Ignorant burger here

we learn about the french revolution in school, but im curious to know more. What where all the parties involved? How exactly does napoleon factor into this? Did the revolution fail? What influence does it have today?

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It started with a debt crisis that the monarchy had been trying to walk around since about 1770, but to no avail. Because they needed to raise new taxes, the had to call the Estates general, which was the only body that could legally create new taxes. The estates general was divided into three estates: the first was the clergy, the second was all the nobility, and the third was just everyone else. The third was further divided between the bourgeoisie, the middle class doctors and lawyers who had wealth but no say in government, and the lower classes, who had neither wealth nor a say in government. Because being a delegate to the estates general offered no salary, basically everyone elected from the third estate was bourgeois.

The first problem they ran into was the structure of the estates general: it hadn't been called for 175 years, so there were arguments about how to structure it. Traditionally each estate sent about 300 delegates and the voting was done by estate (so there would be a total of three votes cast). However, as a result of all the enlightenment ideology pumped out in France led the third estate want to double the number of delegates it sent and to vote by head, not by estate. When they finally met in 1789, there were double the amount of third estate delegates but the voting method was unclear. The first few weeks were fraught with tension so the king called a special session to resolve the issue; however, whether by design or accident, the door was locked to the session when the third estate delegates got there. They decided to go over to a nearby tennis court and swear an oath that they were the true representatives of the French nation and that sovereignty lay with them, not with the King. They declared themselves the National Assembly and decided to draft a constitution for a constitutional monarchy.

how does napoleon fit in there? was he truly a french liberal or just a madman who took power? and what did he want to accomplish?

>What where all the parties involved?
>nobles
mostly monarchy side of course but with some defectors like it is in all conflicts
>bourgeoisie and urban population
both small medium big bourgeoisie, jews, middle classes, most parisians, etc
mostly revolutionary side
>rural population
a lot of counter-revolutionaries especially in regions like vendée
they got fucked
>clergy
divided but a lot on the side of aristocracy
they got fucked too

>How exactly does napoleon factor into this?
charismatic strongman who brought peace order and unity in that very unstable uncertain period

liberal ? well officially his ideas could be quite vague and contradictory
if you ask me that was done on purpose, much like trump, because being vague and contradictory is actually a very successful political strategy if you are confident about it

officiously his ideas are unclear and what i have read is pretty contradictory

>Did the revolution fail?
fuck no it was a brilliant success
now are the effects of it positive ? that's another topic entirely but the leaders of the revolution did do what they wanted to do

>What influence does it have today?
a lot, france is still run on those ideas and the new president is entirely in line with that, as we have seen with the flagrant symbolism of the investiture

>Economic crisis in the french kingdom, mainly because of expensive foreign policy
>King tries to get to establish new taxes by calling for a reunion of the Estates-General (representatives of the three "estates": the clergy, the nobility and the rest) in 1789
>The Third Estate, which represents 99% of the population, calls for more representation instead
>The bourgeois ideals of freedom and equality thrive during the discussion, the king can't repress it because he still needs money but ignores it instead
>The Third Estate forms the National Assembly, which explicitly challenges the king's legitimacy
>The king orders them to leave the reunion
>The Assembly goes somewhere else and decides to write a constitution
>The king orders them to stop, they don't
>Most of the deputies from the Nobility and the Clergy join the Assembly
>The king is forced to give in to the Assembly, a constitution is written, France becomes a constitutional monarchy
>However, the king and his relatives plan to take back power by assembling a mercenary army around Paris
>The Parisians realize this, take control of the capital and storm the Bastille
>The king orders his army to keep away from Paris and goes there himself, he is humiliated but he is considered an ally of the revolution
>The countryside revolts against the new regime, the reactionaries go in exile
>The king keeps trying to slow down the Revolutionary projects like The Declaration of the Rights of Man, doesn't even show up a the debates and wants a personal army
>Parisians attack Versailles, kill guards and menace the Queen
>During 1790, he gradually loses his power because he has been moved from Versailles to Paris, while the Assembly is divided between the Patriots and the Aristocrats, or Left and Right, the Clergy is nationalized
>Exiled aristocrats start a Counter-Revolution
>The King attemps to join them by fleeing Paris in 1791
>He is arrested and brought back to Paris

All that happened in late June 1789. July was a tense month that year for a variety of reasons (bad harvest, annual settling of debts, hot weather, high prices), so when the lower class workers of Paris learned that Jacques Necker (the finance minister who they believed was the only one who could solve the debt crisis) was fired on July 11, they got anxious. On July 14, a demagogue led them into a frenzied mob, where they attacked the Bastille Prison, eventually freeing the prisoners inside of it and killing its governor. As such, July 14 is the traditional starting date of the revolution. This was one of the first major injections of violence into the revolution, and it spread throughout the countryside, culminating in the "Great Fear", where bands of peasants roamed the countryside attacking castles and chateaus (thinking that the nobles were hoarding grain). The King stepped in in Paris and managed to calm the situation by publicly saying he supported the revolution and donning the tricolor cockade.

Filled with this revolutionary spirit and led by a club of radical politicians called the Jacobins, the National Assembly decided to unilaterally abolish all remnants of feudalism, end tithes for the church, end special privileges and tax exemptions for the nobility, completely redraw the administrative and judicial map of France, etc. all on August 4. Although a few of these were eventually walked back, this was the beginning of the "liberal monarchy" phase in France, where the doctrines of classical, enlightenment liberalism were dominant. Later in August the National Assembly passed the Declaration of Rights of Man and of the Citizen, which was effectively the French Bill of Rights.

Despite all this posturing, bread was still scarce and a rumor that the King was going to undo the revolution led a large group of angry Parisian housewives to march the King's palace in Versailles and to bring him and his family back to Paris in October.

>now are the effects of it positive ?

Most of Europe would be a backwards shithole akin to Spain without it. Germany might have been making moves in that direction but the feudal order was holding back the development of capitalist society.

>The moderate government declares that he was actually kidnapped to avoided backlash
>The Jacobins call for punishment, start using violence against the government
>The king pretends he will remain faithful to the Assembly, calls for peace
>The Assembly want to divert attention from the king by waging war against the Habsburgs and Prussia
>Europe begins to fear that the revolution spreads across the continent
>The Germans, who started winning battles against France, tell the French they will burn Paris to the ground if any harm is done to the king
>The Jacobins revolt against this provocation, take control of Paris and put the king in jail
>The French start winning against the Germans
>The government is still in crisis after the first election of the Convention in 1792
>The Girondins try to stop the Montagnards from voting for the king's death, which they do anyway
>He gets executed in 1793

Nothing of particular importance really happened in 1790 except for the nationalization of the Church; all Church officials would be elected, receive salaries from the state, and give whatever donations they received to the state. As time went on, the delegates in the National Assembly further stratified into groups; the conservative right wing absolute monarchists, mostly composed of nobles; the center was mostly bourgeois lawyers and officials who wanted to draft a constitution but basically considered the revolution "finished" by 1790, and on the left were the more radical Jacobins who wanted to further increase the democratic nature of the government, but at this time didn't want to overthrow the monarchy. In the city of Paris itself, many radical Jacobins realized that the urban poor (called the sans-culottes because they didn't wear culottes, the breeches of the middle and upper classes) could effectively function as their personal armies. Increasing tension led to violence over the person of the king, and in June 1971 the King decided to flee France, as many of his noble brethren had done. His escape attempt failed rather spectacularly and he was apprehended in Varennes. His escape attempt confirmed the paranoid fears of many of the radical Jacobins that the King was trying to perform a royalist coup and undo the revolution, and public support of the King plummeted and support for a constitutional monarchy increased. On July 15 some radical Jacobins issued a petition demanding the King be forced to abdicate in the Champs-de-Mars field; petitions had been banned by the National Assembly as potentially seditious activity, so the National Guard was called in to disrupt the proceedings. Things got violent and about 50 of the petitioners were killed. Around this time, the National Assembly had finished its constitution.

>that pic
if I was a politician I'd try my hardest to give fodder to conspiracy theorists constantly

pose in front of every pyramid or eye, "subtly" flash the horns or other "secret" signs, go out of my way to shake the hand of every documented mason or jesuit, hell I'd wear some special effects contact lenses because reptilian theorists need some love too

This late period of the National Assembly had been dominated by a group called the Feulliants, who were moderate constitutional monarchists and wanted to avoid war with outside powers (The Holy Roman Emperor and the King of Prussia had issued a decree that they would protect the King if any violence was shown against him). The National Assembly was dissolved on September 30, 1791, and was replaced by the Legislative Assembly, the main body in the constitution of 1791. However, a hereto unimportant lawyer named Robespierre made his first important contribution to the Revolution; he passed a law that made it illegal for anyone in the National Assembly to become a delegate to the Legislative Assembly; this meant that the Legislative Assembly would have little continuity with its predecessor and would be much more radical.

The new ministry of the Legislative Assembly was dominated by the Girondins, a loosely-defined group of delegates from the Gironde region of France. Although they were generally more leftist than the Feulliants, they didn't really have a platform other than going to war with Austria, France's longtime enemy. The war was supported by the most extreme conservatives who believed that France would be steamrolled and the revolution would be undone; opposed by the Feulliants, who feared that France would be steamrolled and the revolution would be undone; supported by the moderate left of the Girondins, who believed that the new French army would be filled with so much patriotic vigor that they could never lose; and opposed by the radical Jacobins, who believed the revolution had to be solidified at home before any movements abroad could be made. The Girondins, who controlled the ministry of the Legislative Assembly, declared war on Austria in April 1792 and invaded the Austrian Netherlands.

you'd also manage to get somehow elected with 66.6% of the voices am i right ?

Waiting for the next part.

French revolution was an autistic chimpout against a legitimate and good rule.
Napoleon also paved the way for Hitler.

The early period of the war went poorly for the French Army, because most of its higher officers had fled as the Revolution got more radical, and the actual infantry was poorly trained and lacked adequate provisions. The Austrian and Prussian armies easily beat the French when they met, but didn't pursue their advantage much because both were preoccupied with Poland in the East.

The Legislative Assembly basically completely failed to govern domestically. Many of the laws they tried to pass were vetoed by the King (who had the right to do so constitutionally), and the veto could only be overturned like four or five sessions after the veto. Laws regarding an oath for all clergymen to take declaring allegiance to France over Rome and declaring that all property of the émigrés (nobles who fled abroad) would be heavily taxed were both vetoed, creating a lot of resentment from the Assembly and the sans-culottes of Paris against the King. This, combined with the utter failure of the early war effort, led some of the radical leaders to believe that the King was actually instructing the generals to perform poorly in order to make the revolution fail. The increasing tension between the ministry and the King led to Louis sacking all the Girondin ministers in early 1792. Things came to a head on June 20, when a group of protestors invaded the Tuileries palace tried to appeal to Louis to revoke his vetoes and reinstate the ministers, but to no avail. It would be the last demonstration of the revolution that didn't involve death.

This final demonstration convinced the Jacobins that they needed to overthrow the monarchy and establish a republic. Led by Georges Danton (one of the organizers of the petition of July 15 1791), the Jacobins established a "coordinating committee" that would lead the insurrection, and on August 10 they took command of the Hotel de Ville and the Tuileries Palace (killing some 600 Swiss guards in the Tuileries).

The committee renamed itself the "insurrectionary commune" and dissolved the Legislative Assembly and called for a National Convention to be called in late September to draw a new constitution for the Republic. In the meantime, sans-culottes drunk on revolutionary patriotism and led by a demagogue named Jean-Paul Marat went roaming through the streets of Paris and killing anyone they considered insufficiently revolutionary. These "September Massacres", as they would come to be known, took about 1400 lives in Paris. The war front had finally picked up again and the Allied army had taken the last fortress between them and Paris, Verdun. This panic was further amplified by the Brunswick Manifesto, issued by the Duke of Brunswick that claimed that if the King was injured at all, the violence exacted on the Parisians as a whole would be "exemplary". However, in September the French army won an important victory at the battle of Valmy, forcing the Allied army to flee French territory and ending the immediate threat of foreign occupation.

The National Convention met first on September 20, 1792, and its first declaration was a decree that the monarchy would finally be abolished and France would be declared a republic. The convention was divided into three groups; the Girondins (who now sat on the right side of the hall, where the Feulliants used to sit), the ultra-radical Montagnards, led again by Robespierre and Danton, and the centrists who were the swing voters. Although the Girondins still controlled all the important posts in the ministry, their star was waning and they would be purged violently the next year.

Because the war was finally going better for the French, they decided to put Louis on trial. The details of the trial are really quite complicated, but the Montagnards managed to show their growing power by pushing for execution and Louis was executed on January 21, 1793.

BASED user. Keep up the good work. Also, answer this definitively: did Robespierre do anything wrong?

Unfortunately for the Republic, the war had turned again to the Allies' favor after the top general in the French army of the north, Charles Dumouriez, had fled to the Austrians after being suspected of treason. The Vendée region, an otherwise unimportant part of France, had also risen in revolt against the Revolution, and it would take months and hundreds of thousands of deaths to end that revolt. The economic situation in France had also deteriorated; there were more bad harvests, and the currency of the revolution, the assignat, was constantly being depreciated as the Convention created more to pay the army. In April the Convention created the Committee of Public Safety to act as an executive and a Revolutionary Tribunal to root out enemies of the Revolution, both at the prodding of the Montagnards. Further tension between the Girondins and the Montagnards finally came to a head in May 31, 1793; the sans-culottes stormed the Convention, but failed to end the Girondins. Two days later, however, they came back and the main leaders of the Girondins were arrested and removed from the Convention. The Montagnards created a bunch of legislation dividing the property of the émigrés, and drafted another constitution (although this constitution would never be put in practice).

As the Revolution became more and more radical in Paris, a variety of other departments in France also rose in revolt against the central government, adding another layer of stress on the Convention and pushing them closer to the Terror. Marat was assassinated by a woman associated with the Girondins in July, leading to another wave of repression against the remains of the Girondins. Because of the deteriorating military situation and the need for armies everywhere, the levée en masse was proclaimed in August, wherein every able-bodied man would become a soldier and all economic activity would be for the war effort.

Amazing presentation user. Couldnt have put it better myself

Amazing. I really appreciate this.

Nice telling of events user.

Really well done.

one little quibble the department uprisings were led by the girondins kicked out of the convention and mainly in the south. Its telling cause as you mebtioned a lot of girondins were from the south and bourdeaux in particular so the centralized govt proposed by the montagnards would have taken power away from regional power centers like theirs. This is why it was called the federalist revolt: cause the girondins wanted to devolve power to the regions for their own benefit amd because they tjought the liberty of devolved powers to the locality would give incentive to the whole nation to join the cause. One more thing- the girondins were also jacobins not separate from them as i think you imply in your narrative. They were essebtially the moderate prowar faction. Montagbards were the more radical faction but thos is misleading in a way because the montagnards, contrary to what you say, were less collaborating with the sans culotte than pressured by their example. Robespierre among ithers radicalized because they believed that if they refused to take radical measures themselves, the sans culotte would outflabk them on the left and perhaps overthrow them. They thought having themselves at the helm would moderate radicalism as ironic as that sounds

Revolutionspodcast.com

Explains it all in just 30 hours or so!

bump

Most people are going to talk about class conflict, which is because of French Marxist thinkers like Lefebvre popularizing the idea of a unified nobility being assaulted by the bourgeoisie that made up the Third Estate. In fact, it's been proven that the "bourgeoisie" in the third estate weren't what would normally be classified as such, but were actually lawyers or government employees.
Basically, it wasn't two unified fronts going against each other, there were nobles and clergymen who did in fact support the reduction of power of the Crown.
If you want to know more about the historiography, read William Doyle's Origins of the French Revolution.

I'll never know so much about any historical topic, you guys are talking about my country and I didn't even know any of this shit

le truc c'est que les historiens, tout comme les scientifiques des sciences durs, restent englués dans l’interprétation des données (mais au moins les historiens le savent, contrairement au scientifiques durs). évidement, les républicains n'enseignent pas historiographie pour leur baccalauréat .

Donc rappel sur la ''vérité en histoire''
-il y a des gens qui ouvrent des livres
-il y a des données, des histoires dans chaque livres
-chaque lecteur de livres construit une histoire avec le livre lu et les autres livres lus avant
-le lecteur fait des recoupages entre les histoires qu'il cree lui mm via chq livre lu et il déclame que les recoupages ''qui font sens '' (pour lui) sont ''vrais'' et on ''eut lieu''
[par exemple, personnage X est mentionné dans 3 livres ''indépendants'' lus par le lecteur, alors le lecteur affirme ''le perso X existe vraiment entre telles dates et il fait ça et ça.]

ensuite, il y a des HISTOIRES de chq INterpretations. c'est à dire :
-le lecteur qui lit des livres parle à des gens
-l'audience aime plus ou moins ce que dit le lecteur
-une fois que le message du lecteur plait/est coherent pour l'audience, l'audience accepte l'histoire du lecteur
-puis il y a des gens qui pondent des livres qui racontent l'histoire de l'histoire du lecteur [évidement chq personne composant l'audience du lecteur initiale écrit une histoire différente des autres]

l a révolution est un bon ex de ça

fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historiographie_de_la_Révolution_française
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historiography_of_the_French_Revolution

évidement les républicains adorent la révolution donc il vont pas dire que les profs d'histoire enseignent une interprétation particulière et encore moins dire que ce qu'enseigne les profs est une interprétation aimée par les gens du ministère républicain de l'enseignement républicain

merci basé user

>whether by design or accident, the door was locked to the session
Too lazy to look it up in wikipedia, but wasnt that because the first son of the king had died and he was in mourning (so a legit excuse to stop the Estates for a while)

bpm

>Did the revolution fail?
More than half of what you earn is took by the State. Peasants during the Ancien Régime weren't taxed that much.
You have no right to bear arms.
Free speech is relative.

boipp

The state also does things far in excess of the ancien regime
and both free speech and bearing arms are greater now than then

>What where all the parties involved?
The Jacobins(Freemasons, Protestants, Jews, Bourgeois, and everykind of foreigners) that advocated for Civic Nationalism and Centralization
The Girondins(Conservative Bourgeoies) that advocated for decentralization and Ethnic Nationalism
The Royalists(Catholics) that advocated for a return to the Traditional French Order
And later on the Bonapartists(mix of Catholics and Conservative Bourgoies) that mixed the Old Order and the New Order

>How exactly does napoleon factor into this?

Napoleon tried to mix the New Order(Constitution, Human rights, Civic Nationalism, and so on) with the Old Order(Divine right, Monarchy, Tribal Nationalism, and so on)

>Did the revolution fail?

Nope

This shit plague is still infectig our country with no end in sight

>What influence does it have today?
Its influence is powerful and far-reaching in France, even the so called French "Nationalists" who oppose it are heavily influenced by it

The situation in the summer of 1793 was truly dire for the Republic; The British were attempting to take Dunkirk and use it as a base of further operations, all the major cities in France (Lyons, Bordeaux, Marseilles, Caen, etc) were in "federalist" revolt (not anti-revolutionary like the Vendée war, just angry about Paris being so dominant in leading the revolution), the Belgian front was collapsing with a revolving door of top generals (losing a battle was treasonous, and about four different generals served and were subsequently executed between summer and winter of 1793), the Spanish had crossed the Pyrenees, the Vendée war was requiring more and more soldiers and resources, and the Rhine frontier was also collapsing against the Allies. However, all these threats would collapse shortly; the rebels in the Vendée were poorly coordinated and failed to capitalize on any of their gains, the Spanish were easily pushed back, the British forces were hilariously poorly managed and Dunkirk was retaken quickly, the levée en masse resupplied the armies of the North and the Rhine with the soldiers they needed, and the Federalists all failed completely to link up into a larger force. The tension in Paris, however, caused another sans-culottes uprising on September 5. This time it was led by Jacques Hébert, an extremely radical lawyer who wanted to be the spiritual successor to Marat. This uprising failed for the most part to change the government, and the Revolution would never become more radical. However, the Convention did begin to decree a series of price edicts proclaiming the maximum legal price of goods in order to calm the lower classes.

In order to extend its power, the Committee of Public Safety would send delegates called "representatives on mission" who would enforce its will throughout the country (these representatives were the ones who accused the failing generals of the North of treason).

Because the execution of the Committee's decrees was dependent solely on the desires of these representatives on mission, and there were general fears of anti-Paris uprisings, Robespierre managed to get a law passed that allowed the Committee to dismiss any public employee and appoint a successor (this law is called the law of 14 Frimaire because the Republican Calendar was in effect). Some of these representatives on mission, on their own accord, began the process of de-Christianization; cathedrals would be destroyed, priests executed, and people forced to worship literally at the altar of reason. Around this time (14 Frimaire was early December) the final factional struggle of the Convention took shape; on the right were Danton and the "indulgants", who advocated stopping de-Christianization and ending the Terror (because, they argued, the national emergency was over); on the left were Hébert and his "ultras", who advocated the destruction of all religious edifices and increasing the Terror until all enemies of France were destroyed. Robespierre initially sided with Danton but a scandal involving the French East India Trading Company involving many of Danton's close associates made him suspicious of Danton. Throughout the winter there were no purges, but Robespierre grew increasingly disenchanted with this "factionalism" which he believed was inherently anathema to the civic virtue necessary for the Republic to thrive. In early February he suddenly fell rather ill and had to leave the stage for a month, and he advised the factions to reconcile themselves while he was gone. When he returned in March and found that not to be the case, he finally decided to destroy them by force. He first purged the Hébertists, but after a couple of weeks feared Danton's power and purged him and his supporters as well. All were executed in late March and early April, leaving Robespierre as the undisputed leader of the Revolution.

this is top notch user

Fuck the Republic desu

Ou can do it user im one of the posters you replied to and ive only read three or four books on the subject. You have to want to learn about it though and focus in making connections cause the events are confusIng and actually defy a lot of conceptions we have about the past

bnp