Why did the Spartan population decrease so rapidly?

>There is literally nothing about the conditions of ancient Sparta that is even remotely close to Feminism

Except for the fact that their inheritance laws led to a tiny group of ultra wealthy women most taking control of the majority of the property, as well as control over the government through their numerous bribes and loans, as well as (coming from yourself) leading to the total destruction of Sparta itself as a result of their new power, which no other Greek city state had, which led to them not seeking a husband and reproducing.

Do you really see no comparisons to modern feminism in there?

But only if you abstract the ideas of modern feminism and apply them to Sparta. But this would not have been how Spartan women themselves would have viewed themselves. Sisterhood, women's rights etc., things which are specific to feminism, which in itself is specific in that it can happen only in relation to capitalism, and not before.

Having said that, some new piece of evidence might arise to shed light on ancient feminism, but I doubt it. It's not just that it was not recorded, it's that the struggle of women was literally not something which could have been thought.

Their women LARPed as men, this has obvious causality to natality. Proto-Xfit women are sterilizing themselves for their peak fertility ages.

>Spartans were already a minority within their own state even during their most eminent years
>Spartans were racialists and eugenics driven - ie Spartan children with noticeable defects or anything off about them were killed
>war, war, war
>power creeped more easily to women and thus less women reproduced as they were generally wealthy, educated and held high positions in Spartan society
>Low birth rates except for the helots
>Traditional hoplite warfare became outclassed by pikemen phalangites
>Spartan males could lose citizenship and be exiled

Sparta also degenerated when it became wealthy after winning the pelopennese war against Athens.

where my Historia Civilis boys at

How did it degenerate? Genuinely curious I'm not educated on that part of their history, and its probably the most important time period for this question.

when they stopped being the big dogs of Greece the slaves of their slave economy made sure they got reduced as pay-back for the whole slave thing

>Persian Wars
>First Peloponnesian War
>The Actual Peloponnesian War
>Corinthian War
>only one recorded instance of a foreigner being made into a Spartan, a seer and his brother
>no welfare state that gave incentives for marrying women from your poli like in Athens
>had a small population to begin with
It just wasn't a sustainable system.

Wars always advance the place of women in society because of the male vacuums at home become theirs. Women will vote their men into war with white feathers.

Because they were pussywhipped losers who got more cucked by their beastly women as the years went on.
Sparta is massively overrated.

Hi Ray :3c

Then why does Athens' most famous case of a woman being legislated against occur directly after the Peloponnesian War?
data.perseus.org/citations/urn:cts:greekLit:tlg0014.tlg059.perseus-eng1:1
Surely if war allowed them to advance their place in society, the mistress of a powerful Athenian wouldn't be subject to being publicly accused of being a danger to the city's moral fabric?

This thread reeks of psuedo-historians, can someone post some ancient sources backing up the claim that the Spartans were as pussy whipped as you believe?

Ted, Dougal, et al., "What Villagers Hear: Oral Transmission of Prejudice Narratives in Irish Communities," Craggy Island Press 3, no. 1 (March 1998): 11:52.

Like a boulder in the ocean, Sparta was stable and powerful, but eroded away over time.

This. Everything with a beginning has an end.

More specifically: endless warfare, economic developments, social strife, and a changing world. It was a good run, though; Sparta remained an independent and noteworthy power down to the end of the 3rd century. Some might even count Nabis and say the very beginning of the 2nd century.

How long could it have lasted with non-retarded inheritance laws? They had probably the most based and conservative governmental system in western history at least, besides giving the cunts property.

Not very long. Sparta was a response to its time, and was designed to excel in an environment were wars were short and common. It was ill suited to fighting prolonged slogging matches of the kind that became more common towards the turn of the millennium.

Spartans were infamous for being super corruptible. Spartan society had no money, so when individual Spartiates came into contact with large sums of money and somewhere to spend it, they went Russian oligarch-levels of apeshit over it. Now after the Peloponnesian Wars, Sparta took over administering Athens' empire and kept all the revenues for themselves, which was a fucking lot of money.

>Spartan society had no money
Someone should take you out back and put you out of your misery

>It was ill suited to fighting prolonged slogging matches of the kind that became more common towards the turn of the millennium.

>wins the longest war in Greek history
>loses to Thebes and Corinth in a war of pitched battles where Sparta's hoplites were at their best

Classical Sparta used their own currency of iron-bars that wasn't really convertible into actual coins in somewhere like Athens or Corinth. For all intents and purposes the Spartans didn't have "real" Greek money.

>Classical Sparta used their own currency of iron-bars
You mean, they used it like...money?

Don't try and be smart-ass about this. If you and your buddies trade bottle caps for sexual favor that doesn't mean they have any monetary value. The currency used by the Spartans was the same, they didn't have gold reserves backing them like paper money and they weren't worth their weight in silver like Athenian coins. They were just tokens used for exchange within Sparta and were useless elsewhere.

>Don't try and be smart-ass about this. If you and your buddies trade bottle caps for sexual favor that doesn't mean they have any monetary value.
You're the only one being a smart-ass, if my buddy and his buddy and then everyone else living in my country decides to use bottle caps as currency and regulates them, their issue and their worth, then its fucking money.

>they weren't worth their weight in silver like Athenian coins
And?

>They were just tokens used for exchange within Sparta and were useless elsewhere.
Now know that money is only money when someone else decides its money and not the society that uses it as money.

>They were just tokens used for exchange
That's what currency literally is, especially modern currency that's backed by shit all.

>tiny group of ultra wealthy women most taking control of the majority of the property

35% of property owners were women. It was hardly a majority. How exactly did this compare badly to feudal societies where the vast majority of property was owned by >10% of the male population? Spartans absolutely glorified childbirth for women, hardly a feminist principle.

Sparta fucked their population through excessive eugenics over actual economic prosperity, population growth and efficient logistics that help conquest. They loved the military ideal but weren't that great at war.

>That's what currency literally is, especially modern currency that's backed by shit all.

Gee, listen to this Ron Paul wannabe faggot. What do you think gives gold and silver their value, retard? Subjective valuation and exchange, the exact fucking same thing as paper money.

Money doesn't need to be backed by anything you economically illiterate retard.

Yes, you retard, that's why iron bars are literally money when used as such.

The argument isn't that they aren't money you dumb amerilard the argument is that said money was worthless outside of Sparta itself, unlike Athenian coins which you could exchange in Persia and be assured of their value, as it was backed by something considered just as valuable

>The argument isn't that they aren't money you dumb amerilard the argument is that said money was worthless outside of Sparta itself,
Oh really? Wait, let me quote from >Spartan society had no money
Whoops, guess you're wrong.

Not him, but the fucking point is, you autist, that Spartans were easy to bribe because they didn't use the same currency as the rest of the Greeks and when they had the chance to get some real dosh they sold their city for it.

>the argument isn't my argument
>the point is not the point

That's me.

The whole Spartan eugenics thing was probably a meme. There was no physical evidence found of them killing babies. The only skeletons they found in the chasm where they were supposedly throwing them in were those of adults and likely criminals.

Dying in war. Segregation of the sexes. Exclusivity of citizenship.