People are taught the statues were always marble-white to perpetrate white supremacy

I don't understand. They were claiming that the statues still had original paint you could see that Romans weren't white. Did they not know that Rome conquered Africa? They also criticized the sculptor for being "obsessed" with the purity of white marble. They are literally complaining about about rocks being white.

>the statues were always marble-white to perpetrate white supremacy
Does she actually say this? There's a long way from her quote to yours.

>let's make a statue that we consider beautiful
>let's paint it in a color that we consider beautiful
>this is socially constructed
WOW WTF WHITE GENOCIDE MUCH???

It is sad that you need to caricature an argument that is already so transparently based on a faulty premise.

I looked at the video, and the comments together with the like-ratio did not make this seem like VICE is getting away with anything.

And Western Civ as a monolithic entity is a careless reduction in any case.

>And Western Civ as a monolithic entity is a careless reduction in any case.
According to who?

>It is sad that you need to caricature an argument that is already so transparently based on a faulty premise.
If you watch the video you'll see that it's a paraphrase, not a caricature.

news.vice.com/story/marble-helped-scholars-whitewash-ancient-history

white bois btfo

>dey wuzn't wyt it juz marbles n shiet it don matta dat dey haf kaukayshun feechurs Augustus wuz a Nubian

Day of the rope when?

/pol/ was right all along, wasn't it?

>something being a cultural construct means it isn't real

Positivists I swear to God. She is also right in the sense that northern Europeans tried to paint ancient Italians and Greeks as different to modern/medieval Italians and Greeks, obviously now they're considered white but that wasn't always the case.

t. /pol/

>northern Europeans tried to paint ancient Italians and Greeks as different to modern/medieval Italians and Greeks
Can you elaborate?

yes

always

This is the Italian NT. Other than Balo, they are white. Only America in some eras would disagree. But then, they also considered the Irish and Germans

Why don't you go back to /pol/ if you like it so much?

Her twitter.

I know non-Scandis with that hair color you tard.

They're considered that now, but a Anglo dude in the U.K during Victorian era would've disagreed. You have to remember that for a while only Germanics and the French were considered "white", at least to the British and other Northern Europeans.

Northern Italians are literally indistinguishable from French people.

>And Western Civ as a monolithic entity is a careless reduction in any case
It doesn't matter how useful a definition anyone offers people like you, you will come back with this weak bullshit.

Europeans think of themselves as distinct from other regions of the world. Their systems of government, and common principles, are things which have developed largely without foreign input. That itself is enough to conclude Western civilisation exists as a moral/political force, and as physical reality.

There are countless tribes in Africa and South America which were first contacted by Europeans, than by each other, yet the social constructionists never have a problem unifying them under a common banner. It's only Europeans, who have had hundreds of years of common cause and shared history, who (((mysteriously))) have "nothing at all to do with each other".

It's fucking transparent, and the people who push this shit are transparent.

>"Trump admits his border wall could be defeated by medieval siege technology."
>Ha ha! Therefore building a wall is stupid!
what?

Some European thinkers liked to propagate that the ethnicities that were in classical civilizations like the Greeks were no more due to a supposed dramatic influx of Arabs/Moors/Slavs.

Yeah, but that doesn't stop people hundreds of miles away from arbitrarily categorizing them.

This is true though, I don't know why this is such a controversial statement. "Whiteness" did not exist as a concept during those times.

People who exist now are not the same as people who existed prior.

This is true even within Europe. Viking invasions, norman invasions, Turkish invasions, Moorish invasions, etc.

Europe in 1000 BC was different from Europe today. Likely the southern Euros were darker, and the northern ones "whiter".

It's a little similar to what happened with western Eurasia. A half-continent full of extremely divergent populations mixed together so fucking much that we even have a vaguely defined morphological identity, called Caucasoid, today.

I don't care to read the OP pic, but if the point is "white marble makes them interpreted as whiter than they really were", then yes she's totally correct.

Whoever painted that has no idea how to paint... It's flat and terrible, looks like a kid painted his first miniature and is just happy he got the paint in the lines.

Terrible.

It's supposed to be a representation of how they were painted originally.

This is Marcus Aurelius. Do you think he looks any different from the players here

Slightly different but not dramatically so. Those invasions numbering in the thousands are nowhere near enough to change populations of millions that were in Continental Europe.

That's right, just conveniently ignore all the other tweets and re-tweets. Better yet, DON'T read her timeline for yourself. She's just an innocent researcher with no ulterior motives.

Her statement that Rome was non-white, in absence of a statement to the opposite, is purely non-political. Her statement that Western civilisation doesn't exist is also non-political.

Her marking of the date when "crusaders" killed muslims and Jews, including women and children, in a commemorative fashion, is simply pure coincidence.

why don't you people take it to youtube
there are over 9 thousand threads here already and they're all preaching to the choir

Specifically they only have traces of the base coat of paint, they don't know the other layers so they didn't add them, they probably looked a little better than that example.

It's almost like... she's a liberal postmodernist...

French people themselves have a north south divide. Lactose tolerance ranges from 20% to 65% across the nation.

Well someone should tell that ancient guy he did a shit job.

And this is Octavian.

youtube.com/watch?v=86PD8o6xe_4

Here, click the downward thumb, leave a comment.
Stop making more threads.

It really isn't. What we think of as "western civilization" is mostly an Anglo/northwest development. This is even reflected in achievement rates throughout Europe.

You can actually take your argument and reverse it completely. They unify disparate hunter gatherer tribes because of eurocentrism; they've not studied the intricacies of their cultures, and amass them all together, much like we do for Asia vs. Europe even today.

There is no definition for western civilization that bijects to race. If you define it culturally, eastern Europe scores with third world countries. If you define it technologically, Japan/Korea score higher than many Euro nations. If you do it based on historical achievement, Slav/Celt/Balkan/Iberian lands come about on par as Japan.

Nobody cares what "Europeans think". That's not something even remotely objective.

Are you stupid? When we think of Western Civilization, we think of Christian Europe. That's what defined the West and why Al-Andalus was not considered part of the West even if Geographically it was Western and it was very well developed.

(of course, after medieval times, before that it was the Roman-Helenistic Civilization).

I have no fucking idea, because that's an unpainted marble statue.

And moreover it doesn't matter, because Aurelius is one person.

When you're talking about intra-European differences, they're slight by default. Many Spaniards can pass as Finns.

Congratulations, that is one of the dumbest things I have ever read.

The Anglo soul hates all euros and you know it Pumpernickel

>reddit spacing
>spouting a bunch of bullshit and trying to pass it off as fact
stop

You're operating on a different type of reasoning (if you can call it that), and refuse to understand what I'm saying.

Go back to pol.

You can look at the statue of other Roman Emperors. Or their descriptions. A large part of them were blond, including Augustus.

>What we think of as "western civilization" is mostly an Anglo/northwest development.
No.
>This is even reflected in achievement rates throughout Europe.
Irrelevant.
>You can actually take your argument and reverse it completely. They unify disparate hunter gatherer tribes because of eurocentrism; they've not studied the intricacies of their cultures, and amass them all together, much like we do for Asia vs. Europe even today.
Ok, but irrelevant.
>There is no definition for western civilization that bijects to race. If you define it culturally, eastern Europe scores with third world countries. If you define it technologically, Japan/Korea score higher than many Euro nations. If you do it based on historical achievement, Slav/Celt/Balkan/Iberian lands come about on par as Japan.
This has nothing to do with whether or not Western Civ is a meme.

His is not pol, but it is not leftypol either. Go back to tumblr with your idiotic unsupported shit.

>It really isn't. What we think of as "western civilization" is mostly an Anglo/northwest development.
My first thought is Greek philosophy and the Enlightenment, then Christendom, then the Romance and Germanic language trees, then the Renaissance, then the Republican/Parliamentary traditions.

>They unify disparate hunter gatherer tribes because of eurocentrism; they've not studied the intricacies of their cultures
Western culture, as an idea, is almost indistinguishable from Christendom, and has been cemented as such since the Peace of Westphalia.

>If you define it culturally, eastern Europe scores with third world countries. If you define it technologically, Japan/Korea score higher than many Euro nations. If you do it based on historical achievement, Slav/Celt/Balkan/Iberian lands come about on par as Japan.
Western civilisation is the reason why there are 7 billion people on Earth, and not 500 million. It is THE engine which drove BY FAR the most rapid advancement of our species ever to occur.

Not everyone who disagrees with you is a poltard you reddit spacing plebshit.

You're retarded and you should actually go to /pol/

UM

Western civilization is real, but I SORT OF GET what she's saying about the US latching on to Greco-Roman culture... I mean it's famous and impressive... But that's the only thing that seemed to be very logical about this video

I mean come on we are only just finding out about what these statues looked like. But no one painted over them to look "white" they just lost their pigmentation

and the movie clip they showed was from like the 60s, a time when Spock was playing Indians with redface... Not really a great way to make a point about whitewashing...

This lady is probably relishing in all the attention she's getting because otherwise nobody would fucking care about anything she gets published because classical humanities are fucking boring...

>classical humanities are fucking boring

The only reason she was noticed is because her essay title included "whiteness" and "racism".

It's dog-whistle postmodernism worming it's way into the classics.

It's only a representation of the base coat.

Retarded pseudo-scientists who think this is how they looked are totally overlooking the fact that they very likely painted in layers, you have a bright base coat and add darker details on top, but of course being a statue there is not way to tell what the coats above the base coat looked like as there is no residual paint left at all, only chemical traces of the base coat on the marble.

Basically this is a whole fucking gigantic misunderstanding, it is totally dumb, uninformed pop science, even a fucking layman can deduce that you can only ever reveal the base coat and not the details on top of the base coat by simply analyzing the marble.

oh come on your average person doesn't give a shit

My own interest is limited to like Age of Empires

it's really funny because anth is saturated with postmodernist claptrap but like i seems to so far be immune to most of the garbage SJW posturing... Maybe it's because the racism in anthropology conversation got rolling like post-WW2 because there was so much blatant essentialism goin on. This kind of stuff definitely seems way more rampant in the US as well. I think probably most SJWs go for gender studies or sociology, too... DUNNO

And Greeks are indistinguishable from Turks. So either Greeks aren't white or Turks ate white too.

>HOW DARE YOU DON'T STICK OUT YOUR NECK SO YOU CAN BE KILLED YOU FUCKING GOY

>the US latching on to Greco-Roman culture
More like the US latching on to European culture, latching onto Roman culture latching onto Greek culture. Over 3000 years of WE WUZ.

>oh come on your average person doesn't give a shit
>Thinking popularity with the plebs means anything.

Project Evropa and Nathan Domingo say otherwise.

Pssst...
Northwestern Anatolia used to be part "Greece", no fucking shit there are "Turks" that are indistinguishable from Greeks. It's almost as if Turk in the context of Turkey is a catch-all category for multiple ethnic groups of varying origins, that's why not all Turks are Turkic.

The larping as Greco-Romans comes from Brits.

>3108927
(You)

I know this isn't Veeky Forums related but how much sway or influence do these people have? Do you guys seriously think that a women with a serious leftist bias is going to be taken seriously by historians?

Then you all concede to the original point, which is that western civilization being a monolithic entity is reductionist.

The principles and rules of law of the west are now everywhere in the world. India, much of Africa, and the entirety of Latin America would thus be considered part of "western civilization". The only differences these countries have with Europe is racial makeup (and in India's case, religion, which is trivial compared to actual values).

The initial argument that you're missing was a knee-jerk reaction to the point stated in my first sentence, based on "we feel that we wuz n shiet". That's why I mentioned pol.

So I ask again, is western civilization monolithic now, or at least within the last couple of centuries? Is it so by political rule of law? No. Cultural values? No. Technological achievement? No.

There are only two things you can state: race (and even that's changing now too), and religion (which is trivial, since worshipping a polyappendaged elephant or a dead sandnigger on a stick doesn't actually change your core values).

It's true, nordicucks try to steal masterranean achievements at every opportunity.

You're talking to potentially 5 anons.

Isn't /pol/ always saying Med peoples aren't white?

Everything is a social construct. The problem is people who use "x is a social construct" to mean "x isn't real".

i think the problem is all semantics

ameriblobs are all obsessed with a very vague an undefined word - """"white""""

it literally doesn't mean anything, the american census considers all europeans and middle easterners to be white, selfhating liberal scum want everyone relevant in history to be "non-white", retarded rednecks want everyone relevant in history to be "white"

my favorite is the ancient greco-persian wars where liberals are rooting for the persians because the greeks were evil "whites" and the persians were innocent "people of color", when in reality they were pretty much the same race and their conflict was civilizational(which is exactly what the liberals problem is, they hate western civilization, not some arbitrary "white" race)

Ancient Romans were North Africans, so no she is not wrong at all.

>people who use "x is a social construct" to mean "x isn't real".
This triggers me to no fucking end. I don't understand how someone can do this yet still go on and pay their bills that's apparently not real.

>White statues are bad BECAUSE THEY'RE WHITE and representing WHITE PEOPLE
2017, ladies and gents
A statue being white is bad because of the color.

Are statues a race?

evry1 with a working brain

Sound analysis. Anglos are autistic mouthbreathers. Lets wrap this thread up.

Its one big continuity.

There is such a thing as a Western Civilization. And it is not limited to geography. Egypt was once part of the West, while most of Germany was not.

It is the Greco-Roman world and its Christian successors. The people who followed Socrates, Christ, Paul, Augustine and Aquinas.

Yeah only scandis have brown hair

...

A diverse group of people who murdered each other for a long time across the same continent and have only in the modern Era even been unified by a common language, well, you kind of have to come up with a cardinal direction because it's not like Chinese civilization needed to justified. Uniting language, border, series of beliefs, check check check. Sure they didn't invade a bunch of poor technologically backwards cunts to cuck during the prime time to do that, and got cucked by Le ebbin Opium Merchants, but like the Roman Empire their civilizational unity is clear.

European civilization makes more sense, but they wanna exclude the Slavs.

Oh... When I first heard about this, I thought people were trying to say the statues were supposed to be of POC, not that the statues themselves weren't supposed to be blank white. The latter is true, originally they had paint on them, but eventually the paint faded or washed off or something. At least that's what I've heard.

>don't be such a naz-

youtube.com/watch?v=TbIc1LZqIAw

Why are anglos so retarded.

>civilization is a culutral constuct
STOP THE FUCKING PRESS!!

That's some peak neo-liberalism, right there.

why do you want a safespace?

Those are Jews who are trying to divide and conquer. In truth though southern Europeans have lost a lot of their whiteness due to immigration over the centuries.

I got the impression from this video that she thinks North Africans in the Roman era were black