The allies were the good guys---

two nukes weren't enough tbqh

They started it.

youtu.be/HJ0emX5RgZQ

How do you think the people in Japan would fare under months long blockade (no food in) instead?

>good sides and bad sides

B A S I C B I T C H E S

War is terrible, it forces all sides to do brutal things to win. That's why whoever starts them in the first place is considered evil.
Also, what's so special about this bomb killing thousands in a war in which tens of millions were killed?

It is time to drop a third one....

Except the Japs were already going to surrender.

Is that why they didn't accept the peace offer the US made?

>Ask for unconditional surrender
>Finally give it
>Keep emperor in place anyways

>implying people care if you kill them with a nuclear bomb instead of incendiary ones
>implying the nuclear bomb victims weren't an extremely small fraction of everyone who died in the bombing of Japan

If you want to blame something, blame strategic bombing doctrine, not the type of bomb.

>Or maybe not insist on invading Japan in the first place?

I know you love Anime mate but don't be a retard

>300,000 is greater than 1,000,000

where did you learn your math, user?

Weak as fuck argument you should have posted dresden in ruins you low-rank baiter

>literally 20k tops dead
wow this literally gives germans the moral high ground

it's not about the statistics you fucking mong it's about how it is "justified"

I'd call them the "lesser evil" to quote an illuminated man

>The Nazis entered this war under the rather childish delusion that they were going to bomb everybody else, and nobody was going to bomb them. At Rotterdam, London, Warsaw, and half a hundred other places, they put that rather naive theory into operation. They sowed the wind, and now, they are going to reap the whirlwind.

Do it again Bomber Harris

>Nukes are inherently evil
No.

>The Nazis entered this war under the rather childish delusion that they were going to bomb everybody else, and nobody was going to bomb them. At Rotterdam, London, Warsaw, and half a hundred other places, they put that rather naive theory into operation. They sowed the wind, and now, they are going to reap the whirlwind.

Maybe don't declare war after a sneak attack if you don't want to surrender unconditionally when you get btfo by the red white and blue.

An invasion would've killed more people and done more damage than a nuke.

The nukes were objectively the best choice.

>murder of civilians
>just conduct

nice mem

>naval dockyards and an industrial city
>civilians
lol

>industrial city
>city

hmm...

While industrialization lead to urbanization, not all cities are large centers of industry. Some are just commercial centers.

Yeah but if we didn't Mike them the Soviet Invasion would have been worse

>jap "civilians"
>not a perfectly legimate target

>according to my own theory of warfare :^)

admit it was a heinous war crime and be done with it

They were legitimate targets. It wasn't a war crime.

>when you get btfo by the red white and blue.
France is brutal man, I'll give you that.
I agree that the atomic bombings where not a very humane move, but considering the logistics (both in financial and human resources) and the loss of life on both sides, of a full on invasion and subjugation of the home islands, they were technically a better move.

There is nothing wrong in trying to kill off as many cannibals and slavers as you can.

Civilian city centers with m8inimal military infrastructure are not legitimate targets user. It's slaughtering a lot of civilians to intimidate the enemy, and a war crime.

>Civilian city centers
One was a fucking naval dockyard and the other a MIC controlled city. They are legitimate targets.

AMERICAS NAVY
A GLOBAL FORCE FOR GOOD
seriously on a coral reef, people are too stupid to create something this powerful.

>the largest port in Japan that hadn't already been bombed isn't a legitimate military target
really makes me think....

>choose the option that saves more lives
>get shit on for it

>a civilian urban center is a legitimate target
>because I say so

not how it works.

>build shit for the IJN and IJA for the sole purpose of killing allied troops
>people call you civilian decades later
Industrial centers and naval dockyards are legitimate targets. This is not up for debate since it is agreed upon by every state for all time. Also Japan attacked U.S. ports and shelled a U.S. industrial center. Were these not legitimate targets? I'd wager you say they were, because you're a fucking weeb.

disregard for the proportionality criteria is a war crime, military targets being present in a general area do not justify the indiscriminate slaughter of civilians, Americans knew what they were doing and they still used the most powerful weapon in their arsenal to strike fear at the cost of way too many civilians lives, it was all planned.

also the fact that Japs committed war crimes does not mean rules of war become null for every actor, that's a basic principle "agreed upon by every state for all time".

>disregard for the proportionality criteria is a war crime
Every Japanese house had a drill press in it. Leveling a city when each building is manufacturing for the war effort is proportionate. Or would you prefer they just burned the fucking cities down like they did Tokyo, Nagoya, etc.

My Japanese aunt once said they were ready to surrender, especially after the first nuking, because they didn't want to be invaded by the Russians. Is there any truth to this?

>Every Japanese house had a drill press in it.

that's like saying every American has a gun and therefore every single civilian is a legitimate military target.

I'm not saying this or that option would have been better, America decided to stray from the lawful conduct of hostilities in order to win the war, they committed war crimes and in the end they got to write their own narratives to justify their murders.

happens in every war, what bothers me is that it seems like you love to give shit to other countries for their war crimes but don't have the decency to recognize your own.

they were only ready to surrender conditionally and the allies didn't want a conditional surrender

Except that's exactly what the Japanese government had planned. They wanted military production to be spread all over Japan, quite literally in every household so that bombing raids wouldn't had been able to disturb the war effort because "lol they can't bomb every house". Guess what tho

>decided to stray from the lawful conduct of hostilities
There was nothing illegal about strategic bombing. There still isn't. It isn't a warcrime because, again, for the fiftieth time, they were a major military-industrial center and a port city with multiple naval dockyards. The "civilian" deaths are irrelevant as they were constructing military goods with the intent of causing allied deaths. That's total war. It's what you do. It's not a war crime and is, in fact, sanctioned by every military on earth.

>get beaten
>offer to surrender in return of basically being allowed to keep all of your pre-war holdings and leaders
>wonder why allies don't accept it

>There was nothing illegal about strategic bombing.
if directed to military targets true, it's not "legal" a priori in every circumstance.

>major military-industrial center
or so the US claims, what was the point in razing civilians neighborhoods? that's exceeding the military purpose and not lawful.

>"civilian"
without quotation marks, they were civilians.

>were constructing military goods
such as small arms? way to justify the employement of nuclear weapons to wipe out the threat of homemade piston production. again, way exceeded the purpose. it's like you're trying to hard to appeal to the just threat concept bringing up press drills and completely ignoring the proportionality principle.

> That's total war
true, doesn't mean you get to break international law and then claim your conduct is lawful.

>It's not a war crime
but it clearly is.

>let's drop 6 500lb bombs and only hit this street of buildings when we can level the entire city of military production with a single bomb
You are retarded. This isn't even a debate anymore. You're ignoring reality to construe something as a war crime that everyone except Japanese apologists deem a fair target. It's not a war crime. You're literally retarded. I'm done. Have fun with your anime and being a weeb.

>entire city of military production

or so your administration claims, it's still isn't lawful to lump together general areas where military production might be taking place and slap the "military target" label on them, and this is clearly stated in international law provisions.

>level the entire city of military production with a single bomb

well no doubt that's quicker, cost effective and will have a great psychological impact, it's overall the best option if you intend to end the war.

but it's still a war crime considering the circumstances.

also don't have a tantrum we're just talking, gee lad.

>it's Nuke are only thing bad Allies did episde

>implying those gook cocksuckers didnt deserve it
kek we nuked 2 ( t w o ) cities and were still the good guys

While the nukes might have helped push Japan to surrender, let us not forgot at the same time hundreds of thousands of Soviet troops were marching into Manchuria.

>this guy believes the Soviets could have invaded Japan

This. The Japanese didn't really care that much about the nukes. They'd hand out white clothes to their troops because they thought this would protect them from getting burned too badly but communism scared the living hell out of them. Also the troops in Manchuria were the only units to surrender on such a large scale.

>the japs only surrendered there so that means they only surrender to communists
>there are no other factors to consider, such as the loss on all other fronts, constant bombardment...
Can we just agree that everyone has done their part in defeating their respective enemies? I really don't know why it always has to be either "the Soviets won it all" or "the US did it all".

You know the Axis was verminous when nuke-unleashing Colonials were seen as heroes and the lesser evil.

>JAPAN ONLY SURRENDERED CUZ OF THE SOVIETS
>THE SOVIETS COULDN'T HAVE INVADED LMAO

You may only choose one. Also, the Soviets could've invaded Hell by '45 if they desired to.

Totally justified

Two nukes weren't enough

Anime is the cartoon of the devil

...

Yes, the Allies and Axis both commit horrendous war crimes. Sadly the Allied war crimes are ignored due to them winning the war, which is why the Axis are seen as dickheads that gassed Jews and killed poor Chinamen while everyone ignores the unnecessary use of the atomic bombs and the very large amount of women and children mainly raped by the Soviets and Americans, even with the British and (allegedly) the French. The Russians even raped women that had survived the concentration camps. Like I said, these have been ignored due to the Allies winning the war. Quite depressing if you think about it.

>he still discusses wars in polaric moralities
>wars have "good guys" and "bad guys"

user, I think you accidentally selected the wrong image

Japan deserved it tbqh

>Sadly the Allied war crimes are ignored due to them winning the war, which is why the Axis are seen as dickheads that gassed Jews and killed poor Chinamen

Whether or not the Allied war crimes are ignored doesn't sudden mean Axis war crimes don't real. That's not the way it works, and is exactly what you're accusing Allied supporters of. Whatever the Allies did, the Axis WERE dicks that gassed Jews and killed innocent Chinese. Those are still facts.

>britcucks will defend this

>fire bomb japan
>they dont surrender
>nuke japan
>they surrender
>"T-T-T-T-THEY DIDNT HAVE TO NUKE THEM THEY WERE GONNA SURRENDER ANYWAYS!"

I'll take "destruction of strategic resources and the means of production on a mass scale not achievable by 'precision' strikes, with breaking of morale being only a secondary objective"

t. eternal anglo

While the allies did commit a litany of war crimes, the atomic bombs weren't one of them.

The bombing of Nagasaki occurred in the late morning of Aug. 9, after the Supreme Council had already begun meeting to discuss surrender, and word of the bombing only reached Japan’s leaders in the early afternoon — after the meeting of the Supreme Council had been adjourned in deadlock and the full cabinet had been called to take up the discussion. Based on timing alone, Nagasaki can’t have been what motivated them. Hiroshima came more than three days earlier, and wasn't even brought up in the meetings of the Supreme council. In fact, the true horror of what had happened was only reported on August 10, a day after the decision to surrender had been made.

Put this into context: every day there was new reports that another Japanese town or city had been 90% destroyed. In the three weeks prior to Hiroshima, 26 cities were attacked by the U.S. Army Air Force. Of these, eight — or almost a third — were as completely or more completely destroyed than Hiroshima.

The Japanese Foreign Minister, a moderate, said In a letter to a friend that it was important for citizens to endure the suffering because “even if hundreds of thousands of noncombatants are killed, injured, or starved, even if millions of buildings are destroyed or burned."

Here's what did force a surrender: on August 8, the Soviet union, whom the Japanese believed could mediate peace talks, declared war on Japan and were ready to invade within 10 days.

If you're going to post on Veeky Forums know that on one takes sides here. no good or bad.

I mean shit 50% of threads are Hitlerboos.

yeah, we were. problem?

SHOULDA GOTTEN GUD LMAO

> The Russians even raped women that had survived the concentration camps.
those evil asiatic hordes equal to the devil, amirite?

nice rebuttal

>violate all human rights and arms limit conventions at the time
>conduct sneak attack on nation with practically infinite resource potential on the other side of the Pacific
>not expect to get wholly BTFO

They're lucky we only had two nukes to drop at the time

>>m-muh resources justifies killing millions of civilians
>millions
So you know nothing about the subject. Alrighty.

They were. I'd call the atomic bombings of Japan karmic justice except it wasn't nearly enough to balance out the shit Imperial Japan had done to fucking everyone in that hemisphere.

There's a reason why Asia hates them.

Asia hates each other.
SK and NK hate each other and the chinks. Japs hate koreans and the chinks
Chinks are hated by everyone.

japs were warmongering subhumans who deserved it, case closed

your jap aunt had a high government position during the time or was the emperor?

I don't give a fuck about dead japanese from 70 years ago

and neither should you

there were lots of other dead people in that era

why do you meme this thread every day

>going to surrender
>stage a coup after the first bomb drops to make you carry on fighting

Pick one and only one

>suspended and reinstated

Hmm, almost like they stopped when they realised it wasn't working, then tried again every so often to see if it would work as the war progressed and conditions changed.

Really fires my synapses.

>unnecessary use of the atomic bombs
lel
>and the very large amount of women and children mainly raped by the Soviets and Americans
LEL

Yes, deal with it, you bloodthirsty savage.

Japan killed 10 million civilians in China, Indochina, Burma, Indonesia and the Phillippines.

They would rape women, conduct medical experiments on live prisioners, hold competitions of katana-slaying of civilians on the newspaper (pic related), take entire families to the beach and shoot them.

They are the only Axis country that made its atrocities public at the time they were happening, because ordinary Japanese didn't give a shit.

Yet the Allies are villified for two bombs that were the lesser evil compared to a land invasion of Japan.

Maybe the world should remember those 10 million victims of Japanese aggression more often. Nobody thinks about them.

I always wonder why the bombs are focused on and not the fact that Allied troops in the Pacific took fucking body parts home as trophies without consequence.