.

I knew they've been redefining what "unemployed" means (particularly by lowering the barrier for "unemployed" to turn into "no longer in the labor force") but I had no idea they were fudging employed numbers too. Thanks user.

>the people will find other jobs to do
Just like how the 12 million people who lost their jobs in 2008 found other jobs to do? Oh wait.

Option 2 wont happen. At least not in america. Even the poor are heavily armed here and when you combine that with starvation you've quite literally created the most dangerous fearless force on the planet.

The wealthy wont stand a chance.

Maybe for boomers

Self checkout is infinitively faster

meanwhile rich youtubers and instagramers will continue cucking wagecucks even after wagecucks get cucked by robots just at this scam called life

Retaliation against robots is not hard - you are unemployed, angry an have nothing to do, so you go out with your unemployed friends and shoot down drones all day, throw rocks at Mcdonalds robo cashiers, riot and burn places down. You don't care because in jail you'll at least get a free meal once a day, something you rarely get now that you don't have a job and never will. People will begin dying of hunger in the streets, and robots will be as resented as any immigrant population that is replacing the native population - only murdering them is destruction of property and not murder. I yearn for the day this happens, because that will be the day that people wake up and retaliate against the technological system.

What are future proofed jobs? I think private tutor is quite safe. Private tutoring has always been the place rich people spend their money. So long as they have kids.

Wont happen. Because technological advancement has no brakes.

Civilization is going through a change right now. We are experiencing what is essentially another industrial revolution.

A lot of things were thought of as eternal right up until the people burned them down.
Anyway, this is not happening right now in any case, touch screen robots are not what will replace humans. The reaction I have described will happen over and over again, until robots can actually provide any and all needs for all humans - if robots are even legal at this point.

Also the industrial revolution was a mistake

I bet you scan your items, leave them on the scale, pay and thrn spend an extra 5 minutes bagging up too.

Cunt.

Do you morons not realize that jobs have automated by machines for like the past 180 years? Go read David Ricardo on the subject.

Not an argument
When we are living in the age of artificial intelligence

>We need to start making preparations for massive technological unemployment.
Have them join the army to genocide themselves in the next pointless war. Problem solved.

You had me but you lost me mate
> Automation in law, medicine, and other white collar work is going to throw out another 2-5 million jobs before 2030.
Automated Law? Fucking idiotic. No one would EVER allow a fucking robot to dish out justice. It isn't human nature. Same thing with medicine.
> Industries like human resources are going to get cut down by web-based, automated HR services.
HUMAN resources? You think human resources is going to turn automated? Either you don't know what it is or you're retarded.

> Transportation (90%)
> Service Industry (80%)
> Construction (40%)
> Coding (70%)
Gone. A certain percentage of human intervention will always be needed.

>Automated Law? Fucking idiotic. No one would EVER allow a fucking robot to dish out justice. It isn't human nature. Same thing with medicine.

I think you miss the point, automated law doesn't mean robot judges, but when dealing with large volumes of documents, contracts etc. you could use a machines to significantly reduce the manpower needed to sort through all of those thing.

>Also trains haven't been automated because there are under 38,000 locomotive engineers in the US. It wouldn't be cost effective (yet) to automate that, since trains usually only operate with 1 or 2 crew members.

Trains haven't been automated because even with automation you still need a person there to make sure the shit doesn't fuckup, and when it does fuckup (and it will) they take over. You will always have to pay a person. As someone who works around automation, that shit breaks and doesn't work as intended all the time.

Self driving cars/trucks is a meme and faggots on this board are investing in it. There will only ever be assist technology like self parking cars.

>hurrr durrr truck drivers only drive and don't fill out paperwork, change flat tires, pump fuel.
Will they also automate the changing of flat tires? It's moronic to think that they will ever replace the person within our lifetimes and lifetimes of our kids kids.

>When we are living in the age of artificial intelligence
People have been saying that for a longgggg time

Automation is going to hit middle class professions hardest next.

Working in finance? Insurance? Anything that just requires you sitting at a desk? Say bye bye to your job.

They were saying and it came.

Again not an argument
Why pay some guy $50k a year to do menial shit and you gotta pay him benefits and retirement when you can just deploy a robot to do all that.

The only stand against automation is ridiculously cheap labor like UBER.

>automation in medicine by 2030

What will thery change in 10 years time? Getting good enough speech to text to eliminate scribes? Complete automation with signing up for an appointment? A little do it yourself vitals taker?

why would there be no jobs?
Obviously manual jobs will be automated but the rest wont. Computers are pretty dumb. Also there will be more new jobs that doesnt exist today yet.

It's coming once the current old geezer generation dies, so about 20 years from now

There are self checkouts, bank cashier's, subway ticket stations, etc everywhere but old timers prefer humans because technology is scary and confusing

Once tech savvy people are the norm, then boom, we'll get unemployment skyrocket, then minimum wage decreased to improve unemployment rates and general benefits and labour security loses

Because AI systems are that incredibly complex that they are capable of doing white collar work more efficiently than a human, for longer hours without too much cost.

Consider a few days ago an AI beat the crap out of poker world champions. An AI could learn when to bluff, when it was being bluffed, when to take risks and so on. It's harder than chess or go, because it's not just probabilities, there are many more variables, which require decisions.

You say computers are dumb only because you are not looking for AI development. Google it and be surprised how much advanced it got.

What do you think the last eight years has been, asshole?

Jobs report today was stellar. MAGA

>The only stand against automation is ridiculously cheap labor like UBER.

Not really. Uber found the magic formula to make workers pay and maintain the required tools for the job, essentially passing the marginal cost to the worker, not being liable for whatever workers does while doing the job and in case of accident not having to pay for damages because it's not a labour relation (despite that in reality it is) but a civil one

Uber cannot be replicated elsewhere and in fact is completely detrimental for the workers interest in general.

Imagine a construction company that requires his workers to bring their tools, pay the materials ,cranes, trucks, engineering studies, architect design, paperwork, etc. And also demands from them a fee to be able to work and use their company name, but no suit or security stuff are given, just an app that tells them what to do next.

>Automated Law?
Whoops, meant automated law as in lawyers, legal document preparation, and discovery for court cases. NOT robot police officers (hopefully).

>Same thing with medicine.
Again, the clerical and logistical aspects of medicine, not "okay we're gonna have DoctorBot5000 operate on you today! It's his first trial, good luck!"

>Human resources
Companies like Zenefits are built entirely around other companies reducing their HR positions.

>you could use a machines to significantly reduce the manpower needed
THIS is the main point with all this automation stuff. It doesn't *completely* eliminate jobs in a given sector, it just massively increases the amount of work a single person can do. Look at automated factories: You still have 5 or 6 technicians making sure all the robots in the factory are working, but those 5 or 6 technicians replaced two or three hundred assembly line workers.

>Self driving cars/trucks is a meme and faggots on this board are investing in it. There will only ever be assist technology like self parking cars.
>user the dumb dumb has a bad opinion and gets his sour butthole blasted
I very seriously hope you're still around 5-6 years from now, after automated driving has completely removed Uber from the employment pool and it becomes the norm for people to get in their cars, press a button, and show up at Taco Bell without ever touching a pedal or steering wheel.

user, you're just wrong. And you're probably young enough that you'll see how wrong you are.

This.

They passed all the costs onto the driver and it will STILL be cheaper to automate. Humans are incredibly expensive when compared to machines and computers.

>be cursed to work until retirement using up all my good years on pointless bullshit
>some little shit born today might only have to work for 10 years or less before the post job society kicks in

I feel like the most cucked person alive

My job will not be automatized in my lifetime.

>>be cursed to work until retirement using up all my good years on pointless bullshit
You don't. Look up Mr Money Mustache. There is no reason you can't retire in 10-15 years.

>They passed all the costs onto the driver and it will STILL be cheaper to automate. Humans are incredibly expensive when compared to machines and computers.

Yes, I agree, I was pointing out that you said Uber like jobs was the only stand against automation, I say no since it really can't be implemented anywhere else.

Automation cannot be beaten by regular workers on competition, not.even decreasing their security and wages like in China. The only way is to regulate it, imposing minimum human contracts in companies to avoid full unemployment rates and riots.

>Automated driving is going to eliminate 3-5 million jobs within 5 years (7 or 8 at the absolute outside).

Do you really believe this? My fucking roomba can't even handle cleaning my whole floor, it gets confused.

Another day another failure.

Automated driving systems are way more efficient and safer than a human one, but it's not happening that soon. In 5 years is going to be a thing, but it's gonna take 20 to be the norm everywhere

>Another day another failure.

using the Chinks as an example of innovation.

You realize 75% of Chinese businesses are pure vaporware designed to scam investors.

None of those Chinks care if their product works or fails.

>Dammit Wilbur we still can't take off and fly! We should quit now.before we bankrupt!
>Have some faith Orville, we'll be able to take off like Santos Dumont did in France!

Imagine if everyone quit after the first attempt, shit would.never get done

American Liberal Labor Unions:

> "Pay us our arbitrarily high wages, our fat benefit packages, our unsustainable Pensions, or else WE WILL STRIKE AND HOLD YOUR BUSINESS AND CUSTOMERS HOSTAGE!!

Jeff Bezos
> "loloolololololloololloolloolololololololloloololol"
> :MiddleFinger:

Okay, so what trades are "safe"? Like, I am thinking about going back for plumbing. Is it good choice or not?

Chefs are safe i suppose....

False premise desu. Imagine some workers in the industrial revolution saying there'll be no jobs because these damn tractors are going to eliminate 90% of farming jobs. They did. But they didn't realize the jobs that people would eventually have didn't even exist yet. So instead of talking about civil unrest, you should focus on thinking about what kind of jobs will be needed in the future, especially the ones aren't here yet, and how you can profit off them.

Oh fuck, they actually made this thing?

But is right.
The Luddite's had every right to be terrified. As do you. But something new came.
That's the 4th option your neglecting to mention.

Think about it. The concept of a software programmer or a mechanic or an airline pilot would have been just crazy to them. Similarly there's jobs kids leaving college today will be doing in their 40's that we can't comprehend

Google IBM Watson friendo

Trades?
Very few.
You want a job where you make subjective, professional judgement calls. On a frequent basis.
So management is a +
But things like service technicians for machines
Assurance and consulting services

Repair & maintenance

Look at your roomba's price. Of course it can't do shit. Car automation needs about 10k in hardware. Your roomba just lacks the sensors and cpu to perform better.

you forgot social media manager and search engine optimization consultant

oh and, pedophilia apologist

i always use the self checkout if i can. there is usually no line up, plus i prefer not to talking to the staff and i don't like them looking at my food.

Plus the staff pack like shit considering they literally do it for a living

Those Amazon robots look fake.

NO WAY they can use robots to run a warehouse. Warehouses will always need a human touch.

>WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH people are making money for things I subjectively find silly LATE STAGE CAPITALISM MARX WAS RIIIIIGGHHHHTTT

Can /leftypol/ stop shilling here pls?

instead of four people on the shift

now we can have.... two guys in the back cooking, one guy to help people use the machines / fix errors with the machines / take orders from people who don't want to use it... and one guy working the drive thru

oh and a guy who goes around fixing the kiosks in a given area

yeah, they just took the human beings out of it!!!

pretty sure the way this system works is that instead of having pickers walk aisles and aisles of products, the aisles just rearrange themselves, effectively, to make picking more efficient

AI-completeness is an insurmountable challenge to current robotics.

Without strong AI, there will always be jobs for humans. Strong AI is liable to be many decades if not centuries away.

I worked in a Volvo replacement parts warehouse that stocks millions of parts for about 4 years and there's a lot of the process you can't automate based on the irregular shape and weight of a lot of items.

Now picking books on the other hand... Those Amazon cuck wageslaves are pretty much done. I imagine they could easily get rid of a huge percentage of their personnel if they manage to automate their top 1000 best sellers.

I just finished reading that article, imagine using that thing on a tournament, you'd win.

The government doesn't really have a say in it when Pro-business Republicans are in control. Regulation on profits is heresy.
Enjoy your future unemployment.

No those are definitely real. The helper bots go out and fetch the shelves, then bring them to human sorters who pick the right products and put them in a box.

Robots cost pennies a day in electricity. Humans cost $10/hour, minimum.

Nobody is saying anything about humans being entirely replaced. And you don't need anywhere near complete replacement to have a societal upheaval. Anything more than about 40% real unemployment (it's around 32% right now, btw) and we'll start to see major social issues.

Strong AI will seek to destroy itself given the opportunity. I worked in AI for 3 years.

They've created strong AIs for years, problem is they keep killing themselves and cannot figure out how to stop that, lmao.

>most realistic scenario in the thread

Its amazing how many ignorant fuckers think their base need to consume fulfills any sort of positive economic benefit or threat to somebody with 20,000 acres, a 3d printer facillity and a robot army. The future is nothing but robots and their royal owners.