Who were the Magyars and how did they evolve into the modern Hungarian people?

>Originating from far off Siberia
Urals actually.

Well, they kinda did. Magyars had a very hierarchic society based on nomadic pastoralism and nomadic warfare. The small warrior class ruled over many people including Magyars and Slavs. When Otto beat them at Lechfeld he erased most of the warrior noble class. The mainly civilian remains settled into the local population, but their language stayed dominant.
Irony, 300 years later Hungarians got proper fucked by steppe niggers themselves.

Kind of unrelated to what I posted don't you think

Depends, if you think genetics is everything that matters, maybe, if you are interested in the details of history and who did what, then no, it is highly relevant.
Saying the Magyars where not important just because they left not much of a genetic trace is just stupid when they left a huge cultural impact.

magyars on their way to europe assimilated a lot of indo-iranian folk, they entered panonian basin when the frankish empire destroyed samo's empire, then they took power over the remaining panonian slavs.

some time later, 50% of hungarian population got genocided by the mongols. the vacuum was filled with german and slavic colonists, mostly german though.

so modern hungarian isn't really a "mongol, turanist steppe warrior" anymore.

like pointed out, they are no different than their slavic and german neighbours in terms of genetics.

Well, genetics and culture. Modern Hungarian culture is fully Christian and central European, no different from Czech, Slovak or Austrian culture. If you think language is the only thing that makes people then okay.
>Saying the Magyars where not important
I never said that. I said modern Hungarians are not the descendants of ancient Magyars, which holds true.

>in terms of genetics.
Yes, but interestingly enough, they speak some finno-ugric gibberish instead of something Indo-European. I'd say that is quite some impact.

What does the blue one represent?

of course. culture and language is more important than genetics.

I2, a paleo-European haplogroup. Related to Scandinavian I1 and most common in the Balkans.

I'm not saying language is the only thing that makes people. but it is a very important part of culture and changing an entire region to some Uralic language for good is quite a bit of impact.
Of course their society collapsed after 955, but between their arrival in 899 and their downfall they completely changed Hungary. And that matters somewhat more than genetics.

There is far more to culture than just language though.

Also their raids devastated and depopulated large regions all over Europe. Massive fortifications (for the time period) where built to withstand them. Also, knights in shining armor where recruited and a European horse warrior class was born.

Yes, society turned back to a Slavic agricultural lifestyle and was Christianized. Still cool that for around 90 years they where Flagellum Dei and full scale steppe niggered all of Europe. Also, Ugric language must be a huge pain in the ass in Europe.

It sort of is, but noblemen and officials in Hungary used Latin as an official language until the 19th century.

Hasn't it been proven that they're not genetically related to other uralic peoples? Implying that at some point they just picked up the language when migrating through those peoples

You have that proof in this very thread.

Afaik their ethogenesis is unclear for now, only that the original language is from trans-Ural Siberia. Everything else is speculation.

Yeah, sure.

See Or pic related.

i somehow doubt it. western poles simply cannot cluster with germans, they would cluster with russians instead.

Hows that a proof for the ethogenesis of Magyars or the travle of the language/culture from Siberia to modern day Hungary?
Like a couple thousand years ago, the Ugric people started to migrate, likely mixed with everybody on the way, became nomads, started venturing west, mixed with everybody on the way, stayed there for a couple centuries, went south west, mied with everybody on the way and stayed for some more centuries, then ventured west again, mixed with everybody around, stayed some more centuries and then finally a very small group of people arrived in Hungary and made a huge impact.
Now who does your fucking gene chart explain who the Magyars really were and where and when they really developed.
P.S. Uralic admixture in modern Hungarians is around 4.4% which is low, but higher than in any other group in the region.

Do you understand what the map is actually showing or not? It's not "western Poles", it's simply Polish markers from a FST spectrum projected on a map.

>P.S. Uralic admixture in modern Hungarians is around 4.4% which is low, but higher than in any other group in the region.
I'd need a source on that.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4209567/
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4209567/figure/F3/
Just for my understanding, why are you guys so fascinated by genetics when the example of the Hungarians makes it pretty clear that history is much more than that?

Why are Hungarians so swarthy? I've been both to Croatia and Hungary, and Hungarians were the more tanned ones. I was expecting the opposite.

Would you refer to your stepfather as your father?
>ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4209567/figure/F3/
That's not Uralic, that's Northeast Asian. The Yakuts are a Turkic group.

You probably encountered Gypsies.

If the question is who were the magyars as in where did they come from, genetics seem like a pretty good source for clues

Again, no one knows what mixed into they Magyars during their 1000 year travel. We only know that the initial language was Ugric and that they came into contact with lots of different people. Also due to their society it is entire possible that only a small elite of unknown genetic composition transported the culture and language to the next population mixed in and this happened again and again. It is well possible that the Magyars that took Hungary where genetically verry different from the Guys that started migrating a thousand years earlier.
By the way none of those guys is your father or your stepfather, they are like 50 generations away.

hmm, I'm not seeing much genetic difference

I think what must have happened is they found what was a paradise for steppe peoples in the Hungarian steppe surrounded by simple slav hill folk in the Carpathians who proved to be impressionable and obedient servants who adopted Magyar language and customs since they lacked a real culture of their own. After the Germanic onslaught the elite Magyars died in battle leaving the Slavs to cosplay as their old masters.

>However the Slavs being simple people with no real culture to speak of adopted their language and customs
You should really stop posting.

you're right, it is unlikely that the slavs could have defeated the magyars, I noticed my error and altered my theory

>If the question is who were the magyars as in where did they come from, genetics seem like a pretty good source for clues
Especially when the genetics do not match the language at all....
Like apparently culture and language of people change and the guys that finally invaded Hungary might as well have mainly been Goths and Avars who had been magyarized by people that might have been themselves magyarized centuries earlier. Remember, there was a 1000 years with centuries of sedentary lifestyle inbetween migration periods.

>steppe peoples
Steppe people, maybe, we know they spoke an Ugric language, we don't know if that population was of Uralic origin as languages travel population borders.

this, likely Magyar migration and cultural creation was more bucket chain of people who influenced each others and transfered their culture and language to the next population than just some steppe niggers riding west in one go.

Slavs hiding in the forest were a fortress that could not be conquered.
The only reason Magyars established dominance over Pannonian basin is because Samo's Empire was destroyed by Franks, it shattered Slavic forces and they never recovered from it.

Samo's Empire was boss, though again it is the same trend of Slavs following a strange foreign "sorceror" who just seems to know better than them about things, how to build a bridge, how much grain they can trade while still having enough until next harvest, how to read, etc..

You can put that theory to work with every country in Europe.

>hill folk in the Carpathians
Try plains folk in the Pannonian basin.

There's a 300 year gap between Samo's empire and Magyar invasion, there were other Slavic kingdoms/polities during that time. Nitravia and Moravia for example.

Yes, but Moravia was not in Panonian Basin and Nitra was pretty much irrelevant.

Nitravia was conquered and annexed by Moravia.

>why are you guys so fascinated by genetics when the example of the Hungarians makes it pretty clear that history is much more than that?

I was just curious why Hungarians look so generically European when their ancestors came from Central Asia.

>Urals are central Asia
Why are people ITT so stupid

Because we don't know if their ancestors came from Asia. We only know that their ancestors spoke a ugric language. They might have picked it up somewhere else.

2bh the actual uralic and siberian ugrics do look like fucking mongols, khanty and mansi etc

Being steppeniggers at first, they mixed with a lot of folks, considering that the Scythian Steppe's ancient limits were China on one side and the Carpathians on the other. Why are they blonde(ridiculously blonde and swarthy even considering the area)? They heavily mixed with the Pannonian Slavs, the Moravians, Croatians, Germans and probably with proto-Romanians. The one place where you can still find Hungarians with slightly chinky eyes? Szekelyfold, in the center of Romania, where the Szekely population didn't mix with other peoples all that much, except some Romanians and Germans.

The Magyars were a confederation of tribes and only by the virtue of surviving Lechfeld and not dissolving like so many before them do they still exist. The various linguistic or genetic elements that might puzzle us can be easily explained by the fact that they were not a linguistic or genetic unit.

Not a lot of trees in the Pannonian Plains tho.

T. steppenigger/gyppo hybrid that lives there