Give it to me straight Veeky Forums

Give it to me straight Veeky Forums
how long does internal combustion have left?

Other urls found in this thread:

caranddriver.com/reviews/2019-mazda-3-with-skyactiv-x-compression-ignition-gas-engine-prototype-drive-review
roadandtrack.com/new-cars/car-technology/a15912314/mazda-skyactiv-3-gas-clean-as-ev/
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peak_oil
theguardian.com/environment/2014/sep/02/propane-renewable-sources-ecoli-genes
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

100 years

a lot

A very long time, regardless of how difficult they make it for people to use ICE for personal transportation.

Why are you clinging to old and overly complicated technology?

It's hardly old. The innovation just keeps continuing.

>overly complicated
Air fuel goes boom moves wheel

...

In 20 years, with advance in ICE and thermal efficiencies, ICE will be more efficient than EVs

>60 gorillion moving parts vs 1 moving part

Formula 1 just made it to 50%. I think it will take more time than that.

>how long does internal combustion have left?

50 year old here, and I’m expecting civilian internal combustion automobiles to be banned within my lifetime.

Peak oil means that at some point, the prices will rise astronomically and only government agencies will be allowed internal combustion vehicles, (military, cops, fire dept, etc.) with regular people being forced to buy electric cars or take the Shoe Leather Express.

Currently there is not enough Lithium on the planet to make enough batteries to convert every car on the road. Battery tech needs to switch methodology or improve efficiency before complete replacement is viable.

Mazda: Let's develop a compression-ignition system that burns a fuel-air mix leaner than diesel so pure-gasoline cars can get fuel economy comparable to hybrids.
>Rest of the industry: but that's impossible!
Mazda: Done. Next on the fucking chopping block, ICE's with lower combined well-to-wheel Carbon emissions than pure-electric vehicles powered by non-hydroelectric sources.
>Rest of the industry: nervous laughter

Going to guess you are in the US? Average life expectancy for a male is about 76, if you think ICE will be gone (for the general public) in 26 years, I have some bad news for you.

This and the fact that the components in the batteries are already ramping up to be a far worse pollutant than gasoline in terms of negative ecological impact. You convert all the cars in Canada, just the fucking leafs, whose entire population is smaller than that of Tokyo, and the Earth would be uninhabitable.

>what is redundancy

and batteries are already reaching their physical peak potential. They need either new tech or a wholly different approach

If you count hydrogen or propane fuel, a long ass time

desu for a jap company mazda is pretty based

>tfw hate EVcucks with a seething spite just because you can't shift your own gears with an electric motor

>3 moving parts master tier
Apex seal meme is a crap, rotary is the way of the future

> if you think ICE will be gone (for the general public) in 26 years

Earth’s population continues to grow, while there’s a finite supply of oil on the planet and it’s rapidly becoming more and more expensive to extract that oil.

At some point in the near future, the cost per gallon of gasoline will skyrocket to the point that only super rich celebs and corporate types will be able to afford to fill up the gas tanks on their IC engine powered vehicles, at which point the government will step in to insure the remaining oil will be available for government purposes only (particularly the military) and the tax on a gallon of gas will go thru the roof.

They don’t need to ban IC engines, they’ll simply tax them out of reach of 99%+ of the population.

as much as I hate rotaries, I'd much rather have them be the future than EV crap

You can literally run ICE engines on bathtub gin or corn liquor.

>implying you cant have an electric motor with a mechanical gearbox

lmao

>what is compressed natural gas
>what is propane
>what is ethanol
>what is methanol
>what is hydrogen

>not running your car on old cooking oil

Splitting ways with Ford was the best thing that ever happened to them. Build quality shot up from 2012 onward, new engine innovations every three years, best-in-class efficiency. It's nuts.
Meanwhile Honda is fighting its way out of an embarrassing slump and Toyota is partnering with Mazda to keep up.
And it's so sudden, too. It's surreal.

I have yet to see one (1) manufacturer offer one (1) EV car or motorcycle with a manual gearbox. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I assume most EV manufacturers know their main demographics are women and soybois who don't even know how to use a clutch, much less what a clutch plate does.

Got a link for that story on the Mazda engine?

>at which point the government will step in to insure the remaining oil will be available for government purposes only (particularly the military) and the tax on a gallon of gas will go thru the roof.
Also, _supposedly_, the US .mil is already fiddling around with biodiesel.

Alternative fuels will be the future, not cuckmobiles.

The instant Gasoline costs more than any of the dozen alternatives in this thread, people are just gonna start filling their engines with something else. Gasoline is still the cheapest fuel, which is why you aren't already putting another similar and readily available fuel in the tank.

caranddriver.com/reviews/2019-mazda-3-with-skyactiv-x-compression-ignition-gas-engine-prototype-drive-review

roadandtrack.com/new-cars/car-technology/a15912314/mazda-skyactiv-3-gas-clean-as-ev/

Don't be too quick to say that beating EV with ICE can't be done. Everyone said Compression Ignition with gasoline was impossible, too.

>>what is compressed natural gas
>>what is propane
>>what is ethanol
>>what is methanol
>>what is hydrogen

None of which are as practical or cheep as gasoline/diesel, which is why none of them are in any kinda wide spread use compared to gasoline/diesel.

Face it, electric cars are going to be the only option for average plebs like us.

Natural gas is at half the price of petrol in EE. Lots of people convert their petrol engines to run on natural gas to save up on running costs.

>Also, _supposedly_, the US .mil is already fiddling around with biodiesel.

The U.S. military has already effectively gone full-diesel but biofuel faces similar problems to oil; an ever increasing global population needs to eat more than they need to power their cars with corn or sugarcane.

The US military has been running multifuel vehicles forever. Most field vehicles will run on just about any flammable liquid you can pour in the tank.

Marine KLR has a ~900 mile range on a single tank of JP8 assuming thats around 10 gallons. Not bad if you ask me

> The instant Gasoline costs more than any of the dozen alternatives in this thread, people are just gonna start filling their engines with something else.

Sure, but those alternative fuels will also be needed by government agencies (I’m surprised the Post Office hasn’t switched to propane already) and prices on them will also go up.

Electric is the only viable solution for America, which has been built around cars and can’t economically switch to rail like Europe or Asia.

hydrogen fucking sucks its ludicrously expensive to produce. Methanol and ethanol are expensive unless you're talking about corn subsidy but even then its not enough. Natural gas doesn't have the efficiency of gasoline which is why we're able to get so much energy out of it despite carrying so little

I guess plumbing and house lighting should go out the window as well

>Natural gas is at half the price of petrol in EE.

It is NOW but when peak oil hits, it won't be.

Solid logic.

2030, 2035 at the very latest, well before all the current emission bans come in to force.

but for a true time scale we need to wait for the 2020 model years to see if the manufacturers will come true on their plans for major mainstream EVs and hybrids.

camless + HCCI + variable geometry forced induction = pic related

When is peak oil going to hit?

>an ever increasing global population needs to eat more than they need to power their cars with corn or sugarcane.
Pretty sure you can make biodiesel out of soy, too. Put that cursed devil's legume to some good use for once.

Peak Oil as defined by the point in time where more oil has been harvested and used than is remaining untapped? We've passed that. The effects on commodity and price will take a long time to really hit fire straits though.

Just as we could see at the olympic open ceremony, as long as memelords have their tunnel vision focused on batteries, the ICE has nothing to fear

> When is peak oil going to hit?

Dunno, but like I said up-thread, I’m guessing within my lifetime and I’m already 50.

Well as the oil supply dwindles that means our economy will collapse (since it literally runs on oil), new cards will stop being made an the government will be dealing with too many other crisis to enforce vehicle standard so we can just start running our old ICE cars on homemade fuels they did in WWII Europe.
It'll be a fun Mad Max playground full of rolling beater bombs.

he he heee

>I dunno
Sums up everything ITT perfectly.

> Pretty sure you can make biodiesel out of soy, too.

You can fuel from all kinda stuff but on a global scale, it’s just not practical.

> expecting a doctoral thesis
> on a Tibetan finger-painting board

I’ll keep driving my car as long as I can but the end is near.

Seriously though, it's not "Oh darn, the oil's gone! Guess we've gotta drive electric!"
When oil runs our whole society gets knocked back to the Victorian level. We won't be driving electric cars because we won't have the money to build them, and in a post-oil infrastructure won't support a national fleet of them anyway.

Pretty damn long. As another user pointed out, there's not enough batteries in the world to go full electric. Everything else is just a stopgap untill we get fusion rolling, which means we'd be in a post-energy scarcity society. Said society would never even have to worry about producing new gasoline and diesel instead of refining it from oil, because you can just throw heaps and heaps of energy at the problem.

No, I fully expect ignorant people on a Macedonian Donkey Show board to act like they know more than they actually do.
Why be smart when you can just repeat your stupidity?

Biofuel is forever.

>Everything else is just a stopgap untill we get fusion rolling

Yeah, any day now...

EV fags don't want to replace cars 1:1

They're also pseudo-communists, so they want to abolish private ownership of cars and have everyone share a fleet of self-driving taxis. Don't forget the part where you must live where you work in your designated community and walk around to the businesses you are supposed to shop at.

The batteries, not so much actually

The strip mining for copper and aluminum, yes. The oil sands from which the plastics come, yes.

EVs make so much power over a broad range that a gearbox isn't really necessary unless you're intending to race at speeds in excess of 120mph. For common applications it's just extra weight and complexity that has to be rated to handle a fuckload of electric torque without shredding. A two speed would weigh as much as a six speed.

Do your own leg work.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peak_oil

Which is why I said some people will be running clunkers on homemade fuels, but in a post-oil economy that will be small scale and extremely valuable. Most people just won't have cars, either ICE or Electric.

You as well, Mr. "I Dunno"
Or how about this, stop acting like your ignorance is as important as someone else's knowledge.

the increasing global population is mostly in india and africa

not our people
not eating our crops
and most of them are born to die due to cultures/small brains that can't into family planning
they can receive our aid when they cut it down to 2-3 children per couple, stop shitting in the rivers and irrigation canals, and stop raping everyone in sight. like everyone else.

you can just say "fuck those guys" and use your corn field for your people.

>Most people just won't have cars, either ICE or Electric.

In the U.S. electric cars (and bicycles) are the only viable solution, as our entire nation has been built around cars and the cost of tearing all that infrastructure down to switch to rail just isn’t practical.

Formula 1 gained something like 10% in the last decade, we're making huge leaps.

>Finite supply of oil
We're ramping up to produce massive quantities of diesel, gasoline and hydrogen fuels already. The only weak point right now is the energy you have to put into them, which could be solved by hooking them up to a nuclear plant right now, or waiting untill you're just about dead so we can hook them up to fusion.

That was supposed to be in reply to;

>Propane isn't as cheap or practical as gasoline
In what bumfuck country do you live? Here in Yurop it's half the price of gasoline, with a higher octane rating to boot.

Genocide 10% of the population, now wreck every Xth column of houses and run a side street through
or
Build suspended road networks with spiraling ramps down to housing blocks
or
Raise housing prices so people who don't fit into society quite as well as the rest are forced to become poorfags in apartments, then wreck some columns and build roads to reduce travel times

>We're ramping up to produce massive quantities of diesel, gasoline and hydrogen fuels already.

And the more we ramp it, the more it costs, which means we need to ramp it up even more and so on.

The fact it, we ain’t making more oil.

Bicycles will be the only solution. In a post-oil world we won't have the economic resources for individual cars. We'll go back to a lifestyle where most people never travel more than 30 miles from their home.
It's not just "oh, our gasoline cars will go away" our whole way of life will change. We'll take a giant step back on the development index across the board.

>yfw being part of the upper class that could afford an electric motorcycle
>yfw it's even one of the fast ones

>Here in Yurop it's half the price of gasoline

Because gasoline is _still viable_ but once the cost of gasoline goes thru the roof, the cost of propane and other alternate fuels will follow right along.

same
>shooting the shit with my mate
>mention ev's and wanting a manual gearbox
>basically calls me retarded because direct is more a lot more efficient
>can't explain the bliss of rowing gears

I'm gonna drive my 71 Connie until I die.

...

>In what bumfuck country do you live?
not europe

>Electric
>Viable
Pick one.

>Europe and Asia
>Economically switch to rail
Pick one you uneducated burgermutt.

20 years maximum

Say hello to the future of motoring.
If you can afford it.

>Electric
>Viable
>Pick one.

You really think they’re going to run rail lines down your subdivision street?

Son, you’re going to be slogging on foot at the butt-crack of dawn in the middle winter to get your burger flipping job, because there won’t be any IC cars anymore.

Electric cars are the ONLY option for the U.S.

>Europe and Asia
>Economically switch to rail
>Pick one you uneducated burgermutt.

Europe and Asia already have wide spread rail transport systems in place but this simply isn’t practical in the U.S., where everybody is spread out across 300 million square miles.

What's the point in overhead valve? Why is it better than overhead cam?

feels almost like they just wanted to put in more bits to break desu

yeah or maybe we will eat less meat or make it differently and that would free a shit ton of land to grow stuff that we can eat instead of growing stuff for animal we then eat

>I have yet to see one (1) manufacturer offer one (1) EV car or motorcycle with a manual gearbox.

Check the torque curve on an electric motor vs an ICE. Then try to explain why any manufacturer in their right mind would put a manual gearbox and clutch on a EV.

A while. Because even when electric cars take over the new car market, hobbyists will still keep it alive. Also, boats, airplanes, and other forms of transportation (including military vehicles) will probably never go fully electric.

They won't new rails at all. In a post-oil collapse there won't be any new infrastructure built.
EVs will not be viable.
New train systems will not be viable.
Older ICE car will be partially viable if you have the means to make your own fuel.
Bicycles will be the only viable wheeled transportation for most people.
Also burger flipping jobs will go away because fast food won't be viable anymore.
Literally our entire way of life change, not just our vehicles.

Mazda is fucking based. And I like electric cars, too. But I really like what they're doing. If they keep this level of innovation going, there may never be a day where ICE dies. Either way, I'm interested.

I'd give it another 90 to 100 years.
Halfway or 3/4ths of the way towards the end we'll start to see suppressed technology from ancient patents that allow engines to pump out 100 - 200 mpg hit the mass market. Combined with more fuel efficient engines, the oil and auto companies would add on another 50 or so years to the inevitable end.
Just right before the end we'll probably see another wave of suppressed tech i.e. Water Fuel Cell Engines.

On the bright side though, there's still probably dozens of untapped oil wells in countries all over the world, we just have to find them. Antarctica probably has quite a bit of oil, but drilling, collecting, and distributing it might be an issue since it's "owned" by quite a few countries. Not long after Peak Oil we just might see a war over sovereign claim for the icy continent when it comes to who gets the oil.

On an even brighter side there might be even hundreds of years worth of oil all over Mars if that planet did in fact have life at one point. Supposedly there's satellite images that show evidence of what might be oil leaks in certain regions of Mars. The only problem with all of this though is that there's currently no way to efficiently drill it and bring back to Earth. The cost of importing it from another planet far exceeds what it's worth here.

People assume that we can't switch the type of fuel we use. There may come a day where they create synth fuel that can be used in most if not all ICE engines and can be produced from renewable (or a lot more plentiful) sources. I highly doubt energy companies/lobbyists will just let the most powerful corporations on the planet die - they have too much power to let that happen.

>The US has gotten small scale fusion going since 2014
>Wendelstein is making power since 2015
>The Chinese broke the plasma containment record with 30 seconds in 2013
>And have tripled that in 2017 to 101 seconds.
Wendelstein is on schedule to assume stead state production somewhere in 2019. GET HYPED SON

Looks quite comfy actually desu

You seem to be confusing making gasoline with extracting it from oil. We're extracting less from oil, sure, but we are currently developing the production facilities to make gasoline out of thin air. Well, water and thin air (CO2) to be precise.

There's masses more gas than there is oil, especially once we start fracking. Once oil becomes more expensive, more reserves open up because it is now financially viable to use them. Even better, you can easily make propane using CO2, more easily than you can make new gasoline:
theguardian.com/environment/2014/sep/02/propane-renewable-sources-ecoli-genes
tl;dr Use modified E.coli to make propane

Does it depress anyone else to see pictures like this?
Literally millions upon millions of gallons of gasoline/oil being burned up EVERY DAY in every single city, town, and road all across the globe...

>because there won’t be any IC cars anymore.
But there will. Gasoline, diesel and propane are easily renewable, and the energy to do so will be cheap in the future.

Electric will never be viable because there aren't enough battery materials on this planet. You are making one big circular argument.

>Europe and Asia already have wide spread rail transport systems in place
As someone who actually lives in Europe (unlike you), no we don't. They are not nearly enough to support a fraction of all commuters.

Better for airflow of course.

I remember when the Post Office got rid of these vehicles for good. In the Northeast people from Northern New Hampshire,Vermont,and Maine bought them. I know 4 people that bought them for 2 to 3 hundred dollars. They are all being driven still.

>Older ICE car will be partially viable if you have the means to make your own fuel.
I predict that there will be people doing exactly that. Home distilling for alcohol is already a thing, now it'll be done to make fuel.

>Home distilling for alcohol is already a thing
Bitch please. My grandma used to help make bathtub gin during prohibition.

Love these hoodrat classics in all its forms. Even the bouncing spicmobiles(niggers never get it right).

Meant to say
>Home distilling for alcohol is already a growing thing
My grandma used to distill with her own father back in WW2. Now I'm bringing the spirit back with a new still we built, she's enjoying it a lot - both the distilling and taste-testing.