Explain why as a non-white I should care about this country in historical sense

Not that guy but are you two getting triggered over the word SJW instead of addressing the substance of his post? Because nothing he said was incorrect.

No it's just that we here the same poorly informed ideas surrounding Rhodesia when much of it is exaggeration and the reality is a lot more complex than "muh breadbasket" and "muh Ian Smith".

*hear

That's what Veeky Forums is here for. To educate wandering /pol/fags.

I'd rather Veeky Forums be irrelevant so all the normies fucked off.

It was top 5 African country in living standards and that included the Rhodesian blacks, that's a fact.
Never experienced a famine and produced a great surplus of food, also a fact.
Went to absolute shit under Mugabe within 15 years and became a hellhole with 80% unemployment rate and mass starvation so bad they now rely on food aid, a fact too.

All a verifiable statististical reality, no exaggeration. I remember there was some assblasted anti-white Ugandan on Veeky Forums who always cried about "Rhodie expats" and /pol/ everytime Rhodesia was mentioned, is that you?

>Veeky Forums
>feared.
same way people fear cockroaches tbph

a e s t h e t i c

short shorts and FALs, man
>tfw no Rhodesia cosplayer waifu

Zimbabwe being a shit hole compared to Rhodesia can only be said in hindsight and the blame placed solely at the hands of Mugabe.

The fact is that if you have a minority who reaps the rewards of these economic benefits at the expense of a second class of citizens who are barred from certain forms of education, barred from an active role in politics, barred from certain parts of society and doomed to be looked down upon, you're going to have some problems.

You shouldn't in a historical sense, but it's just plain interesting.
>Declares independence, only state to do except the US
>Immediately embargoed and warred on by most of the world, including their 'allies'
>Still manages to have a great living standard, a near-unique culture, and the only african country that had enough water to water their lawns and streets every morning.
>Enough food to actually export it to their neighbours before said neighbours declared war.

Not only was all these problems you describe not only common at the time, but black people could vote, could get educated, and all of that. Even tribals could vote, and the vote of a clan leader mattered a lot more, politically, than that of a random white dude.

I'm a permanent resident in America and I don't have a right to vote. In frankness I don't give a fuck, it's not a big deal and I'd rather be a non-voter in America than a voter in Uganda.

>random white guy
and a random black guy's vote was worth less than a random white guy.
Or are you saying every nigger was a clan leader?

youtube.com/watch?v=-p1NRLFso6Q

>enough water to water their lawns and streets
Wait, people water streets? Why? Doesn't all the water just go down the drains?

>rejoice black people of Zimbabwe! for even though you live in hell on earth you have been given the gift of FREEDOMS that was taken away from you by your oppressors!
by the end of the day it all boils down to americanism and americanist influence.

French revolution too.

Only Nazis care about this shithole because muh whites

The Blacks did the right thing and reclaimed their lands

>did the right thing
Starved to death? What a brilliant plan.

Freedom ain't free

Kicked out the only people who could manage the farms and business's effectively?
Brilliant plan, truly the reason for Zimbabwe's stunning success.

I hope you feel the same way when euroniggers start chimping out to reclaim their lands from Muslims 20 years from now.

...

Explain to me why I should care about a non-white's opinion.

>living under a literal dictatorship
>freedom
>BUT AT LEAST HE'S BLACK LMAO

Typical tribal negroid mentality. Who cares if he's shit, at least he's ours.

I do

I'd even support jihadists as long as they're fighting for self-determination and preservation

>self determination
The retarded enlightement meme that just refuses to die.

go check out all those posts on stormfront where people say they'd happily live in poverty as long they weren't being ruled by da jooos

>muh stormfront

White people had no problem voting for Obama if they believed in his policies. Meanwhile the blacks would literally NEVER vote for a white guy running against a black guy, regardless of policies.

And this is proving by voting record in pretty much all African countries that allow voting, they always vote for some stupid fucker from their own tribe and don't care if he's completely incompetent or insane.

yeah well, tribalism isn't exclusive to niggers, just sayin', the whole "it's shit but at least it's our shit" is common in all ethnonationalist movements

In America it pretty much is. Whites can and do vote for non-whites. Asians can and do vote for non-Asians. But with the blacks as long as there's a black candidate he's 100% getting their vote if he's running against a non-black.

It's kind of funny when the liberal media portray America as if whites are racists who want to live in segregated white utopias while blacks are inclusive and tolerant multikulti apostles, when in reality it's the exact opposite.

end your life you stupid nigger

>and a random black guy's vote was worth less than a random white guy.
No. An educated person of legal age could vote. That was all it took. Except clan leader didn't have to be educated to vote.

yes, and the majority of seats would have to be given to the white minority of the country.

I know I am not going to get an answer - or the answer will be no, but here goes:

Does an up to date, SCHOLARLY history of the period following the UDI exist? I'm not looking for a 'military history' which is slavering all over the FALS and 'sticks' - I'd like something that looks at the history of the Republic of Rhodesia taking into account political, economic, social and military factors.

Well hindsight is 20/20, cant blame them for wanting to run their native countries

But it should be a warning story that sometimes, even often. Democracy is overrated. I would argue that democracy is worthless without a functioning civic society, relatively free and scrupulous press and an independent but apolitical judicial branch. Having social mobility and access to education also helps.

None of these are necessary for democracy or vice versa.

Its not 100%, Trump got marginally more black votes than Romney for example.

Well that's cause the whites were more educated. Of course the educated people rule the nation.

They lied about the Great Zimbabwe.

Personally, I think it's just a bunch of faggots with oper8ing fantasies and an FAL fetish who obsess over this particular failed nation-state.

It's called cleaning them

You're lying:
>In the 1970 constitution, the electoral system was changed with the 'B' roll being abolished. Instead, the electorate were segregated by race with European, Asian and mixed citizens meeting certain income and property qualifications – an annual income of 1,800 dollars or more for the past two years or immovable property worth 3,600 dollars or more, with either demand lowered by a third if the person had completed four years of secondary education – voting in 50 constituencies, with Africans meeting lower qualifications – an annual income of 600 dollars or more for the two past years or immovable property worth 1,200 dollars or more, with either demand lowered by a third if the voter had completed two years of secondary education – voting in eight. In addition, there were eight seats elected by an electoral college of African tribal chiefs.

The number of black seats was capped at 50 too, so no matter how educated or wealthy the blacks became (and access to education and wealth was obviously not equal either), whites were still guaranteed 50% of the seats despite being less than 10% of the population.

Also:
>The Rhodesian government was never tolerant of dissent throughout the UDI period, but it became positively repressive as the final debacle approached. The liberal former Prime Minister Garfield Todd and members of his family were subject to various forms of detention and house arrest.

lol triggered

More mugabe who used Westerners with regressive leftist leanings to mitigate international outrage when he seized land from whites to award cronies

I think he means a sewer system which most African nations lack

>don't have the right to vote
Why tho

Same reason why we care about the Indus Valley and Sumerian civilisations, because it is a look at how society can be perfect when run in more than one way

Cockroaches are to be feared if you don't keep them in check...

So are you.
>majority of seats would have to be given to the white minority of the country

What happened to Zimbabwe is sad for that reason, it became a "famine stricken wasteland" only around in 2000.
The 20 years of Mugabe's rule beforehand were actually quite prosperous for Zimbabwe which is were the the term "breadbasket of africa" actually comes from.

That wasn't me, but last I check 50 is greater than 16

Only citizens can vote. Not all permanent residents are citizens.

fucking....aye...brah....
:^(

quora.com/What-can-be-explained-about-the-hyperinflation-in-Zimbabwe-What-were-the-causes-of-it-and-its-impact-on-the-economy-of-the-country

Really answer it all multiple times.

>only
Yeah, because shit needs time to decay.

Also you can pretty much delay the time in which Blacks can reach the majority for years since the government has control over all the things that tie into enfranchisement.

It's just like how Booker T Washington's idea for Black empowerment relied on a naivety that one can have economic and justice rights without civil and political rights. Can't have the former two without the latter two.

Attention for attention ' s sake is not a moral good.

You fucking tween.

I'm Asian and I like Rhodesia because it's one of very few African countries that didn't suck total shit.

I do realize that Rhodesia is often used by white supremacists as an example of white people succeeding even in harsh conditions, and I think this association is what turns most people off.

But if you look into it a little deeper, you'll realize that Rhodesia is actually better for black people. At least compared to modern-day Zimbabwe, or modern-day Africa in general. Yes, it's true that white Rhodesians were more privileged than the blacks, but it's not like it's the only country guilty of this. Hell, it's the 21st century, and people accuse the USA of the same thing, even to this day, even during a black presidency.

White people in Rhodesia were working hard to make things better for all people living in the country. The government even wanted a black-majority rule someday, but it's not something that can be accomplished overnight. They were working on it slowly but surely, but shit got fucked up really fast because people in general are greedy assholes.

The downfall of Rhodesia basically boils down to outside nations saying "Look, my fellow black man, whites have more power than you in your own country. Are YOU really gonna take this from them?", then the country basically imploded.

The black-majority rule was expedited much too quickly, and modern-day Zimbabwe is the shithole we know today.

Bottom line, Rhodesia technically wasn't terrible. White supremacists just make everything they touch look like total dogshit.

>Yes, it's true that white Rhodesians were more privileged than the blacks, but it's not like it's the only country guilty of this.

5% of the population are enfranchised while 90% consisted of a racial underclass and maybe add some Asians (. 5% complete dominate everything in one country.

>White people in Rhodesia were working hard to make things better for all people living in the country.

No they mostly voted in a government that supported them and preyed on their fears. Also welfare only existed because they wanted to make sure no class solidarity existed between the poor whites and blacks.

>The government even wanted a black-majority rule someday, but it's not something that can be accomplished overnight.

But in enacted rules and polices that DIRECTLY opposed it.Blacks got worse pay in the same fields compared to whites dramatically like night and day. Blacks were barred from competing with whites for jobs or positions with exclusionary polices and the fear of blacks stealing jobs with dirt cheap wages. They couldn't be paid as equals to white nor were they able to use their cheaper labour wages to their advantage due to complaints for labourers.

You are also making it seem like Blacks voting is such monumental task only fit for the exclusive few. Nigga it's just a vote and the whole "when yo are ready" is a moving goalposts that can be hindered or moved.

> They were working on it slowly but surely, but shit got fucked up really fast because people in general are greedy assholes.

It would take until 2030-2050 for it to be "ready" at the pace back then. Better yet why would a minority give up it's power to a majority and lose all it's influence? Slowly but surely is not enough because like I said before local interest and the government can and in many cases did work against it.

Rhodesia was in it's white parts good, bu the rest was utter shit with the only "good" part being "they are less worse then most other states". that's until you realize that they could've done so much better for it's people but didn't at all since it was about the bare minimum.

Rhodesia for example if it ACTUALLY extended it White education for all kids it would have much more strain on it's budget. The Black quality of education would soar but the whites woudl have a strain.

You're falsely generalizing whites. A lot of whites don't vote for Obama because he's Barry Soetoro muslim or something like that. They won't vote for a black man ever.
He said when a black candidate goes against a non-black candidate. The only circumstances are the 2008 and 2012 elections. Not only blacks per se, but the media and the academy was also guilty of racebaiting idpol shit.

How in the actual fuck do you think what happened in Rhodesia/Zimbabwe was in any way related to what we usually call SJWism?

Government policies to gradually raise the standing of blacks were attempted to be issued some years prior to the wars but the ideas were quickly dispatched, resulting in the fall of the ruling party IIRC.

Basically what happened is that some blacks were mad about colonial oppression, Commieblock countries wanted to gain a foothold on a continent rich in resources, found some potential dictators with zero regard for human life, their goals coincided pretty well, Soviets and Asian communists financed, armed and trained their candidates and helped them incite certain parts of the population into going to war.

If that's what you are thinking about, the lack of Western support/lack of recognition for the Rhodesia-Zimbabwe government had nothing to do with SJW-ism, it was simple realpolitik.

>not providing counter information
>just laughing like a smug asshole
Why do people do this?

If the people have no culture of democracy it goes awfully wrong

Because I'm not a citizen, dumbass.

youtube.com/watch?v=mmwEnfyFTtY

...

...

if this were true ben carson would have gotten a lot farther than he did.

Not so long before dropping out he was second next to Trump, quite popular among evangelicals, he only got into the nomination to market his latest book

The guy is.. very peculiar.

Didn't they have power sharing in the government between blacks and whites?

>some stupid fucker from their own tribe and don't care if he's completely incompetent or insane
Nigeria elected that Muslim guy who seems to be pretty based

>he only got into the nomination to market his latest book
Trump released a new book around the time he announced his candidacy.

Herman Cain in 2011 too.

No

Blacks were in the parliament with some laughable small numbers, like blacks could vote black candidates into 5% of the seats while they constituted the majority of the population.
The government tried to issue equalising legislations a few years before the unrest but the rest of the parliament voted against it, finding the planned transition it too fast and risky (that's the official explanation, maybe they were just simply racist and didn't want to see blacks in power) and it eventually resulted in the fall of the ruling government.
At the end of the war, Ian Smith tried to make peace and create a more equal state of Rhodesia-Zimbabwe which had a much more equal power sharing and intentions to bring more equality in the future. Western governments expressed moral support towards it but did not recognised it, knowing that it was a lost cause. Rhodesia-Zimbabwe was probably the best idea that could happen, but Mugabe wanted to be the only one in charge (R-Z had the other guy's party in the government IIRC) and he continued the war to eventually win it. And when he won, he ironically did nothing to create equality. Knowing that he will be much more able to exploit the country if the best farmlands in the middle of it stayed in the hands of those who have the know-how to work them, the lands that in theory constituted the casus belli of the war remained in white hands. It was not until some 15 years later when Mugabe's lackeys demanded more loot and he handed them the farms, which afterwards they completely ignored because they got bored of actually doing something in their time that is not murdering and oppressing civilians, pushing Zimbabwe into starvation, hyperinflation and an overall economic crisis. Mugabe then begged the white farmers to come back and stormfags use this event to justify their claim that blacks can't do anything of worth without the aid of white people. Don't be one of them please.