Vercingetorix and other heroes

He did that because he wanted to get them to safety you big dummy, he thought the Romans would let them go

>he thought the Romans would let them go

If he believed the romans to be so nice, why did he rebel against them? I'm just saying he wasn't a hero but you're calling him retard. Ancient and roman warfare didn't work like that and he knew it. Accept the facts, he didn't give a shit about Caesar letting them go or not. He didn't give a shit about gauls, at most he cared about his arvernii and probably just about his aristocratic fellas.

Maybe war is based more on practical reality than on sentiment idk

Well what do you think is more likely

He turned to his army and was like "haha fuck you I'm going to send all your families to die"

or

He turned to his army and was like "okay we men are probably screwed but at least we can save our wives and children"

>we are screwed so let's send the women and children outside the fortifications while we wait here

>this is what coqaboos actually believe

Mithridates is a good one. The last great Greek ruler.

Read about Viriatus. The only one of those romantic heroes that actually wasn't defeated but assasinated. Claimed by both portuguese and spanish nationalism since lusitanians lived in both nations.

What he said is completely irrelevant. Not to mention that half of his army didn't care either. How many alessians were part of his army?

A retarded uprising against a superior foe that has already defeated and dominated you is not practical, tho. It's the very definition of sentimentalism. Caesar literally made gaul elitemen senators. Vercingetorix didn't choose wisely.

>greek

Hellenic would be better. He was a fucking persian, his name isn't precisely greek.

Mirthidates was mixed Persian and Greek.

>fpbp

Well of course, since his mother was a seleucid princess. But his ideology was full on achaemenid revivalism, he was an iranian-style King of Kings, not a diadochi. He did see the benefits of patronizing greek culture and participating in the hellenistic ethos, though. But so did the Parthians.

Hellenes fear the senatorial warrior

>Seems like an obvious candidate for national hero of France
except that he wasn't french so no

>Antiochus III "the great"
>mithridates VI "the great"
>tigranes II "the great"
>Phillip V "beloved of the hellenes"
Will gre*ks ever learn?

THERE CAN BE NO PEACE
NO PEACE WITH ROMANS

>MUH TROPES
>ROMUNS DINDU NUFFIN

The sacking of Rome was done by the Senones, a northern Italian and completely unrelated group to the central Gaulish Arverni confederation headed by Vercingetorix, done hundreds of years before Caesar entered Gaul. None of the Gauls alive during that time had anything to do with the sacking of Rome. Moreover the Senones were provoked when Roman ambassadors (notorious for being belligerent assholes and deliberately sabotaging negotiations to establish pretenses for wars of conquest) stabbed a Senone chief to death, egregiously violating the rule of ambassadorial neutrality. Instead of punishing to Fabian ambassador as the Senones requested, they instead honored the murderers with tribune powers and consulship. This is what provoked the Senone to sack Rome, not wild bloodlust and retard strength.

Well, the biggest resistance hero against ROme was of course a germanic warrior, Arminius or in his native language Ermanamer.
He did so much good for us!

autism

A true hero clearly, but it can definitively argued that the true heart of the Gallic resistance was actually a small Gaulish village in Armorica.

*dies like a bitch far from home*

Roman equite*

This.

Asterix >>> Vercingetorishit

But it's true. French people that claim Vercingetorix are LARPing

>resistance
>educated by Rome
>Rome wanted to bring civilization to that hell hole called Germania
>chimps out and betrays his benefactors

Arminius a shit tbhfamsmh

>have a traitor as a national hero
>complain when other countries "betray" you
German hypocrisy never ceases to amaze

French people claiming a symbol from their own past are wrong? Why because they are one hundred percent Frankish, is that it? Sperging about this is as retarded as the really old Napoleon not French meme. Trained in French military academies from age nine, still can't be claimed by French.

Get fucked and accept the fact that Vercingetorix was better than everyone else's token resisting Rome figure.

>he lost a little better than the others!
Guess that's an achievement for French people

Her name was Boudicca, you disrespectful fool.

France has a long history and plenty of national heroes. With the Romantic movement and a reclamation of figures from antiquity, you could do a lot worse than to pick the only man to defeat Caesar in battle. In fact, everyone else does!

BTFO

I too watch Historia Civilis

I don't. Is it good?

Yeah, the poster you're replying to did get BTFO pretty hard.

Seriously? Just vercingetorix? Not hannibal? Antiochus? Any of the many parthian and sassanian kings? Boudicca? You're somehow less informed Tham the average Veeky Forums shitposter

Sorry meant to quote

WELGOME TO MY WALD VARUS :--DD VOLLOW ME :-DDD

t. HERMANN

Hannibal doesn't count, the Phoenicians were an equal force against Rome

>has the high ground
>numerically superior force
>amazing cavalry, being a gaul
>still looses to Romans
And why do franks love him again? Verc should have won in this fucking 3 to 1 fight, but being a tribal nigger he ley himself get anally raped by the g*rmanic auxillary cavalry of all fucking things.

Gauls are about as french as italians are latin.

The French are less Gaulish than Italians are Latin due to being WOPPED and FRANKED, in that order.

>Literally a muh heritage American of ancient times killing the civillized people because muh heritage

The French were also Greeked, Goth'd and Burgundied

It's really obvious. Token rebellions of minor significance, like Boudicca, Zenobia, Decebalus, or whatever are not the same as a single leader uniting the majority of a formerly disunited and tribalistic nation.
It's a much greater achievement than helping Julian the Apostate meet his self inflicted end, and nobody would seriously try to claim Hannibal because it would be a giant Koch curve.

Yes I felt including the minor ones would be going overboard. Don't forget the Berber pirates who went as far inland as the Alps.

>resistance against the Roman Machine.

Ambiorix and Julius Civilis are two that I know of.

He was 1/16 Persian

>stubid uncibilized barbarians wond led us gonger them :-DDD

>destroy two legions in a cowardly ambush
>get utterly destroyed when romans come back and you can't betray them again
Contrary to popular belief, Rome could have annexed Germania after Germanicus' campaign but didn't because of internal politics

Arminius, the guy who orchestrated the teutoburg forest ambush became idolized through german nationalism, they began calling him Hermann (his germanic name)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermannsdenkmal

Enough of this meme shit.

Here is your list of based native opponents of Rome.

>Civilis
>Virathius

That's it.

what do you mean by internal politics, im curious.
I thought that germanicus' invasion was simply a retaliation aimed at saving rome's glory and punishing arminius.

As a born and raised irishmen (not any plastic paddy shite) is it possible I descend from this guy?

The purpose of the invasion of Germanicus was to defeat Arminius and recover the lost eagle standards. Tiberius, the emperor at the time, was completely hated by everybody. Germanicus was extremely popular, handsome, a charismatic and effective commander, basically perfect in every way, and the heir to the emperorship. Tiberius got the governor of Syria to poison him. The emperor extremely paranoid and prone to purging his suspected enemies, eventually spending the last years of his life in self imposed exile because of his fears of conspiracies.

depends. are you a loser?

Well yeah. I'm on Veeky Forums.

>destroy two legions in a cowardly ambush
contrary to your shitpost, Arminius destroyed 3 Legions.

>Celtics still butthurt that they once again where invaded and assimilated
>don't mention the successful Germanic resistance
Would you like to know what happened to little Titus and his mom?

Well at least one of us got the job done in the end eh brother?

Weird thing is that the Germanics were still using just clubs and spears with very little armor and wooden/wicker shields. Meanwhile Celts had the best metallurgy and cavalry in western Europe. Maybe Tacitus was right and the Germanics were better at defending themselves because they were less degenerate, strictly monogamous, and killed their homosexuals before throwing them in bogs.

>Arminius was seen as a German hero during the Third Reich
>Someone who literally backstabbed a trusted friend
>Lost every encounter afterwards against the Romans
>Also someone who ended up dead because fellow Germans thought he was getting too powerful
Fucking Nazis were stupid for revering him.

>a trusted friend
Did he had Stockholm syndrome or something? He was sent as a hostage to Rome and he fucked them over as soon as he the chance. In the process he saved much of Germania from becoming a Roman province.

Arminius was held hostage. Roman soldiers were rampaging through Germania, turning them against each other in divide et impera, and actively trying to subjugate them. It wasn't a betrayal because the Germans had no loyalties to Rome in the first place, it was a revolt of auxiliaries. Plus there are other examples of Romans being evenly matched by Germans or getting fucking destroyed (Battle of Arausio, 80,000 Romans wiped out in one battle, way more than Cannae), despite Germans being treeniggers wielding nothing more than spears with tiny points, clubs, no armor, and wooden or wicker shields. I would think that would be something to be proud of. I forget who, but a Roman writer remarked “German freedom is to be more feared than persian despotism“ (paraphrased). That's saying a lot, since the Persians were the only other civilization to match the Romans at warfare.

>While they just smashed, Rome built
you know this is as much a meme as Noble savages is, right?

Hermann was referred long before the Nazis.
And why not, btfo'd Rome and kept Germania Germanic.
I mean people refer Vercingetorix, and he was just another surrendermonkey that lost miserably.

FACT: Viriathus is way cooler than either Caesar's pet or traitorous Arminius

The true king of Iberia

>Iberia
Hispania Tarraconensis you mean?

No, iberia, since that was the name at the time he was unifiyng the land, hispania came after the treachery that killed him

Why did Celts always lose against Romans. It's like they were asking to become slaves.

They were rapidally becoming city states, and thanks to Viriato defending against roman invasion, a single unified kingdom, Viriato lost because of this

>Knowing that the Lusitanian resistance was largely due to Viriatus' leadership, Quintus Servilius Caepio bribed Audax, Ditalcus and Minurus, who had been sent by Viriatus as an embassy to establish peace (Appian[45]). These ambassadors returned to their camp and killed Viriatus while he was sleeping. Eutropius claims that when Viriatus' assassins asked Q. Servilius Caepio for their payment he answered that "it was never pleasing to the Romans, that a general should be killed by his own soldiers.",[46] or in another version more common in modern Portugal and Spain, "Rome does not pay traitors who kill their chief". Q. Servilius Caepio was refused his Triumph by the Senate.

>After the death of Viriatus, the Lusitanians kept fighting under the leadership of Tautalus (Greek: Τάυταλος).

>Laenas would finally give the Lusitanians the land they originally had asked for before the massacre. Nevertheless, total pacification of Lusitania was only achieved under Augustus. Under Roman rule, Lusitania and its people gradually acquired Roman culture and language.

>Viriatus stands as the most successful leader in Iberia who ever opposed the Roman conquest. During the course of his campaigns he was only defeated in battle against the Romans once, and from a military standpoint can be said to have been one of the most successful generals to have ever opposed Rome's expansion. Ultimately, even the Romans recognized that it was more prudent to use treachery rather than open confrontation to defeat the Lusitanian uprising. Some fifty years later, the renegade Roman general Quintus Sertorius, at the head of another insurrection in Iberia, would meet a similar fate.

sauce in wiki

also bonus points for Boudica

>They were rapidally becoming city states, and thanks to Viriato defending against roman invasion, a single unified kingdom, Viriato lost because of this

But nevertherless they weren´t unified countries with total confidence in their leaders, therefore the lack of understanding of the need in unity against outside forces and the act of betrayal

This is a common theme amongst Romes barbarian enemies. More often than not they are taken down by treachery than being defeated by the Romans in open battle. The Germanics would only really start getting their act together after the Marcomannic Wars, where Rome proved that they would literally genocide whole tribes if they resisted.

>By the middle to late second century AD, migrating Germanic tribes like the Marcomanni and Quadi pushed their way to the Roman frontier along the Danube corridor, movements of people which resulted in conflicts known as the Marcomannic Wars; these conflicts ended in approximately AD 180.[83] Not long thereafter, larger confederations of Germanic people appeared, groups led by tribal leaders acting as would-be kings. The first of these conglomerations mentioned in the historical sources were the Alamanni (a term meaning "all men") who appear in Roman texts sometime in the 3rd century AD.[84] This change indicated that the tribalism of the Germanic people was being abandoned for consolidated rule.
From wiki. Ethnic conflict = growth of states.

Fuck those savages. They destroyed so much history in their travels.

Averni didn't sack Rome.

Fucking terrorists, they ought to be drowned

If i had a time machine, i would go there, imagine the romans or the egipcians seing europe as the same as europeans latter saw america and africa
Just wonder the possibilities, you could make your nation, form a culture and even a religion
>Imagine

>Pretty sure several of the Gaulic tribes subgugated if not exterminated by Caesar's forces were actually already established allies if not protectorates or vassals of Rome.

Yes. Those who went back on their commitments to Rome and joined the Gallic side after allying with Rome were treated very harshly. Oath-breaking and treason and stuff, this was taken very seriously.

The Germanics sound like my kind of people. Drink mead, eat pork, hunt, smother fags in bogs, don't pay any taxes, don't even bother with backbreaking farming, worship trees. I would introduce metal to them in exchange for wenches and land.

>He did that because he wanted to get them to safety you big dummy, he thought the Romans would let them go

The Romans refused to let them cross the Roman lines and leave the area around the besieged city.

Vercingetorix would not let them back into the city, and left them to starve outside the city walls, until the day of the surrender when he had to open the gates so he could ride out, letting them back in.

his reasoning was militarily sound -- he was under siege, feeding mouths that could not help fight made his position harder to hold. But it was not in any way an action of a populist hero. He was a thug who started a war, abd was ultimately the cause of everything that sprang from that act..

Amusingly, my auto spell check wants to change his name to "overcrowding."

"The Poison King" is a good book about him.

I would make some sort of theocracy, were the king would be like the pope but with the hereditary-primogeniture inheritance, were appointed priests would rule on my behalf, beat the romans into it and be first to write laws in paper like some sort of magna carta, and focus in militarization and production of metals and agriculture

>I would make some sort of theocracy, were the king would be like the pope
So a Caliphate. Germans inventing Islam before the Arabs– I shudder at the thought.

>be first to write laws in paper like some sort of magna carta
You mean the Quran.

And of course, i would choose iberians

>Fertile land with abundance in wildlife
>Lots of metals and natural ports
>Access to 3 seas and the atlantic ocean for fishing and exploration and trade
>Defensible due to mountains

Hum, perhaps, i was imagining as the roman emperors also proclaimed themselves gods
I wouldnt even know if it would be monotheist or politeísth tough

Or the latter european absolutism and englithened despotism