/civ4xg/ Endless, Stellaris, Civilization, and 4X

/rtsg/ /cbg/

Last turn ENDLESS SPACE 2
>Official and Unofficial Wiki
wiki.endless-space.com
endless-space-2.wikia.com
>Community Hub
www.games2gether.com
>Planets Stats
imgur.com/w5RO8TH.jpg
>Ships Stats
pastebin.com/aabCNGau
>Horatio splicing guide
pastebin.com/1cH8sqEH
>Manual
cdn.akamai.steamstatic.com/steam/apps/392110/manuals/User%27s_Manual_-_Endless_Space_2.pdf
>ES2 politics guide.
pastebin.com/pDUQDpwA
>Comics
wiki.endless-space.com/comics
>Soundtrack
soundcloud.com/flybyno/sets/endless-space-2-soundtrack
>ES2 prequel
www.games2gether.com/endless-legend/forum/6-game-design/thread/3572-the-last-flight-of-the-gray-owl

ENDLESS LEGEND
>Manual:
cdn.akamai.steamstatic.com/steam/apps/289130/manuals/User'sManual.pdf
>Wiki:
endlesslegendwiki.com
endless-legend.wikia.com

STALEARIS
>2.0 Patchnotes:
forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/stellaris-dev-diary-105-2-0-cherryh-patch-notes.1069794/
>Pastebin:
pastebin.com/YHdisqem
>Wiki:
www.stellariswiki.com
>The Development of Stellaris en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Development_hell

CIVILIZATION
>Browser Civ Game, plays like civ2
play.freeciv.org
>Civ IV XML fix
www.dropbox.com/sh/ljdms8ygix2btcs/AACC_IGIy7zAkomwA6S4DJp3a?dl=0
>Civilization Analyst (Civ VI, Civ V, BE):
well-of-souls.com/civ/index.html
>Civ V Giant Multiplayer Robot:
www.multiplayerrobot.com
>Civ 5 Mods
forums.civfanatics.com/forumdisplay.php?f=393
>Civ 5 More Mods
pastebin.com/5ANRmRur
>Civ 5 Drafter
georgeskleres.com/civ5/
>District Cheat Sheet:
civ6.gamepedia.com/District

ALPHA CENTAURI
>Essential improvements:
pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/Sid_Meier's_Alpha_Centauri#Essential_improvements

MICROPROSE
>MoM
www.myabandonware.com/game/master-of-magic-21t
>Wiki
masterofmagic.wikia.com/wiki/Mod
>MoO 2
gamesnostalgia.com/en/game/master-of-orion-ii-battle-at-antares

DISTANT WORLDS : UNIVERSE
pastebin.com/hubsc3ZS

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=Mri-GrBT_KU
youtu.be/kBRCbFUwlFM
twitter.com/AnonBabble

>Can't have four ion cannons around a Citadel
WIZ

I spawned next to the fanatical xenophobe FE . first time

do they let me colonize the free scripted planets that appear near me or is this start 100% fucked

Wow Wiz. Sorry that you had to read this Ingrate's bullshit. Know that you always have loyal fans like me to eat up your quality content!

how unlikely is this?

The math that you've linked to is fucking obscene; claiming territory shouldn't punish you AT ALL.

Settling planets might, fine; I get it that you can't just have people build tons of research centers and blaze through the tree.

But the old method was better than this! This is an obscenity!

How is stellaris since the patch?

is it dare I say, fun? or still kind of shitty?

At most, upgrading your outposts should add 1% per upgrade. Just building an outpost adding 2% defeats the entire purpose.

2.0 is fucked

I want to watch a livestream where Wiz sits down and spend an hour or more playing 2.0 and realizing that it doesn't fucking work.

...

>claiming territory shouldn't punish you AT ALL

This is why you aren't allowed to design games

It's even worse than before. Not because of bad ideas, but because of bad implementation of those ideas. The numbers for everything are off and it makes the game horrible.

MOMMY

As if what Paradox have done by linking research speed and population size makes any sense

Mechanically it's better. But like someone else said everything is currently an unbalanced mess

>Eco-damage
Do I look like a fucking hippy to you?
Go masturbate with a mindworm, Deirde

It'd be more fun than the current way its handled.

repostan because bullshit needs to be smelled

Why 2% per system is bullshit.
In terms of science, take a 3 physics black hole system. Fairly common overall
Now 2% increase in cost means that if you have more than 150 physics research, settling that system and then building a station is a NET LOSS in terms of science speed.
If you need to claim another system in between to claim it as that means 4% increase which means that if you have as little as 75 physics research it is NOT WORTH settling that system
Now this is ignoring that a 3 physics system does not just increase physics research but all research and unity.
If we consider it as a 3/0/0 system then as early as 50/50/50 research, which is common for a science focused early game and a regular midgame, claiming a 3 physics system is actively harmful.
Unity loss is harder to calculate bug given how powerful unity traditions are I say for the sake of argument it's fair to consider it a 4th research.
If we consider unity a 4th research then as early as 38 research overall it is not worth settling. 38 overall can be reached with 1 planet.

That's just average systems, now let's take a look at a special system: the best possible outcome of the infinity machine the 10/10/10 pantagruel black hole.

settling this if you have more than 500 research each, something which is entire plausible for an early endgame empire is a net loss if it's right next to your border
if it is 3 systems away, and remember this is a top tier reward from a one per galaxy event, then it is not worth settling if you have 170 research each. That's midgame research levels.
And remember Pantagruel is only the BEST possible outcome for an event that requires you to sacrifice one of your scientists for a significant period of time.
Most of the time it just remains a 3/3/3 singularity which would be worthless as early as 150 research each on your border. And this is the same category of events that unlock 6th tier shields.

even at 1% the math doesn't check out
0.1% is where it starts checking out

Does blockading my own systems stop my allies/peaceful races from trading with me?
(ES2)

It doesn't make any sense for things to work that way because this is a game where labor-saving devices can become their own autonomous civilizations. You have fundamental misconceptions about the role of human labor. As I said initially, preindustrial and intergalactic war are fundamentally different for a variety of reasons. You can't build synthetic humans in EU4, you can in Stellaris. The games are fundamentally different conceptually and have different internal logics. It makes no sense to put manpower into stellaris because it's not just men doing the work.

No, AI barely ever making trade companies does.

>when Hostile Fleet Detected starts playing

youtube.com/watch?v=Mri-GrBT_KU

No, only hostile blockades do that.

then remove exhaustion

Anyone has that pic of a custom stellaris race of jews?

Is there a way to stop an AI from "peacefully" converting my systems? Or do I have to be at constant war with someone if they have better influence production?

Just rename it something that'll fit the flavour better. Maybe they won't run out of people but having all the factories that used to make space-dildos now churning out combat robotics and slugs for railguns in order to keep up with the rate of losses is going to cause upset.

Space mining and labs should autoupgrade with mining and lab tech, so they will be true alternatives to planetary

So why have war exhaustion at all?
If people are so detatched from the conflict overall, war exhaustion shouldn't even become a thing until planets start getting bombarded and the realities of being at war start to hit the populace.

I'm completely OK with that
There's already a maintenance cost for ships and buildings and there's no need for more than that, except maybe something that makes maintenance more expensive as ships move away from starbases.
>So why have war exhaustion at all?
I don't know, I'm not advocating for its inclusion in the game.

ES2? You can ask them to stop, if you are big and scary (or have good relations with them) they will stop. Beyond that conquering their planets also works.

manpower can work sort of, if you consider that only a small portion of specially talented individuals are capable of manning military grade starships

that said ship xp already is in the game so war exhaustion from losing ships shouldn't make any sense

what SHOULD cause the war exhaustion is rebuilding ships. If you are losing ships at an alarming rate then you should be able to reduce your consumer goods for a period of time in exchange for war exhaustion ticking up as long as you're reducing consumer goods
then if you keep losing minerals eventually you'll hit the threshold of having to sign surrender because your people are about to revolt if their basic necessities keep being turned into star ships you keep blowing up

War exhaustion should also rise with occupied planets for obvious reasons

Reminder RTS games like Age of Empires 2 and Sins of a Solar Empire have tradding while "4X" Stellaris does not.

just going to repeat from the previous thread, but exhaustion as it is now is neither realistic or fun, s either give it a resource for the players to manage or remove it, manpower is just a possible name for it

Have some Turks.

It shouldn't be War Exhaustion, it should be fucking War Score like in Paradox's games that actually make sense. Once you get sufficient War Score to achieve your claims the AI will accept peace. War Score is added by winning battles and occupying systems.

>if you consider that only a small portion of specially talented individuals are capable of manning military grade starships
This doesn't matter when you can build an AI or machine capable of doing the job of one or more crewmen.
>manpower is just a possible name for it
Then whoever suggested this shouldn't have used the word 'manpower' to describe it

>destroy enemy starbase
>they getexhaustion
>they recapture it by being backstabbing niggers
>i get the same exhaustion
>they know where you r units are headed the moment you give the order even if the fleet is far outside their vision range so its practically impossible to catch them off guard

Biggest issue with war: if you try to advance the enemy will just undo your work until war exhaustion forces a white peace. Its impossible to hold onto systems unless you park a fleet on it which gets prohibitive past 2-3 systems, and dead in the water if you face a war on multiple fronts (which you will since everyone is forming federations and shit)
Also with the massive ship upkeeps you wont have more than 2 viable fleets that can take on the enemy so again, you cant do shit against backstabbing.
They shouldn't get all their "exhaustions worth" out of recapturing their shit. the war is being fought on their territory, they should suffer for it.

>I'm completely OK with that
>I don't know, I'm not advocating for its inclusion in the game
ok then, but sadly its here to stay, so giving it a resource to manage it is a solution, the current version is shit

oh and this also solves the issue of "I just lost half my fleet but dealt a crippling blow to the enemy in the process, better sign white peace"
you simply don't rebuild your fleet or just start the rebuild at a peacetime pace while you use your remaining fleet to occupy their planets given their entire navy was just dismantled.
As long as you don't take drastic measures your war exhaustion doesn't increase

and if it turns out your crippling blow wasn't near as crippling as you thought and the enemy managed to rebuild his fleet and come back for you, well then that's your own fault

No it shouldn't.

>using my image as the op
noice

also to the many people from earlier, to fix the mathematically INSANE system penalty on tech and unity, go to 00_defines in common -> defines, obviously you'll need to give yourself the permissions to edit the file if you don't already have them, and then change both

TECH_COST_MULT_NUM_SYSTEMS

and

TRADITION_COST_MULT_NUM_SYSTEMS

from 0.02 to something lower than that.
I reduced it to 0.01 but logically speaking there shouldn't even be a system-based penalty for tech at all.

At 0.02 I had a 400% penalty to my research and unity, it was fucking ridiculous. 0.01 gave 200%, which is still dumb in theory but wasn't fucking me over anywhere near as badly.

I also increased system ship speed (SHIP_SUBLIGHT_SPEED_MULT) from 5 to 7 and decreased hyperlane warmup (HYPERLANE_WINDUP) from 15 to 5, but those aren't as fundamentally necessary to do as the stupid mult_num_systems penalties, I was just getting personally annoyed with how slow my fleets seemed to be.

>so giving it a resource to manage it is a solution
I don't understand what you mean by 'resource,' you already pay maintenance.

In ES2, should I be careful and thrifty about which system improvements I build where? Or should I build them somewhat freely? Not sure if upkeep costs are going to bite me hard later on or if I won't even notice.

Why does hyperlane travel take so long? Wouldn't it make more sense for hyperlanes to be for quickly and efficiently moving through owned territories while warp drives could be expensive and time consuming, making them best suited for military ventures? I hate that when a pirate base spawns in a system that I'm surveying it takes me months to get a fleet out to stop it even though I own everything in between.

I already used that pic, i need the jew one

>they know where you r units are headed the moment you give the order even if the fleet is far outside their vision range
it will always work like that till better AI exist

How do robots and single-minded murderous xenophobic purge collectives get tired of fighting?

>This doesn't matter when you can build an AI or machine capable of doing the job of one or more crewmen.
not necessarily, the way the game is set up, creating an AI with human level of intelligence and capability is an endgame tech only achieved when you reach synthetics. Both robots and droids have severe penalties to mental activities like research.
and these are styled as individuals not carbon copies so even among them there would be extraordinary individuals you can't simply rebuild

that said I already admitted it was a flimsy excuse and sufficiently represented by ship xp

Gimme a sec, I can make a Jew race.

Somewhat freely works fine, but nothing stops you from min-maxing that shit.
The only improvement you should really be careful with is that production thingy that buffs sterile and hot planets, obviously you should probably delete it once you start terraforming.

>creating an AI with human level of intelligence and capability is an endgame tech
So there is no logical reason for empires that have synths to have manpower concerns.

0.01 is still to high, do the math it's fairly easy to see
changing it to 0.003 is more along the lines of being fair

>when time of change starts playing
youtu.be/kBRCbFUwlFM

The upkeep costs are big early on. Only build shit where they'll provide a large bonus, or are otherwise necessary. If you don't have temperate or fertile worlds don't even bother with xenoindustrial infrastructure or public private partnerships until you have most of the system colonized and can pick up 40 or so industry/science from building them. Going for the conversion techs early is important so you can convert industry into dust or science when you run out of good things to build.

looks like I'll have to play a different shitty 4X with a different shitty expansion

why are they all so shitty

Outside of the pure exterminators I could see an AI empire become tired of spending so much computation on war when it could be doing other things. Just need a sufficiently good writer to dress these things up.

So from what I gathered from the new Stellaris update is that the game punishes you for expanding your empire even though thats the entire point

Have the Жидopeптилoиды

You wouldn't dismantle me would you, user?

I think you could think of a way to spin it if you wanted to but I don't actually give a fuck about your roleplaying. For stellaris war exhaustion is the better gameplay mechanic. The numbers just need to be tweaked.

So ships are just piloted and maintained by what? At some point you have manpower working in your fleet. Either in the form of soldiers or officers. Every civilization isn't using artificially intelligent robots to man their fleet. Even then, robots have some kind of cost to them. It's not like the materials come out of thin air and they just assemble themselves. Stop pretending like its a crazy concept.
>b-but what if my population is artificially intelligent robots
Cool then maybe you can replenish your manpower pool with minerals. It opens up interesting game mechanics that can separate different types of civs.

yup, a logical AI would also be immune to the sunk-cost fallacy and realize that it approached the point where any outcome of a war would be unfavorable to ending the war at which point it would immediately seek to end hostilities

>when you run out of good things to build.
Warships are always good to build in the early-mid game. Conversions start to matter in late only, in my opinion.

Are there any waifu robot mods?

me religious
me destroy robot

I think one of the big points of 2.0 was to make wars of massive gain really not viable unless you VASTLY overpower somebody. I think they wanted to push conquering as something more tedious to prevent it from snowballing. Probably why they made vassaling so much harder too.

I'm down with that, but then against I never really go militaristic, I can see why that'd be annoying for someone who wants to.

On the upside the enemy has to deal with the same bs you do, it's nice to know your not gonna get conquered out of one war, and if you get smart about system claims you can make them have to waste up their claims ability and military ability not really taking too much of value from you.

Why is war exhaustion "oh we are le tired of fighting" better than war score "you are clearly winning this war"?

me materialist
me turn into robot

>Grug embrace progress
>Grug reach singularity
>Grug more than a man now!

according to the devs in the forums for the excuse of war exhaustion
>war exhaustion works under the assumption that the tripulation you lose on destroyed ships isn't that easily replaceable as the ship itself, and that your citizens growth tired of the war state as time advances, and for macine/swarm empires that their matrix/hivemind overload/gets tired
its bullshit but they aren't removing it, wi already said
>I MIGH teak the numbers in the future
what I mean by manpower is some resource that you spend on shits that symbolizes the tripulation, with different prices depending on the ship size, and war exhaustion only activates if that number reachs 0, that way both the AI (as cheaty as it can get) and you would get affected by it on long wars

Well said fellow intellectual

I would. I can't even stick my dick between your silicon tits when there's pipes there.

>dat nose

P E R F E C T

>materialists

then give crisis and the marauders war exhaustion

>tfw can't blow up any planet you want.

Also if you build a fleet.
Or go to war.

But jews are xenophobes

>truce ends
>AI instantly converts one of my systems before I can do anything

Hol' up.
Do militarists gain war exhaustion at the same rate as pacifists?
Do authoritarians gain exhaustion at the same rate as egalitarians?
Does anyone gain exhaustion at the same rate as their counterpart? Because they really fucking shouldn't if this is how they're "modelling" war exhaustion.

problem is that we have other paradox games to compare to how war exhaustion worked
in say EUIV war exhaustion made you want to end wars as it amplifies any inherent flaws in your empire, it causes people to start revolting for various reasons, causes the economy to sputter etc. It was up to the player to determine when enough was enough and to end the war and deal with his own country disintegrating

This is good game design as it increase the number of choices the player had to make.

Stellaris with it's auto white peace however takes choice away from the player and doesn't give enough feedback. You can tell the player as much as you want that the empire is getting sick of it but if you don't show it happening it feels to disconnected.

What could happen instead would be as war exhaustion increases unrest starts to rise among your planets, some go in strikes against the continued war, the pacifist faction gains more and more support even in otherwise militaristic empires, ships start deserting, army morale goes down etc
and it's up to the player to cut the knot and say "enough, no war is worth this"

would also help that this could be tweaked by how fast it all happens by what sort of war you're facing. If you're defending against a homicidal fanatic purifier it increases way less quickly

"Synthetic God" and "Assembly the fleet" are their best music.

Paradox is obsessed with implementing features that exist purely to hinder the player's progression. I guess it's easier for them than implementing meaningful logistics and economy.
It goes like this
>the only thing you can really do in our games is blob, so what should we do?
>add something else to do?
>nah, let's just add some lazily designed roadblocks, fuck putting effort into things
They balance EU4 and Hoi4 in the same fashion.

>Using materialist to mean desiring wealth when it refers to a metaphysical belief.
*tips fedora*

They're xenophile for the goyim's nations they control in order to water-down goyim's sense of unity.

I was going more for how ZOG operates IRL, projecting power from Israel in order to promote xenophilia in other countries. Can't you still use the policy option in-game to have core worlds be for your own species only?

Because of the way it functions in gameplay.

No. Those are completely different from normal empires.

You are all set then

Ok, I don't know what I was creating last time. This time; genocide

>be a species only existing to war on xenos filth
>"boo hoo, war is bad, we should end it even though we are mopping the floor with the enemy"

I fucking hate when devs try to justify shit. Just say that you believe gameplay reason come before roleplaying this time, and be done with it.

Jews were behind the materialistic movements in the late-1800s and eary-1900s, especially Marxism.

that would be one hell of a god tier start for a mechanist science empire

>Build 3 Gateways
>None of them are usable because they haven't been encountered before
>I literally built all 3 of them in systems where I have starbases
WIZ!

running into things blind is a common problem

governing types and shit doesn't affect it
a devorious swarm is no different from the prethoryn

The thing is enemy empires face that too. I've found in my games expansion for all empires goes much slower, and it gives everyone much more freedom through the course of the game until later to explore and chart everything, as well and plan around others. Also since your main use of influence now is building stations you can just choose systems that are choke points, block the hyperlane path, and close your borders and fill the gap later.

I like it. The AI as well expand at the same restrictions you do and it doesn't make empires feel much much bigger than they are. They feel relative in size to their actual power.

>and it gives everyone much more freedom through the course of the game until later to explore and chart everything,
It takes too long to move from system to system so that 'freedom' is an illusion--you can't actually explore everything and everything is pretty samey after you've explored your starting cluster.