How serious are modern neo-pagan movements? Are they seriously trying to revive the dead religions of the past...

Personally I'd wait at least three generations before I take them seriously. The first and second generations are usually just choosing to adopt a new religion to be different or rebellious from the norm. After three generations I'd be happy to see if the new generation of neo-pagans are honestly fauthful or just wanting to feel special.

I think a lot of them teach their children that the Gods are more of a spiritual thing, or that the Gods and the stories about them are moral/educational lessons. If they're just teaching their kids this I wouldn't say they are actually faithful either. I could do the same by raising my children to be irreligious and reading biblical stories and norse sagas to them as moral lessons. That wouldn't make them pagans or christians/jews in the same way children raised on fairy tales don't believe in a fairy god mother spirit Goddess.

So I'd wait 3 generations and if after that point I see children and adults that honestly believe their pagan Gods are real in the same way religious people of other faiths see their Gods as real. THEN I'll accept them as an actual religion and not as a bunch of weirdoes playing dress up in the forest.

I'd also like to see unified religious cultural practices and traditions for each faith that are upheld by people in each group but I'm willing to wait longer for that.

Sorry, I didn't think this was /b/. Can you explain your objection any better than a reaction meme?

your post was laughable

Its not /x/ either you silly billy, don't start talking about your conversations with Gods and demons and think people will take you seriously.

Yes, you indicated that with your meme. Now could you explain which parts, and why? Or are you just shitposting? Should I expect you to be posting bananas and walking the dinosaur now?

Are you aware that Jung used to take long walks in the forest with a demon, with whom he discussed the elements which became his model of psychology? These entities are archetypal personality fragments built into the structure of the human brain. When you have a dream, all the characters in your dream are parts of yourself, but parts which are also parts of others: ie/ archetypes. These entities are extremely powerful and very real, but don't exist external to ourselves. It's psychology, not religion.

YOU FOOL, DO YOU NOT KNOW THAT CAPITALISM HAS EXISTED SINCE THE BIG BANG?

I was at work just today, just a few hours ago, and I was wondering something very similar about Northern Europe today. How is paganism done there, these days? How "authentic" is it? Are there nazis?

You sound like an interesting person.
Tell me more, how is talking to these entities?

>wrongbadreligousbeliefs
As an atheist who just respect the beliefs of others I find that ironic how abrahamicfags are being so fedora about people believing in other things than them.

Unironic atheist here too, honestly most of these people are just retarded hipsters but the ones that are legitimate are chill as fuck really

The big bang itself happened because of capitalism. Capitalism comes before the big bang.

It gives them something to do on the weekend, who cares?

The thing is that nobody gets like this over actual polytheists like Hindus or some Buddhists. They have historical continuity. The idea is that no god would let themselves be forgotten for centuries

yes we will bring europe back where it should be

There's tribes in Russia that practice native Finnish paganism (or, rather, their tribal variant of it). It's the religion that they've been practicing for as long as they've existed, and they continue to practice it. When Napoleon invaded Russia they sacrificed some horses to the gods of winter and war to aid the Czar's forces. There's less than a million of the people in this tribes however so it's definitely a minority religion.

Finnish Pagans follow the traditional practices that they still have written down or remember and they fill the gaps with stuff from their eastern kin. There aren't a whole lot of "genuine" pagans but there are a handful left.

Baltic Pagans are pretty much in the same boat as Finns. There's not many "genuine" pagans however.

Both Finnish and Baltic pagans are in the same boat as all Europeans: Christianization ended the de jure worship of the native gods even though it didn't stop de facto recognition of and interaction with them (See: The Twelve Olympians all across Europe).

As for Indo-European paganism in Europe, yeah, nah, there's none of it that survived Christianization alive. There's plenty of material to revive from but anyone who says that they have a living connection that didn't get wiped out by Christianity is full of shit.
>Are there nazis?
Plenty of groups in European governments and the EU want to vehemently stamp out European paganism because it makes it harder to control people for the same reason nationalism does so pagans often get lumped into the broader category of "Nazis" that includes people like Ron Paul, Thomas Jefferson, and Winston Churchill. This leads to Pagans often embracing National Socialism because, hey, they're getting shit on for practicing the native traditions of their people, might as well become as extreme as possible because if it were up to the people that label them Nazis they would all be dead in a ditch and every trace of Thor would be wiped out.

>Are there nazis?
There's an overlap, but I don't think it's fair to compare people legitimately trying to revive what they see as their ancient faith to LARPers using the symbols to espouse modern political theories

Where are the best places to find these remaining sources? I know there's no hope for celtic or true norse pagan revival, but there must be enough for Greek, Roman, or maybe Baltic. The best I have are the vedas.

Eastern European paganism seems better than any sort of American or western European Neo-Paganism.

Slavic/Lithuanian pagans are moving into the woods to live the comfy offgrid lifestyle and making children. American pagans are men's clubs that party, cut themselves and dress up while never actually going tribal(settling down and making families)

The gods of Europe didn't let themselves be forgotten. No one forgot about Thor and Zeus. Hell, Gemistus Pletho (The guy who reintroduced Plato to Western Europe) was a Byzantine scholar who, up until his death, advocated reconverting the Byzantine Empire back to Dodekatheism. He was the teacher (and later enemy) of the Orthodox Patriarch who would go on to declare Mehmet the Conqueror to be the defender of Christianity and the ideal Christian.

The question is whether or not the gods of Europe would let their followers get shat on that badly. If we look at the myths, the answer is "Yes".

As to whether the Pagans actually "Believe"? Yeah, some do. Some are "le spiritual jungian archetypes". Some just want people to talk about the Twelve Olympians more. Some do it out of ethno-nationalism. It's a very diverse group of people.

>youtube.com/watch?v=zEwOxdAAjYE
>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavic_Native_Faith

youtube.com/watch?v=SBpNu4_TP9w

These Greeks seem serious enough about it.

>Norse
The Eddas and the Sagas. There's plenty. Enough to revive? I personally think "revival" is the wrong word for Germanic Paganism. Reconstruction is more apt; there's tons of gaps to fill in and no sources saying how to fill them.

>Celtic
You're shit out of luck.

>Greco-Roman
There's TONS of sources. It's Greek and Roman mythology my dude. Hesiod, Homer, Cicero, Caesar, and on and on and on. Greco-Roman religion can truly be revived. Will it be Frankenstein's monster in comparison to what it was 2,000 years ago? Absolutely, but there's more than enough to patch together a working religion. Give it a few centuries to come up with some traditions and apologetics and the idea of someone not being "genuine" in their worship of Zeus would be ridiculous.

if you think that any of pagan religions outside of maaaaybe nordic shit have enough of content to practice them and have some sort of canon you're delusional retard

i meant to say european pagan religions
dont know about stuff outside of europe

Why not Greece?

>implying you can't use Vedic scripture, Neo-Platonist philosophy and the few European Pagan sources to revive be it Norse, Greco-Roman or Slavic paganism

Kek, the majority of catholic festivities are pagan ones, you just need to change god

platonism is pagan

It wqsn't just the mythology, but also the specific ceremonies. Do we still have those ceremonies recorded?

are thor's hammer pendants really pagan symbols? why did they start appearing around the same time christianty was introduced to the region? i don't buy the explanation on wikipedia that they "may have come into fashion in defiance of the square amulets worn by newly converted Christians". if that was the case, why not just continue to wear the hercules club pendants instead of coming up with a new design that looked more similar to the christian cross?

You mean things like putting tree into the house as a symbol for the world tree on the winter solstice, getting eggs gifted from hares at the spring equinox for returning fertility, making a really big fire at the summer solstice and a big feast as gratitude for harvest in autumn?

It depends, the Eastern European neo-pagans are very serious about it, as they consider it part of their heritage. American paganism is often overlapping with wiccanism and is filled with queers, trannies and other degenerates who have an intense hatred for any sort of etnic factor within the religion.

Which gods, the ones whose stories were only preserved by Catholic monks, who likely put a twist on the whole mythology?

Or the meme Celtic reconstructions that are based on texts by Romans talking shit about them?

The only pagan faith that seems to have been preserved in Europe for the most part is in Finland, everything else is a literal dead meme propagated by edgy teens who hate their Christian parents.

Plenty of them are likely serious about it, but barring some discovery that gives us near-perfect insight into how ancient europeans practiced their religions they won't be reviving anything, only making new religion.

In Western Europe - anywhere from not-serious to almost-serious
In Northern and Eastern Europe - half-serious or fully-serious.

Udmurts have an almost unbroken line to Paganism (never fully converted).
Estonians and Latvians were poorly converted, many traditions were destroyed, but e.g Setos still made statues of Peko and sacrificed to him up to the 1930s.
The biggest blow in Estonia and Latvia was the Moravian Church in the late 18th century, which started destroying holy sites. They introduced wide-spread literacy, though.

About Pagan holdouts, I remember something about the Basque not being fully converted until the early Middle Ages. Does anyone know more?

They define us, quite literally: our personalities are constructed from mixtures of these "primary colour" archetypal entities. So they have the same range of personalities as people, some are nice, some are scary, some are flirty, some are arrogant, some are helpful, some are deceitful. What's interesting is these entities seem to be aware of what they are when you talk to them.

Reminder that neo-pagans are a cancer funded by zion to disrupt the west.

Any website about that? I kinda like that stuff even I don't really believe in it.

>Jews would fund and support an entity that in many cases opposes the Christian teachings of tolerance and respect for the non-faithful
What exactly do they gain here?

- Man and his Symbols, by Carl Jung
- Hero with a Thousand Faces, by Joseph Campbell
- Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind, by Julian Jaynes

That's a good place to start to understand archetypal psychology and what's really going on under the hood.

As for belief, this isn't religion; it's not something which requires faith. You can verify it for yourself using Jungian active imagination. Jung researched many different religious, shamanic, and mystic traditions, looking for commonalities so he could figure out what was actually effective and what was just window dressing to increase suggestibility. There are exercises anyone can do which will allow you to communicate with these entities.

Just play Persona

If they disrupt the west they can slowly corrupt the people and have them intermix with other "pagans" with sodomy and turn it into a shit storm.

>By encouraging Eurocentric religions they're encouraging race mixing
That's a fucking retarded statement

If you fall for the pagan meme you fall for the race mixing meme.
Fuck off (((pagan)))

That doesn't even make sense when most inter-racial marriages are presided over by a minister of some official church and not a meme religion

No, it does. If you literally are falling for the zionist meme of (((paganism))) that hasn't removed jews, why the fuck wouldn't they mix blood?

Are you fucking insane?

I was unaware that pagans were communists.

Ignore him. He's a /pol/fugee.

>So I'd wait 3 generations and if after that point I see children and adults that honestly believe their pagan Gods are real in the same way religious people of other faiths see their Gods as real. THEN I'll accept them as an actual religion and not as a bunch of weirdoes playing dress up in the forest.
Come to Boston - got tons of third, fourth, and fifth generation pagans out here.

Still LARPers (I mean, have you ever been to Starlight?) In the grand scheme of things though, we're all LARPers.

From my extremely limited studies (yes I spent a half-semester studying Paganism) there's a mixture of both actually. Some of the participants are full on WE'Z ANCIENT PAGANS who maintain that the old way never went away, but just was kept secret untill recently while others like the rituals and spectacles of it and simply view the gods as jungian archetypes.

>pagans
>approving of race mixing
Perhaps you have not met the Asatru pagans (especially these days, Aryan Brotherhood anyone?).

I mean, seriously, if any religion approves of race mixing, it's the Christians - literally appropriating a Judaic religion and expanding it to cover their own race.

Neo-paganism a tool of the jewish elites to try to disrupt the western world.

Paganism stretches back to the occultism movements in the 19th century.

Isn't everything a tool of the Jewish elites according to you?

Don't talk shit about things you don't understand. Atleast do the minimum of effort and google Jung.

>tfw scandi watching US spic-looking mongrels "honor their ancestors" with norse pagan LARPs

Stick to marvel comics you fucks.

Please, I used to volunteer for CUUPS - aka. the pagan legal defense fund. That's gotta be the only group of lawyers I've ever seen without a single Jew in it.

Of course. And every antisemite is a plant designed to make antisemitism look bad.

>trying to revive ritual-based religions by turning them into a faith-based religion.
It's nothing more than a fashion statement, which is fine but it will never really be a true religion. The only future it has is want material for trad-nationalists and liberals tripping on romantic bullshit, and even then they would only practice it in a cultural sense.

youtube.com/watch?v=leK2WkAHLYk

Religious and mystical experiences are rooted in human biological processes, their symbolism and imagery are likewise determined by neural structures that can be made unique to a set of people and their descendants through time.

Truly dead religions cannot be recreated.

they are tremendous faggots.
youtube.com/watch?v=5LgCuvb79eQ

If we'd get some academics and historians together with the right amounts of autism and zealous nativism that is necessary to do something like this+some kind of cultural pressure that involves people dying for their beliefs then we might get something together here.

>people were doing these ceremonies for hundreds of years before capitalism

No, fair maidens dancing in white robes a gay effortless handholding dance around a fire while some hippiefaggot bangs a drum was probably not how they did it as every fuckshittribe put a bit more effort then that into even their most primitive ceremonies.
youtube.com/watch?v=-84kUNuvlBg

it's mostly just larping shit. there are people who do study pre-christian rites and religion of europe academically following the antiquarian revivals of the 19th/20th century. but nah there's really no continuity with these modern larp groups.

>could choose chad God that is the incarnation of everything that's good and also omnipotent and the creator of everything
>choose faggot beta godlets instead that aren't even omnipotent and mostly act like petty dicks
What did neo-pagan memers mean by this?

>Choosing the lazy Mary Sue concocted by Jews when you could pick mythology based on millennia if human development and traditions.

Hmm, I wonder.

this. what does choosing to dance around a pole and praise Wodan on the equinox have to do with economics?

prolly never heard of chinese gods.

I definitely don't know any chinese gods.
Serious question though: is Confucianism considered a religion or just a philosophy?

>About Pagan holdouts
A Norwegian king conducting a crusade into Sweden in the 12th century which was some time after they had "officially" converted.

Church officials demolished a Stave church in Sweden in 1826 after they found out people were performing pagan rites there which seems to be something the church had been battling against at the site for hundreds of years.
>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skaga_stave_church

Those are the ones that comes to mind but there were probably many more holdouts and much greater ones. If I recall there was also an effort to convert the peoples in the Alps in the 11th century which is many hundreds of years after they are supposed to have converted.

You had better be a hot chick