You guys realize that even after the great depression...

>You do realize that even after the dotcom bubble, people who kept their money in companies with good fundamentals that were going to continue succeeding, still ended up making more money than people who sold right?

Well one could argue that microsoft was one of the companies with the most solid fundamentals, being the software company providing the most sold OS of all times.
If you invested in microsoft at its previous ATH in late 1999 when it was at $58, it took 17 years to break even. After that it has risen to a whopping $72 as of today.

Based on these facts, do you still claim that "buy and hold" is a solid strategy? Considering the inflation in the us dollar, you are not even at break even yet, you might just need to hold another 17 years for that if we go trough another recession.

With all due respect OP, if you don't give an explanation to your mental gymnastics that made you draw these conclusions, or if you, ignore this post you will be proving that OP, is as of regular a faggot for ever.

yes, and the best gamblers would pick winning numbers every time, too.

you realize that the only reason its so hard to beat the market is because of tax rates bordering on extortion?

fuck the US government. fuck the IRS

This isn't about guessing when a dip will occur - A clear downtrend has been happening for weeks now and holders are choosing to watch their own assets depreciate

17 years in crypto time is a couple of months.

You realize stocks represent actual wealth and not just speculation on code written by a Slav brony?

>cryptos are the same as a global economy
really made me think
ok ill buy your bags now

not an argument

wrong, a stock is not directly valued by the performance of the business itself. a stock is 100% speculation, the only thing driving the price up is more buy orders then sell orders.

>not taking dividends into account
Confirmed for 14 year old

I've seen too many people get burned on a quick and unexpected rise. You people don't get what a lot of us anons are really holding for - a chance to make it big. We believe that someday these assets that we hold will be worth ALOT. I'm not willing to risk mitigating loss in order to let go of that ticket to the moon. I won't fucking do it. I'll watch every bit of ICN, ANS, TRUST and BTC I own burn to the ground until it's worth nothing and I'll still hold. Sorry if that bothers you man and sorry if you're way smarter than me but this is my plan and I'm sticking to it.

Companies have what is called a book value. That's the floor for valuation - if the company were completely liquidated it would be worth $X per share. The book value of crypto is, and always will be, $0.

A true hodler emerges

This is only true if you own shares in companies that aren't going anywhere. Obviously you're not supposed to sell after a crash because blue chips are meant to be held for a long time. You either have to sell before a crash or if you own and it crashes than just buy more to bring down your cost average.

i like this post, and wish I agreed with it more than I do.

This is actually pretty decent advice, especially this:
>-Always rebalance once massive gains have been made. This is literally autopilot "buy low sell high". Rebalance your portfolio to keep your crypto at the same percentage you planned it to be

I'm 100% in on ETH but once it got to $400 per coin I could have taken at least a few gains and bought some normie investments, or even just held it as fiat.

he didn't take splits into account either.

however it is true that buying MSFT in November 1999 would have taken until 2013 to get a positive return, though by today that return would have been 134%. So yes that user is a retard who doesn't know shit about stocks but his greater point has some truth to it.

But nobody would buy MSFT all at once at its ATH so it's basically irrelevant.

microsoft.com/investor/Stock/StockSplit/stockcalc.aspx

Can someone with knowledge on this clarify this issue for me.

Is Bitcoin 'anonymous', in that nobody can really track and trace bitcoins very well?

xD

>The book value of crypto is, and always will be, $0.
That´s also "the book value" of the dollar.

Both bitcoins and the dollar are nothing but mas delussions and are backed by nothing substantial.

What if i told you to fuck off?

Bitcoin and ethereum aren't used as currency though. Sure, in theory they can be and there are some fringe transactions occurring. But you'll never buy your groceries with crypto.

The dollar is backed by the the most powerful economy and military in the world, you cryptocommie.

You'll never buy your groceries with gold or ETFs either

No, it's not anonymous. Anyone can track it within seconds from a website.
If you want anonymous coins there is a market for it out there.ine

I shorted Btc and Eth for the past few weeks,and gained 21.3k using 5x leverage.I'm going to buy back when the uptrend starts,so I 'm earning way more than you

Or you just stop being a retard and sell the top. Then you buy WAY MORE at the bottom. Idiot.

The dollar is backed by the military and the military is funded by??? The dollar.

But you'll never buy your groceries with crypto.

That's OK, Bitcoin has a very large untapped demand from other areas in the economy.

>The dollar is backed by the the most powerful economy and military in the world, you cryptocommie.
The dollar is still only an abstraction and is only sustained because some huan arbitrarily decided so. Of course it will never fall to its true inherent value of nearly zero, but fiat money can be subjected to serious crises in the long term.

Even better,sell near the top,short while it goes down and close your position and buy at the first sign of an uptrend

And fall to the bull trap?

No, thanks

But I do? Ever heard of a crypto debit card?

This is the real answer.
>inb4 "trust the market, goy. Sure you'll lose 50% now, but over 10 years you'll actually make 25% gains"

youre fucking retarded.

The stock split multiple times.

Almost every historical stock price graph will take that into effect and retroactively adjust the price.

>BTC
>good fundamentals
fuck off xiao

It's technically possible but fiat is more practical for that.

Bitcoin's potential lies mainly with international remittances, avoiding confiscation, and hedging against currency movements. Just to serve those ends its market cap could increase by an order of magnitude.

You do not buy groceries with crypto. You may exchange you crypto for dollars and buy groceries with the dollars, but piggly fucking wiggly is not accepting bitbean.

He also is missing the point that microsoft was sitting on mountains of cash in the 00s and was famous for paying out huge dividends relative to other tech companies

I'm so poor, I've only got a couple hundred bucks in the game, but I'm here to HODL

its the same old shit with you people, you're arguing over two polar mindsets that are both valid strategies

Personally, money is only useful as I can spend it on improving my quality of life, so I'm not much one for the "boy gee this might make me a millionaire when I'm 64" model, but it is still valid.

The fact of the matter is 90% of you are not that intelligent and not that well-read either, so you really dont actually know which way its all going to go, you are guessing like everyone else.

Lindy taleb btc
Lindy taleb btc
Lindy taleb btc
Lindy taleb btc

>be 50 yo during great depression
>see your portfolio collapse by over 80% but you still decide to hold
>the market doesn't recover until 30 years later
>die before you see any gains

>The fact of the matter is 90% of you are not that intelligent and not that well-read either, so you really dont actually know which way its all going to go, you are guessing like everyone else.
Please point out the people who are actually smart and well read in a market that is like 5 years old (semi ironically asking this).

All right, I'll drop a name: Ari Paul. but he's too bullish.

It recovered in 10 years, you are engaging in revisionist history. 10 years is a reasonable investment horizon if you know what you're doing

Also crypto world is sped up so 10 years is 1 year cuck

>has anything changed?

Yes, a lot has changed you fucking idiot. For one thing, bitcoin trading has become taxable by the IRS. So if you've been doing any worthwhile trading OP, and you're from the U.S., then you just may be on the IRS's radar. Audit anyone?

>Your BTC is going nowhere.
Yeah, okay fuck head. Let's see about that August 1st whenever the coin splits in two.

>Libertarian idealistic realities we've all been talking about?

Yeah, but that's all just smoke people puff each other's asses. The bulk of the Bitcoin market is held by large corporations and holdings companies. Unless you buy btc locally or in some backhanded tedious way, then you're known to the government as a bitcoin holder.

>Crypto is literally the 3rd world countries' saving grace.

Yes, because dirt shit nations, where they worry about power outages and worm water on a daily basis, are wanting to throw their life savings into something that fluctuates ten to twenty percent per day. You're not using your head. People will continue to exchange their currency to USD or Euros because of their stability. In regards to stability, BTC is like driving a 1991 Ford Explorer with the original Firestone tires.

>People who kept their money in companies with good fundamentals during the dotcom bubble were still going to succeed

Yeah, but the whole problem behind the dot-com bubble was that many investors didn't know how to properly value a company which conducts most of its business online.

For example, do you think Time Warner bought out AOL because they said, "Huh, look at this shit company with poor fundamentals. It's a gem!!"?

You speak all of this grand bullshit about fundamentals, but what fucking fundamentals are using to adequately price BTC?

All of the dumbass advice you gave about rebalancing and shit is just ripped from investopedia's guide to pleb investing.

Rethink your life, because you're nothing more than a speculator.

I give it one year before ETH hits $900 and BTC tips $4k
Logic:
>divide gains by half, more normies adopt crypto, another moon comes in faster time, given the use of smartphones and computers

This look like a "10 year recovery" to you from the 1929 peak? Dumbass.

Thinking about possibly mining coins. Also not the best with computers, but if I invested say $10,000 in making a rig, how much money can I make per month off that?

...

Clueless user

DJIA is not the stock market and this doesn't include dividend reinvestment

i bet the people who bought the dip made the most money though

actually in the 30s, 40s the DIJA was extremely representative of the market, weighting issues aside.

Sorry, I'm talking BTC

-$150 at least

How come? Let's say the price stabilized at $2000, would that still be the case? Is the break even point unattainable?

about three fiddy

>Cryptos
>Assets
You want to know how I know you'll always be poor?

>aren't used
>in theory

>several major European and other grocers and takeaway.com, foodler.com
>Steam, GMG, Itch and almost every other game store
>major online chains, not just electronics and music etc. sites
>one of the only ways to safely buy drugs
>Paypal, Microsoft store, Overstock, Newegg, all Shopify stores
>countless physical stores and restaurants who stand to lose nothing even during the highest volatility and could easily double their tiny profit margins as it picks up wider adoption

>aren't used
>in theory
You're right about eth though, not even most AB vendors accepted that.

>You do realize that even after the dotcom bubble, people who kept their money in companies with good fundamentals that were going to continue succeeding, still ended up making more money than people who sold right?
No, they didn't. Just because a company has good fundamentals doesn't mean it can't be overvalued to hell and back.

3rd worlders would rather have small fluctuations than hyperinflation

does this include canada?

I'm already retired in comfort, nice rage post though

unless you're a whale there's no point in DCA faggot. lump sum investing is superior for buy and hold. learn something

>all you have to do is predict the future

What are rebounds

Omg

You don't know what splits are, do you?

HAHAHAHAHGAHAHA

THIS BOARD IS FULL OF RETARDS

Yes there is for highly volatile assets. It decreases your entry volatility

That's the scariest chart in the history of ever. What the fuck is that?

i only own eth

Look for a mining profit calculator

Shut up faggot, HODL AND NEVER LET GO

Yes these are definitely the same asset classes in the same point in their lifetimes

Give me a break with these comparisons

Lots of companies went out of business during the depression lots of dot coms are no more after the bubble once a business is out of business then there's no gains. So ur statement is fucking weak.

That's the chart for Internap, a company that had its IPO in the middle of the dotcom bubble. Good fundamentals, but tremendously overvalued. My dad was telling me about it when he was getting me into crypto. He rode it to the top, then when the big crash came assumed it was a correction and tried to catch the knife by buying that dip. He finally dumped the last of those bags last march.

Fuck off you Macfarlane-tier analyst

Microsoft (MSFT) has 9 splits in our Microsoft stock split history database.

>Look at places like the middle east and shit tier African countries with inflating fiat. Crypto is literally their financial haven, their saving grace - once they realize this is when it will really take off

Hahahahaha. Implying cryptoshit will ever take off in african and middle east countries. Shit, son, most people here don't even have a fucking bank account, let alone a way to use this shit.

t. Angolan resident.

youtube.com/watch?v=0l__jSgTAmQ
Thanks Kamina

>give me a break with case studies in buy-and-hold stupidity
if you're smart enough to know that should bitcoin crashes it will recover to previous highs then wait until it's done crashing to buy

Lol if they dident split they would be 1000 a share like Amazon. Fuck other user was a retard

You fucking summerfags are so annoying. I've lost 0 money holding because I'm not as late as you autists. All of you crying because you just discovered crypto a week ago.

This shit has been shilled for years now. And everything is still way higher than it was just months ago. You're holding bags simply because you're late as fuck. Your best bet is to leave crypto and never return. You're cancer anyway.

that's why its not 10.000.000 per BTC you fuck

>Both bitcoins and the dollar are nothing
False, the dollar is backed by the government. You must pay taxes in dollars not shill coins.

Also, if you owe a debt. The dollar must be accepted to pay off a debt. I don't have to accept your shill coins, but I must accept dollars because it is the legal currency.

Also, most currencies have coins which have a physical value. I can't melt down shill coins. There's no one to prop shill coin up when everyone flees from that scam.

>comparing shitcoin scams with shares of a company
what a fag.

ROI roughly 10 percent with good power bill. You need to be in cool area for it
To b efficient
More heat = more powa wasted

People are literally using energy produced by a finite resource to mine some shill coin.

Why aren't environmentalists losing their shit over this?

so wait, after we replace the gold in the Western world with crypto, who are we going to sell the gold to?

i would have said Africa, but since you talkin about hookin the entire continent on some next level block chain shit they won't be interested gold

you must be Chinese, OP. its always the Chinese doing some weird ass stuff in Africa

The ones who killed themselves didn't.

buy low sell never