Veeky Forums, help me understand how the liberal party, emphasis on the liberal, turned away from classical liberalism...

#
You mean back when it was the party of the Klu Klux Klan?

They went from KKK Democrats to urban reservation Democrats pretty quick.

>don't segregate the blacks put them all together on giant sprawling urban reservations instead
>haha good now they can't feed themselves haha
>now bus them to white schools and force them to be as European as possible!
>gah why didn't these social policies work this is crazy it must be because white people are racist

And that was Democratic social policy form the last 50 years

So it's equality of opportunity vs equality of outcome?

The plan of Democrats following the reconstruction era was to displace rural blacks and shuffle them into cities to force them to be as white as possible.

Then, when that didn't work they forced blacks into white situations increasingly in attempts to de-Africanize them.

It began with forced bussing but quickly spread to every aspect of society.

Somehow, these great social endeavours only worked to create urban killzones which serve as self-cleaning ovens for the black American population.

Ghettos are plantations without labor

>when you have absolutely no idea what socialism is (or, more likely, no idea what the defining characteristics of any major ideology are) but you post about it anyways

>when you have no idea that parties prior to the '60s were more regional than ideological but you insist on posting on the history board

>when you literally invent a story that conforms to your absurd beliefs rather than reading any actual history, and post it on the history board

This is the most asinine thing I've read all week.

>no idea what socialism is

Oh I get it. It's something for nothing. Shit is free.

It's a disincentive to work and an incentive to game the system as hard as possible.

Socialism punishes labor and rewards middle management. Why be the guy picking the carrots when you can be the 143rd guy on the network to count the crates???

>The modern democratic party, with their desire for open borders, Europhobia, globalism, secularism, and cosmopolitanism are not in sense of the word "right-wing."

In what way did Obama do anything like that?

This is not only an obviously biased definition of socialism, but one which fails to hit upon all of the core parts of the ideology. It's like defining liberalism as 'dude weed lmao'.

None of this is an argument.

Democrats have always seen African behavior as a major problem. Something to cure and fix like a social disease.

Back then their plan was to acclimatize blacks out of blackness from constant exposure to whites.

Needless to say whites were not thrilled at the interruption to social norms.

Today it means plantation ghettos and endless social programs to the point where the American negroe has been wholly disincentivesed to productive labor.

Why work a lick when every aspect of your life is paid for from birth to death?

And Democrats call these urban killing fields progress.

Sure little commie, one day it can be done right!

Youve followed the pack so far right of mussoulini and friends thay the fascist dictator obama looks liberal to you

This is a c uckservatoce blog. The gayest shit ive ever seen.

Not an argument just insults

You already lost

There is no part of anything you said that is even remotely true.

Really makes me think.

Maybe you have to figure out a way to motivate people besides poverty, you fucking capitalist pig.

>Oh but it's so easy to threaten people will being poor! why try anything else?
lazy fucks

You're right, this isn't an argument, just everyone ridiculing you for being an idiot.

It's ALL true.

And Democrats have held political power over these urban reservations for 5 decades in most places.

They talk about the progress in Chicago which is a current irl killing field for black Americans which is hardly succeeding at basic literacy rates!

>progress in Detroit
>progress in St. Louis
>progress in Baltimorw

Just insults.

That's all you got this morning

Well giving them everything for free isn't fucking working.

This is the most tired talking point. All those places had decades of republican governors and republican federal gubment

Just because youre from a trailer park doesnt mean you can project your cuckservative notions on cities

Dude if youre afraid of magical black penises good luck not getting riddiculed

The most destructive force that black Americans have ever had to face has been Democratic social policy.

You guys need to stop overseeing laborless plantations and actually vitalize the American negroe at some point.

Your arithmetic of birth-prison-death isn't working.

Dude insults aren't getting you anywhere try constructing an argument

Youre just copy9ling anne coulters words but they have no meaning 10 years later. They are empty claims of fear and hatred.

Blacks dont control the world youre just a cuc

Uh sorry if i cant point out youre copy pasting cuckservative ideas that black have magic powers

What are you talking about?

I'm talking about Democratic 'progress' in tricking American blacks to stay on urban laborless plantations which have turned into modern killing fields with a 1 in 4 change of federal prison.

And a 1 in 3 chance at basic literacy.

Plantations Democrats have exclusively run for almost a century now.

>In what way did Obama do anything like that?
He passed the dreamer act and had policy known as "catch and release" which simply turned people away caught at the border instead of detaining them and sending them to mexico for prosecution. He supported merkels refugee debacle. He supported the TTP and other globalist trade deals. He supported "trans-gender" bathroom laws. Eric holder sold weapons to drug cartels in order to prosecute American weapon salesmen.

>How much heavier could the socialism there possibly get
by abolishing private property and giving the workers the means of production, all other welfare shit is just "bread and circuses"

Socialism can mean two different things. The current definition is Capitalism with some government intervention/programs (healthcare, military, roads). This is also sometimes referred to as Social Democracy. Virtually all capitalists (except ancaps) believe in this form of socialism to some extent.

The other is the 20th century definition of socialism which meant communism. People like ton conflate the first definition with communism but this makes little sense. Commies hate Social Democrats.

As for why the liberals turned away from laissez-faire? Because they needed support from workers. Also, the Gilded Age and Great Depression dampened support for classical liberalism.

However, in recent years, liberals, at least in the United States have moved much further right economically. So have conservatives. In the 70s, the Republicans tried to pass a healthcare bill more leftist than Obamacare and Democrats still rejected it as too conservative. Hillary is basically a center-right DINO going by the standards of a few decades ago.

Learn what socialism means and come back, /pol/tard.

You want to give the average Californians control over the tech industry?

Top lol comrade 8/10 would laugh again

Those things aren't just given out and the state will fuck you if they find out you've been abusing the system

Oh gee you're right.

They do make you fill out paperwork.

So you're right Califronia doesn't just hand them out.

But believe me it's maddeningly easy to get welfare benefits.

>alt-left
>Democratic Party is left
>Democratic Party is socialist
No.
And if you are talking about the radical left and isotyping it as socialist, I can tell you why that is.
It goes back to wilsons red scare and the exterme business-state-media propaganda campaign against radical politics that has occurred since.
It's why most any American with an education to the high-school/bachelors level thinks anarchism is synonymous with chaos, thinks marxism is payed for with tax dollars, thinks anything criticizing capitalism is communist, reacts with "Marxist" when libertarian/anarchist concepts unrelated to Marxism are attempted to be explianed to them.
What makes propaganda effective isn't what is being said with the propaganda, it is what the propaganda prevents from being said.

The reactionary right and radical left are really the same types of people, seeing the same problem, just in different places.
Ignoring the moderate middle class, and the influence of idenitiarianism, and only looking at (socio-economic)-ecological habitat.

On the left you have the intellectual elite, with their needs fufilled seeking to accomplish what the want through sociological influence, and the impoverished proles who depend on the intellectual elite to fufill their needs motivated by fulling their needs and the possibility of one day being able to sustain themselves. These are the cultural decendants of slaves, and inter-city union workers who have been taught helplessness.
On the right you have the business-elite with their needs fufilled seeking to accomplish what they want through economic power, and the wage-slave proles that depend on the business elite to fufill their needs via paychecks, motivated to keep their needs sustained and to one day rise to economic power themselves. These are the descendants of tenant-farmers, coal miners, confederate soldiers and have a deeply set cultural slave mentality.

>muh healthcare is socialism!!!

FUCK AMERICA YOU GUYS FUCK LITERALLY EVERYTHING UP

EVERYTHING THAT REACHES AMERICA TURNS TO SHIT, WHITE PEOPLE ARE SHIT IN AMERICA, BLACK PEOPLE ARE SHIT, ASIAN PEOPLE ARE SHIT, AMERICA IS JUST SHIT, YOU LITERALLY CANNOT DENY THIS, AMERICA IS THE WORLD'S GREATEST HAVEN FOR MEDIOCRITY THAT IS RULED BY NARCISSISTS

Wtf I love stoic centrism now

no, re-read. it's still about equality of opportunity-- if those born wealthy have *more* opportunity then opportunity isn't equal.

>confused /pol/tard comes to Veeky Forums with meme understanding of political ideologies based on propaganda
>instead of explaining those ideologies to him, proceed to give him an even memer psychological explanation of the ideologies
Good job.

that's literally not what socialism is, socialism is when *workers* own portions of the profits rather than getting wages. welfare states are just social programs, traditionally.

we call this socialism a lot and I'm not sure how that started, but this should clear up what was saying

>it's another episode of pasty teenager eats pop tarts his parents paid for while being mad that some people are too impoverished to even have the opportunity to survive as wageslaves .

Those people are barely getting by, have jobs if they are lucky to get one, usually are children/parents, and work their entire life's and never get anywhere close to the level that their boss was born at.
Fuck yourself, you'll more than likely know what it's like to not be able to provide for yourself one day

It's a pretty decent overview

>Those people are barely getting by, have jobs if they are lucky to get one, usually are children/parents, and work their entire life's and never get anywhere close to the level that their boss was born at.

Meanwhile they are all contrarily also sanctuary cities for illegal economic migrants!

Oh Democrats... never change.

>game theory is a meme
>game theory is psychology
I'm offended

alright you fucks, you remember the archetype of the poor white 20-something whose grandpa put in 35 years at a factory, retired with a pension, and supported his family while his wife stayed at home?

one answer to this is to make sure the government doesn't fuck up the economy, if you believe the economy will just work properly if left alone.

another answer is to make sure when the economy goes to shit there's still a safety net to catch the young white 20 something who is surely capable of doing a job. this is often done terribly and it's why you hate democrats or whatever, but this isn't what actual socialists want.

still *another* answer is to abolish wages and have people actually own a percentage of the products they produce. instead of putting in 35 years and making my boss's boss rich, I want you to have your cut of the company that's being built off your sweat.

the thing everyone seems to be forgetting is that we literally all care about the same core issues and the arguing is mostly just down to the core beliefs each side holds.

I'll be the first to admit that liberals have some insane ideas that they don't examine as closely as they should, but ultimately the "liberals are just parasites who want to leech off the backs of those doing the real work" is exactly the opposite of what the socialists want.

fuck the democrats, but we all really have the same concerns and we should be having real conversations instead of doing this same bullshit all the time

Fucking Americans and their retarded meme politics man

>game theory as a model of real human behavior is not a meme
>master–slave morality is not a meme
>X ideology is descendant of Y labor culture is not a meme
Everyone seems to have their own psychological explanation for people defending ideologies they don't like, all contradicting each other. They're useless, unfalsifiable garbage. Ideologies should be assessed based on the ideas that sustain them, which you didn't bother to mention.

that's a red herring.
Who cares about that irrelevant nonsense when there are terrible crimes being committed by the states through its military industrial complex, it's control of international banks and trade, and it's industries which are allowed to destory the ecological systems/ physical environment that make possible everything we have in America and around the world?
Illegal immigration is an absurd issue that has been force feed down the throat of American whites by politicians, think tanks, and front groups that are working for industry.
For example trumps campaign, was ran on the non-issues of illegal immigration and domestic terrorism in a purposeful(just look at his campaign/administration advisers and staff) attempt to get uneducated reactionaries fired up enough to vote away the little representation they had left.
Look at his actions in office
He promised crystal clean water and his admin/congress has already scraped the stream protection act and numerous other public safety regulations
Campaigned on how bad the opiate epidemic is and is looking to appoint a corporate shill from CEI with close ties to the pharmaceutical industry to head the FDA.
Numerous other examples within the trump administration. Which is just a one occurrence in countless since hierarchal institutions have been around. The red herrings, divide/conquer, and idenitarian manipulations will never end.
You think people would be able to recognize the patterns by now.

The pattern of America consistently producing an even cheaper labor force to undercut existing populations thus ever keeping the worker in a position of bondage and squalor?

Illegal laborers are just the 2017 equivalent to Irish indentured servitude, African chattel slavery and Chinese mass immigration of previous centuries.

The man who loses every time is the American worker.

>shillary
>socialist

The Clintons are the literal epitome of the modern Democrating Party shifting rightward, though.

Their core voting base became low income and dependents

thus the shift to being the "big government" party began

They are absolutely not given everything for free you completely misunderstand the welfare system of California.

This is just a big lie

>democrats are socialist
>liberals are socialist

Americans, can you please learn basic economics/politics before posting?

I'm pretty sure the Chinese, Irish, and slaves had a much harder time than the American worker.
The American worker should upset at their extendibility, not their expenditure.
The problem isn't illegal immigration the problem is workers aren't the ones profiting from their work. It's hierarchy that done it.
Property ownership and Free market policies that see workers as points in the supply chain, and the world as a natural industrial park are what is hurting the proletariat, unfortunately they are constantly manipulated into giving their suffrage to its support.

I was talking about the illegal hispanic worker being the replacement for cheap labor.

You seem to have misunderstood.

And actually yes the problem for the America worker most certainly is cheaper labor.

Cheaper labor dissolves the quality of life by nature.

That's a symptom not a problem

Okay look at it this way

I have a lot of money and want to make my money grow. I choose to open a business making car parts.

I construct the factory, hire the specialists needed, I even purchase all the required duties to begin manufacturing.

I paid for it all, or got capitol through investors.

Now you say that the moment I hire some local to push button X or stamp seal Z that he is entitled to own the means of production which I have laid for and created.

That's why I can't see eye to eye with you. You're a covetous and jealous person who wants to take what others have made.

Building and organizing and paying for a whole business just to take on every employee as an equal share partner is madness.

>didn't mention the ideas behind the ideaology
Maybe because I was analyzing how and why those sets of ideologies are acquired and not subjectively making qualitative reviews of them.
This is what I was talking about when I said you can't into systems. Litterally can't understand concepts outside of descriptions of their own microscopic qualities and view them as parts in the systems that give them those qualities.
Don't feel dumb, that kind of niave thinking is natural to our cognition and we have to learn to overcome it.