/parag/ - Paragon General

>thinking any of us believe a damn word Cameron says
Hello EPIC.

Did you read the rest of my post, moron? I said what Cam is doing is fucking wrong and won't work.

he doesn't read anything because the only yuro who actually posts is a reddit faggot who just shitposts about cam and how much the game sucks here because he knows he'd get banned for doing it there. he's been doing this since 42 released

I wouldn't give Cam or the Paragon internal testers any credit whatsoever. Letting slip that they had the new system for 3 months was a mistake: how in god's name did no one on the team try Red Zone Death Crawler Kallari, or SacAlc Emerich Wukong? Worse is the fact that almost every hero that was billed as being made exclusively for 42 turned out to be total shit (Revenant, Wraith) or ridiculously broken (Wukong, and to a degree Iggy and maybe Zinx).
I have no faith in them to do a good job if they can't catch even the most obvious stuff. We were putting together the broken shit weeks before launch when all we had were the damn leaks ffs.

I'm a non-redditfag Yuro and I don't shitpost, so you're wrong there.
Cam is a colossal cunt, though.

>I'm a non-redditfag Yuro and I don't shitpost, so you're wrong there.
then im glad you're here but im really sick of this one faggot just posting the same shit every thread for the past month as if any of us care or can do anything about him not liking the game anymore.
>Cam is a colossal cunt, though.
something we all agree on

Suppose I'll keep her bumped for three or so hours until real Yank hours. That's the kind of shit you dumb-fuck kids say these days, right?

which girls virginity would be the most fun to take?

this desu. Epic should stream dev testing just to show the community what a shitshow it really is. They are a tiny sample of gold and silver players testing shit against other mediocre players who are testing shit. There is no way in fuck you get valuable or meaningful balance data from that. Yet, that is the sort of testing they make key decisions from. Oh, and mysterious contrarian server data that we can never, in any capacity, see or verify. Their balance department is all asspull and strawman with a healthy dose of player-blaming all to fit some vague incomprehensible 'vision' that Epic pitched to papa Tencent.
And does anyone know who Tencent shoved onto the Epic board? I had heard tell of a few guys from Tencent's mobage division getting installed after the purchase and that explains a lot of the monetization choices as of late.
And to go even further into tin foil - Is Tencent pushing Epic out of the PC moba market and solely into the console plebs to prevent them from competing with LoL but still allowing epic to tap a newer market? That feels like a decent reasoning for Epic making this a casual brawler.

>does anyone know who Tencent shoved onto the Epic board?
I think it was the guy who made the Infinity Blade mobile games, Donald Mustard.
venturebeat.com/2017/02/27/epic-games-shifts-strategy-to-self-publishing-with-6-games-coming/

one of the top epic ceo's is a former mobile game executive yeah. and this was always going to be a console game tencent or not epic isn't stupid enough to think they're gonna sap people from league or dota.
ebin can talk about eports or whatever other shit they want to try to fool a bunch of nerds into slaving away at the game but this games only hope is gonna be to carve out a niche as a fast paced action moba with good looking waifus.

the closest we ever got to seeing their sacred internal testing games is when they fucked up the video on a couple of the community corners and just showed an interal match going on. Its number 13 and 14.
like everyone has always said they dont play the same game as everyone else does and its incredibly obvious after you watch just 3-4 minutes.

did they revert from new dawn yet?

uhhh our internal data shows that there is increased build variety so basically this update is perfect go fuck yourself

damn. I was hoping they'd decided to turn their retardation to focus entirely on fortnite. Guess not. They absolutely ruined both games in less than a month. I'm impressed, frankly.

Is Fortnite as much of a grindfest as I'm hearing? It released to some minor fanfare, but then nothing.

It's not even grind. There's not even a grind to get stuff, you have to pay. You get a basic drip feed of barely usable schematics for gear, 1 per like 5 or 6 quests (which is like 2 or 3 missions each), and have to pay for anything higher than a blue. Or get to a super far point in the game, that I would argue is impossible without friends dropping you pre-crafted gear from THEIR schematics (which will degrade and break, usually in the span of 1-2 missions), where you can throw 5-6 schematics for a RANDOM schematic with a CHANCE of it being purple or orange which are the only good rarities since they come with such massive boosts in base stats over green and blue that it's almost ridiculous.

There's not even much to grind unless you pay money for schematics, you'll cap out on inventory space in an hour or two of playing, you can play missions over and over for skill points but are ultimately then gated by research points (accrued at x points per hour to keep you logging in), and again, you are teased with the llamas (loot crates) that you have to pay for, that are the only source of new characters to play as, with better skills and more health (absolutely 100% necessary versus enemies who start doing ~1000 damage a hit, enough to kill the heroes you get free instantly).

It is a total disaster. They nerfed a bunch of characters in the patch from yesterday, and added a survival mode, which is something everyone wanted. But they made all the zombies do several thousand damage a hit and kill even the highest rarity mythic (above legendary) heroes die in two hits. This is obviously not going over well with whales who spent hundreds to try and get them.

Morigesh, always Morigesh

Jesus, that sounds fairly bad all right. Bad idea to piss off the whales: I'd imagine that they're the people you want to keep around if everyone already knows that your model is bullshit.

yeah they keep pissing them off, and the game is sinking in players daily, it took me almost a half hour to find a quick play co-op, which can throw you in missions already in play. So basically there were no matches running for almost a half hour. nothing. not a single one.

I'm not european and I don't use reddit. Good job trying to identify users on an anonymous imageboard though.

Let's hope that the same doesn't happen to Paragon. It would be harder, since the micro isn't as intrusive as it could be yet, but it's possible if they try something like that mastery shit again.

Think he might have been talking about me, even though I don't have a Reddit account either. Kind of proves your point, really.

It'll happen when they start charging for champions.

That would kill the game instantly, no backsies. I know we said it's a bad idea to give ebin the benefit of the doubt, but surely even they couldn't be so stupid.

man now that its calming down A LITTLE and i get to play drongo i actually like him a lot. i don't think hes really as useful as murdock or chadblast but he can silence people out of channeling their ults and its fun to throw a boomerang.

>hate v40 and how the game was after the update but the general actually is active
>love 42 but the general is back to being dead to the point that threads get archived after 100 posts again
i just want to have fun playing the game and have a place to talk about it with my bushbros why must fate be so cruel

do I do more reading or more playing for this to click? Try your best not to attack me here, I'm trying to be a contributing member to the moba community and we all started somewhere.

I am learning to play mobas with paragon. I've been playing for like 2 days and have little to no idea what I'm doing besides basic principles and having one friend who plays it. Wtf did I get myself into and is there a real concrete beginners guide to this particular game and or is it just fuck up and practice until you finally fucking understand.

His design would improve tremendously if the two tentacle things coming out of his head were removed.

Before you tell me to just Google it, when i do that I get either outdated or really advanced sorts of advice or stuff that really doesn't seem to help that much. I am asking here simply for where you folks went to pick this up. I'm all for the challenge and learning curve but I just wanna know if I'm right in thinking I have to fuck up a bunch of other peoples matches all day until I know what I'm doing or if I really can learn basics from "advice"

For other mobas probably yeah. For Paragon though, everything about the games is still unbalanced and being changed too often. The current system has less than a month, so I wouldn't expect to find any in depth guides yet.

Which reminds me, I have to finally update the fucking FAQ

Did you ever play Dynasty Warriors? Or one of those games? MOBAs are basically those, but the commanders are actual people. You push your side to take control of the map. The buffs are temporary and can make a difference if a fight is close, but won't make you overpowered. Paragon is the first MOBA I played an extensive amount of (I had about 30 hours in HOTS before this) and I tried DOTA2 (it's shit), LoL (it's ok but a bit overwhelming with how many heroes there are), Vainglory (about as good as you'll get for a portable), and Smite. Paragon's the best one IMO but I'm not a huge Blizzard fanboy. I like the characters in this the best.

But yeah, don't worry about getting kills or any additional shit. That comes later. Just focus on your lane and killing minions until you get familiar with the controls, heroes, map, etc.

guide to paragon 42.3 in 10 steps:
1) pick a role and stick to it. learn multiple roles because you won't get your preferred role very often.
2) farm for 3 minutes
3) 3 minutes 1 second: end game has hit, now maraud around in a death ball with your team BUT also simultaneously your teammates expect you, no matter your role, to protect BOTH left and right lane, at all times.
4) but seriously when your allied killari/revenant/yin chases past their tier 2 to get an unlikely kill and died and spams THANKS! at you over and over, it wasn't your fault. in that situation, just retreat unless you really, really, really can get the kill.
5) if its khaimera though it might just work
6) (unrelated to previous points) make sure you get last hits at all times unless you're support, in which case never get last hits unless its literally impossible for your ADC to get it. pros get like 90% last hits or some shit (in other mobas, there aren't real paragon pros)
7) make sure your deck has some kind of sustain because going back to base constantly will mess you up. i like the healing aura 3 int card, and put it on my ADC decks JUST IN CASE the draft doesn't give me a support. this happens pretty often.
8) when your team gets some kills, make sure to take that opportunity to push motherfucking objectives. that means right after getting a kill, don't retreat unless you absolutely have to, instead take the 30 seconds to push and kill the nearest tower or when you miraculously triple kill and your team starts pining attack OP, do it unless you're really going to die.
9) uhhh running out of tips
10) when you lose, its okay, when you die, its okay. just make sure to learn from it.

i really want his scavanger skin or whatever its called. fuck i almost have enough coins. hopefully i can open some in a chest or something soon.

Thank you I feel way better now. I'll just try some coop stuff with different heroes til I find a couple I'm comfy with and get some practice in with my abilities. My first mistake was that in other game genres I tend to play glass cannons so I tried countess which is a crap idea for someone who can't read their opponents yet.

He seems like the kind of ADC that can really fuck with people once you really learn how to play him well, but the majority of players never will, and most of those shitters are "ADC mains", so good luck ever picking him even if you do get good with him.

The best part is as soon as you start to feel like you know what you're doing, Epic will delete the whole game and release a new one with the same name and heroes and now you have to start over

If only.

>They could have just made the least used cards they originally had into new effects
This is what confuses me more than anything: why not change the useless cards like Irradiate into something useful like Red Zone? You're still building stats, it's just you have less control over them now and the screen for seeing your total stats was removed. Was it so people wouldn't be backing every now and then? Because I actually liked that.
I don't understand how the attribute system magically allows EPIC to "apply balance changes more easily", or whatever nonsense it was they said. Apart from the number of available actives decreasing and stat building being less obvious (but still present), I just don't see how v42's new system gives them "a better foundation" like I keep hearing EPIC's buttboys repeat every time the new version's weaknesses come up. I'd be happy to change my tune if EPIC explained HOW this is good for the game, but they just kind of shrug off any question that they don't feel like answering.

>He seems like the kind of ADC that can really fuck with people once you really learn how to play him well
idk if this is accurate higher up (low gold here) but it feels like with how attack speed is and with how quick games are, adcs are kind of just mid level in team importance so having an adc with almost like half a support moveset seems really strong.

epic has a weird fascination with tentacle headgear. kallari would look much better without them too.

Yeah he's actually pretty fun. He works with my regular carry deck. I'll try him on PvP since I've only played him on PvE

>"fix" godawful UI in patch
>fix the fix the next day with another patch because the first one was so bad
Jesus Christ, is there one competent person on this dev team? I guess whoever models the waifus is pretty good, but there have been some misses mixed in with the hits.

Yeah, ADC's don't generally have much time to enjoy their full build from what I've seen, so having a carry with a more robust kit instead of just being shoot-man is definitely an advantage.

Its not that stat building is gone, because a role like carry is just always going to build stats. its that there is no 'right' build for every hero now. taking kwang as an example, you can do suicide kwang, shield kwang or tanky kwang as opposed to before where it was just stasis-radient-bloodsoaked-adamant-ward and if you built anything else you were objectively building wrong.
as far as the attribute system being easier to balance i dunno just more cam bullshit.

This is why I like the new system it is more flexible and varied.

i've only done my normal black/white deck, but i feel like black/green with trapper and one with the tribe or whatever its called is going to be wild. an added slow/root, tons of power in team fights, and of course vampiric blade for sustain.

probably to keep people from finding more broken shit, the community outcry brought it back, you can't hide from dataminers and mathematicians they will find your shit

example here's your OP end game carry builds everyone

These are pretty much the optimal non gimmick builds you need

I wouldn't put it past them to do it once the game leaves beta.

I never built Radiant on Kwang and enjoyed a 4.0 KDA with a 56% win rate.

But that's the thing, why not just add new active effects and reduce the overall effectiveness of stat building at the same time? Best of both worlds without the need to completely reinvent the whole system. There will always be "perfect" or just plain meta builds that everyone gravitates to, just like suggests: the only difference now is that some of the actives make up for not building optimally in some situations. Technically things are more diverse, although there was nothing stopping them from adding these effects pre v42.
If there's any logical reason behind the change (other than just shaking up the whole game for faster matches or even just publicity), then it must have something to do with the new system's infrastructure, but EPIC never explained why this matters outside of a few fluff lines about it making things easier for them to balance (lol).

But that's wrong, we only have 3 slots I can guarantee you a astral leap, flag bearer, protective sentry ADC will get their ass whipped even at 25 agl because non of those cards have power

but even if I apply that to casters it's the same and fighters too, there is WRONG building in v42 just less because of the new system

But for the most part there are already core must haves on each lane:

Mid, Atomic soilder
Carry, shatter golem/ Deathcrawler (rev)

etc.

Hopefully that will be less of an issue when they start adding more cards, but that's at least one full numbered update away, so we're looking at just after Halloween at the earliest.

I didn't say there weren't wrong builds I just said there isn't a right one anymore. Just take as an example thats 7 viable builds for a carry without the Rev or Grim meme builds. as opposed to before where every single carry build was the exact same cards, in the exact same order, with the exact same upgrades that ended with the exact same end stats.

sheeeeit i might even try blue/black with o.p.d. militia, the new cryoagent, and vampiric blade. bit more mana, bit of burst, slow, and you can buy that consumable power item to keep your power up. probably won't work on a team that doesn't have quite a bit of damage already though.

Could the same effect not have been achieved with the old system by unlocking the affinities and moving some numbers around? Who ever made use of that one Order card that gave crit and regen? There were a couple of crit bonus Corruption cards, but why would Revenant ever not build Blade of Agora?
Build variety would have been at least as varied with the old cards, discarding about 30% of them that were just a complete waste of inventory space (although they could have been reworked). Maybe even more varied with 4 active slots, who knows.
I get that the 3 slot system is for balance in terms of what effects are on the field as well as to fit the new economy and game pace, but this still seems like they just decided to throw the baby out with the bathwater yet again.

I assume its due to the slotting upgrades basically requiring that every builds degrades into min/max which then degrades into a single correct build. I'm not trying to argue that the new system is everything they say it is, like I said its more than likely just more Cam bullshit, but it is better than the old one.

I agree that the new system works fine, but what I'm having trouble understanding is why they needed to tear everything down in order to implement it. Seems like it was just another box on the checklist of things to remove from the original concept instead of something that was absolutely necessary.

I recall them saying this system was more intuitive for new players and they had way more success with people understanding it than the old one.

Fair enough, if that's what their "data" says. Not to sound.like a prick, but I don't remember ever having a problem with the old one starting out. Maybe I didn't balance my decks with the early game in mind for a good while, but I never found it hard counting to 60.

i made a few smurfs and you'd be surprised how often people would go entire games without understanding you could put upgrades into cards or even equipping any cards at all. I can see how the current system would be easier to understand if you're just starting.

>its mid plat and carries are STILL pushing the lane early, getting ganked & complaining about how shit support/the team is
Seriously? NOBODY here thinks about matchups? None if these w+m1 brain dead CoD fucks think "hmm there's a squishy in the offlane let's pull the wave back and poke them hard outta lane once they try to get farm"? Not one single fucking carry player here in the top 5% or whatever goes "hmm if we push the lane life is super easy for the solo laner who is getting 100% xp compared to us, hmmmm if we take the tower early the solo laner who is already fucking 4 levels ahead can play catch up on gold and if we push up any further before mid takes the tower we open ourselves to getting ganked hmmm"

I'm so sick of the lack of personal responsibility in mobas and this game doesn't do enough to punish bad players or enough to reward good players who know the little things. Every w+m1 fuck who wins games because the enemy team was uncoordinated or sucked or didn't have w/e flavor of the month OP BS broken hero ends up thinking they're a Greek god and if they do some shit that causes them to die its everyone ELSE's fault for playing properly.

I can vouch for that. The old system was terrible at explaining how it worked.

Jeez, that's dire. Then again, there's nothing even approaching any kind of tutorial outside of that 15 second Gideon/ Steel joke, so it's not that surprising.

The top 5% doesn't mean much when the game population is relatively tiny. I'm not sure taking out the few things that would appeal to serious moba players who would like to try something new was the way to go in addressing that particular problem, either: you're not going to see good retention with the xX420GunSM0keItErryDayXx crowd one way or another, and the autists that come over from the competing titles won't stick around if the mechanics are as shallow as a puddle and the balance is consistently fucked.

the old system was extremely simple if you took just 5 minutes to figure it out but you have to remember that most people who play any game has the attention span of a 4 year old on crack. Having 8 points and wanting to do more damage in the old system meant you had to back, pick the right card, fill it with some upgrades and make sure those upgrades, along with your other cards and upgrades total 60. Now you get 8 points and go ding-ding-ding into agility and can equip heavy hitter

if your carry is retarded just ditch them. they'll bitch and whine the whole match but they'll also usually play super safe and get farmed while you help someone else win lane. one of the keys to solo q is knowing when to cut your losses

oh boy

Bump before bedtime. We're back to where the last thread was before it died, Yanks: show us how much better you are at keeping us bumped.

I JUST GOT FIRED FROM MY 450K A YEAR JOB AND IT WAS JUST FOR SHITBI PORN

I mean...I appreciate that it exists, but a T-pose isn't terribly exciting.

And you weren't buying shares in ebin in order to positively influence development? This is all your fault then, in a way.

>love 42
>bushbro
hmmmmmmmmmmmm

gay

lewd. I love it.

is there an issue?

>tfw having more fun playing CoD than Paragon: CoD Edition
Looks like the joke is on you, Camalamadingdong.

Anyone else play a match or two every few days hoping you pull a 180? I'm sure this is why the general died, I know I haven't been posting nearly as much.

I'm going back to drawing and Dark Souls for a while, but /parag/'s a comfy place to hang out and bump while keeping an eye out for any major changes to Paragon.

>two people both pick drongo
>second pick just waits there and says nothing
>first pick locks in drongo
>second pick chosses a new hero

what do people expect if they don't say anything?

I've got nothing else to play till I crack and buy destiny 2 on launch day.

kek

If I'm still new to playing and I'm only competent playing one or two heroes (decent with sparrow, passable with countess) and the roles are unevenly distributed at draft should i
A) dodge draft
B)pick a hero I suck with that we need
C) use who I'm experienced with and supplement myself into a different role

A if you want the true paragon PvP experience
C if youre at 30m draft penalty and realize the game is trash and roles barely matter anyway

C will make you an eternal shitter
B will lead you on the path out of shitterdom
A is what you will do once you have escaped shitterdom

Play bots to get good with 3 or four characters with different roles then you'll be set, you can also do this in pvp matches if you're ballsy.

I hate how clunky some of the support cards feel
Like Mallenk's Grace for example
>yeah let me just click this and try and click my teammate during a teamfight for a shield that lasts 3 seconds
Fuck off man, just make it so it shields you and the nearest ally or make the shield last longer

or just bring back htp so people actually buy the card

Why the FUCK does Greystone have only an 18% pick rate? I've used him 17 times and I'm 14-3 with him. My KDA is 5.03. I'm eating Countesses and Wukongs and looking like a pure aryan Captain America in the process. This fucker is glorious.

He sucks in this ultra burst meta and his ult is bugged right now where sometimes you'll die when its up

So am I supposed to be running red/white for carries or red/black

He has as much burst as Wukong, doesn't he? He still hits like a truck with his normal attack + Make Way. He's very resilient if built right. I don't know, he seems to have more defense than Wukong or Kwang.