Keynes or Hayek?

Pretty much these.

>Hoppe started my conversion from Libertarianism to National Socialism

Cringe

Neither

I too agree that mussolini's italy is preferable to a failed state or an absent one

Reading das kapital turned you into a national socialist?

Tough crowd.

> when it's to everyone's benefit
Yes, but the magic comes from taking the leap between
>coercion is not, ever, philosophically justifiable
and
>coercion, in some cases, is philosophically justifiable
It was a difficult one for me to make, and simple Utilitarianism
>it's for the greater good!
did not account for the shift. If it did, than I would also have to support a legal system that obligates people to prevent a blind man from walking into traffic, such as the old Law 101 example goes, and to support a variety of economic, social, and cultural rights.

Simplifying it a bit (lot):
>coercion will happen regardless
>humans accept a baseline of coercion of occurring
>coercion thus can be preemptively utilized for key aspects

this is combined with my new understanding that
>the sum of all voluntary human interactions cannot be adequately categorized under the 'market' if that term is to retain any meaningfulness

>likewise, the 'market' as a narrower term referring to buyers and sellers, and buying and selling, cannot and should not be used to optimally organize all voluntary human interactions

>furthermore, some human interactions cannot be optimally organized purely voluntarily (market failures)

and
>a good lot of 'property rights' are a spook

put me over the fence on statism and economics.

Yet Maoists, Trotskyites, and anprims roam free on this board, Veeky Forums, and /co/
Are you implying that all libertarianism =anarchism?

Marx and the anarchists allowed me to understand property ownership and capital from a philosophical and metaphysical standpoint beyond Locke. I reject property-rights-from-first-principles, and I reject that "self-ownership" as a concept is and can be equivalent to ownership of a car, or put options, or a piece of music. I no longer maintain a philosophical connection to private property rights, but a practical one.

>eco teacher has a huge hard on for austrian school, quotes Hayek all the time
>crisis should not be sought to be avoided or solved because it's a cleansing mechanism of the market
>the market is perfect and pure and magically stabilize itself towards optimality

Keynes has been debunked so neither

For an Austrian your prof sure wasn't the keenest one.

At least modern ones accept that economic events don't happen in perfectly-free-market vacuums, and paint them in such a fashion that presents government as the primary cause of downturns.

I no longer agree, but still respect that they tried to maintain cohesiveness

BTW are you an MMTer, an anarchist Shaikhian, Minskyite post-Keynesian, Lange–Lerner, Marxian, Neo-Marxian, TSSIst ,Georgist, Neuroeconite, some other snowflake?

>no neo ricardian

Wolff

>neo ricardian
What the hell else emerged from the CCC?

Surprisingly, almost none of my former Economics professors, regardless of school, knew about the Cambridge Capital Controversy, the branches that split off from it, or its implications on economics as a whole. Just drew blanks.

As far as i know samuelson was like "i admit sraffa is right but we're gonna keep going as if nothing happened" and everyone else was happy to follow.

Ha, probably didn't help that my uni used Nordhaus and Samuelson's Economics (15ed or some such), and the department head was a grant-grand student of his.

Keynes is being disproved as time goes on, the problem is there is very little incentive to re-do yet again the whole science especially when it's so helpful to use politically.

It's going to take a long time for people to realize what Hayek was really trying to say with the dispersion of knowledge and the impossibility of long term central planning keep a society stable and prosperous.

Almost like Einstein or Tesla he saw something, a spark of genius that revealed a deep truth to the world which is currently being ignored and discarded for what inflates peoples ego's in the short term.

cringe

le capitalism should be abolished face

This

I dont think hes being proven wrong now so much as criticisms of him that he acknowledged are coming to fruition.

>Marx and the anarchists
Which anarchists, Proudhon and Stirner? Neither? Others?

Don't attack Georgism senpai

>It's going to take a long time for people to realize what Hayek was really trying to say with the dispersion of knowledge and the impossibility of long term central planning keep a society stable and prosperous.
Pretty sure everyone understands what he said, it's pretty simple. His critique of central planning doesn't affect neoclassical economics nor keynesianism though, it's basically irrelevant unless you are a tankie.

>a spark of genius that revealed a deep truth to the world which is currently being ignored and discarded for what inflates peoples ego
Jesus christ austrians are a sect.
Mind you telling us what the revealed truth of our lord hayek is?

Im not retarded enough to force a particular paradigm up my ass and deny every refutation by rationalizing mistakes

youtube.com/watch?v=GTQnarzmTOc