/dsg/ - Demon's/Dark Souls General

>That helpless attacking to save his already dead friend

fuck off duskposter

He's fighting pve mobs with the best stability shield in the game, maxed stamina, and a chloranthy ring+3. If you call him out on it, he'll move the goalposts. This is literally how duskposter works.

>50 strength for that greatshield
>still infuses the sword raw

I'm not saying shields are useless in general, but the stamina damage mobs deal in low level areas is literally fucking nothing. Also, look at how much stamina you're losing when rolling could have easily avoided any of these attacks, except maybe the headbutts, which hit you anyway
Unfortunately shields are still being used as a crutch in souls, good for players with poor timing but with a much lower skillcap, even in roll souls 3. As long as shielding comprises of simply pressing l1 and sporadically releasing to regen stamina better, it's never going to be actually good
Also, fuck whoever made the cathedral/lothric knight shieldbash and thought this shouldn't be available to the player

>best stability shield in the game,
That's actually wrong.

It's the second best after GS of glory, which fucks up your stamina regen. For all intents and purposes, it's the best stability shield

The only shield that has more stability is Greatshield of Glory. It's literally splitting hairs at this point, just ignore the duskposter.

You're the one saying wrong things not me. I'm just correcting you.

not an argument

fuck off duskposter

how do I use splitleaf? I got my ass handed to me so bad invading, it's embarrassing.

>splitleaf
>invading
theres your problem, thats a duel weapon
the tier list is for duels

You use R1 for trades when you can and then L2>R2 if you connect. You also use L2 on its own if you want to be an annoying shitbag.

First off it's not #1 clearly, second it's because most arena people aren't tryhards and people in pve won't get it unless it's dropped because you only get it at the end of the DLC.

You hit people with it.

It's got a narrow hitbox, so it's not great at fighting multiple people.

Basically you just outspace your opponent and try to play passive. The run attack is pretty decent as well for chase downs and the normal r1 is great for roll catching.

Make sure to keep the weapon buffed and confirm r1s into your 3 hit combo.

But I didn't say that. What I said is that it's basically the best. Look, the difference is from 85 to 82, meaning from 15% to 18% stamina damage. That's a mere 20% increase in stamina damage. Even in the best case for the GSoG (chlo+3) your stamina regen goes from 35/s to 15/s, which is less than half. Worst case, the regen drops by 80% (from 25 to 5). Do you see now how moaning is better?

My Black Flame will instantly guard break a BK shield unless he's using GMS.

One my non-pyro character I like to use a Dark Corvian Scythe. It's cuts through shields like butter. It's sometimes hard to tell whether or not my opponent is blocking since the damage is almost the same.

Shields have their uses but this idea that shields are insurmountable is just nonsense. I think FROM did a pretty good job balancing them this time around.

I'm not the one who said it had the highest stability.

there's a very large difference between medium shields and Greatshields.

>My Black Flame will instantly guard break a BK shield unless he's using GMS.

That guy in your webm must have had shit for stamina then because there is no way it should guardbreak it instantly, which by the fact that he's a scaled down phantom and was running towards you in the webm lends to the fact that he's more incompetent than anything against shields.

>One my non-pyro character I like to use a Dark Corvian Scythe. It's cuts through shields like butter. It's sometimes hard to tell whether or not my opponent is blocking since the damage is almost the same.

Yes, you're using one of the few weapons that deals decent shield chip with an infusion that is one of the few ways to deal with shields decently. Even in dark souls 2 dark weapons were meta partially because of shield chipping mind you. And if someone really wanted they could just use a Deep Cathedral Knight Greatshield to negate even most of that. I wouldn't call shields 'insurmountable' but you really have to work hard to deal with the very best ones for a reason especially if you are fighting anyone competent.

Actually I misread your webm, I thought the first phantom was the one with the BK shield but it was the host. That's even more a point against yours though because the host was spamming R1 with a curved greatsword and rolled repeatedly with almost no breaks before holding the shield up, of course it's gonna be guardbroken if he's managing stamina like a moron.

He swung multiple times with little to no time to recover stamina though. Got any better examples?
Me neither, some other dude said that. What I said is that it's the basically the highest stability unless you only ever want to block one big hit. If you care about continuous blocking it's ass unless you use magic shield with lingering+2, but then they just wait out your buff. Playing passively with buffs other than bundles is counter-productive. There's a reason Enisle uses that one and it's not for fashion

Stop moving the goal posts.

>There's a reason Enisle uses that one and it's not for fashion

I honestly don't care what or why he uses anything.

I'm not the shield webm guy, I'm just pointing out basic facts here. As I state here the guy in the webm manages his stamina like a moron and holds his shield up after it's probably drained getting him guardbroken. That's not a credible argument against shields and I'm only entering this discussiong because people in general aren't giving good reasons to back their points.

That second guy was using Black K***ht Shield, which has greatshield tier stability. And the Black Flame still knocked it away like it was nothing.

He ran and rolled once, then ate two R1s, during which he was still recovering stamina. With how fast stamina recovers in DaS3, he most likely had a near-full bar when he ate that Black Flame. The spell does stupid amounts of stamina damage, so even if it doesn't instantly break a greatshield you just have to butter it down with a couple R1s first and then Black Flame.

>Deep Cathedral Knight Greatshield
>whooping 67 stability on a greatshield
Fair enough but that was just an extra indicator, not the argument. The actual argument uses hard data, and you can't refute that

I'm pretty sure that a Black Flame with the Parting Flame will instantly guard break a BK shield. I've never had an occasion where that hasn't been the case but I haven't tested it thoughroughly.

If you encounter someone who's using a shield that you can't guardbreak (like Havel's) then you change tactics. If you can't go through it then you go around it with a scythe or a whip or chip damage etc...

People seem to think that shield are just "hold L1 to win".

>He ran and rolled once, then ate two R1s, during which he was still recovering stamina. With how fast stamina recovers in DaS3, he most likely had a near-full bar when he ate that Black Flame.

I know people like to meme about DS3 stamina recovery but unless he had Chloranthy+3 on (possible) there's no way he had even a quarter of his stamina bar up because he barely had any moments in that webm where he was in a neutral stamina recovery position before he got guardbroke.

>whooping 67 stability on a greatshield
Which is still more than enough for most things and with the stupidly high dark defenses it has will nullify most dark damage chip.

>I've never had an occasion where that hasn't been the case but I haven't tested it thoughroughly.
If you'd like I'd be willing to test this with you right now on PC with my 40 END build with BKS just to get some hard data.

Greatswords are too slow to be effective in PVP

t.Revan

>Black K***ht Shield, which has greatshield tier stability.

Not really.

Friendly reminder that the filter list has been updated to include those shitty shield webms by duskposter. If you don't want to see the posts, filter them.

ahem

docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/130Qz_BflHwpnx5UrSTO9pjeMxMEdFdoi_8_WvEVPnK4/pubhtml

>Black Knight Shield+5: 69
>highest to lowest greatshield stability: 85 to 62 (with about 70 as the mean)

You're a gentleman and a scholar, user

So it's basically as bad as the worst greatshields that no one would ever use.

But that's wrong?

If that's bad to you considering how much it weights next to something like Havel's I wanna know what's good.

That doesn't disqualify the statement that BKS has stability that equals or surpasses that of greatshields. But I can't say I'm surprised that you would move the goalposts like that.

No one uses greatshields anyway.

He asked a question, I gave him an accurate answer. There are people who won't use greatswords because they aren't the most effective. Just because I know the answer, it doesn't mean I champion that mentality. I hate people who go extreme meta because it is just dull

It's weight efficient and stat efficient, on top of having good defenses all around.

>If you'd like I'd be willing to test this with you right now on PC with my 40 END build with BKS just to get some hard data.
Sure. Where at? I'd also be curious to see if Black Flame combos when blocked.

>Apply dark resin to warpick
>Laugh at host's shield

Think you replied to the wrong post, chum

Not everyone spams Scimitars and PKCS's user.

"Greatswords are too slow to be effective in PvP" is not an accurate answer at all.

High Wall, pass dsg. What level are you btw? I want to know if I should place my red sign or if you should place yours depending on who might be downscaled or not.

I'm SL 125.

That's fine then since this will be on a 120 build, my signs down at the first high wall bonfire.

>always break Sirris's quest on new characters because Silvercat can be muled while Proper Bow can't
>don't even remember how to get Hodrick's set anymore

>greatswords are useless
>3 hit UGS combo
>pshh nothin eprsonnel kid

How is that at all a low level area?

Here is how much Black Flame did with Parting Flame on a 40 END Black Knight Shield now.

The dreg heap is the fucking worst place to invade.

that is ridiculous stamina damage desu, easy 1HKO on 30 or below

And here is without Parting Flame, seems only slightly less.

I did indeed
still wrong though

>roughly 75% of the stamina bar
So, they can just hit R1 once or twice beforehand, or bait out an attack/sprint/roll from you, and then instantly break through the strongest medium shield in the game for a free riposte. And if instead someone were to roll through that Black Flame they would take zero damage and lose only a small fraction of that stamina.

Read the post to which he replied with that webm

Yeah Black Flame's pretty fucking strong that is without a doubt and it's good to get further confirmation. Needing to be so close for it is a bitch though.

...

>muh black flame 1shot destroys shields

I've been saying for the longest that it doesn't. But nah don't listen to literally one of the best players in the thread

Hes talking about low level areas and the webm is in one of the last areas in the game

On a scale of 1 to 10, killing a host with a throwing knife while his phantoms are attacking you has gotta be like a 9, 9.5?

Yes, but I'm not talking about that area. Jesus, your reading comprehension hits negative values, so I'll guide you through. He had posted a webm of him using the moaning shield in fucking irithyll. A +5 shield with the second highest, highest effective stability in the game than needs 50 fucking strength to use. Capiche?

How's this build I want to invade in the dungeon, should I make my character lower or weapon buff lower?

You have to keep in mind that BKSh has retarded stability, had it been ethereal oak, he might've got gotten guardbroken

Do you think that someone standing with full stamina guarding and anticipating a Black Flame proves that it's ineffective against shields?

If you've lost a bit of stamina or maybe you don't have 40 END then Black Flame will guard break you. I don't know any other attack that is that fast that does that amount of poise and stamina damage.

>one of the best players in the thread
I am one of the best players in the thread :^)

No, you're exactly where you want to be. If you want to be the nastiest cunt, use poison in the dungeon

>He had posted a webm of him using the moaning shield in fucking irithyll

Then why not reply to that webm instead of the one in the last area of the game? The shields are not upgraded by the way.

Are you a fucking idiot or what?

I'm one of the best players across multiple threads.

>BKSh has retarded stability
But it doesn't though.

>Do you think that someone standing with full stamina guarding and anticipating a Black Flame proves that it's ineffective against shields?
Black flame is pretty terrible im ds3 desu. Once you use it once you'll almost never land it outside of a combo. Probabaly don't even need to roll or run to dodge it.

You know how discussion works? And I was explaining my earlier post at the time. You seriously need to work on your reading comprehension

this thing is a beast against ss gank squads

Any anons whiling to help a sunbro in training out, and summon me to assist you in O&S encounter at 50 soul levels? I need to praise it, and praise it hard!

Should had added playing on Steam, and summon sign will be around Solaire's summon sign, or I can put my summon sign where Solaire is sitting and help clear he way for you to.

>one of the best players in the thread
lol who are you?

me

Black Flame is great wtf are you on about?

Outside of combos it's one of the best turn and burn moves in the game. For some reason people love to rush the squishy pyro and walk right into it.

Sorry to the guy who I summoned for Y**rm, I forgot to rescue onionbro

>It's 10 AM
>I have literally been invading for seven hours

Fucking hell it's hard to stop when you're on a roll. Also, if there's a dude called Cheeseburger here, those were legit some sick goddamn parries, my man. Couldn't have done it without you.

I thought it automatically failed the quest if you entered the fog before rescuing him?

How come this place still manages to be worse than /bbg/

Nah it doesn't

Is blessed lothric greatsword fun?

How do I use Gael's Sword? Seems like a mediocre greatsword desu.

You use 2HR1. You hit people. You press L2. You press R1 after that. Repeat.

Yes it does, he won't come now
Stat allocation doesn't make a weapon more or less fun. The LKGS is fun as fuck and can work as blessed