I've always been fascinated by the prospect of ancient peoples exploring distant lands. For example, there's a theory that says if you adjust the errors in Ptolemy's world map, it would place the "Fortunate Isles" in the same location as the Antilles, the implication being the Phoenicians or other ancient peoples had traveled there and that knowledge was passed down and distorted.
What does Veeky Forums think about this theory and others of ancient transantlantic travel? Is it all bs or is there something to it all?
I don't think it's impossible. Heroditus tells us about a phoenecian circumnavigation of Africa. Phoenecian shipbuilding and navigation skills were certainly ahead of their time
Mason Bennett
It seems kind of a huge stretch to claim those are the Antilles rather than the Canaries.
Dylan Lee
There's a theory that some of the prehistoric natives of the midatlantic US came from Europe and that they came over here when the Atlantic froze over. I have a video of it somewhere (haven't gotten around to watching it yet though). I'll see if I can find it on my laptop give me a sec
Ryder Williams
>white americans make theory about prehistoric white americans
Hmm...
Jose Bennett
>muh solutrean
Go back to /pol/
WE WUUUZZZ GUYS WE WUZ!
WE BUILD DA PYRAMIDS!
WE BUILD DA PYRAMID OF THE SUN!
WE WUZ CAHOKIA MOUND!!!!!!!!
WE WUUZUZZ GUYS WE WUUUZZ WE JUST ICE SKATED ACROSS THE ATLANTIC LMAO NATIVES BTTFFOOOOO WE WUUUUUUZZZZZZ
Why do WN's try to claim every mound in the world as European hurritage? Is it penis envy?
I consider it a viable hypothesis that some individuals might have crossed over but the thing is you need 50 people to create a healthy gene pool. A guy and a girl doesn't cut it. If these Solutreans crossed over, in all likelyhood they didn't last there for more than a generation.
Adam Rivera
The Norse/Vikings settled in North America for centuries. Seriously, I thought it was stormfag bullshit at first but it happened
Circumnavigating Africa is fundamentally different from crossing an ocean, though. Exploring further down a known coastline vs. heading blindly into open water for weeks or months.
Kayden Diaz
and got BTFO by natives so hard that they forgot all about it
Robert Sullivan
Pytheas made a blind voyage into very treacherous open ocean in the 300s BC. Some speculate he visited Iceland while others northern Scandanavia is more likely
Tyler Fisher
the guy was more closely related to ainu people of japan than european. WN we-wuzzers jumped the gun before all the studies came out
Charles Diaz
Wasn't there some kind of greek or roman expidition westward but they ran out of food and turned around in an area that kind sounds like it describes the sargasso sea? Anyone know what I'm talking about?
Charles Ramirez
You mean Kennewick man?
He was 100% Native American actually. His DNA was tested and after the relationship to the local natives was established he was buried.
Levi Richardson
>You mean Kennewick man? his skull and such was phenotypically ainu but hes genetically native american yes. nordcucks got btfo when that was revealed
Camden Jenkins
Does your whole life revolved around the feelings of /pol/?
If the Solutrean hypothesis was true it actually wouldn't mean /pol/ won. There is zero genetic continuity in Europe from the Solutrean.
Joshua Parker
Ok but that's still rather different. He describes a "6 day journey," which is still far less than an Atlantic crossing. On the other hand, Polynesians were already spread across the Pacific at that point, so it's not like advanced tech is required, just maybe different skills than Mediterranean people's had, since they never really attempted it.
Lucas Diaz
I wonder why there's no records at all of at least an attempt to sail west by ancient europeans/mideasterners. I find it hard to believe nobody till the vikings was the least bit curious what lay west. Even a record of someone sailing west and turning around would be interesting
James Morgan
It's almost certain that a couple of large Roman grain ships could have survived the voyage over to America. It is unlikely that these isolated incidents would have had any real impact on the Americas though.
Landon Turner
>nobody till the vikings
Irish beat them to it man. Not even kidding, I believe this shit now.
Besides, there's substantiated speculation that the Egyptians had trans-Atlantic contact with Americans due to the presence of tobacco and coca in the bodies of mummified royals.
In roughly the year 1000 the Polynesians actually visited modern Chile as well, and this is now commonly accepted as historical fact. We know this by the presence of potatoes on some Pacific islands even though they are native to South America.
Jaxon Jenkins
Specifically the sweet potato, and I belive it was around 1200.
Camden Peterson
Navigating the west coast of Africa is extremely difficult, especially around Cape Bojador, which is why it took the Portuguese so long to do, and when they did it one of the results was being accidentally blown to Brazil.
Jacob Hill
Forgot the pic. You can see that rounding Africa tended to (but didn't have to) involve sailing out into the Atlantic, close to Brazil. I don't know if the Phoenicians would use this route though, probably not.
Isaiah Nguyen
i suggest you look up a man called Thor Heyerdahl op. he was a norwegian man who like you was very interested in pre columbian peoples and sea travel. he proved some unconventional theories back in his day. gavin menzies is also worth a look, nothing wrong with questioning what man is truly capable of.
Jose Cook
probably the Canary Islands desu
Easton Russell
Absolutely not. No relationship to the contemporary local natives was established. The genetic link between Kennewick Man and the Colville tribes was extremely sketchy.
The genetic analysis showed that he was more closely related to modern American Indians than to any other contemporary group, i.e. he's not in fact Polynesian and certainly not a fucking European. But despite the study's claims, it didn't conclusively tie him specifically to the Columbia Basin tribes. He probably wasn't their ancestor. He *might* have been closely related to their ancestors. Perhaps to another native group. We'll never know, now.
Returning him to the tribes to be reburied was illegal. He didn't belong to them. NAGPRA mandates that there has to be a definitive link between remains and SPECIFIC tribe or tribal group for the remains to be returned. It's not enough for them to just be "Native American," and the tenuous link between Kennewick Man and the tribes he was "repatriated" to was not enough. I can't stand /pol/, generally I'm on the tribes' side when it comes to things like this, but this was a case of science and politics going to war and science losing.
And the Army Corps of Engineers can still go fuck itself sideways.
Not that I'm bitter or anything.
Gabriel Turner
He lived 9000 years ago. There's probably not a long list of ethnic groups which could trace their ancestry to one group so far back. IIRC, Kennewick was genetically closest to Great Lakes tribes but still fairly close to the NW tribes.
Ayden Scott
Reminder that the austronesian language streched from the pacific to fucking africa
Forget the vikings, forget the carthaginians. Austronesians are the real boat people
Brayden Watson
Forgot pic
Nathaniel Parker
Thanks anons, really interesting stuff. It really looks like these kinds of travels were not only possible but probable, but even proved in some cases.
