Is Islam an inherently violent religion? More so than say, Christianity or any other major religion?

Man, Muslims belong perfectly in the Warhammer 40K universe

Terrorism (jihad) is literally part of their scripture.

>religions that revolve around a murderous warlord aren't inherently about a murderous warlord

stopppppppp itttttttt

Islam was about God, no more no less.

Yep. And Jesus was an anti-establishment, anti-wealth rag tag preacher who is utterly alien to modern churches.

>They don't either.

Sorry to tell you, anonymous, but they do. Incessantly.

>Terrorism (jihad)

Unless you want to qualify all wars as terrorism, the idea of holy war doesn't really translate specifically to terrorism.

No. The violence we can see in the Islamic world are almost all political in nature. Nobody is actually killing each other over scripture debates, like whether Muhammad was really the last prophet or whatever, which would be the case if there was something inherently extra violent in the religion. The conflicts we're seeing are over things like land, war and occupation, globalization, economics and living conditions, etc.

Jihad isn't necessarily about war or extremism. The concept really refers to any kind of struggle that a practitioner might face in following the religion. For example, if someone was torn between doubting the existence of God or following Islam, that is a type of jihad. A jihad is a holy or sacred struggle of any kind, and its pretty obvious why extremists (so-called jihadists) would tie this concept to their political ambitions.

Muslim teachings and culture needs to adapt to the progressive secular societies of Western states or Muslims will always be misfits.

The point is that they see death to apostates, sharia law and the creation of a caliphate as laudable - and these are all things they've been taught by the koran

>they see death to apostates, sharia law and the creation of a caliphate as laudable

Wow, it must've taken a while to survey 1.6 billion people to find this. Good job.

They justify it as THEY are the caliphate and therefore the true muslims, so any muslim who fights against them isn't really a muslim.

Arent all wars literally terrorism? (as you are trying to enforce your will through the use of terror (the terror of murdering and pillaging everything with your armies that is))
All religions used holy wars though

>than say, Christianity

Not a very high bar m8

Its insanely more violent than 99% of religions on Earth either way.

>be Somalian muslim refugee
>attend uni in USA
>hate how media portrays Muslims as violent
>decide to try and murder as many people as possible

Every religion has to fight to save its memes

He didn't even manage to murder anyone in the end

In the case of Somalians, being niggers override being muslims

I think the whole "islam never du nuffin" and how hard it's pushed is very telling about insecure people are about the whole slay the infidels aspects of the koran.

Go....plz go.

The apologetics will cover it up with earlier verses that are more open and peaceful and neglect to mention abrogation. Banking on non-Muslims barely even knowing the basics of Islam (if that), since not everyone can sit down to learn everything about foreign cultures and religions.

No, it is a religion.
Religions are not inherently good or bad. The social structure of the individual countries and the lack of opportunities for certain individuals allows group to be form.
Terrorist groups of today are more political, they have political aspirations rather than religious ones.

Except the "slay the infidels" shit in the quran is mainly about self defense and flat out says to make peace and not harass those who wish to make peace with you.

The hadiths literally provide the context for each aspect of the quran.

The problem is, as others have mentioned, is that what qualifies "oppression" is loosely interpreted to mean whatever the fuck and Wahhabism has been used to make Islam more militarized to benefit the Saudis.

To fix Islam, the Saudis need to be removed.

Well they're not. They're about the IDEA believers have of that person.

>inb4 the Old Testament laws
>you don't know anything about Christianity lmao
>Implying Christians in the US don't justify all their gay hatred off of Leviticus

So... Why Saudis got into the power? Wasn't it because they were the most pious muslims and Allah helped them to rule peacefully over their lands?

Christian hatred of anyone is unbliblical

also, eat shit. It's fucking wikipedia-tier common knowledge
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_the_New_Testament

Islam may be seen as an Arab attempt to Arabise the Jewish Torah with Muhammad starring as "Allah's Apostle" and to spread the Arabised faith far and wide with the hatchet and curved machete.

Mostly because they pledged to fight the Ottomans harder than the Hashemites and got a lot of British support

You look at proclaimed 'Islamic' groups and countries not through generalizations.
Malaysia and Indonesia are not the same as The Gambia or any of Islamic majority African countries for example.
Each group and country has a large history of how it came to be, religion is just another aspect to the wide range of reasons why violence can occur.

Those spreading violence and hate simply do not follow true Islam.

Because the British backed them to cause problems for the Ottoman Empire.

The House of Saud joined with an obscure Muslim scholar named Wahhab and thus Saudi Arabia is born as is the cancer that is wahhabism

kek

Muslims were using Jihad for their raids against the Romans since the 7th century. Don't listen the "personal struggle" retcon

I would say that it isn't. The thing about Islam is that there are so many contradictions in it and so many vague lines in it that any one could interpret it in any way they want just based on their intentions. There are countless lines in the Quran where Mohammad and Islam are portrayed positively. They don't force Islam on anyone, they help people of all races and creeds, they feed the poor, unify warring tribes etc. Mohammad and his people are portrayed as the quintessential perfect kind humans in those lines. This is the stuff that "good" muslims focus on. To them, this is what they're supposed to emulate and all the violent shit just doesn't click with them so they write it off as that person "is not a REAL muslim." (granted a lot of the stuff terrorist groups like ISIS do is against Quranic teachings such as suicide bombings) Then you have lines in the Quran that go directly against this stuff. Stuff that talks about killins POWs, or how muslim leaders would walk around with sticks and beat people they disagreed with, threatening people with death based on petty shit, slavery, marrying women off for material gain, etc. But since the Quran is written in Arabic and, to the majority of people, it is learned orally, there is a huge cultural infusion into the religion and Islam tends to vary quite a bit based on region. So a lot of places don't really even highlight or know about all the violent shit in there cause they can't read it or don't take the time to read it. They just know the basic shit like pray 5 times a day, don't eat pork, don't drink, etc. So despite what's in the Quran, it's quite hard to pin down what exactly "Islam" is imo, just cause there's such a wide range of interpretations. I hope that we get a more progressive version in the future as western ideals spread and more muslims are born and raised in more liberal areas of the world. I think it's already happening on a smaller scale.

/thread

also
nice side note!

Hey worship the moon I think. Not even a less shitty idol like themselves or planets. The moon is nighttime, darkness, bad, evil. Vuala

Chick plz, go back to being dead.

This, it seems like it was written by two completely different people desu, and the accounts of his life seem to portray two people too.
One seems like the epitome of patience and reason and the other seems like an absolute madman.

No. There are over a billion muslims in the world. We'd be in a lot more trouble if Islam was inherently violent.

Muslims aren't inherently violent... the ideology is.

christianity IS a religion that derives its power from destroying secular authority

it's built into the ower structure of all christian societies

islam is a religion that derives ALL of its power from directing genocide towards neighboring groups and rewarding the most effective killers and rapists

confucianism is a system that rewards people who are good at studying static texts and taking tests. it rewards patience and narrow thought.

this is literally a fucking fact. the only one we can't say this about is islam because faggot leftists are afraid of getting BOMBED

Not the person you were responding to. Why do you say confucianism rewards narrow thought? Because the exam system tested you on specific things?

>Someone who has never lived in a Muslim country and has never had contact with Muslims.

are you questioning why an ideology must NECESSARILY have a societal reward system, or are you asking a specific question about confucianism?

because the fact of the matter is that ideologies and societies ALL have rewards systems. this is uncontestable.

for islam, it is violence against the outgroup

for confucianism as it existed for most of east asian history, it rewarded mastery of a canon (regardless of how true it was) as a proxy of intelligence and virtue. confucians were WELL aware that the confucian canon was not all true. they were afraid that the conflict over truth would lead to destabilization, so court politics and status revolved around whoever could master the canon material the best. truth was always secondary, and as often as not, punished with death.

perhaps its better to say that it rewarded conformity and raw IQ, rather than narrow thought. it actively punished creativity, however

Yes

Just like the negro (the race) or the "villero" culture.

The latter. You answered it. Cheers.

It doesn't matter if Islam is a violent religion or if it is more violent than Christianity. It shares many traits with many world religions, such as charity. Why Islam cannot support real civilization is because it is revenge based. Christianity says to forgive those who harm you. Islam says that you must cut off the hand of the thief.

>me against my brother, my brother and I against our father, my family against the clan, the clan against the tribe, the tribe against the infidel

A revenge based society does not prosper. There is never enough revenge. Muslims are still mad about the Crusades and still want revenge for them.

Theyd fit perfectly as one of those low technology planets the humans use for research.

I don't understand these people. How could they think that revenge is an appropriate response to the crusades?

Sexual violence? Clearly those are major violence of the religion why would it be taught by the religion?

And about the marriage, there have been many misconception about the spouse, who is Aisha which was considered by many as an "ordinary six years old". If you learn more about her and their relationship you'll there really is nothing wrong the marriage.

thanks for asking a relevant question.

it's a thread about islam, so I was half afraid it was gonna be one of those "reality doesn't have constraints, and so therefore any ideology can have all KINDS of different effects that we don't really understand and who are you to say what those reward systems are SMUG FACE"

their ideology is literally formed out of malthusian pressures.

not sure why libs are incapable of understanding ths, but we should kill all the liberals and muslims before they get us beheaded

Wow too much Tyrant: the tv series for you senpai

they are a bunch of FUCKING SAND NEGROS

And jihad doesn't necessarily mean war all the times, but to go on the way of Allah. Also, there many hadiths that explain about paradise rewards by many kind of prayers you should look it up. There are many ways of going to paradise in Islam. But martyrdom offer the biggest reward but then if you can't go to war for a reason, as long as it is acceptable, that'll be fine.

Islam is a very order and system based religion. Each action has an appropriate reaction. You find this in the Sharia. What is the penalty for theft? You cut off a hand. You have these systems in your own life, it's just you aren't damned to Hell or whatnot if you fail to carry them out. It's why Muslims are so easy to 'radicalize'. Everyone has that moment in their life where they realize they are going to die or biology kicks in.

I understand what Islam is on a fundamental level.

Go read more hadiths and tafsirs, you're wrong. You exagerate stuff and aggravate it.

Jihad isn't terrorism.

I know many Muslims. All it takes is one of them to not be violent for the claim, Muslims are not inherently violent, to be true.

Abrahamice religions:
>Judaism: a tribal religion that was pretty violent until pacified by Romans killing off any non pacifist sects to the point that Jews became known as the ''weak intellectual type'' instead of being known as the violent rebelling brigands that served as mercenaries in far off places.
>Christianity: a pacifistic offshoot of Judaism that became pretty violent after being embraced by the barbarians with their savage values being merged into it's practices.
>Islam: a violen offshoot of the previous two developed by a dark age warlord for his warlike desert tribes.

Well it's inherently imperialistic and religiously tribal. It enunciates violence against the Other vastly more than other religions.

This is of course uncomfortable for most people to hear, including most Muslims, because most people haven't read the book at all, and paid attention to what it really says about Jews and non-believers.

>paid attention to what it really says about Jews and non-believers
It says both good and bad things. It says jews and christians are "people of the book" and should be respected + they get to go to heaven after some time in hell. But then it also says all the violent stuff you already know about. It's not so cut and dry to say that it's one way or another.

>It enunciates violence against the Other vastly more than other religions.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashtiname_of_Muhammad

>has never had contact with Muslims.

i live in a city with a lot of muslims and they are more violent than the general population. they are massively over represented in crime statistics and incarcerations and are especially responsible for violent street crimes and domestic violence.

lol where do you live that this is true?

You should start cutting off their hands then.

Nope. Side note: Muslims who tell you "muh peace" are just as deluded as Jihadi Johns, who think insurance is haraam but live in council housing

t. Muslim

>It's not so cut and dry to say that it's one way or another.

And I didn't say it was either, but since the book says both things it's easy to justify one or the other depending on your mood, because unlike Christians and Jews, Muslims still believe the Qur'an is the perfect word of God.

sydney, australia. you can look up the statistics. theyre online for everyone to see. we have a lot of muslim lebanese all from shitty, backwards little villages and they are massively corrupt. even if they are successful and are not just violent street thugs, they commit white collar crimes. fraud, bribery and such. we have to have a special middle eastern crime focused police squad because of all the lebanese gangs selling drugs and driving around shooting at each other.

wtf i love islam now

>Religiously tribal
What does that even mean?
You pretty much just dressed up the phrase "they are religiously inferior to my beliefs" which pretty much just waters down to "I think they are wrong and that makes me superior".

>Unlike Jews and Christians
I've personally meet people who believe that the bible is a perfect and accurate holy book that essentially comes from the mouth of God Himself.

Broad demographics come with many different explanations that may well have nothing to do with - in this case - the Muslim faith itself.

>that may well have nothing to do with - in this case - the Muslim faith itself.

on the other hand it may well have everything to do with the muslim faith and its live by the sword die by the sword dictates.

Despite the final sentence and possible misunderstandings in the first sentence as well as maybe the whole retconning thing, this is one of the few otherwise decent comments in this thread.

>I've personally meet people who believe that the bible is a perfect and accurate holy book that essentially comes from the mouth of God Himself.

I have too, but it's vastly more common among Muslims.

What's up with the "moderate muslims" myth?

Consider Indonesia, the country with biggest population of Muslims, always being brought up as an example of tolerant moderate muslims.

And now they're going apeshit cause some guy said they don't have to follow Koran 1OO%.

theguardian.com/world/2016/dec/12/jakarta-governor-ahoks-blasphemy-trial-all-you-need-to-know

It might. That is however not a valid point and I realize now that you're leading me on a red herring.

>It might
I should probably clarify that.
I meant it might, if you were even correct and not begging the question.

Actually they do.

it's because the earlier versus on peace are abrogated in favor of when Mo shed his facade when he had the numbers to make others run their shit. You guys are fucking stupid.

>99% of muslims are doing it wrong
okay

Thats a valid argument, 99% of Christians are doing it wrong if the Bible is to be followed as it is "supposed to be"...why can't the same be for the Koran? We're talking ideology, not the meandering path of interpretations through time and changes in environment.

(In retrospect, I probably should've just gone with begging the question.)

Dude, have you even read the bible?
If you played a drinking game with the number of contradictions, nonsensical teachings, ambiguous scripture and scientifically incorrect statements you would go unconscious and develop a brain tumour from just trying to figure out when to drink at times.

A good majority believes Sharia law should supplant native government, that death should follow apostasy, and a little bit less believe that infidels should be killed with impunity. I can go on.

That is a significant fucking amount, and they are increasingly becoming a majority in Europe.

Wake the fuck up, please.

Their founder was a literal warlord that spread the religion primarily through violent conquest.

What do you think?

Europe and their leaders reap what they sow. Unless something drastic changes I'm curious how the mainland will look a couple generations from now.

Abrogation would be fine if all the mentions of killing apostates/infidels was all at the front and the hippie stuff at the back, but obviously that's not the case

Look, here's the fact of the matter.
All these faith, be the Muslim, Jew, Christian or whatever the fuck..
They change their beliefs depending on what they can accept. With the lenient nature of scriptural language and the heavy manipulations permissible through sheer human logic regarding *all* possible meanings, context, etc., the fact is that religion WILL inherently update itself.
This is why some forms of Buddhism are my favourite religions, because they embrace re-interpretation and essentially reinvent their religion with the times while not fooling themselves that they don't need to change.
This is what all religions can and should do.

No religion is inherently wicked.

Islam prides itself on not changing.

Also, Hinduism is better than Buddhism stay up to date.

Jesus was a pacifist carpenter tho