Mfw people turn away from Christ because of modern churches and denominations...

>mfw people turn away from Christ because of modern churches and denominations, it's autism under autism that just scares anyone with a minimal amount of sanity
>Catholicism autism
>orthodoxy autism
>protestant autism

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1. YOU ARE DESCRIBING JUDEOCHRISTIANITY, NOT CHRISTIANITY.

2. YOU IGNORE WHAT AUTISM IS, SO, ABSTAIN FROM USING THE WORD "AUTISM" AS A DEROGATORY TERM.

autism

Actually I turned away because I read the bible and it was probably the most horrifying thing I ever read. There's like 3 books that are in the "expected" category in the whole old testament. quite honestly by the end I was like 'how do people go around believing this stuff." I had to go an systematically disabuse myself of Abrahamism through a diet of fedora-tipping videos because I was losing sleep over this stuff. And man that Daniel prophecy was a toughy. So what if I'm going to hell? Is it somehow more significant to reject the bible with some amount of wilfulness than to simply be predamned like a majority of the world? Outside of my own tiny frame of reference, my damnation is entirely unremarkable.

You realize by replying, YOU'RE the dope, right? He has severe mental retardation, what's /your/ excuse?

let me guess, you think that adam and eve ate an apple (which btw, wasn't an apple) that was recommended by a talking snake should be taken literally

His posts have been moderately more lucid of late.

No but I don't much see the point in things like Numbers 31:17-18, the general endorsement of slavery or God helping Samson pay off his gambling debts, people being struck down for a slight indiscretion of their king. Ultimately though it was the "pretty much everyone goes to hell" eschatology that was a stumbling stone. I thought, well I better read the rest of this thing to see if I can get the answer on this. However the bulk of it was really just a bunch of Jews raping, pillaging and ethnically cleansing their way through the desert. And heck, I started by reading Job which is more often attacked by fedoras than anything else and I actually found it fairly edifying.

There is an indication that the more you know, and yet reject the salvation offered to you by Jesus, the worse off you will be; "more stripes" and "less stripes" were mentioned.

Why not avoid it all? Why not skip going to hell, forever?

Why not take the pardon offered to you?

I don't have a basis to take it any other way. We're here as humans; someone had to be the first man and woman.

We're not living in an idyllic world; we're living in a broken and cursed world, but yet from time to time I can see glimpses of the perfection that was present in the beginning.

Something bad had to happen.

As to "talking snake", I know that we have supernatural enemies who can take whatever form they chose; in fact, one of the Hebrew words for serpent (not snake) has the same root word for enchanter, sorcerer, diviner; i.e. a supernatural enemy of God's.

As to the effects of them eating the fruit from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, do we not have that knowledge? Can we not tell good from evil?

So no, I have no basis to take the account in any way but literal, because as soon as I start making parts of it metaphorical, the metaphorical bits don't fit.

In all fairness this has more to do about dogmatic fundamentalism (and therefore Catholicism too) than the reformation. Everything after Orthodoxy (early Christianity) was a mistake.

Do you believe God has slaves in heaven? Do you believe that God had slavery in the Garden of Eden?

Or is slavery a known condition of fallen man, present with mankind every single day of his existence for over 6000 years? Do you think God should address slavery, or not?

Because God doesn't care if you're a slave or a free man, rich or poor, black or white, Jew or Gentile; all He cares about is that you believe Jesus is Who He says He is; the Christ, the Son of the living God.

As to Samson, God made Samson to kill Philistines, and Samson performed as ordered.

As to the faults of everyone in the bible being on display, you can know that their faults are not being hidden from you as they are in virtually every other ancient culture ever.

You've touched on one of the problems with having a king; he represents all the people and his "indiscretions" effect everyone.

And no, not everyone goes to hell; only the ungodly, the unrighteous, and the unbelieving.

>Numbers 31:17-18
extermination of degenerates that went to total decadence, as child sacrifices, """sacred""" prostitution and so on... in one word, no sane person could live with them. It would be as living side by side with, lets say, extremist mudslime salafist majority.
>the general endorsement of slavery
Not endorsement, but regulation. And old day slavery was more of an standard economic system with employer-employed. It was a degeneracy, but since it was so widespread in the world, it should have been at least regulated.
>people being struck down for a slight indiscretion of their king
By what purpose it depends. "eye for an eye" was a principle of testament.

>"pretty much everyone goes to hell"
I cannot understand how can you read a new testament and come with such retarded conclusion? Or do you consider hell as a boiling caudron with pitchforks n sheit?

>And heck, I started by reading Job
Oh, you mean a literary narrative about piety that was actually a prophecy?

I'm so amazed Job could, before Abraham even met God, predict that God Himself would have to become a mediator between man and God in order for man to petition His Creator.

That Job knew he would see this mediator, this go-between, with his own eyes?

Remarkable. Absolutely remarkable.

Forget the extermination. What about the keeping the virginal "women CHILDREN" alive "for themselves"? If I had taken issue with God dispensing his wrath on various people for their own unrighteousness as some do then I would be here all night citing instances of that even more severe.

>not endorsement

I would think God could just say "hey don't keep people as property" if that was what he intended.

>How did you come to that conclusion

I wasn't aware that people could be saved without hearing the gospel. Another point I'd like to mention that in Revelation it says 'he causeth all to receive a mark" and that everyone who received the mark would be cast into hellfire. Now I have to think that means "all" in some sense of the word. Even as hyperbole "all" is still a vast vast majority

>actually a prophecy

T. Revelation junky

Overall I just want to say I find apologetics thoroughly unconvincing. I'm done with them. Some asshole on youtube said interpret this verse in this very specific and contrived way? No, instead I came to the conclusion that it wasn't the inspired word of God and was written by a bunch of primitive kikes that couldn't into many precepts of morality that are now seen as self-evident.

I believe Eve literally cucked Adam with the serpent and racemixed, and the story pretty much illustrates that women are subhuman whores.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serpent_seed

t. Gnostic

Not even.

Slavery in the bible was not chattel slavery; it was usually indentured servitude out of poverty for a set period of time. In Israel, the slaves were set free every 7 years for instance. And slaves could, and did, hold very high offices. Joseph was sold into slavery in Egypt and ended up as the highest official in the country but for the pharoah himself.

Your kneejerk reaction to "slavery in the bible is condoned!" is nothing more than your own lack of study on the matter. If a family is so poor that they are all going to starve to death, and by selling a son into slavery they can all survive, are you going to call that evil?

>Forget the extermination. What about the keeping the virginal "women CHILDREN" alive "for themselves"? If I had taken issue with God dispensing his wrath on various people for their own unrighteousness as some do then I would be here all night citing instances of that even more severe.
Ancient world was extremely patriarchal and generally fathers and men influenced society. Therefore, influence of those women on society wouldn't be so degrading (although we see that on higher echelons, like with king Solomon).

>I would think God could just say "hey don't keep people as property" if that was what he intended.
1)Ancient times slavery was not as we get it now. It was an economic system. Like you work to pay for your debts to bank. Similar system was in old times, but with naturalistic payment. this type of slavery (if we can call it so, its more like a serfdom) is seen even in modern world. While actual kidnapping and slave trading was punishable by debt. So main article is about debt slavery (that we have even in modern times in changed form) and war captives (that we have as POW forced labour)

>I wasn't aware that people could be saved without hearing the gospel. Another point I'd like to mention that in Revelation...
1)Paul has said that those who didnt heard the word, will be judged by general moral laws (that is by consciousness)
2)Revelations is hard to understand general, but here, "all" means all who recognized and submitted to the beast

>T. Revelation junky
Glorious reply. Entire old testament is a prophecy about Jesus if you didn't know. Entire mosaic code and animal sacrifices were prophecies about sacrifice of Jesus for mankind. And Job stands out not only as a prophecy, but also as a literary story.

Also, the last statement shows that you are just full of hatred. You try not to act as a fedora, but you fail at it, to be quite honest.

>While actual kidnapping and slave trading was punishable by debt.
by death, I should've said

Oh its no secret that I hate the Jews. I would never try to deny such a thing now.

How in the absolute fuck can you spin what is in all probability just a parable into a prophecy. Meanwhile verses actually supposed to be prophecies have failed.

"How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them?"

Romans 10:14

>And no, not everyone goes to hell; only the ungodly, the unrighteous, and the unbelieving.

Which is basically everyone according to the Abrahamic definition.

>The material near this tag may use weasel words or too-vague attribution

Not at all. Heaven is huge, and will be well populated. Likely in the billions.

The ungodly are people like fedoras who have no God, and say they have no God.

The unrighteous are the people who, like the Jews, are trying to become righteous by following the Law of Moses, or some other law.

The unbelieving do not believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God.

To be godly, righteous, and believing is to confess that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart God raised Him from the dead.

There are many of us who have done that, and so Jesus will have many siblings. God usually measures things in grains of sand on the beach or stars in the sky; there will be many of us.

>is to confess that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart God raised Him from the dead.

BUT HOW
i grew up my entire life believing that science trumps all

if it can be proved by science/mathematics it is an unequivocal truth, however i hear of only one person ever being raised from the dead in my entire life

not a single medical instance of someone being raised from the dead after THREE DAYS (im not counting "medical definition of dead but revived via some fancy shit i dont pretend to understand")

And Lazarus, Jesus' friend, was raised from the dead after 4 days.

Jesus is Life. Jesus breathed life into a clay statue and Adam became a living being. Jesus breathed His Spirit into His disciples and they were resurrected to eternal life with Him.

Jesus had the power to lay down His life, and He had the power to pick it back up again after three days. Doing so proves He is God, as only God could do that.

You have to meet God in God's arena, the arena of faith, the arena of the unseen, if you want to be with God forever.

You cannot be in mankind's foolish observation exercises and gain eternal life (but notice how that is what they are promising you for the future?).

When push comes to shove, ask God for help, and He will help you. He has to help you because what we have laid out here is supernatural knowledge, and requires supernatural acts (that require supernatural assistance).

Let go of your empiricism; it is a failed worldview and useless for the afterlife.

Reach out to Jesus, and He will hear your voice, and heed your cries, and save your soul.

Okay I'm not even Christian but you're being retarded. Isn't the fact that Christ rose from the dead SUPPOSED to be an entirely exclusive event?

The exclusive event part of it is that Jesus rose in an eternal body and ascended into heaven 40 days later, having never died again.

Everyone else that was raised from the dead died again. (And two men did not die, but were translated directly, as will all believers at the rapture.)

>origin is representative of the views of more than a tiny minority of early christians

People turn away from Christ because :
1. Freedom of religion, greater exposure to other religions.

2. There is no logical reason to value a clearly man-made and personified God like Christianity does, when you can focus purely on an indescribable monad/pantheist outlook. Or a vague sense of materialist spirituality.

3. "Sin" and "hell" are unjustifiable and illogical when explained to people who have a choice of alternative religions to follow.

4. People don't want their kids molested by a priest (even if the rates are lower, the psychological hysteria/damage has been done and is irreversible.)

5. Church morals in general are weakening in the west, particularly in state Churches where they must follow politics.

Turning away from Catholicism is a good thing, as people weren't designed to be slaves, but protestantism deserves a boost.

Okay whatever, I don't care. I'm just saying that guys argument is silly..

I disagree.

People start out having no idea about Jesus whatsoever, and if they're never told, they never turn away or towards Him at all. Such are the vagaries of life.

Anyone who is in Christ Jesus, in this age, will never move away from Him as such a thing is literally impossible. Nobody can take me from the hand of my Lord, not even me.

The benefits of heaven and the horrors of hell suffice to move anyone out of their own manmade nonsense.

Sin is missing the mark, not being like God; hell is a place intended to confine the devil and his angels, and any who join their rebellion.

Again, people like you. You joined satan's rebellion against Jesus, and you don't even know it's already lost.