Why is the Sphinx Water Erosion hypothesis

That's not argument to support such beliefs. It's controversial because it's easy to fall for any delusional unproven bullshit.

because primitives are scared of big statues

That bitch Hawass is not even willing to consider that a megalithic site in asia minor that was abandoned 9k years ago (Göbleki Tepe), could be of any significance for ancient egypt whatsoever.
You know, two cultures with megalithic monuments in the general geographic location.

Different era

yeah, if you believe the egyptologists
it's circular reasoning really

So you think Ancient Egypt was a pre-agricultural society like GT?

Firstly, there will be always people like you who jump to conclusions.
Second, there isn't enough proof to confirm what you said.
Third, he will die and other people will have different interests that may be obstructing the discoveries.

Lastly, they were a pre-agricultural society, as the rest, so their spread is less likely to reach zones like Egypt, even less knowing that pre-agricultural cultures' tech and knowledge is forgotten easily by future generations.

Guys, I love Graham Hancock too. I think his lectures are fascinating. But don't start taking it all as fact. He even says it himself... it's just a theory. None of it is proven, nor is there actually any evidence to support it.

I belief that the nile valley civilization has a longer history than postulated and the monuments like the squinx, the valley temple, the first levels of the "khafre pyramid", the osireiron, as well as the foundation of important temple site reach back into a time before the first dynasty.
We know very little about that time, but an earlier foundation and slow development of Religion, "sciences" & monumental architecture makes IMO much more sense than the current timeline, where suddenly a highly developed civilization appears.
Göbleki Tepe shows that humans around the area experimented with megalithic buildings much earlier than currently accepted.
The egyptians themselves talked about ancient mythical origins, where "the gods ruled".
There is even evidence of early agricultural experiments in upper egypt around 11k BC that was abandoned after strong nile floods.

I don't know what was going on at the nile around the time of the last glacial maximum, but I think there is enough evidence to re evaluate the current time line and try to find out one way or another.

If the professionals cling to their favourite pet theories and dismiss other approaches without serious discussion, we all loose the chance to gain a better understanding of our past.

John Anthony West covered the subject pretty good.

>Firstly, there will be always people like you who jump to conclusions.
There will always be people reevaluating evidence and postulating different theories, which is a good thing.
>Second, there isn't enough proof to confirm what you said.
There is no proof, but conflicting evidence. For definite scientific proof there would need to be studies. To conduct these studies you have to consider evidence that points in a different direction without proof.
Scientific method buddy.

>they were a pre-agricultural society, as the rest, so their spread is less likely to reach zones like Egypt
pre agricultural societies settled the whole globe up remote tiny island in the middle of the pacific.
Suggesting the boulders of Göbleki Tepe would not be able to have contact with the nile valley is nobody-could-reach-sicily tier
>pre-agricultural cultures' tech and knowledge is forgotten easily by future generations.
Pre-agricultural cultures routinely pass their knowledge over centuries and millennia through oral traditions.

>There will always be people reevaluating evidence and postulating different theories, which is a good thing.
That's different that what I said.
>There is no proof, but conflicting evidence. For definite scientific proof there would need to be studies. To conduct these studies you have to consider evidence that points in a different direction without proof.
>Scientific method buddy.
The "conflicting evidence" is actually not "conflicting" evidence as it doesn't disprove the established consensus.
>pre agricultural societies settled the whole globe up remote tiny island in the middle of the pacific.
>Suggesting the boulders of Göbleki Tepe would not be able to have contact with the nile valley is nobody-could-reach-sicily tier
No, you don't get it.
The spread of knowledge of such feats of nomadic populations is low, as all history has demonstrated. Even the clovis culture in America demonstrates how its reach has been so low that the posterior cultures didn't adopt its technology and regressed to an earlier stage of late paleolithic technology.
>oral traditions
As I said before, oral traditions aren't that useful when you have 20 generations of a vague description of how to make some instrument or other useless tool.
That's why the permanent settlements constitute a great difference as the circumstances are the "same" as years pass, and the cyclical duties and activities carry a higher quality knowledge that can be passed easily to the future generations, as they will keep doing the same rituals and cyclical duties.

Not implying that there weren't cyclical and seasonal duties as nomads, but the permanent settlements changed completely the circumstances.

aawsat.com/home/article/178846
the writer of the article is this guy
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zahi_Hawass trust his words at your own peril.
he claims that it was called in the language of the pharaohs (don't know a word for it) berhol or bohol.
bohol is read in arabic bo hol. no translation. be says it was twisted to abo al hawl which means in arabic the father of dread. bo hol means nothing in arabic but abo al hawl does. not sure about his explanation but i'm too lazy and not interested enough to look it up.
couldn't find english sources sorry. and i'm too lazy to find books about it. the first link is from a newspaper.

>EVEN THEN they had a ridiculously accurate calendar based on the movement of Sirius in contrast to the Sun every year, that didn't need tweaking, like ours does.

Say on, please.

Particularly, what do you mean by "did not require tweaking, like ours does?" If htey didn;t have a "tweak" like leap-years, then it was not all that accurate, you can;t keep an accurate solar calendar matched to Earth days without that sort of tweaking. So I assume you are talking about something else..

>That's different that what I said.

>The "conflicting evidence" is actually not "conflicting" evidence as it doesn't disprove the established consensus.
Evidence for water erosion on the squinx is conflicting with established consensus that it is 4,5ky old.
Göbleki Tepe completely BTFO accepted time timelines for development of civilization.
There is plenty of evidence that is conflicting and to open up debate about "established archaeology"
>No, you don't get it.
We don't know who these cultures were, how they lived. They could have been nomadic, they nile valley was especially around the ice age really abundant and could have allowed for a population to stay in a general area and start building more permanent stuff.
You are assuming a lot if you think nomadic tribes are the only possible form of human culture in these times.
10 years ago nobody would belief humans in this era would be able to build something like Göbleki Tepe.
We simply don't know and I think it would be REALLY interesting to see what else we can find.

>oral traditions
They can transmit really precise and comprehensive information. You can see this for example with the precise astronomical knowledge the ancients collected, where they made precise observations and communicated them for many generations.

>Evidence for water erosion on the squinx is conflicting with established consensus that it is 4,5ky old.
>completely BTFO development civ
So you didn't mean the near creation of the Nilus River civilization but the Sphinx monument. I agree with the change of perspective, but I was talking about the direct link of Gobleki Tepe and the Nilus which is completely nonsense for now without lack of evidence.
>10 years ago nobody would belief humans in this era would be able to build something like Göbleki Tepe.
>We simply don't know and I think it would be REALLY interesting to see what else we can find.
...

>They can transmit really precise and comprehensive information. You can see this for example with the precise astronomical knowledge the ancients collected, where they made precise observations and communicated them for many generations.
Except they were stable populations that didn't change their cyclical rituals for numerous generations. If nomads encounter a difficult climate where they need to migrate every several months, and stop using the tools or don't have the same luck and they get killed or forced to migrate to more far away lands, then it's more difficult to preserve ancient oral tradition. That's why the development of crops made possible a more stable static population possible.

>Evidence for water erosion on the squinx is conflicting with established consensus that it is 4,5ky old.

>Analysis of the Sphinx's bedrock by the Getty Conservation Institute (1990-1992) concluded that "Continual salt crystallization, which has a destructive effect on the stone, would explain at least some of the deterioration of the Sphinx."[26][27]

>here suddenly a highly developed civilization appears.

Suddenly?

Agriculture was in Egypt since like 7,000 bc

And the Egyptian civilization exists since at least 3100 bc, its highly developed features such as huge temple, pyramids, irrigation etc, developed in several centuries, there's nothing sudden about it.

>the valley temple

Where's the proof of it being older exactly?

> the osireiron

Proof of it being older than thought?

>as well as the foundation of important temple site

Which one?

> the first levels of the "khafre pyramid"

Proof of it being older than thought?

>Göbleki Tepe shows that humans around the area experimented with megalithic buildings much earlier than currently accepted.

1,000 kilometers to the north is around the area?

Also Gobleki tepe is a few menhirs with nice carvings on them, The Osireiron, the pyramids, and the other Egyptian temples are structures that require much more time and effort and more highly developed technology than gobleki tepe

>The egyptians themselves talked about ancient mythical origins, where "the gods ruled".

Really?

We're gonna take myths at face value?

What is this, Ancient Aliens now?

>So you didn't mean the near creation of the Nilus River civilization but the Sphinx monument
I mean the ancient origins of this civilization and the question when they really started building (semi)permanent settlements and megalithic monuments, as well as developing sophisticated culture.
>the direct link of Gobleki Tepe and the Nilus which is completely nonsense for now without lack of evidence.
Göbleki Tepe suggests that humans in the general area were able to accomplish things that were until then considered impossible in this time.
There is no evidence of a direct link, agreed. But having concrete proof about such feats in such proximity raises the question what populations in the Nile valley were up to at the same time.

>nomads [...] difficult climate [...] more difficult to preserve ancient oral tradition
Again you presume that they were nomadic tribes experiencing hardship of .
The Halfan culture (>20kYBP) already settled for longer periods and the following Qadan culture (15kYBP) cultivated wild grases for their grains.

What if they were living well enough to spend the time of the anual flood carving the Squinx and building the first temples to Osiris and Isis?

Also I see no reason why oral traditions should not be preserved in difficult times. They would be the most important asset to continue the culture when times became better.

>That's why the development of crops made possible a more stable static population possible.
And that is the time, when the first dynasty took off.
It doesn't mean that the foundations of this culture were set at this time.

>semipermanent buildings and megalithic monuments
That's the thing, we actually don't know anything yet. We now know that nomadic cultures built those temporal megalithic settlements.
>And that is the time, when the first dynasty took off.
>It doesn't mean that the foundations of this culture were set at this time.
I mentioned before the Neolithic changed the completely the circumstances.

>halfan culture
>qadan culture
That's interesting, it's more possible for those culture to build the sphinx than Gobleki Tepe, and it's more likely that those cultures spread to Anatolia.
>There is no evidence of a direct link, agreed. But having concrete proof about such feats in such proximity raises the question what populations in the Nile valley were up to at the same time.
I agree. Do you have more info about those Halfan and Qadan cultures?

>That's interesting, it's more possible for those culture to build the sphinx than Gobleki Tepe, and it's more likely that those cultures spread to Anatolia.

It's not, genetically Natufians and Anatolian farmers diverged like in 20,000 bc

Is there a general genetic map and its changes over time online? I know almost nothing about those genetic studies.

>Suddenly?
My point is that it likely took even more time than that and roots more ancient than currently theorized.

>Where's the proof of it being older exactly?
The sand stone blocks of the temple are quarried from the building site of the Squinx. This connects to construction of the temple to the building of the Squinx. These stones also show extensive erosion.
Later the temple was faced with granite. At the time this happened the original temple was already very old, since the granite was fitted to the erosion pattern.
It is likely that Khufu renovated and extended the Giza plateau in 4,5kYBP

In general it seems like the monuments with the biggest stones are also the most ancient. This also the argument for the khafre pyramid, since the first levels are build with massive megaliths, much bigger than everything else used on the other pyramids.
Same for the Osireiron.

>1,000 kilometers to the north is around the area?
Yes, it is more likely than not that they were in contact and exchanged ideas.
It is really not that hard to walk 1k km.

>We're gonna take myths at face value?

You don't think the stories a culture tells about themselves contains valuable information about their past?

And who mentioned ayys?

>That's the thing, we actually don't know anything yet.
Including how they really lived and to what extend they were nomadic.

>I mentioned before the Neolithic changed the completely the circumstances.
And I'm telling you that we currently underestimating the importance of the Mesolithic

>Do you have more info about those Halfan and Qadan cultures?
There is really very little known about them, other than the general timeframe they lived in and that they continuously became more settled and slowly switched to agricultural lifestyles.
Also traces along the nile would have probably disappeared, since there were periods of very heavy flooding following the end of the last ice age.

>You don't think the stories a culture tells about themselves contains valuable information about their past?

Yes but they are not on the same level as historic accounts, they can interpreted in many ways

>These stones also show extensive erosion.

Because they're on water

This.

Wait....so u be sayin....THAT WE WUZUNT???!!!

Most of it?

Such as?

FPBP

Much of it
Mostly who build what and when and how old stuff is

Such as?

The Squinx, the valley temple and the foundation of the khafre pyramid

All were Made by Egyptians and either way it's three out of hundreds of Mountains

>All were Made by Egyptians
Yes but not by Khafre 4,5kYBP
>three out of hundreds of Mountains
what?

anyways, for anyone whos interested:
youtube.com/watch?v=cm4eUPNo3_8

They fear the black warrior.

>Graham Hancock

When will Hawass die?

But user, he is talking out of his ass. A true performance!

Exactly 100%

They dont want it revealed because climate science depends on the fact that there was not a great comet to end the last ice age in 13000 bc and these are interdependent facts. Also academics are skeptical but for a good reason but watch out this theory still has a chance if they can get a revelation in their comet samples then well know there were advanced ancient civilizations and the ancient aliens get it all wrong it actually ancient humans that passed down memories of the great death and destruction in the fire of N.A. and the melting of the ice and this all happened about 13000 bc and Plato knew and said some redpilled stuff
Here is a map before the ice age ended and all north american large mammels die as a result but yeah do your own research its some crazy possibilities

The old priests of Sais told Solon that there were many previous civilizations periodically destroyed by floods or scorched by radiation from the sky.

jesus fuck nigger learn some punctuation.

Degradation of the stone due to salt crystallization has a distinctive pattern. It is more like a horizontal patchy type of erosion rather than the vertical patterns of erosion evident in erosion caused by water. The sphinx shows evidence of water erosion caused by rain fall.

>What?

Egyptians Made hundreds of monuments, even if your wacko theory were true (it's Not), The fact that someone else built The foundations of like 2 monuments wouldn't mean Egyptologists based everything They say on mostly lies

>even if your wacko theory were true (it's Not)
You triggered? :^)

Or it means that the climate was different back then.

>Graham Hancock