Hey I wanna talk about Madagascar so let's do!

Mostly bantz but you know leprosy is still an issue.
Not with Christian influence now they are being hunted to extinction. Though to be fair the myths and legends came after the extinction of gorilla, sloth and baboon lemurs.

Cool, what religions were practiced there?

Is it true that the bubonic plague is still a thing in Madagascar?

What is the most popular alcoholic beverage, and what is the most common recreational drug?

What do you think would have happened if the Madagascar Plan went through and millions of Jews were sent to you?

Are you able to understand any words from other Austronesian languages?

Catholicism, Protestantism, Islam with underlying ancestor worship
It was never realitically gonna happen and was used by Nazis to soften the blow of the real intentions the Holocaust.
Yes

Sugarcane and rice based drinks
Bubonic Plague comes from tenrecs and yes

That sounds a lot like the hunter and gatherer vs. agriculturalist that happened 10,000 years ago, Neh?

Are the people of madagascar Asiatic? And why is it that Radama I looks straight up white?

Tbh the human history of Madagascar is no later than 5kya and most researchers believe the majority of humans were in the last 1,500 years desu

.....All Malagasy are black and Asian with some Indian and Arab inputs depending on subgroups but none looked white in the least. The French though Malagasy were Mulatto thought and denied Asian influence at first strangely enough

Bump

Why does she have epicanthic folds?

She like all Malagasy are mixed race.

Africa is actually incredibly diverse, a European has more in common genetically with a North African than a North African would another region of Africa. Some parts polarize genetically so much it would be like the difference between a Chinese and a European

The people of North Africa is varied and your statement is not a universal. Please take that to another thread.

Imo, the legend of a dwarf negrito aboriginal population isn't unique to Madagascar, it also exists, to my knowledge, in much of Polynesia as well.
Thus, I am of the opinion that these legends are actually derived from the common ancestor of the austronesian peoples when they first arrived into indonesia from taiwan. Indonesia likely would have been inhabited by primarily negrito peoples (They still exist in PNG and the Phillipnes) and thus, these legends are evidence of the austronesian displacement of these peoples.

This is false and simplistic assessment based on talking about things you know nothing about.

>In this study, we assess mtDNA variation in 266 individuals from three Malagasy ethnic groups: the Mikea, Vezo, and Merina. Complete mtDNA genome sequencing reveals a new variant of the Polynesian motif in Madagascar; two coding region mutations define a Malagasy-specific sub-branch. This newly defined ‘Malagasy motif' occurs at high frequency in all three ethnic groups (13–50%), and its phylogenetic position, geographic distribution, and estimated age all support a recent origin, but without conclusively identifying a specific source region.

>humans in Madagascar was limited previously to a few hippo and elephant bird bones and one extinct aye-aye tooth. New evidence comes not from archaeological sites, but from specimens collected in the early 1900s, without stratigraphic records, at "subfossil" sites (i.e., sites renowned for their late Pleistocene or Holocene fossils, often lacking human artifacts). Whereas these are hardly the most ideal samples for analysis of this kind, careful scrutiny of the characteristics of the cut marks has allowed us to document butchery beyond any reasonable doubt. One bone with definitive cut marks has been dated to the very earliest part of the human period in Madagascar. Continued, careful research on the bones in subfossil collections is warranted.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16225904

There is also pollen from cannabis in the Highlands before the agreed upon period as well as other inklings showing evidence for previous human groups before Austronesians and Bantu.

This doesn't necessarily disprove my theory though, the existence of a previous group of humans on Madagascar doesn't mean they were what we know as the Vazimba.

Yes it does. There is universal recognition that the previous inhabitants of Madagascar were hunters and gardeners that were intermarried maternally into later populations. The three groups mentioned in that study all have the maternal markers found no where else on earth showing great antiquity and all those subtypes of this marker show early isolation from one another.

That shows continuity, isolation and assimilation by multiple groups coming into the island.

Don't talk about things you know nothing about.

How does it disprove my theory?
Yes, there were people on Madagascar that lived there before the Austronesians and Bantu arrived, alright, but I'm fairly certain you know nothing about their actual physical characteristics outside of Malagasy legends, therefore whether this "marker" of great antiquity is actually related to the Vazimba is questionable at best.
Compare this to the continued existence of negrito groups in Indonesia that fit the physical description of a common legend shared across Austronesian peoples, you literally can't disprove my argument, as I can't decisively disprove yours.

Looking at xvideos, they are a lot cuter than the rest of Africans, what's they ancestry?

how much did the austronesian impact madagascar? is the story about the srivijayan from indonesia colonising madagascar after getting invaded by the chola true?

imagine if buddhism took root in an isolated african island, how cool is that

The Vazimba were recorded and recognized within the oral literature of Merina which are less than 600 years old.

Beyond that the recognition of phenotype is marked given the fact that Merina were generally speaking at the time of arrival moreso farmer Malay looking.

The Queen who intermarried into the royal family was named Kinky Haired and whereas the Elites were generally the fairest of all Merina the royal family descended from many Vazimba women were darker with curlier hair and smaller.

I have Haplogroup M46 and just as I have it so do 1 out of 12 Moken and as it's stated

> MKN2 is not closely related to any previously sampled lineages, but has been tentatively assigned to the basal M46 haplogroup that possibly originated among the original inhabitants of ISEA.

It's related to pre-austronesian peoples inhabiting the islands of Southeast Asia, along with the Malagasy motif.

You don't know what you're talking about and are posturing now because I said you don't know.
.

Austronesian language is the basis of Malagasy, all dialects have Swahili influences but the south and west have the most Swahili terms.

I'm of the opinion that Malagasy went through atleast two main migrations followed by a third that brought Merina

Buddhism is South Asian import, Malagasy religious basis is in Ancestor worship and spirit possession rooted in Southeast Asia and Zimbabwe.

Supposedly Hinduism had left some influence though.

How many of these numbers do you recognize? Its my native language, It has the same roots as yours

Siji
Roro
Telu
Papat
Limo
Enem
Pitu
Wolu
Songo
Puluh

One isa/iray
two roa
three telo
four efatra
five dimy
six enina
seven fito
eight valo
nine sivy
ten folo

Noice, im from java btw

Its mindblowing to think our ancestor sailed oceans all the way to Madagascar and the pacifics with canoes Thousand years ago

I have no questions, but I'd like to just say that this is what I'd like to see in Veeky Forums more. Good show.

It is neat but seems as though a good many came from Banjar people and some from Sulawesi.

Javanese proper came in the second migration, arguably as heads of ships with Banjar subordinates. Many words and phrases come from Sanskrit and judging my Sorabe an Arabic influenced script there was once Sanskrit writing that became extinct.

The Austronesians who mixed with Africans and travelled all around the Western Indian ocean and coastal Africa are known from the time of Pliny selling cinnamon from Southeast Asia to Madagascar and from there the islands of the Swahili coast.

It is important to recognize there were likely two paths, the first was along the monsoons from Southeast Asia through India and Arabia before going south. Later it went across the Equatorial current.
Thanks

Oh you meant our Austronesian ancestors well yes it is neat but when our Negrito forefathers took to the sea to fish over 50kya then there is no surprise wed eventually master the seas.

Neat thread.

Do Malagasy think of themselves as "African?" Do they identify at all with the rest of Subsaharan Africa?

Haha. Highlanders, especially middle and upper class Highlanders dislike very, very much being associated with Africa.

Asia? Yes.
Pacific Islands? Yes.
Jews? Yes. (We wuzzing exists everywhere but I wouldnt be surprised if Yemeni merchants didn't go to Madagascar like the did Africa with Lemba.)

The negativity of Africa and Africans is mostly related to post-European contact imo.

It's not universal however, Lowlanders generally speaking have no issue with Africa associations. In part because the long history of more pronounced Swahili and Zimbabwean culture and influence there.

Highlanders can and do see Lowlanders as Africans and thus at times state they don't care about giving them more representative power or control of their mineral wealth.

The colonial Malagasy Diaspora is not spoken often but they are found though out Comoros, Mauritius, Seychelles, Peru (including a former president of partial descent) as well as the United States where they were a small but noted minority.

Muhammad Ali, Maya Rudolph, Benjamin Jealous, Oprah, Mae Jemison, Frederick D. Gregory, the first black "millionaire" Robert Church and many others count Malagasy ancestors in their descent.

Malagasy were the only people in the US to maintain ethnic identity in the US.

afropop.org/21879/wendy-wilson-fall-on-malagasy-americans/

In the 1930's a writer mentioned
>A curious case based upon this diversity of Negro peoples came to light some years ago in a criminal trial in the Delta. A Negro woman stabbed a Negro man. Her reason was that he had called her a “Nigger.” “I’m no nigger,” she said. “My grandma told me not to let nobody call me no nigger. I’m a Molly Glasser and an ink-spitter.” Upon examination it developed that she was descended from the tribe of Malagasi. They were a strong and superior people who themselves had owned slaves. They were betel-chewers and expectorated black. Unfortunately, the law does not recognize distinctions of this kind. The descendant of the Malagasi went to jail.

Huh. That's funny. I don't think it's widely known that they aren't the same as the rest of Africa. I myself knew nothing about Madagascar before this thread other than lemurs.

What is the political structure of Madagascar? Is it as bad as most places in continental Africa?

People are ignorant. On forums when people mention the mixed origins of Malagasy people post pictures of Khoisan to show they can just look that way without non-African admixture.

It's ignorant, Khoi and San look nothing like 'Gasy.

Madagascar is corrupt and controlled by the Merina Elite both the French and English propped up, it's worse off than most of West Africa.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_rankings_of_Madagascar

The elite care for nothing but themselves, in many ways it still a kingdom of peasants (most are subsistence farmers) and lords.

That's why I roll my eyes at racial supremacy things and African inadequacy. Clearly "superior" genetics doesn't make a nation any greater than a predominately black one.

Is it true that parts of it was colonized through pirate havens on the eastern side of the island?

Pirates were there and Thomas Tee's son Ratsimilaho founded a kingdom. But I wouldn't say like Libertatia was as much literal as it was an idea of rogue Europeans marrying and trading with local leaders and embedding themselves and their descendants into power

What would be the most Veeky Forums-approved city in Madagascar according to you?

Ask more questions people
There isn't much left. In the Highlands it was earthen and that was mostly destroyed to make way for European style buildings.

Alasora (Twelve sacred hills of Imerina) are pretty much it, plant based and wood based structures persist elsewhere in the island but it's not old. Stone was reserved for the dead.

The stone tombs of the South and West are modern yet harken back to older times in ornamentation.

What do you think of Ranavalona I? How is she seen over there?

Depends on who you ask. I for one see her as a fierce and astute Queen who wielded much power. She continued in the legacy of her Vazimba foremothers and Europeans absolutely hated her for her resistance.

She rightfully knew a Christian presence would lead to Madagascar's end and it was her greedy court and son that sold the island out. Her tyranny was a reaction to threats of eminent destruction.

Talk more