Who you siding with?

this

just a more religious version of Hobbes

>implying Hobbes wasn't the poster child of the progressive enlightenment
>implying Rousseau wasn't the poster child of the reactionary Romanticist period

They are both right to some extent.

With the advantage of a couple extra centuries of academic history, anthropology, and political science we can now say Hobbes was objectively wrong about nearly everything except that power comes from the people.

>life was nasty, brutal, and short
No it wasn't Hobbes. What do you know? You live in the 17th century and know nothing of anthropology. That was literally just wishful thinking based on NOTHING.

Explain why people were taller in the middle ages than in your time. Explain why hunter-gatherers show signs of better physical health than early agriculturalists. You can't, you dead asshole.

>Rousseau
>reactionary
What the fuck am I reading

>Rousseau

>Rousseau is a reactionary
>the first person who called private property as theft
lol wtf?

shit meant to quote

Marxist detected.

But life in the state of nature is nasty brutish and short

This is a bad way of approaching the history of ideas. Hobbes laid the foundation for social contract theory, a fruitful and rich tradition that is very much relevant. Plato is still thaught and studied even though his theory of forms are bonkers. Why? Because it is the first proper attempt at the problem of universals. Read basic hermeneutics.

>declares that humanity should go back to a time before property and all the progress that happened during it
>not reactionary

Neither. It's a strange false dichotomy/dilemma since they both preached authoritarianism and platonic sectarianism.

Explained:

Rousseau preached peace through subjugation based on ancient unscientific (and sophist) ideas of human nature.

Hobbes was an authoritarian that preached hegemony as the solution to all of mankind's problems.

They were both authoritarians, an anti-intellectual philosophy that preaches that some have a higher intuition for truth; something modern epistemology and psychology has buried.

Humans are naturally prone to narcissistic delusions, and this immediately follows bias, narrative-control, sectarianism and basic low ball hegemony.

>Explain why people were taller in the middle ages than in your time. Explain why hunter-gatherers show signs of better physical health than early agriculturalists. You can't, you dead asshole.

stupid moron

Hobbes

So I guess the English civil war was a lot more tame

Idiot.

This nigga really gets it

You can sort of understand why he thought like that. People who grow up in the country and move into the city later in their life, or vice versa. City-dwellers tend to be selfish assholes, and cities (especially capital cities) are like parasites which suck out every wealth and prosperity of the entire nation.

Are you a literal moron? Leviathan was a reaction to the civil war.

Hobbes all the way, Rousseau was a whiny, paranoid bitch who was an asshole to everyone.

>hegemony

Real shame I don't get to use this in everyday venacular.

*whom

>Explain why people were taller in the middle ages than in your time
proof nigger

Rousseaufags are the worst. Even anarchists can find better philosophers than this idiot.

Hobbes was 100% right

Stirner.

You could have just looked it up yourself, you know.
researchnews.osu.edu/archive/medimen.htm
>Men living during the early Middle Ages (the ninth to 11th centuries) were several centimeters taller than men who lived hundreds of years later, on the eve of the Industrial Revolution

>Steckel analyzed height data from thousands of skeletons excavated from burial sites in northern Europe and dating from the ninth to the 19th centuries. Average height declined slightly during the 12th through 16th centuries, and hit an all-time low during the 17th and 18th centuries.

>According to Steckel's analysis, heights decreased from an average of 68.27 inches (173.4 centimeters / 5'8") in the early Middle Ages to an average low of roughly 65.75 inches (167 cm / 5'5.7") during the 17th and 18th centuries.

Everyone thinks people in the past must have all been migets at all times because the people that stormed the Bastille were in fact some of the smallest average humans that have ever been and they just extrapolate backwards from that.

...

Hobbes because he's right
There are clear evidence of people bashing each other's brains out before civilzation.

>life was nasty, brutal, and short
>No it wasn't Hobbes

Yes it was. You had a 25% chance of getting murdered by another man. You died as soon as you couldn't pull your own weight because everybody had to obtain food in order to survive. But you are right about people being healthier, simply because following the way of life humans had been following since there were humans was the natural thing to do and our bodies were adapted to it.

>Veeky Forums likes Nietzsche
>Veeky Forums dislikes Rousseau

You delusional faggots don't know the depth of the people you claim to know