Occultism & Magick: Library Update 52

A lot of butthurt and autissimo going on, for sure. Give us this day our daily knowledge, and banish thee from our realm the spirit of Autissimo Maximus, so that every spirit of the firmament and of the ether, in dry land and in the water, of whirling air and rushing fire, and every spell and scourge of god may be obedient unto us...and that no more butthurt may enter! So mote it be!

Anything interesting or worthwhile in the the Order of the Solar Temple or are they just another masonic rip off?

>what exactly does that mean?

That these groups literally copy Masonic ritual and structures and rebrand them as their own

It's really a matter of history.
A.'.A.'. is essentially nonmasonic.
Golden Dawn splintered from SRIA as a comasonic org.
OTO is an outgrowth and revision of Memphis & Mizraim.

I don't really know much about those cats.

Since I offer Masonic ritual scripts alongside those of other orgs, you can substantiate this claim, yes?

AYY LMAO

Praise Jesus

> you can substantiate this claim, yes?

Of course looking at your material for the 1o in OTO

The initial and closing process prior to that is very similar to the tiling process in a Masonic lodge

They then hoodwink the candidate (using the same wording as the masons)

Then they both start with the conversation at the door with the "whom have you there"
And have a similar spiel poor fellow ect

after that they point a dagger to the candidates throat as the Masons do to the heart and eventually use the same noose.

They go though a simmilar list of commitments to which the candidate replies "I am"

-They use a striped down version of the word or token part of a masonic initiation - using the exact words in the exchange "give that word" "I was taught to be cautious" ect but only do the lettering rather than the halfing

Whilst not wholly plagiarized it borrows very very heavily

>Whilst not wholly plagiarized it borrows very very heavily
Ok, that's 1st.
Now tell me about 0 through 11.

Any of you guys make your own novel rituals or magical practices?

Completely original I mean, not just derivative

>Ok, that's 1st.

Is there a particular reasoning they copied the first ?

Well, let's consider the fact that even the person who I'm replying to admits it's not wholly plagiarized.

Then let's consider what I'd mentioned earlier: OTO is a revision of the Memphis & Mizraim traditions from a German Oriental outfit or possibly some irregular lodge, the history isn't clear.

The German 1st IS more or less a copy of Freemasonic Entered Apprentice with some tinkering. Early in the OTO's history, it's express purpose was "making Freemasons" which meant they essentially ported Blue Lodge degrees early on and then elaborated and revised thereon.

Crowley decided he was going to revise the whole damn thing to put it in line with Thelemic ideals and concepts.

What's the litmus for originality?
I'm building some eclipse rites from scratch using clues in Totemic Invokation of the Shadow Selves and some of Schulke and Chumbley's books (ZHA/Baetyla)

True originality is harder than you think. Which is why "master of the Temple" is it's own grade

Nice. Thanks Ape!

There's also this.
There's also the question of whether the Freemasonic model is actually worth a fuck when it comes to mystical systems.

Hence how redacted OTO initiations are, and why the A.'.A.'. doesn't really use much of the Freemasonic system(s) [read: One of the A.'.A.'. initiations is very original, and the other
Egyptian derived but nonmasonic].

Pleasure as always.

Back up top.

Have a bump /x/ refugees

thank you for welcoming us to your supple land

I'm not exactly a refugee; I've been posting on Veeky Forums since very shortly after inception.

no one cares about your Chan cred, Ape-eroo

>cred
Sorry if I [triggered] you while trying to add context to someone's reply.
We (I) am not here as a 'refugee'.
I'm not here because /x/ sucks (even though it does).
I'm not here because we've been banned.

I'm here because the texts I add to the library are Veeky Forums topical, regardless of what certain detractors may imply.

Look magic is a part of human culture and from what I understand this board is History and Humanities discusses things relating to that so you can have a hissy fit all you like but this technically can belong here although I much prefer it to stay on x. Not because I'm a his board user but because it makes x a little more better than it is with its presence.

>Not because I'm a his board user but because it makes x a little more better than it is with its presence.
Really for the last almost, like, what, a year? It's made Veeky Forums better too compared to:
>prove me wrong
>*blocks path*
>did nothing wrong
>WE WUZ
>were [nonwhite group] white?
>MUH POLITICAL SYSTEMS
>MUH JEEBUZ SHITPOSTING
>MUH CLASSICAL ART MEMES FROM FB

I just meant I prefer reading this thread on X. I know you post on lit as well and from my experience the threads on x seem better to me, that is to say more/better discussions but I mostly find these threads through x and not as often on the other boards.

I stopped Veeky Forums posting because there are some people with MASSIVE cases of Ascended Master Syndrome out there; people from the Gunther lineage who flip their shit if you're not keeping a public blog with your entire ritual records.

from what ive seen of lit, yeah, I get that. Just a bunch of contrarians and hipsters, you have to have read the 'right' books which change all the time, flavour of the month and meme book galore.
Lit is one of the worst, elitist boards on this site. They don't deserve a threadlike this.
It's their loss.

The idea that there is a 'correct' interpretation of texts and symbolism therein that comes from actual research and historiography makes it hard to get an English degree.

huh?

"Every man and every woman is an Ascended Master."

Thanks for the great rec. of Silene Capensis. I didn't realize the shit has effects in waking state as well. Isn't it sometimes used for necromancy?

He's shitting on Veeky Forumsfags who read some Evola and like a quarter of the public Crowley corpus and think they've got it ALL FIGURED.

Yes. IIRC, could be wrong.

>He's shitting on Veeky Forumsfags who read some Evola and like a quarter of the public Crowley corpus and think they've got it ALL FIGURED.
Oh right thanks for explaining all I could see were the words and the meaning wasn't sinking in.

>public blog w/ entire ritual records

Because it's not like this could make someone, I dunno, susceptible or anything, right?

?
I'm not entirely sure I follow.

Like, I got no issue if you're running an entry level A.'.A.'. blog. Go to town.

But on the other hand don't pretend you're the only person doing Work just because you post some notes on the LBRP.

(Funny enough, this guy's handle on the system was poor enough to not know the grade at which you may take students and the grade at which there's no going back, metaphysically speaking).

I have a sinus infection so some meaning may have been lost.

Pretty much that. They treat it like a novel and make up their own meaning for everything and don't actually put any of it into practice anyway. It's really bad when they talk about Buddhism because it really highlights that no one there has read a primary source or referenced it with a commentary.

Sad thing is that describes like 4/5ths of Buddhist discussion on Veeky Forums too.

Everyone has an opinion but nobody wants to crack open the Tripitaka.

I just don't think posting your entire ritual notes, complete with when/where/how/why/who/what, &c.
is an entirely good idea, generally speaking,

But I mean, yeah if someone's just LBRPing and LRHing it up, I guess very little harm can be done by publishing that info in real time. Other things... not so much, I would think.

Autistics tend to have a stigma against the kind of drugs you need to power through vedic philosophy and penomonology. 40 pages into this and I need a nap.

I'd tend to agree.

Man I found the short discourses to be more "trouble" than Abhidhamma; which is really just a phenomenology of perception with Indic terminology.

The short discourses are full of literal propaganda to convert plebs. My favorite is when anons quote the tale of gotama converting the city of yogis and think it means "see for yourself if the dhamma is true" and not "these pious fucks fell for it and so should you rajeesh".

They're also full of cute and interesting but hard to contextualize vignettes showing the underlying mechanics of Siddhartha's mode of thought outside the dry and systemic framework of Abhidhamma.

I dig the "I want some water" bit.

Bump
~t. Stoner Philospher

I haven't been through those in a long time. The last thing I read was all the entertaining stories about why monks have a rule for absolutely everything.

Ape, do you believe David Griffin's alleged attainment to be what it is claimed to be? I know 'above the abyss' and all that stuff, but he just doesn't strike me as quite the enlightened individual as even the Neophyte might expect from one of so exalted a grade

Are you fucking kidding me?
Dave Griffin couldn't Attain his way out of a wet paper nutsack.

He's the Imperator of absolutely nothing, and I doubt he's brushed his fingers across Tifaret let alone completed his Exemption.

Well, there's no Tranny Sevenleaf shitposting in this one, so that's a plus.

I mean, didn't mean to [trigger] you there. I know fuckall about the guy, other than seeing him shitting everywhere, constantly, but apparently he has a lot of people sucking his cock and thinking he knows what he's talking about. Who decides these things?

>2017
>not liking girldick

I dunno the actual lineage holders like Pat Zel and Stella Matutina.

>tfw no trans occultist gf to perform rituals with and suck eachother's feminine cocks

youtu.be/iET8HtUwdtY

>tfw no occultist girlfriend to perform rituals with at all, but still have gf so can't seek one out in good conscience

>Masons constantly deny any affiliation with the occult but most organisations claim some masonic origin

Not true

>When people say that the Golden Dawn, AA and OTO are masonic off shoots what exactly does that mean?

They conform to the same philosophy and beliefs that masons do for the most part

>tfw milking bliss state as much as I can

How fucked am I?

The pendulum swings both ways.

There is no pendulum.
There is only Awakened Ground.