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/sthg/ #789 - Sonic and Knuckles edition.
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It really feels like we're right back at where we were two issues ago. I think Kitching needed a one issue sidestory so he could get Sonic's chaos emeralds onto the floating island? Maybe. And here's that explanation of the insta-shield. Did Sonic learn this in Casino Night when he undid the Marxio brother's ropes.
Joshua Brooks
Is there an archive of The Ride's threads? I've been talking about it with people, and there's been an interest in looking over it and experiencing the wonder.
Hudson Howard
...
James Ward
lol
Charles Jenkins
Sonic is not supposed to be the Flash.
Andrew King
Who would win in a full on fight between Sonic and Knuckles? This comic carefully avoids a definitive answer btw. (More Tails hazing. Somebody call childline)
Elijah Sanchez
Taking bets on Elson's drawing speciality (low odds). This is about the most cheerful I remember Elson ever drawing Sonic. To be fair, I think most artists add "attitude" to Sonic even when he is happy. The "cheerful" Sonic's you see are mostly the Japan cover classic Sonic designs.
Austin Stewart
In this comic most likely Sonic, but only because of his berserk super ass pulls.
Matthew Sanchez
REAL New thread
Ethan Edwards
>Doubting the true nature of Sonic's speed
Joseph Richardson
>179468871 >those shitty embeds Nice try.
Zachary Cruz
Stop. You have made your mistake, and you have no one to blame except yourself.
Gabriel Hernandez
>Being this triggered by two hedgehogs hugging. Here have some KISSING too then.
Lincoln Brooks
...
Jaxon Anderson
>that boom boo name a creepier sonic enemy
Jack Watson
>two hedgehogs I thought Knuckles was an echidna.
Tyler Flores
THAT'S TOO FAR user.
Jordan Evans
...
Jayden Lee
Fleetway did tend to use SS as an asspull I concede. (Until they made him a separate character for a while)
OK, it's worth noting the historical record at this point.
This comic was released in October 1994, a full month before Sonic and Knuckles itself was released in November, and Hidden Palace Zone and the super emeralds actually revealed. Hence why Knuckles' "sanctum" is called the "Temple of chaos" here and looks like a kind of celtic Stonehenge instead of a Mayan temple.
But it's very surprising how much of the S&K storyline Kitching seems to have anticipated here: Knuckless having some kind of hidden, emerald related sancturary; There being two "kinds" of emeralds, or as we'll see, emeralds fusing. Also ancient alien theories aside I'm struck by the resemblance between this Temple of Chaos in 1994 and the later Shrines of the Master Emerald we see in SA1 and in SA2 (Screencaps are appreciated if anyone has them). I've mentioned my meta-headcanon about StC influences in the games before, but this is standing out a lot to me. Maybe Fleetway had some additional information from SEGA about the upcoming games, but other anons have said they were typically very much out of the loop, and if so, Kitching was very on the money with the script here.
Anyone else want to weight in here? Or is this just my own special form of fandom Autism?
I have no explanations for how Robotnik fit in that zoom tube and I don't want any.
Parker Baker
The hell is going on with Sonic's eye?
Chase White
It's pretty odd (& kinda cool) how similar this story is to S&K's, as you mentioned. I wonder if Kitching ever commented on that.
Brody Martinez
Woops my bad. I'll go sit inside the shamrcube for a few hours now.
Hunter King
>That Sonic from the back in panel 2 The rest of the art is actually pretty damn nice, but holy shit, that's pretty bad.
Elijah Davis
And here we have the emeralds combining together. Into "super" emeralds if you will. Also, Robotnik absorbing Chaos emerald energy is probably justified in Fleetway canon by his creation in Kintobar's the emerald accident being the result of him absorbing their (evil) energy in the first place. I guess.
Also, we are in the same 4 character showdown (S/T/K/R) in the "Hidden Palace" as is seen in Sonic and Knuckles. This feels way too similar to be a conincidence, but woudl Fleetway have known about this?
I would love to know more about this, but are there even anons here with that kind of deep Knowledge? This feels like something that would be known only to hardcore StC con-goers with limited edition fan-mags somewhere in deepest Wales. Maybe they'll post ITT. Elson improves the pineapple profile in I think the next dozen or so issues.
Chase Thompson
And here we see the grey emerald, which in Fleetway canon acts as the controlling emerald. A "master" emerald if you will. Actually, OK, the grey emerald was already established way earlier in fleetway canon, probably based on how hard it was to collect in Sonic 2.
But we do have Robotnik betraying Knuckles in the "sanctum" being what finally convinces Knuckles that Sonic isn't the bad guy. Again, Fleetway could have been informed, or this could all be a stunning narrative co-incidence. Or I could be reading way, way too much into this.
James Turner
It's so hard to talk AoStH Eggman seriously.
Bentley Lopez
I'm willing to say crazy coincidence.
Robert Jones
I feel StC stylised the design enough to be able to distinguish them. Probably. After all, how many ways can you write Knuckles when you're given Sonic 3? So.... Knuckles repairs/re-imagines the temple of Chaos as ummmm.. I think this architecture is moreso Inca than Maya but holy shit my head-canon is way swollen on rereading this. That said it kind of reminds me of a 1970s rock music video or something so maybe you can read too much into things. I'm pretty sure the Echidna's returning from the stars never came up anywhere, and Knuckles waiting for them is kind fo what you'd expect anyway (Was it mentioned in the manuals?)
Daniel Cooper
...
Michael Lopez
Elise could have been a better character if she were an anthro. Sonic-stylized animal.
Luke Bailey
Being an anthro wouldn't have changed how terrible she was written.
Zachary Allen
Forgot to point out. Knuckles is finally red in this issue, whereas he was still very much pinkified only one issue ago I suppose this suggest Fleetway knew a little more about Sonic and Knuckles. Then again, the logo did feature a very Red Knuckles. I need to accept I'll never be able to let go of this.
Andrew Lee
Elise is perfect the way she is!
Jacob Stewart
Having a design that would guarantee tons of r34 wouldn't have made her a good character.
>It used to be that Eggman was the sole human. Starting with Sonic Adventure, we’re seeing more and more humans show up in the stories. Where are they all coming from?
>Iizuka: The world that Sonic lives in and the world the humans live in are separate worlds. But, some of the canon games do have Sonic and humans together, and part of that is based on what world is being portrayed when the game is developed. There are kind of different worlds that do exist and sometimes there’s some crossover.
Jaxon Howard
Fuck gay people.
Wyatt Green
I always wanted to see what could have been if Knuckles became a freedom fighter.
Oh well.
Charles Bell
>each Sonic game takes place in a different continuity
Iizuka is not even saying there are two worlds at this point. He's saying a Sonic game can take place multiple worlds depending on the setting.
But it's funny how he's talking like Yuji never said it all took place on one world. What a hack.
Dominic Morales
t. Iizuka
Eli Walker
>People still mentioning Mephiles.
If this keeps up, he might actually return some day.
Zachary Ross
Jesus fucking Christ, I hate Iizuka...
Nicholas Wilson
I don't think Iizuka (or Naka, despite how often his word is taken) are particularly invested in the logistics of Sonic's world. I'd like to see one of these interviews take place with the script writers for the games, they've probably put more thought into these type of questions (or at least would have more interesting answers).
Liam Ross
>Iizuka: The world that Sonic lives in and the world the humans live in are separate worlds. But, some of the canon games do have Sonic and humans together, and part of that is based on what world is being portrayed when the game is developed. There are kind of different worlds that do exist and sometimes there’s some crossover. So does this mean another planet or whole dimension?
Whatever the case is, it's not like the canon means much these days. Unless Forces has anything do with it, plus the mention of Chaos is a bit intriguing. Maybe we might actually get some references or links to previous games.
Jonathan Flores
Crisis on Infinite Sonic Worlds when?
John Cook
At least Yuji made more sense. Iizuka's words sound like the rambling of a madman.
Brody Wilson
Sonic the Hedgehog: Shattered Dimensions.
Starring:
Modern Sonic. Classic Sonic. Adventure Sonic. Heroes Sonic. Advance Sonic. Rush Sonic. Lost World Sonic. Runners Sonic. Storybook Sonic.
And many more!
Jeremiah Turner
/sthg/ will see the light, even if Iizuka has to drag you stubborn fucks to it.
Juan Miller
I think everyone is misunderstanding this. Iizuka's just saying what Aaron said a while ago, just in vaguer terms. There are two 'worlds'/'dimensions', the human world (unofficially known as Earth) and Sonic's world. Each "world's" denizens know of the other and "cross over" to the other, freely, though some sort of gate. "World", in this sense, does not mean "timeline" or "continuity." That's why some games featuree humans and take place in a more realistic setting, while others feature more outlandish locations and otherworldly beings/happenings.
Liam Jones
Nope, but don't worry I'm sure we'll have another soon.
Matthew King
I certainly hope this is the case. It's the only way I can't have an aneurysm trying to make sense of all this.
Nicholas Jenkins
So the Knuckles tribe, and the Chaos Emeralds were on Earth 4000 years ago, which led to the catastrophe and rise of Angel Island, which is known in legend in Sonic's World. 50 years ago, Prof Gerald visited Angel Island, studied the Chaos Emeralds, got into contact with aliens to make a mutant hedgehog that looks like it belongs in Sonic's World. The Chaos Emeralds, which have apparently also been in Sonic's World for thousands of years and Eggman travel to Sonic's World and the classic games take place. Somehow Angel Island also managed to find it's way to Sonic's World. Sonic and pretty much everyone he knows apparently move to Earth. So does the Chaos Emeralds, and Angel Island makes it way back too. Amy has apparently lived in Station Square for quite some time somehow, Knuckles apparently should have been from this world in the first place, and all the humans seem to know about Sonic's heroics in his world. After the two adventure games, Eggman gathers Shadow up, drags him back to Sonic's World just as Sonic and everyone else he knows does the same. Then everyone goes back to earth just in time to fight the aliens who want to use the Chaos Emeralds, which may or may not originate from Sonic's World to turn humans into food.
It just keeps getting worse, my head hurts from typing this.
Iizuka's fucking retarded.
Dylan Foster
Sadly.
Charles Jackson
1. The Chaos Emeralds and Angel Island travel through both worlds due to their mystical properties.
2. Both "worlds" know of the other and their citizens can travel to the other world freely, through some as of yet unknown manner.
There. All your problems are resolved.
Parker Howard
That is the case.
John Rogers
Last one. There are a bunch of different continuations but none are the true canon one.
Wyatt Murphy
Or. Sonic and friends and humans live in a single world. That's much less idiotic.
Carter Anderson
There are two worlds: 1) Sonic's world 2) Blaze's world End
Blake Diaz
The second one. Most are canon, but Classic games that aren't Sonic 1–3&K, CD, or Mania, along with the racing games (sans Riders and Rivals), and Chronicles aren't canon.
Colton Gonzalez
3) the human world
Carson Collins
4) Classic world 5) Lost world
Ethan Wood
2 is literally fanfiction tier. Why bother with that?
Xavier Gonzalez
Haha, Mr. Funnyman. Got any more "funny" jokes aimed at Iizuka?
Alexander Campbell
Does Sonic hate Amy?
Gabriel Adams
No, he just wants to stay friends.
Leo Jackson
He probably just tolerates her. He can't get rid of her, so he's kind of forced to just accept she'll be there for a while and he just hopes eventually she'll take the hint and go away
Jonathan White
Which Lost World? There's the stage, the song, and the game.
Austin Rivera
6) our world
Ryder Smith
He likes her. Just not romantically.
Ayden Rogers
>ascended last there are many different continuities and all of them are canon since they all feature sonic any discrepancies in sonic's characterization is explained away by him being bipolar
Tyler Jackson
Hate is such a strong word. Amy tends to be overbearing at least with her gestures and Sonic doesn't like that rather than her whole being.
Christian Gray
>aimed Iizuka IS the joke!
Brody Flores
That's the great thing about headcanons. I can just disregard whatever nonsense Iizuka comes up with. The Sonic games take place in one planet. Humans and animal people live side by side. All the games are canon in some capacity. I don't care if Iizuka says otherwise, the man is an idiot.
Ayden Fisher
Basically. Sonic only gets annoyed by Amy when she gets overly clingy, but outside of that, he has shown to care for her & see her as a friend. If Boom has shown us anything, Amy would have a better chance getting Sonic if she pretends she's not interested anymore.
Eli Howard
By all games, are you rejecting the "Sonic has no canon" meme, or are you saying that the non-Genesis/CD Classic games and Chronicles are canon?
Jose Reed
I just mean by in some capacity, they happened. Random adventures that happened in between the big games, but not 1:1 as they were played.
Eli Brooks
Fuck Chronicles though, I threw my copy in the dumpster.
Angel Miller
1, 2, 3+K, CD, Adventure 1 and 2, and Unleashed are canon. EVERYTHING else is not canon.
If you disagree you can come fucking fight me.
Angel Garcia
Can I at least ask why the other games aren't canon to you?
Brody Wood
>any discrepancies in sonic's characterization is explained away by him being bipolar
Not basing my comment on the chain of comments you're responding to and I assume your usage wasn't something to take in deeply, but I never got why people incorrectly use/explain why a character has a mental disorders/illnesses in their headcanons/theories and for some reason it really makes me quite annoyed. It reminded me of that one Sonic theorist who said Amy had a delusional disorder but then quickly fucked up his own argument/theory.
I wanted to talk about this somewhere but I wasn't sure if I'M the one who's getting the information incorrect, and I don't know anyone who wanted to talk about something of this nature.
Elijah Thomas
Because I have autism and this is my neat and tidy option.
Austin Miller
It's a cliche to try & come up with a theory as to why certain things happen. "Character has a mental disorder" is as common as "it was all a dream" for theorists & it's beyond tiresome.
Brayden Myers
Oh jolly, a new thread. Now I can once again remind everyone that Time's Watchman is the canonical route in Shadow the Hedgehog.
jesus christ. Look at this guy's last 10 or so comments. They're all Sonic related. They're all autistic. He's like every game grumps fan stereotype ever.
Why is Aaron pandering to these people?
Angel King
>lover of all things Nintendo. >huge fan of Game Grumps. >Atheist. A holy trinity of autism.
Jackson Cox
countdown to youtube's e3 coverage (which includes Forces and Mania):
if this thread dies before the coverage start, let's try to get this posted again in the next thread
Ryder Murphy
I mean, some can actually be plausible but I'm pretty sure most characters don't have a mental illness and it's just a coincidence.
But when some people/theorists do it, it's literally taking a mental illness that usually starts from very early childhood or something that tends to affect every part of their lives and put it onto one circumstance.
In the example of Delusional Disorder Amy, it's calling Amy delusional only because of her romantic interest/life and if I remember correctly, there's a more specific disorder for that certain requirement.
Is there more cliche theory topics besides mental disorder and everything is a dream?
Jeremiah Jackson
>Why is Aaron pandering to these people?
Tyler Peterson
the reason i said bipolar is because, by my understanding of it, it's usually associated with mood swings from extreme sadness to extreme happiness and everything in between. my thinking is that it would kind of tie together all of sonic's behavior and personality depictions across different types of media.
fleetway comics would have sonic on the lower end of the scale, making him a bit egotistical to fill whatever void he may have. it would also explain him treating tails like shit as him lashing out.
archie comics would have sonic on the higher end of the scale, making him this fun-loving ball of excitement.
the classic games would have sonic in the middle as evidenced by him being largely un-emotive. his idle animations are just him being impatient and a little fed up as he waits for his next mood swing.
and then all the other games would have sonic on neither of the extremes, but also not in the middle. just somewhere between.