History of metalworking and traditional techniques

The biggest difference is that the Walloonian process used two kinds of hearths in conjunction which sped up production. One for heating up the bloom which was heated with the best quality charcoal, that bloom would then be worked on and consolidated by water driven hammers or teams of men with sledgehammers. Then the consolidated mass would be put into a finery forge, where the metal would then be reheated and hammered into the correct dimensions. The German style only used one forge which was much less efficient.
> Brescia process of steel making
I had to read up on this but I think I can explain. the Brescia process from what I can tell had a tower that they would fill with charcoal and iron ore, most likely in layers like 50lbs charcoal/20lbs ore/50lbs charcoal, until they had determined it was full enough. Now, most of the bloomeries I know of didn't use forced air, but it seems like this one used large man driven bellows to accelerate the process. At one side of the tower there was more than likely hole to drain the slag and a hatch or hole that they could open up and drag the semi-molten mass of iron out for it to be consolidated and turned into manageable pieces.
>What innovations took place between the iron age to the renaissance?
In europe? The introduction of cast iron would be a one of the biggest. Cast iron is much easier to produce than steel or even wrought iron. Understanding how to reliably produce steel would arguable be the biggest discovery, but the development of the blast furnace, water hammers, how to use rock coal, are also important.
> low impurity iron ore that made the gladius obsolete
It wasn't low quality iron that made the gladius obsolute but the fact that it was made of iron. Iron was a very labor intensive process to make. The roman Empire only produced around 80 tons of iron a year at it's height with virgina and maryland in 1750 producing almost 3000 tons of iron a year.

>Is it true that lords used to cripple blacksmiths so they could not leave and take their valuable skills to another land/lord?
At least this was a common subject from a Germanic legend on Wayland the Smith.

>What is Damascus steel? Why is it so extraordinary even today?
Damascus steel is a shit generic therm, theres two things, Wootz (aka the real deal), a real crucible steal from the Indo-Persian area which under certain conditions shows pattern do to nano-structures in the cementation layers of the alloy.

Then there is every sort of pattern welded steel that gets that label, nothing special about this, everybody did this, some better, some worse.

>How many times is a katana folded? Is the more times it folded, the stronger it is?
Depending on the part of the blade, 5-11 times. It does get stronger, because you hammer out slag and align slag layers (aka create a grain). This improves the qualities. Note, everybody did that one time or another, the Japanese just did hold on longer to this tedious process.

>Why does my stainless steel cutlery never rust compared to ordinary steel?
Because it has a high dose of chromium in the alloy, which prevents oxidation but also changes other qualities of the alloy.

>Brescia process
Not what I heard, I thought it was about melting high carb cast iron in a pan and decarburize it somewhat?
I.E. a process to turn cast iron into steel using an open hearth and partially liquid metal.

>The roman Empire only produced around 80 tons of iron a yea
Wrong, 80'000 tons a year and thats a conservative estimate. However, most of it was lower grade ally and mostly fit for construction and similar.

>At least this was a common subject from a Germanic legend on Wayland the Smith.
There's also that Greek blacksmithing god who was also a cripple. Maybe the legends do have a basis in history.

Where it first began and when it spread to the rest of the world, I guess the Mediterranean is a good place.
>17th century,
but the blast furnace emerged outside China in the late 15th century. There is a goatse between the iron age and the renaissance. It is a big question as to how we went from the gladius to knights in shining armor with halberds. The main steps seem to be...

Hoplites, phalanx, gladius legionaries, spatha late Rome, Charlemagne era (I read some where that Frankish swords were sought after by the vikings), norman era and crusades, high middle ages, later middle age/renaissance, there were rapid changes in the 15th century

Forgive me for fixating on warfare but I don't know anything about the history of carpentry tools or whatever.

What were the effects of the blast furnace on the economy? Can cannons be made without it? There has to be more than the blast furnace.

>but the blast furnace emerged outside China in the late 15th century.
Wrong, latest finds indicate that the technique came up in the 12th century and was spreading rapidly by the 13th century. The oldest traces of the technology in Europe are at Lapphyttan in southern Sweden. By the 15th century the technology had already spread trough whole Europe.

Iron is also a rather bad material for a sword since it's unable to harden without an alloying element. This meant that iron swords could easily lose their edges or bend, this is the reason why the gladius was so stout, it was mainly a stabbing weapon, and it didn't require all that much iron
> allowed the medieval long sword and allowed plate armor.
Steelmaking, especially from a from a bloomery requires a vast amount of iron, oxidation removes roughly 1% of the iron every heat. which made steel production incredibly expensive. In the 1820s in virgina a pound of iron cost roughly $20 today, while a pound of steel would have cost around $80. The further you go back the more and more expensive iron and steel becomes to produce. Steel at first was incidental, sometimes during a smelt some of the iron would have a higher carbon content and would be useable in tool making, eventually people found out how to reliably produce steel, and the means to produce consistent steel allowed for things like steel long swords and plate armor.
Cast iron was made usable much later around the 15th century in england, while cast steel wasn't until around 1800. A blast furnace did create a gradient of different grades of iron though, with the cast iron, steel, and iron forming rough layers. The 'finished' metal was still incredibly rough at the end and needed to be worked into useable shape.
>Over time, mono steel construction for blades and full quenching instead of slack quenching become more common.
I don't quite understand this part. The steel part is true enough unless I wanted to get super anal about it, but the part about the quenching I don't get, I've never heard the term 'full quench' do you mean quenching the entire item at once?
>Is it true that lords used to cripple blacksmiths so they could not leave and take their valuable skills to another land
Nah

Interesting thread, kudos.

1. What was the effectiveness of bodkin arrows? Were they able to pierce average quality plate when at the right angle (potentially not the aketon), or was their effectiveness more for mail? Did they use hardened points?
2. As above, but crossbow bolts, and were these so effective due to projectile mass causing greater limb damage? Was there any hardening of the iron head?
3. Is the zweihander a viable weapon against plate armour - specifically, can a sword of those dimensions have been used against weak spots without bending, and is the momentum of the blade/strength of the steel adequate to cause any sort of damage against weak points?
4. Is the estoc viable against 14/15th century plate?
5. Are 'anti-armour' weapons, eg. poleaxe, mace, horseman's pick, etc really all that viable against high quality contemporary plate? Was this an arms race, or were they mainly for dealing with the vast majority of guys in inferior armour?
6. Can you give me a brief outline of the processes required for plate armour or a source dealing with it? Were there specialists for different parts, eg. helmets?

Resources on Mesoamerican and Andean bronze and metalwork (pop these into JSTOR):

>Ancient West Mexican Metallurgy: South and Central American Origins and West Mexican Transformations

>Sound, Color and Meaning in the Metallurgy of Ancient West Mexico

>For Whom the Bells Fall : Metals From the Cenote Sagrado Chichen Itza.

>Metal Artifacts in Prehispanic Mesoamerica

>The Huastec Region: A Second Locus for the Production of Bronze Alloys in Ancient Mesoamerica
^Particularly compelling.

>Metallurgical ceramics from Mayapán, Yucatán, Mexico

>Cast iron was made usable much later around the 15th century in england
Earliest cast Iron objects are from the Baltic and date back to the middle 14th century. You can forget England as a metallurgical factor until the 17th century, before that they where simply not important.

Can pig iron be produced without a blast furnace? How did the Romans and other groups produce cast iron?

>water hammers
>rock coal
When and where were these processes discovered? When did they spread to the rest of the world? How pivotal were they?

>The roman Empire only produced around 80 tons of iron a year
not sure about that tbqh, that would mean about 200000 iron tools for a population of 60 million, or 1 tool produced per year per 300 people.

>I don't quite understand this part. The steel part is true enough unless I wanted to get super anal about it, but the part about the quenching I don't get, I've never heard the term 'full quench' do you mean quenching the entire item at once?

It seems that for a long time blade smiths preferred to slack quench their blades and not fully harden them. I.e. they would not shock them in water, but rather drag them trough a lump of clay or similar. Because of this no tempering was needed. Full quenching, i.e. rapidly submerging the hot blade in water/oil/horse piss and followed by tempering was unusual and rare. This changed in the high medieval.

>Can pig iron be produced without a blast furnace? How did the Romans and other groups produce cast iron?
No, you need a blast furnace to reach the temperatures needed for pig iron.
Romans used blast furnaces, but I am not sure if they produced and used cast iron at all. Will check.

>When and where were these processes discovered? When did they spread to the rest of the world? How pivotal were they?
Water power for blast furnaces was first used in Sweden in the 12th century, it was extremely pivotal.

Fossil coal was used in the 17th century, it had no immediate impact, but the use of coal and coke made production cheaper and where in the long run responsible for parts of the industrial revolution.

>not sure about that tbqh, that would mean about 200000 iron tools for a population of 60 million, or 1 tool produced per year per 300 people.
As mentioned, estimates are 80'000 tons a year, not 80.

Thanks, this has been educating.

I am now more interested in the the processing of iron and steel rather than bloomeries and blast furnaces which I think goes further in explaining the differences between a blacksmith in ancient Gaul and a 15th century blacksmith and all the smiths and metalsmiths in between.

The bloomery wikipedia article tells me about carburization and pattern welding. Were there any things like this that you consider pivotal? Pattern welding emerged in the late classical era, possibly explaining the shift from the Gladius to the Spatha.

You mean the Bessemer process?
Missed a 0, but still that was the entire empire. While Virgina and Maryland had 1/110th of the population yet managed to produce 1/35th of the iron.
Bronze making often involved arsenic, which needless to say isn't very good for you.
Yeah I'd say that's possible.
>water hammers
There are more than one kind of mechanical hammer. Some used wind power, others water, some were powered by men or animals on tread mills or by springs. I believe that water powered hammers came about during the 11th century in europe.
>coal
Mineral coal has many impurities that make it rather unsuited for ironmaking, such as phosphorus and sulfur. By coking the coal you released most of these impurities which allowed you to make iron and steel instead of just cast iron. The development of coal basically saved the forests of europe.
>not sure about that tbqh, that would mean about 200000 iron tools for a population of 60 million, or 1 tool produced per year per 300 people.
missed a 0.
I'm not so sure about that. For one, that would create an incredibly uneven hardness throughout the entire blade if dragging it across some clay even worked, never mind the distortion that would happen from that. The shock from the quenching is needed to harden steel, the faster the steel cools down the harder it can become. The clay simply wouldn't be able to absorb the heat necessary for the steel to cool down quick enough, which would mean that the the sword you dragged through some clay wouldn't be hardened or tempered, it would just be annealed.
>carburization
It's a process that adds carbon to the iron, making it into steel. Blister steel was produced by heating a piece of iron placed in carbon rich material in a mostly air tight container. As you heated it up past the steels critical point it would start absorbing carbon, case hardening itself.
and pattern welding

>carburization
pivotal, not really, but blister steel and shear steal as well as crucible steel (you need blister steel for this) where a huge step in quality and quantity of high grade steel.
carburization was done before, but not methodically on a large scale, it was more and artisanal process with mixed results.

>and pattern welding.
happens anyway if you start with a bloomery, you need to hammer out and forgeweld the blooms to get a halfway uniform material quality and to drive slag out.
later on it was also done for aesthetics and to conserve expensive steel and partially use cheaper iron instead. It offers no real advantage besides that to a mono steel construction. But good steel was rare and expensive at the time.

can't find a source on a roman blast furnace, just this which is titled "blast furnace" but then says "a remarkably perfect furnace or bloomery of the Roman period"

cambridge.org/core/journals/antiquaries-journal/article/roman-blast-furnace-in-lincolnshire/D917217F65B3D5B11CD9701BB4D45985
www.google.com/search?&q=roman+blast+furnace

How widespread were water powered furnaces and blast furnaces before the 15th century?

>You mean the Bessemer process?
No, the Brescia or Milan process used in the 15th & 16th century in northern Italy.

>I'm not so sure about that.
None the less, blade finds all over Europe show that blades until the high medieval where hardly if ever full quenched. The cristal matrix clearly shows that. Apparently full hardening and tempering was a process developed relatively late. They used a delayed ("slack") quenching and did not temper afterwards.

>How widespread were water powered furnaces and blast furnaces before the 15th century?
As mentioned, they started in the 12th century, by the 14th century the technique was known in at least Scandinavia and large parts of Germany and likely northern Italy.

>can't find a source on a roman blast furnace,
Interestingly enough, I can't find one either. Just going trouhg my books, but I might have told you bullshit.

If you need a good online read on archeo metallurgy, tf.uni-kiel.de/matwis/amat/iss/index.html is always nice.
Some stuff is not up to date, but most points are correct.

>carburization
That case hardened piece of steel would then be forge welded to another piece of blister steel or welded back onto itself several times to evenly distribute the carbon content. This process took days.
>pattern welding
Pattern welding is mostly done for decoration, it serves no useful purpose. I believe that it was initially done to try to reproduce damascus, but I'm confidant that others discovered it by themselves.

Carburization is probably the most important metal working discovery besides ironworking itself.
>you need to hammer out and forgeweld the blooms to get a halfway uniform material quality and to drive slag out.
That's just forge welding. Forge welding was a daily chore for a blacksmith, most knives, tools, and weapons were constructed of iron and edged or faced with steel. They wouldn't have made a billet of steel and wrought iron in multiple layers as that would have decarburized the steel. Why make a pattern welded sword, when you could use 1/10th the steel by forge-welding the edges on?
>slack
>“As when a man who works as a blacksmith plunges a screaming great axe blade or adze into cold water, treating it for temper, since this is the way steel is made strong, even so Cyclops’ eye sizzled about the beam of the
olive....” Homer's Odyssey 1100bc
>"Tools are also given a harder tempering in the urine of a small, red-headed boy than in ordinary water." Theophilus 1125ad
>“...take the chest out from the coals with iron pinchers, and plunge the files into very cold
water, and so they will become extremely hard. This is the usual temper for files, for we fear
not if the files should be wrested by cold waters. Della Porta's 'Temper of Files' 1300ad
>houghtonintl.com/sites/default/files/resources/article_-_the_history_of_quenching.pdf

'The only possible thing that I can think of is quenching part of a blade in water/oil and then letting the residual heat temper the blade.

>No, the Brescia or Milan process used in the 15th & 16th century in northern Italy.
My bad, apparently I meant the process described by Biringuccio 1540 in Pirotechnia, seems to be an early variant of the puddling process.

>'The only possible thing that I can think of is quenching part of a blade in water/oil and then letting the residual heat temper the blade.
Alan Williams suggest this was done by interrupted quenching, so martensite forms on the outer parts, but pearlite and maybe bainite form in the inner layers. The residual heat is enough to temper the martensite.