What's wrong with German Engineering?

They are probably planning buying cells or power packs made in china, or waiting for government welfare.

The main issue is that they can´t realy sell their batteries, except for their E-bikes.

fairly certain my Toyota does not have bosch in it as denso is Toyotas primary supplier and they do all the same shit bosch does

they see the writing on the wall, that battery power is NOT the future. It is a stepping stone that small minds cant get off of.

The future will be biofuel such as ethanol, biodeisel and hydrogen which are clean and don't suffer the same drawbacks as batteries when it comes to mining, shipping and manufacturing emissions. Many existing cars can even be converted to these fuels with very little tweaking.

>my Toyota does not have bosch in it
My toyota has a BOSCH ECU...

ill have a look at mine, PRETTY SURE its denso brb

Traction control/ABS modules, any rocker type connector are likely Bosch candidates.

so, it says right on it Toyota and made in japan. This usually means Denso Japan.

If your toyota is french built then I could see bosch products being used.

possible, but if those did have a label on them before, canadian winters probably murdered it. If they are still OEM though, I'm going with Denso.

Where the car is manufactured isn't going to determine where they source the module, it's by model. If your ABS/ESC/yaw sensor/etc. is exposed to the elements you have much bigger problems than brand selection. What Toyota do you have?

>Where the car is manufactured isn't going to determine where they source the module, it's by model.

Ya no. even the engines in Toyotas are slightly different if they are french built.

This, Bosch just knows whats up, electric is a dead end unlike Hydrogen Ice, and more Thermal Efficient versions of Gas/diesel.

Huge difference between using different modules and using different engine options. Having 20 different teams of EEs design the circuitry and firmware twice is a huge ordeal. Accommodating different engine types or any other regional thing like lighting layouts utilizing the same modules is much easier. Sourcing different manufacturers for modules on the same car makes 0 sense, just a waste of manpower for pennies spend on importing the module. An engine weighs hundreds of pounds and legislation in different regions is drastically different, a module weighs a few ounces and there is no legislation concerning how a manufacturer controls their vehicle aside from industry standards like OBD2.

Hydrogen is horribly inefficient, amongst other things.

Ethanol, biofuels, etc are bad for the environment in their own ways.

>Ethanol, biofuels, etc are bad for the environment in their own ways.

sure but no matter what we do, there is always going to be an environmental impact. Biofuels would be less than batteries as they can use cars that already exist and infrastructure that already exists.

>Having 20 different teams of EEs design the circuitry and firmware twice is a huge ordeal.

not if you just give the layout/specs of a module or ECU to bosch/denso/whoever and tell them to manufacture to spec. Easy enough and money is saved so long as a french plant turns out enough cars to justify subcontracting a manufacturer that is closer.

Unless you are doing algae biofuel using wasta water. Then the agricultural impacts and logistics of production are worse than battery production.

Electrical infrastructure is 99 percent complete. It is just a matter of getting power that last 50 feet from power line to car.

>not if you just give the layout/specs of a module or ECU to bosch/denso/whoever and tell them to manufacture to spec
And doing this to two different manufacturers is a cost saving measure how? Manufacturers use these generic modules to save a lot of money. Nobody specs out their own modules and hands them out to be manufactured as a one off. Though you don't seem aware of how the industry works you are inadvertently getting a glimpse of the future, in 10 years you won't see a third party module in a car, nor will you see a traditional fuse or relay.

>Electrical infrastructure is 99 percent complete. It is just a matter of getting power that last 50 feet from power line to car.

your missing the part where the battery components have to be mined, refined, manufactured, shipped, installed, shipped again and then used and discarded.

biofuels can use existing land that is already set aside for refineries, be pumped out of the same pumps we already have and used by current cars with minimal effort (brazil proved this with all their cars running on e85)

>And doing this to two different manufacturers is a cost saving measure how?

ok, so you don't understand how manufacturing works. conversation is now moot.

Explain how a manufacturer can come out with a financial advantage by
-doing 100% of the design themselves
-giving the design to TWO other manufacturers
-paying both of them to make the modules
vs. (what actually happens in real life)
-engineers designing around a generic module that is used across many brands/models (economics of scale)
You are way out of your league, stick with Corvette vs GTR

>30 year old commifornian incel tries to economics

They don't import from China.

>Ethanol, biofuels, etc are bad for the environment

There, there Mr. Exxon. We understand.

Maybe because electronic isn't the futur?

hydrogen's volumetric energy density is shit tier, it will never be viable in ICE
BMW's prototype was getting 50 l/100km with a only a 200km range

despite having a huge 170L bomb in the trunk

Brazil clear cuts rainforest to get farmland to run their ethanol production. Biofuels compete with food farming for arable land and scarce fresh water.

My car is entirely British
Also most of the electrical things don't work properly.

Cuz we are dumb

Certain types of biomass can be inserted in the regular crop rotation as they help the soil regain its nutrients. It is essentially free.

Oh, please. Gasoline explosions are just as bad as hydrogen, except gasoline burns longer due to the fact that it continues to burn as the liquid evaporates. It also spreads more along the ground when there’s a leak and persists for a relatively long time, while hydrogen just goes straight up into the atmosphere if there’s a leak. Yes, it explodes, but so does everything else we use to make power.

A tank of gasoline catching fire is literally nothing like a 1000psi tank of hydrogen exploding, you uneducated spastic child.

This is not a bad step

Because sooner or late the EU will subsides Bosch to create or build a plant which produces battery technology

there is no point for a business as large as Bosch to begin with producing risky innovation if they can be on corporate welfare for when it becomes needed

>electrical systems
This holy fuck. My italian bike's ecu is magneti marelli yet the oem traction control is Bosch. Seriously, just how much traction control systems are bosch

Biofuels actually pollute more than oil-derived fuels because you have to use a shitload of fuel, fertilzier, pesticides and CLEAN WATER to produce the crops and synthesize the biofuel

Fracking upends the equation a bit because it pollutes like a motherfucker to produce it

except they don't have to.

>grow food
>eat food
>use waste of food and chaff from farming (stems, leaves, seeds, roots etc) to ferment for bio-fuels
>........
>PROFIT!

the only reason we are having a problem with bio-fuels is because so many people are fixated on battery's as the second coming of Christ. Just a little more innovation and bio-fuels will vastly outstrip battery's on all fronts.

they are not as cucked as tesla and reaslise electric cars will not be as big as people think

not appealing to the hipsters and battery industry lobbyists should be applauded

Hydro and Aeroponics will help

>>Electric is the future whether we like it or not
I remember when lobbyists, marketers and publications and manufacturers said this exact thing about diesel cars.

Biofuels and and Mazda's Skyactiv-X will be the future

>fuel

not if the equipment uses the bio-fuels, it would be a neutral operation

>fertilizer

you don't need fertilizer (or at least as much) if you plant soil building plants in between crop rotations.

>pesticides

these are a meme and there are far better ways to control insect populations

>CLEAN WATER

if no one is going to eat the product then you don't need clean water at all. you can pump straight from a creek, river, pond or hell use grey water from a city that is nearby.

nice reddit spacing

> Neutral operation
It would take up more arable farmland
> Soil building plants
You still need fertilizer unless you want diminished returns over the years
> Pesticides
> Meme
Dude, half the output of our crops is due to pesticides, fungicides and herbicides. If we go your way, a good locust season would shut down production like a hammer to a nail
> Pump straight from creeks or rivers
Nigga they already do that, that is what basic irrigation is in almost all countries
> Grey water
For sure, but that shit is polluted with soaps and other nasties and will ruin your soil over time

Biofuels are a meme, plain and simple

That's why the national laboratories have been developing them for so long.

Because they're a meme.

...

There won't be any need to develop biofuels because we will be able to harness fusion before the oil runs out.

Holy shit cannot believe you faggots are seriously discussion biofuel. Biofuels are just a hidden subsidy for farmers. Nothing more. They literally don't even exist anywhere but the US.

>just how much traction control systems are bosch
The better question would be how many are not Bosch.

My reaction too.

Mazda's tricks are that good and scalable for at least two or three more generations. toyota and bosch are both bought in. Diesels and HCCI. And supercaps.

HCCI effectively replaces diesel, at least in light duty applications

The Hydrogen powered forklifts where I used to work were running 350bar or a little over 5000psi. It's a little unnerving standing next to them but you get used to it. The sticker that basically says run if you hear a hissing noise is funny. Cars would likely have to run even higher pressures than that.

Wait till that shit actually exists in a production car you fuck. I also want to see that over complicated piece of shit outside of a test cell in the real world. You fucking Mazda girls...

People have already driven test mules with Skyactiv-X engines in the real world on public roads
They said that the mules they were driving idled like diesels and were a little rough when switching between modes, but they worked fine otherwise. And that was over a year before the cars are supposed to launch

high pressure gas is no joke, I've gotten frost bit just from changing LNG tanks with sticky valves.

LIHD biofuels are carbon negative because net ecosystem carbon dioxide sequestration (4.4 megagram hectare(-1) year(-1) of carbon dioxide in soil and roots) exceeds fossil carbon dioxide release during biofuel production (0.32 megagram hectare(-1) year(-1)). Moreover, LIHD biofuels can be produced on agriculturally degraded lands and thus need to neither displace food production nor cause loss of biodiversity via habitat destruction.

And how is that relevant for passenger cars?

BROOOOONNNNNNKKK BRAP BRAP BRAP

gotta make it easy for europoors to read it with their 3rd grade comprehension skills.

its very clear that you know little about how easily agriculture can be reformed to accommodate bio-fuel production and instead choose to believe oil/battery industry propaganda. I encourage you to research soil building plants (which themselves can contribute to bio-fuel production) and research how pesticides are not necessary, but are a multi-billion dollar industry for companies like Monsanto so they are made to look like they are.

they "develop" them because they are an easy sell to the lazy and uneducated farming community (in reality they just relabel the same pesticide to make it look new)

and when they ban your diesel cars and your forced to buy gas at 3 dollars a liter, your going to be begging for bio-fuels as well

Rare earth isn't actually rare, and a good amount are byproducts of smelting more common metal.

they're just in buttfuck africa.
I'd rather not displace niggers around the world so I can have cheap gadgets

>displace Africans for bio-fuel
NO THAT'S BAD REEEEEE

>displace Africans for lithium mining (destroying all the land with giant pits)
perfectly ok.

base bosch working the ecocucks into a shoot

>Africa
They're also in chinkland, you urbanite-loving cuck

Yeah because China loves it when the west mines their shit amirite

Yeah but it's clean

We need to focus on passenger car emissions because they are the #1 thing wrecking the plane-

Question is, what can we even do about air transportation? Jet fuel sure as hell ain’t sustainable, and nobody has the balls (or simply lack of sense) to say jet engines need catalytic converters.

electric VTOL airliners unironically could work if they ever make them

>pay 1 eur to travel 100 miles with hydrogen
vs
>pay 50 eur to travel 100 miles with gasoline
its also coal, gas and solar power plants that cause mad contamination along with industry.
If we had switched to nuclear power, a power with barely any ecological effects and insane effeciency, nobody would be talking about emissions for cars right now.

youtube.com/watch?v=Xuc8sVERy6Q

I wonder whats wrong.

Nuclear engines. No, seriously. All a jet engine needs is air and heat.

Youd use up all energy carrying around shielding, reactor, turbines and cooling

You don't make electricity with nuclear jets, you just heat up the (formerly) combustion chamber, so no aditional turbines beyond the jets themselves are needed. Cooling is baistically venting excess energy, so if the reactor's designed output is just right only minimal cooling will be needed.
These will still only work out in any usable capacity on massive jets, though, so only feasible for long-range flights, elsewhere should adopt high-speed rail systems and start doing it right now. Look at Japan, their trains invalidate any other mode of transport

if it was feasible it would've been done by smarter people than us

this. a modular battery system and a fleet of these
>plane charged
>flies route
>lands in airport
>battery goes to charge port
>fresh one goes in
>wait for it to charge for a different plane

>pay amg prices
>some german mutt assembled it

If i were rich, i would be pissed about this.

if feasibility was the only thing that stood in the way of innovation we wouldn't even be having this conversation my man

I like the way you think

Bosch knows electrifying the roads is the future and having a battery os a jewish move fron nowadays automakers

Feasible? its been patented like 2 years ago.

spectrum.ieee.org/tech-talk/energy/nuclear/boeing-patents-laser-nuclear-fusion-jet-engine

>They're also in chinkland, you urbanite-loving cuck

and you wonder why there is so much propaganda surrounding batteries being the future? The US would have nothing if China supplanted its oil industry by becoming a battery manufacturing powerhouse.

This.

>Working on 98 Lexus LS400.
>ABS unit says "Under license from Bosch

cancer chemtrails yay