This copper statue was made in Nigeria 800 years ago

I dont know... What color do you thing Egyptians were?

Yeah, West African bronzes are fucking great but nobody knows about them

It's crazy that people with such rudimentary tools and surroundings could make sculpture as good or better as what existed in contemporaneous Europe, India, or China

wtf is this lmao

Because those things are emergent phenomenon that occur on the basis of demand and environmental possibility.
Seems to me that they were good at being west Africans and bad at being something else.
Blatantly ethnocentric, it's a big world and there are a lot of ways to look at it dude.
I think you have an inability to veiw other cultures from outside the lens of your own, but when in doubt one could argue that you're just fucking stupid.

>he doesn't practice fertility rites and phallic veneration

Best post itt

>these were made by the Yoruba people, who had a complex culture of city states, all of which had Kangz
>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_Americans#Genetics
>Correspondingly, Montinaro et al. (2014) observed that around 50% of the overall ancestry of African Americans traces back to the Niger-Congo-speaking Yoruba of southwestern Nigeria and southern Benin, reflecting the centrality of this West Africa region in the Atlantic Slave Trade.
Guys.

They really wuz kangz n shiet.

Memes aside, the Yoruba and Edo between the 13th and 17th centuries were pretty cool.

negros are creative but lack intelligence
mongoloids are intelligent but lack creativity, they can refine things to a T but is that true creativity?
us white folks are both intelligent and creative

every civilization had the resources to build a caravel and sail around the world except maybe eskimos and shit, geographical determinism is irrelevant

If only this guy has been around 2 thousand years earlier

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ibrahim_Njoya

>Ibrahim Njoya is credited with developing the Bamum script, a syllabic system for writing in the Bamum language. Before his reign, the long history of the Bamum people was preserved primarily through oral transmission from one generation to the next in the manner of the African Griot tradition. (This was largely true of many other African civilizations of the time.

>Recognizing the inherent danger of important historical facts being omitted or corrupted, he set out to establish a means of written recording of Bamum history. When his work was completed, his alphabet, called, A-ka-u-ku, contained 73 signs.

>His grandson, Ibrahim Mbombo Njoya, a present-day Sultan in Cameroon and the latest ruler in the Bamoun Dynasty, has established a school in the palace built by his grandfather, in which schoolchildren are learning the Bamum script developed by Ibrahim Njoya

>Col. Gorges noted in 1914 that he held court or durbar daily outside the gatehouse for the dispensing of justice and receipt of tribute, and that all his people had access to him. There was a very well-defined code of court etiquette observed.

>"Any courtier wishing to speak to him assumes a cringing attitude, removes his skull-cap, clasps his hands and, taking a chukker round behind the presence, finally arrives at the royal elbow. Here he averts his head and makes his request in a hoarse whisper. When the king coughs or clears his throat everyone present softly claps his hands."

Of course they were kangz, but not Egyptian kangz. I'll never understand why do they have to fetch their kangz so far away from their homeland, when they had ones just right here where they lived.

That one looks like it was made by lifecasting (or with a dead body - which I suppose isn't 'life'casting), particularly the very death maskish face.

American education teaches really nothing about non-Western history besides Egypt

Meanwhile here in the UK Muslim or African history is a mandatory part of the curriculum (but World War I isn't).

They were made with lost-wax casting. It's too small be have been life-cast.

you can still compare the culture with your own.

WE

>mongoloids are intelligent but lack creativity
So asians are not creative? They have the most complex religions and grammar systems.

Why even respond?

No it's not, cunt. WW1 is taught for an entire year and we never touch any history outside of GB or Europe.

I see you've missed the redraft of the history curriculum of the past few years...

Bad at what exactly? Because that's a pretty broad question. I'll give you the sciences, but they did manage metallurgy, agriculture, and medicine as best as needed for their societies to function. I'm personally butthurt when it comes to writing, I think so much potential for growth was missed due to later access.

I finished sixth form last year, did GCSE and a level history, so no.

Actually literally the only mandatory part of the national history curriculum for the 1901 - present day period is the Holocaust. Everything else is now non-statutory and up to the school/teacher.

See:
gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/381754/SECONDARY_national_curriculum.pdf

No mentions of non-western history. IE African or Islamic, save the British Empire within them and the independence of India.

>Seems to me that they were good at being west Africans and bad at being something else.
This. There's a difference between too much cultural relativism and common sense cultural relativism. Expecting the whole world to be one way or follow a linear path is ridiculous.

>No mentions of non-western history. IE African or Islamic, save the British Empire within them and the independence of India.

They are in the curriculum which actually covers the relevant time periods, i.e. the primary curriculum.

gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/425601/PRIMARY_national_curriculum.pdf

While your lack of the ability to check this on your own is already a testament to the quality our educational system, you still have it better than the kids who started schooling recently and will actually be using these new standards.

This is the most autistic shit I've seen in my life

You can tell by the excessive use of old fashioned language

s a l t y
a
l
t
y

Maybe, but the stomach and face seem slightly off anatomically

Because it was the work of a Portugese artist

>there were Portuguese in Nigeria in the 13th-14th centuries

You can look at it from outside sans HVAC and plumbing, faggot.

Maybe, but the stomach and face seem slightly off anatomically

That's from 1250

But hey, I'll humor you. Show me any medieval Portuguese sculpture that looks like that.

>Blatantly ethnocentric, it's a big world and there are a lot of ways to look at it dude.
yes, and some ways of looking at things produce civilisations with people who are well fed, largely free of disease, and not at risk of violence (either from the government or other sources). And other ways of looking at things produce Africa.

If the value of a particular culture, and way of life (which naturally follows on from culture), really were relative then you wouldn't have Africans flooding into Europe. All those immigrates have looked at both cultures, decided which they believe is superior, and voted with their feet.

Take your smug, superficial ideas back to the undergraduate discussion group you obviously got them from.

and you can go with him (assuming you're not just shamelessly samefagging)

Yeah, but the problem is comparing the two from the perspective and standards of your own culture. It throws objectivity out the window and the bias leads to a misinterpreted understanding.
Yeah, the point veiw from the devolped world is disturbing, especially coming from there myself. What we are destoryed what made us what we are. We aren't human beings anymore we are human things, by the Aristotelian distinction.
>mad
>why isnt African culture successful when our rules are arbitrarily forced upon it? It must suck
>Africans flooding into Europe?
Do you mean the Syrians that are fleeing from a European proxy war, the North Africans dealing with the lasting effects of European proxy wars/ and colonialism, or the poor folks up in the horn that are dealing with the same, and civil war that has been instigated by European colonialism and divide and conquere tactics applied to traditional disputes to make their explotation easier?
That isn't African culture failing, that's your culture failing Africa.
You say the first world is well feed, not for long. Hardly any fish left in the ocean, arable land is rapidly losing soil carbon and undergoing desertification, and their are few traditional socio-ecological systems left to exploit resources from.
All because of the consumer culture of the devolped world. Traditional cultures have problems but they aren't driving us straight towards extinction.
>undergrad discussion group
Lmao, i went to college for 1 semester, and only took courses in the life sciences, I do almost all of my discussion on this website.
Take your disinformed opinion back to the echochamber that does your thinking for you.
>pic related, mfw

NOSOTROS

>Syrians that are fleeing from a European proxy war
the syrian civil war started because the Syrian population has double every thirty years for the last four generations, and then a once-in-a-millennia drought hit in the mid 2000s. Blaming it on the foreign powers that got dragged in later is like saying America started WW1

>North Africans dealing with the lasting effects of European proxy wars/ and colonialism
because god forbid that brown people actually bear some responsibility for their actions. They're really just children, after all, incapable of agency, and white people basically run their societies.

I always find it weird the oblique form of white supremacy a lot of supposedly left-wing people seem to believe in.

>That isn't African culture failing, that's your culture failing Africa.
even with its current problems Africa's living standards are far, far better today than they were before European contact.

You aren't denying agency to Arabs to recognize that establishing nation states out of the blue, and shaping their governments and economies exclusively for the benefit of the West, can have dangerous ramifications.

Radical Islam would not be anywhere as powerful as it is today if Western governments did not support radical Muslims every step of the way from 1914 to 2001.

>You aren't denying agency to Arabs to recognize that establishing nation states out of the blue, and shaping their governments and economies exclusively for the benefit of the West,
actually, pretending that the west created the arab countries and controlled their governments and economies pretty much is the exact definition of denying them agency. The West may have interacted with those countries but the influence they had on the arabs was nowhere near as extensive as you suggest. The only reason you think that the west is responsible for basically everything that happened in the middle east in the last century is because as you're a westerner - and a westerner who clearly has a fairly limited perspective dominated by the simplistic narrative of the basic-bitch liberal - you only know about the events that involved the west in a significant way.

It's also worth noting that interaction is a two way thing. Western countries would have plenty of justification in blaming their problems on the Arab oil embargo in the 70s, or the economic damage caused by the closure of the Suez canal, or the time Iran violated an embassy in a gross violation of international law and changed the course of a US election. Not to mention the drastic shift in culture and politics that 9/11 caused in America. And yet no one ever frames it in those terms because the West - Americans in particular - see themselves as the actor and everyone else as the acted upon. Behind the facade of concern the liberal insistence that the west is responsible for all the third world's problems is just another outgrowth of western supremacist thinking.

This surpasses anything West Africans achieved in sculpture or anything else?

It's not a pissing contest.

what thread are you in?

Ancient Rome at its height was much more advanced than the Yoruba civilization at the same time

It's Funny...liberals praising a shitty marble statue and say "oh look at how great those west africans were"

yet they won't acknowledge this masterpiece

>anyone who appreciates good art is a leftist

I actually visited Rome and the rest of Italy unlike 99% of the white nationalists who sperg about muh greco-roman heritage.

They do, unlike your silly fantasy. Things aren't just one or the other.

So you guys are saying that St. Peters Bascillica is not that good compared to this west african sculpture?

Are you retarded? They're saying that you can appreciate both. No itt has called European art inferior or even implied it, only you with your make believe liberals.

What's it like being incapable of any kind of thought?

I'm genuinely curious.

>they like west Africans sculpture
>IT MEANS THAT THEY ARE FUCKING LIBRUL WANTING TO GENOCIDE THE WHITE RACE
Fuck off /pol/

WE WUZ CONQUISTADORS AND SHIEET

I like European art, I like African art, hell I like Japanese art too. Can you give the persecution complex a rest for a little while?

You can appreciate something without always relating it to something else, brainlet

Because of the relativism meme that you liberals always push

"you can't say one art is superior, its all relative...."

fuck out of here with that

Nobody's saying that.

I can't even consider you human at this point.

No one is saying that art can't be superior, idiot

We are talking about something you like and you coming along and saying "YOU CANT LIKE THIS BECAUSE THERE'S SOMETHING BETTER"

You're a retard

Do you stop everyone eating a meal that they like to say "YOU COULD BE EATING TRUFFLE AND STEAK RIGHT NOW THEREFORE THE CURRENT MEAL YOU ARE EATING IS UNENJOYABLE"

Do you listen to the same music everyday?

Idiot!

so what do you think is better the sculpture or the basillica?

The Basilica. But this thread's not about the Basilica, you vapid shit.

so your the dumbass that would say something like

"Einstein was a cis white male heteropatriarchy man, his science was racist and colonial"

"we should go back Ancient African cosmology that believed that monkeys were gods that created the universe or some shit"

but hey its all relative, we can appreciate both right

What?

thats how leftists think

they tried to pull the same shit with Isaac Newton... look it up

"Decolonize science" video

Literally every group has their version of this Goldilocks thing where they are just right, I should fucking collect them just to paste a wall of quotes at retards who think they are making some insightful observaton.

If this is trolling I have to say I'm slightly impressed. You're coming off as a genuine retard.

I just know how you leftists love to downplay Western Civilization's accomplishments

and overplay the accomplishments of literal who's

>thought we might actually have an interesting thread about the Yoruba/Edo or West Africa in general
>get this
Pic very related.

>it's a persecution complex
>you're just paranoid
>leftists don't really hate western art

exactly.....this is what i been trying to tell these idiots

It's Funny...conservatives can't and don't appreciate art unless they can use it as an argument for their cultural and ideological superiority.

Since you are neither intelligent nor creative, I would ask you to cease associating yourself with us white folks.

>It's a /pol/fags having a persecution complex episode

Complimenting one person's skill =/= Shoving another person down

Einstein was a Jew and Liberals are God-less.
You're delusional

You're talking about abstract ideas subject to opinion

Spooks

>The elephant is bigger than the mouse

Is an objective statement

>The elephant is better than the mouse
Is a subjective statement

I know this is aJuju invoking image board, but while it was inevitable, I didn't see the shift coming. It happens in every thread touching upon Sub-Saharan Africa's past.

Fuck off kike

Einstein was a fraud who stole Aryan invention

Pretty much. You notice how when /pol/ has "art" threads it's about circlejerking to realistic paintings of conquests. They have no appreciation for art.

I feel bad for Berlin, that sucks and I really do agree with you about that. I only came to this thread because OP had a cool image of a sculpture I had never seen before I wanted to know more about west African art. I promise you that I think St Peter's Basilica and the Stadtschloss are absolutely kickass in every way, but I like learning about other things too.

You are free to make a Renaissance art thread too if that will make you feel better.

>but bad at most other stuff

What do you mean? West Africa was pretty developed in the Middle Ages was it not? I thought they were rich as fuck from trade and whatnot.

Why am I supposed to care about the facade on a building? You're arguing a completely different thing. Changing a facade to make a political statement has nothing to do with the actual visual characteristics of the facade. Meanwhile, someone posted a statue from Africa and you decided to make an entire set of posts railing on liberals and claiming whites are superior

>Implying Ancient Greeks and Romans were white.

Yeah. All those Jews who helped America build the bomb were frauds.

Where pray tell was the German atomic bomb?

>pov from developed world is disturbing

Wow youre a fucking child.

They didn't chance a facade. They just didn't build a mock up of the old building.

Not really. There was gold, which meant some states like Mali were rich in relation to the Mediterranean, but that didn't mean much in West Africa itself were gold wasn't especially valuable. Copper was seen as more precious because of its rarity.

That aside, despite a number of urban civilizations it wasn't an especially well developed region. Manufacturing wasn't very intensive, there was no real infrastructure, no minted currency, not much technology (though there was a lot of innovation in metallurgy), very little improvement of or investment in land. Many areas lacked literacy and practiced human sacrifice, and the slave trade was a major part of the economy.

I wouldn't say they were 'bad at most stuff' though. Their civilization only really emerged in the Middle Ages and they didn't have much time to develop. They weren't comparable to contemporary civilizations that had been developing for thousands of years, but were at a stage more similar to early civilizations like the Shang Dynasty or the early Sumerians. Of course the /pol/fags will just see this all in terms of race.

>Copper was seen as more precious because of its rarity.
Is that why the Igbo jumped right to Iron working?

The jury's still out on where iron working came from. It might have been introduced from Carthage or Meroe, or it might have been independently developed while somehow skipping the Bronze Age. I'm tempted to say it was introduced, but so far neither side has been able to actually prove anything so it could by anything.

Either way I don't think it started with the Igbo. It seems to appear around the same time in the Great Lakes and Sahel after about 500 BC.

If it developed in the Great Lakes (which I'm very sympathetic to), I can't possibly imagine that was introduced via Carthage.

>negros are creative but lack intelligence
>mongoloids are intelligent but lack creativity, they can refine things to a T but is that true creativity?
>us white folks are both intelligent and creative