Biggest economic miracles in history

The two biggest economic miracles in history:

>Nazi Germany
From 1938 to 1945, Germany went from the most oppressed, collapsed nation in the world where people burned barrels of German currency just to stay warm, to economic super power over night in the biggest economic miracle in world history.
>China
From the 1990s to the 2010s, China went from overpopulated third world communist hell hole to the biggest economic super power in the world.

>How did they do it?
The unleashed the power of the marketplace but they maintained a tight grip on social order and put their nation and people first, to the chagrin of outsiders.
>What about America?
A great economic story that lead the world for decades, however failure to maintain social order and disloyalty towards its people and nation has caused it to collapse. The mental illness of white guilt has made this and Europe a place ripe for pillaging by external influence and groups.

Agree? Disagree? Explain your view.

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>From 1938 to 1945, Germany went from the most oppressed, collapsed nation in the world where people burned barrels of German currency just to stay warm, to economic super power over night in the biggest economic miracle in world history.

This is got to be the most sneaky and annoying neonazi myth. War economy, huge debt, near colapse and of course starting a war aren't signs of economic miracle even if it coincides with natural signs of post-depression recovery.

We have this thread daily.

>pic related

Also /r "muh nazi economy"

At least post the real German economic miracle.

...

>Loses 2 world wars
>Ends up controlling Europe anyway

They can't keep getting away with it.

That would be Ludwig Erhard.
Nazis and Keynesians hate him. He discovered one simple trick to conquer Europe without a single shot.

The 'economic miracle' of Nazi Germany is possibly one of the most incorrect and unchallenged myths circulated about it.

Firstly 1938-1945 is already well into the establishment of the Nazi regime in Germany. I'm assuming this is an honest mistake on your part, because to assert that Germany was in any way doing economically well by the end of WW2 is patently absurd.

It was under Stressman, BEFORE the Nazis, that economic recovery began for Germany. Stressman ended the occupation of the Ruhr, Stressman introduced the Rentemark and Stressman renegotiation the terms of their reparations payments under the Dawes plan. The initial recovery from the post-Versaillies depression, then, can be seen as not being ended by the Nazis at all.

Following Stressmans death in 1929, there was another economic crisis in Germany, true - but this was not unique to Germany, but rather the result of the global Great Depression and in no way can be seen as condemning the previous economic policy of the Weimar government. If the NSDAP had been in power following the Beer Hall Putsch, the exact same calamity would have befallen them - they are, in this sense, the benefactor of their own incompetence in having failed to come to power earlier.

This is all, of course, before we have even gotten into the economic policy of Nazi Germany itself. Under Hitler, the Nazis ran up a deficit of around 35 billion Reichsmarks - a completely unsustainable sum that funded this so called 'economic miracle'. The only member of the Nazi administration who could plausibly be called economically competent, Hjalmar Schact, resigned in protest of the utter fiduciary and economic incompetence of Hitler, Göring and Co in their managing of Germany's economy.

1/2

It was almost the Roman economy turned up to 11. It was only possible through conquest, appropriation of foreign resources and the massive and unsustainable public spending on rearmament.

Whereas it took the Romans hundreds of years for the ponzi scheme to collapse, it took Hitlers Germany less than a decade.

Based CDU.

youtube.com/watch?v=6HGlEBbyJO4

Hitler HIMSELF admitted this in the 1937 Hossbach Memorandum - where he personally saw Nazi Germany in a state of imminent and calamitous economic crisis unless it undertook aggressive military 'wars of plunder' to fund it's massive debt to the very wealthy industrial elite they claimed to have been opposing. By 1939, 17 million people were on state welfare even as the official unemployment rate was at 0% - people were more dependent on the state than ever as the vast-majority of jobs were so lowpaying they had to seek governmental assistance to maintain their basic living standards - a fact often conveniently forgotten by 'economic miracle' mythologisers.


This is all of course, without even getting into the ethical and moral issues surrounding forced work-camps, rampant nationalisation and the suppression of personal economic freedom that accompanies a state-controlled economy likes that of Nazi Germany.

This thread appears so often in Veeky Forums that I cannot help but be frustrated, and whilst it probably will do little to change the minds of the indoctrinated I hope this helps to illustrate to the merely curious the utter falsehood of the economic miracle', which often acts at the beginning of the rabbit hole in creating neo-nazis.

To be fair, the Roman ponzi scheme collapsed on its own through running out of suitable neighbors to plunder.

Nazi Germany was compelled to pick a fight with neighbors that were stronger than it was, which is the real cause of the economic devastation as they started blowing shit up and occupying territories. If they had somehow managed to win WW2, it probably would have trundled along for a least a little while longer.

>Miracle

Miracles are nothing but illusions. Or do you also believe the magician when he cuts his assistant in half?

Didn't the Roman economy become relatively self-sustaining once they controlled the entire Mediterranean?

Carthage paying paying back 50 years worth of war dues in 10.

>This thread appears so often in Veeky Forums that I cannot help but be frustrated
Probably because the only explanation given as to why it was not an economic miracle is "it had massive debt that it tried to sweep under the rug with military conquest" which is precisely what every successful country in history and on Earth right now has done. So it's a shit argument.

War was their basic idea from the start. The rest is your typical centrally planned economy with all its flaws.

Not him, but that is not the "only" explanation given. The explanation given is that the recovery was not much of a recovery at all, which is why Nazi Germany is in that shit category of "needing to pass peacetime food rationing", levels of economic turdfloating. Domestic consumption went down, not up, which is normally what happens when you have an actually healthy economy.

>"it had massive debt that it tried to sweep under the rug with military conquest" which is precisely what every successful country in history and on Earth right now has done
This is also just false.

>"it had massive debt that it tried to sweep under the rug with military conquest" which is precisely what every successful country in history and on Earth right now has done.

I'm sorry, when did Canada go on a continental rampage to solve its budget deficit after spending unstainable amounts on military spending? I also must have missed out on the part where the Netherlands, or Switzerland, did this. Or are those countries not successful in your mind?

>which is precisely what every successful country in history and on Earth right now has done.

It would've worked if Nazis won, but they went all in with a weak hand and lost. Why would anyone call it "an economic miracle"?

Canada is an irrelevant country that exists merely through being situated next to the US.

Ehh, not him, but not really. By the time you factor in how you have a dominant ethnicity (Germans) ruling over a large portion of relatively dispossessed people, you essentially create a need for more or less permanent occupation forces, large ones. That in turn means you need to import labor from somewhere. Large scale slavery like that is probably going to cause all sorts of problems.

>muh nazi economic miracle

>The world's 10th largest economy is "irrelevant."

Also, don't think I failed to miss that you neglected the part about Switzerland and the Netherlands. When did they have their rampages? Please enlighten us all. Hell, modern Germany has managed to secure a comfortable position as the world's 4th largest economy without having any more rampages since 1945. So what's going on?

>Germany
loans
>China
capitalism

They propped up the entire economy by turning it into a military/industrial complex and it created countless jobs, which is all fine and dandy if you're at constant war, but if you're not, eventually tanks are gonna be worthless and your economy is gonna collapse. Germany would've been bankrupt by 1950(probably a lot sooner).
By 1939, the German economy was fully committed to rearmament. They were running a HUGE budget deficit, spending something like 50 times more than they were taking in. They kept this secret through some fancy accounting tricks, because they didn't want people to realize the full extent of their rearmament, and also because you'd never want people to know you're running a tremendous budget deficit like that. The Nazis also had a fairly generous welfare state to keep the German people from turning against him. One of Hitler's pet theories about Germany losing World War 1 (alongside "muh jews") was that he felt that shitty conditions for German civilians during the war caused morale to break down, resulting in Germany losing its will to fight. Hitler wanted to make sure that this breakdown of civilian morale wouldn't happen again. All of this is quite expensive, and unsustainable unless you're plundering other countries to pay for all of it.
Of course being at constant war is only useful if you win.
I don't think I would hold up Nazi economic policy as anything other than an example of irresponsible government which almost brought Germany to its knees by 1938. Hjalmar Schacht, who predated the Nazis, was ultimately removed from office for resisting Nazi economic policy insanity. The annexations of Austria and Czechoslovakia were necessary to shore up the faltering Nazi economy.
Maybe you should read The Wages of Destruction before talking about something you clearly don't know anything about.

Daily reminder that the Benelux started the European movement, not the BDR

You had me until the last point on the list in the image. Keynes was right about Versailles. If only the world had listened.

The Union was created to contain Germany but the eternal teuton turned the tables on them.

>pic

Defied the banks? By... borrowing vast amounts from them?

>It was almost the Roman economy turned up to 11.

Nonsense. The Romans made a lot of cash invading other countries but their fundamentals were sold and paid fro thru taxation, the Nazi fundamentals were catastrophic and they paid for their debts by taking out more debts.

Why isn't Nippon going fuedal to industrial within a generation not a miracle?

Not him, but for at least a chunk of Roman history, people living in the city itself paid nothing in taxes because the loot from conquests was enough to pay for all the expenses of government and then some.

>America has collapsed
Uh huh.
China's got a fucking continent worth of resources and people, as does russia, eventually, as we can see with china, export economies lead to a higher living standard, higher living standard = higher wages, higher wages = companies fucking off to get cheap labour = export economy dying, and reverting to a service economy.

America's not anywhere near dead and it's fucking dumb that you think that.

>the Nazi fundamentals were catastrophic and they paid for their debts by taking out more debts.
So like the United States and Europe?

Neither the United States nor Europe have annual spending that is over double annual income.

>America's not anywhere near dead and it's fucking dumb that you think that.

You mean you didn't get the memo that "more brown people living in the country" = "imminent collapse"??????????

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And the efforts of generations of Canadians to carve out their independent space in the british empire and then leave, cordially, but no, yeah, fuck em, they never waged pointless wars of agression so they're like epic faggots.

Read The Third Reich in Power's economic chapters.

Employment went up but real wages went down. Wages were falling in the years before the war and there were wide spread shortages of everyday materials.

People couldn't even buy white flour or butter because animal fats we're all being used by the military and farm production was down from conscription.

Also, corruption was wide spread, and Nazi officials were looting many of their programs.