s there any more overrated military unit in history than the Waffen SS? They were terrible in combat, and were meant to be Germany's elite troops. They performed worse than the regular Wehrmacht by far, and all they ever managed to do was commit atrocities that pissed off the locals into the arms of the partisans.
>3rd SS Division >Fight in France >Everyone else is kicking France's ass, and the 3rd SS division's greatest contribution was machine gunning 97 British POWs >Lose 300 officers in the campaign >Invade Soviet Union >Everyone else is kicking the Red Army's ass all the way to Moscow >3rd SS division gets encircled in Demyansk and lose 80% of their men
How about the 36th Waffen Grenadiers? Dirlewanger Brigade >Biggest contribution to the war was a massacre of Polish women, children, doctors and babies in Wola >Have a 315% casualty rate fighting Polish partisans, not even a real army >The entire unit is replaced by reinforcements 3 fucking times fighting the Polish partisans
>The war in the Soviet Union proceeded well at first, but the cost to the Waffen-SS was extreme: by late October the Leibstandarte was at half strength due to enemy action and dysentery that swept through the ranks.[69] >Das Reich lost 60% of its strength and was still to take part in the Battle of Moscow. The unit was decimated in the following Soviet offensive. > The Der Führer Regiment was reduced to 35 men out of the 2,000 that had started the campaign in June.[69] > Altogether, the Waffen-SS had suffered 43,000 casualties.[69]
>During Manstein's counteroffensive, the SS Panzer Corps, without support from the Luftwaffe or neighbouring German formations, broke through the Soviet line and advanced on Kharkov.[86] Despite orders to encircle Kharkov from the north, the SS Panzer Corps directly attacked in the Third Battle of Kharkov on 11 March.[87] >The German offensive cost the Red Army an estimated 70,000 casualties but the house-to-house fighting in Kharkov was particularly bloody for the SS Panzer Corps, which lost approximately 44% of its strength by the time operations ended in late March.[88]
Hunter Russell
Stormcucks and Wehraboo reenactors BTFO?
Henry Lewis
Nice bolsheboo bait
Dirlewanger was never part of the SS you fucking idiot btw (the division was only formed from random remnants shortly before they were smashed in the Halle cauldron), they reported directly to Himmler and Kaminski's slavs (who along with him perpetrated most of the actual war crimes and were later lumped in as "the germans" by post-war allied propaganda) were tried and many of them executed by the SS judge Konrad Morgen in accordance with german field law.
Also what those slavic axis soldiers did pales in comparison to any of the atrocities perpetrated by soviets or polacks against german citizens by far throughout the war
David Ward
if you meant to cite this as a positive result, a 25% loss of personel usually means the unit is depleted, a 44% loss means its destroyed
these are the actions why "divisions" operated less than 10 armor and battalions of pz. grenadiers with 50 ppl
wasteful,, untoughtful and ignoring direct orders for particulary nothing
Colton James
>>Have a 315% casualty rate fighting Polish partisans, not even a real army jesus how
Asher Bailey
Even pissraeli historians openly admit that the Waffen SS was the most formidable military unit in history
But keep deluding yourself with ur own bait lmao
Jackson Robinson
>it was the bestest unit ever in history.
Ayden Phillips
Well yeah I assume early to mid war they were better than the average Red Army unit because of better equipment. That's not really saying much if you don't have the number to back it up. The beginning of Operation Barbarossa was like shooting slavs in a gulag. They still somehow found a way to fuck up bad.
Chase Green
educate yourself retard
Julian Gomez
Is this bait? Kaminski was executed for stealing shit, not for committing atrocities, you stormfag liar.
William Gutierrez
>Bolsheboo The only thing I hate more than Nazis are Commies. But the Red Army doesn't have a reputation as being elite and competent super soldiers like the Waffen SS does. >positive result Nah I didn't have any more characters left to post that bit.
Henry Campbell
You're a classic example of reactionary revisionist. The common notion is that the SS were an elite fighting group of soldiers. This extend true to only some SS formations but is completely false in regards to others. So, the retard you are, you go the complete opposite way and pretend the SS were shit.
Ryan Myers
>Dirlewanger was never part of the SS you fucking idiot Lmao what? >Oskar Dirlewanger (26 September 1895 – 7 June 1945) was a German military officer (SS-Oberführer) who served as the founder and commander of the infamous Nazi SS penal unit "Dirlewanger" during World War II. >At the beginning of World War II, Dirlewanger volunteered for the Waffen-SS and received the rank of Obersturmführer. He eventually became the commander of the so-called Dirlewanger Brigade (at first designated as a battalion, later expanded to a regiment and a brigade, and eventually a division), composed originally of a small group of former poachers along with soldiers of a more conventional background.
Hudson James
Good thing i'm not a historian and just a shitposter on a mongolian antisemitic aktion board
Bentley Smith
>Is there any more overrated military unit in history than the Waffen SS?
Unironically USSOCOM given how routinely they fuck up
>crash helicopters into each other in Iran >crash helicopters into each other again in Grenada >head of Seal Team Six winds up in prison for fraud >Navy SEAL team nearly wiped out by a bunch of Panamanians who they probably could've just bribed with some tequila and cocaine >ODA 525 on a SCUD hunt gets busted by a bunch of 12 year old Iraqi school girls and didn't even bother to rape them >DUDE LET'S FLY AN AC-130 OVER AL-KHAFJI IN DAYLIGHT LMAO >Black Hawk Down.jpg >calling in an airstrike on Hamid Karzai >Mazar-i-Sharif POW massacre bungalo >failing to get bin Laden when he was holed up in a cave in Tora Bora >shooting up multiple weddings >Operation Anaconda >all of the Iraq War >Operation Red Wings >wrecking a billion dollar helicopter during the raid to kill bin Laden >SEALs literally racing each other to kill bin Laden first so they can get the better book deal (I'm not fucking kidding) >Navy SEALs spilling state secrets to a major video game developer and the game is still a piece of shit (again, I'm not fucking kidding) >the the phrase "bury the hatchet" literally >that Chinook full of Navy SEALs that got blasted out of the sky >Benghazi, the never ending scandal >walking right into an ambush in Niger >Navy SEALs murder a Green Beret after he figures out they're planning on misappropriating Army funds even though their whole existence is a waste of taxpayer dollars
And these guys are supposed to be the Tier One Operator badasses who will fight all our wars for us in nanosuits in the future
Gabriel Sanders
>be Nazi Germany in 1940 >create combat outfit composed of thugs and criminals "convicted of major crimes such as premeditated murder, rape, arson and burglary" >"terrifying rabble" of "cut-throats, renegades, sadistic morons, and cashiered rejects from other units" >unit turns out to be an almost comical band of fuckups who were kicked out of every major field command they were assigned to and whose most noteworthy achievement was sadism and brutality that appalled even the most notorious architects of the Holocaust
>be Louisiana in 1861 >create combat outfit composed of “the lowest scum of the lower Mississippi...adventurous wharf rats, thieves, and outcasts...and bad characters generally” > the worst men I ever saw…. I understand that they are mostly wharf rats from New Orleans, and Major Wheat is the only man who can do anything with them. They were constantly fighting with each other. They were always ready to fight, and it made little difference to them who they fought.” >unit turns out to be one of the best in the Confederate Army, earning a legendary reputation for being utterly fearless and hard-fighting, becoming the Army of Northern Virginia's premiere shock troops alongside the Texas and Stonewall Brigades
Where did we get it so right where the Krauts got it so wrong?
Did they fear the Southern Warrior?
Also bonus question: What would happen if a nine month pregnant Anne Frank mysteriously teleported into the middle of a Confederate Army camp of Louisiana Tigers?
Would they be courtly Southern gentlemen and take her to meet General Lee? Sing Bonnie Blue flag and Rose of Alabamy by the campfire with her? Share their sweet tea and hardtacks with her? Teach her to do the Rebel Yell?
Isaac Turner
>Where did we get it so right where the Krauts got it so wrong?
Krauts are primitive brutes with the strategic intellect of a two year old with Down Syndrome. You know Max Hass from Wolfenstein: The Jew Colossus? He's one of the smarter ones.
>Did they fear the Southern Warrior?
Everyone fears the Southern Warrior
>What would happen if a nine month pregnant Anne Frank mysteriously teleported into the middle of a Confederate Army camp of Louisiana Tigers?
I'm not even gonna dignify that with an answer.
John Powell
W-who got her pregnant?
Caleb Walker
Who do you think?
Nolan Wright
Its no surprise they're similar to the SS, given how the US tried to copy the le epic germans xDDDDD instead of using its previous military ties to the successful French army which had served it well throughout its history
Christopher Barnes
Marine Corps Scout Snipers literally LARP as SS. Highly trained snipers actually prefer to emulate mass murderers who thought killing kids at point blank range made them badasses rather than someone actually worthy of admiration such as Simo Hayha. Mind you the first USMC Scout Sniper killed in Iraq was Jewish.
Speaking of snipers, Chris "don't google Craft International at Boston Marathon" Kyle and the rest of Seal Team 10 committed blatant copyright infringement with their stupid Punisher unit patches
Josiah Sullivan
>When the Slovak National Uprising began in late August 1944, the newly formed brigade was committed to action. The conduct of the brigade played a large part in putting down the rebellion, and by 30 October the uprising was put down. With the outcome of the war no longer in doubt, large numbers of communist and socialist political prisoners began applying to join the Dirlewanger in the hope of defecting to the Soviets.[21] SS-Brigadeführer Fritz Schmedes, disgraced former commander of the 4th SS Polizei Division, was assigned to the Dirlewanger by Himmler as punishment for refusing to carry out orders. With his extensive combat experience, Schmedes became the unofficial advisor to Dirlewanger on front line combat.
>In December, the brigade was sent to the front in Hungary. While several newly formed battalions made up of communist and socialist volunteers fell apart
Andrew Nelson
>get BTFO by barely trained Red Army peasants >get BTFO by partisans all over Europe >get BTFO by GIs
SS was a fucking meme
Jose Phillips
>calling in an airstrike on Hamid Karzai
nah good call
Hunter Ward
what the shit? A bunch of GIs were LARPing as SS troops in afghanistan?
Jacob Gomez
>Dirlewanger was never part of the SS >He just had an SS rank and commanded a unit subordinated to the SS
Kayden Wright
They got into because Scout Sniper is often abbreviated as "SS" and didn't seemed bothered by the fact the Nazis are hated everywhere outside of /pol/ and this stupid gimmick would reflect badly on the Corps and the United States as a whole.
Evan Anderson
>Where did we get it so right where the Krauts got it so wrong? I don't know, I'd think that the logical result of putting the unit under the command of an alcoholic convicted sex offender would result in Dirlewanger-esque incidents
William Reyes
Agreed, but it's generally a bad idea to blow up Hamid Karzai while he's right next to you (which is exactly what happened).
Connor Smith
they could have used literally any other symbols except the meme runes. Must have been awkward working with germans or poles or the french or the bongs deployed in afghanistan.
Adam Hughes
Name one historian with such an opinion.
Eli Stewart
>>Navy SEALs murder a Green Beret after he figures out they're planning on misappropriating Army funds even though their whole existence is a waste of taxpayer dollars What in the actual fuck.
Ryder Hernandez
Even more awkward when the Jewish Assistant Commandant of the Marine Corps shows up for an inspection and he sees all your SS flags in the barracks.
There’s a reason why the Wehrmacht has a severe mistrust of SS
Caleb Ward
...
Justin Davis
How do they get away with this?
Anthony Young
they got kicked out of the army
Elijah Howard
>the SS stands for scout sniper boss >but its literally the same sign as the schutzstaffel >awkward silence.
Jose Clark
Spartans and the USMC.
Jayden Gomez
Only a few SS divisions could actually be considered "elite". The rest were largely made up of conscripts and foreigners. The 36th Waffen division was made up of literal criminals.
Cameron Carter
>/b/ : the division vs >Average chav brawler/hooligan, the division
It's true for most of the "Germanic" divisions really, Dirlewanger was just the champion
Aiden Morgan
Sorry, I don't speak loser.
Ryder Torres
except weren't non-nazi generals impressed by the SS?
which is why they didn't try and cap hitler sooner ?
Nathan Nguyen
>kill "civilians" (partisans) >you monster, how could anyone do something like this
>hide among civilians and shoot people in the back >glorious heroes, brave freedom fighters, the good guys
How are you supposed to fight partisans? An honorable country would have an army, if the army loses in battle you give up and you lost the war. That is what France did and they didn't get genocided.
Jaxon Ward
>Czechs are best slavs What a surprise!
Sebastian James
Poles weren't fond of Germans very much.
>ragtag Polish partisans went toe to toe with an "elite" SS division + reinforcements for 2 months, armed with pistols and homemade submachine guns >they managed to capture 3 tanks and shoot down a Stuka
Lincoln Sanders
based polacks
Isaac Powell
>how are you supposed to fight partisans?? by not genociding their people from Day 1, you brainlet wehraboo
John Miller
>An honorable country would have an army, if the army loses in battle you give up and you lost the war. That is what France did and they didn't get genocided. There is no honour in surrender.
Isaiah Hernandez
>you give up and you lost the war. That is what France did and they didn't get genocided. The French literally set up a government in exile that directly ordered partisan activity dude. They weren't as effective as the Eastern partisans and are much more heavily romanticized but they were still there.
Lincoln Torres
At least the Czechs tried to be subtle about it by going with SS division collars rather the fucking SS logo.
Kevin Morgan
Partisans didn't live among civilians for the most part, they hid in the forests and lived in camps. Civilians were killed in retaliation, not to wipe out the partisans. Do you actually think random 22 year old slav housewives with 6 kids hanging off their teets or 72 year old white haired blind boris are going out at night attacking Nazis? Nigga are you retarded?
Landon Peterson
>Do you actually think random 22 year old slav housewives with 6 kids hanging off their teets or 72 year old white haired blind boris are going out at night attacking Nazis?
If a 15 year old Dutch-Jewish girl who's nine months pregnant with twins could do it, so can they.
Nathan Butler
Are you trying to argue that Poland deserved what they got?
Leo Rivera
I think a distinction is needed here.
Id argue the SS Panzer divisions were no meme, but the SS Infantry Divisions certainly were.
Austin Edwards
It's not like Hitler wasn't open about wanting to turn Poland into lebensraum for the Germans, most Nazis hate Poles for whatever reason.
Connor Kelly
Can someone help me understand why Hitler needed the SS? I get that they were loyal to the Nazi Party rather than Germany, but wasn't the German military also loyal to the Nazi party by dint of the Nazis being in charge of the government?
Carter Clark
Not really the whermacht operated more independantly than what people think, despite all the party pressure. They kept trying to win a war while the nazi party wanted something more propaganda worthy. >We need to look into some innovation for our men on the ground. >BOLT ACTON ONLY LOL >Mein Führer the army is about to be encircled, without new weapons or a steady supply line, i am afraid our only option will be retreat! >LOL ATTACK ANYWAY >Mein Führer, I regret to inform you that the city has been encircled and our men are under seige by the enemy, without a relief effort, we may never recover... >FIGHT TO THE DEATH LMAO >But mein Führer, think of the families of all the... >YOUR WIKI PAGE WILL BE RAD LOL
Kayden Perry
The SS were mainly good for two things, killing civilians and staging false flag attacks.
Andrew Moore
Like others have said, talking about the Waffen SS as a whole when discussing quality is stupid. The core divisions were very good, the later ones utter garbage.
The 12th SS was made up of mostly teenage boys from the Hitler Youth and held off three British armored divisions (with some help from Lehr and the 2nd SS) for months around Caen, despite overwhelming artillery and air support.
Isaiah Gutierrez
Hitler distrusted the Wehrmacht because of its traditionalism, even forcing the recruits to swear allegiance to him personally wasn't enough
Asher Brown
>BOLT ACTON ONLY LOL I assume you're talking about the StG44, the fact is it's unrealistic to equip every German soldier with one, it requires an entirely new cartridge to be produced, and it's a bit of an overrated piece of shit with a fragile receiver and jams when used at full-auto
Gabriel Johnson
>Everyone fears the Southern Warrior I'm not sure if you're aware, but they lost the only war they ever fought in.
Cameron Butler
>implying their fighting spirit doesn't live on in the hearts of their descendants
Kevin Smith
To be fair the Dirlewanger brigade was a bunch of criminals/lunatics uses as canon fodder
Juan Miller
So what you're saying is, a Confederate could've impregnated Anne Frank during WWII
Carson Cox
That wasn't the original intent, it was supposed to be comprised of poachers using their marksmanship in a light infantry role, the criminality of it just kept getting worse and worse
Dylan Robinson
They could take males and kill them. Not all with women and children.
Blake Russell
Of course the SS were terrible. Hitler planned them to replace the wehrmacht, which was still the best land army in the continent, despite losing the great war.
He allowed the SS to parasitically divert funds and supplies from the real military, while they larped around in their hugo boss uniforms, giving each other nazi salutes (which the real wehrmacht had refused to do). The only salient point is the SS intelligence services, which outperformed its national counterpart only by virtue of not being in active conspiracy against the fuhrer.
Lincoln Harris
Uhh... The descendant of one? Sure, why not. Let's say Nathan Bedford Forrest III managed to jump from that plane instead being incinerated, landed right on top of the Annex for no apparent reason, had to stay with the Frank family, and got real cozy with Anne...
Samuel Fisher
They were fanatical and fought fiercely.
But this isn't always good in warfare.
The Japanese were the same and that didn't work for them either.
Carson Robinson
yes they were stupid and incompetent also we should fear them because they were the ultimate evil
which is it?
Ayden Wright
You should fear them if you don't have a gun is the lesson to be learned
Isaac Roberts
that's like saying you shouldn't fear a pack of nigs just because they are stupid they are stupid AND violence
Isaiah Myers
>/pol/tards say that the SS was an elite fighting force based on a few divisions that did well >go the complete opposite direction by saying that the SS was a shit-tier force based on a few divisions that did poorly unironically kill yourself you generalizing fuckwad. Yeah, there were good SS divisions and there were bad SS divisions, that doesn't mean you can generalize the entire force. Or can I start basing my analysis of the Red Army on a few underequipped starving peseants?
Brayden Torres
No, talking anout Hitlers insistance that nothing needed to be changed about the main infantry weapon, the mauser 98k While from the kasserine pass to Normandy, the regular infantry were out classed by lee's and garands.
Robert Foster
>Also what those slavic axis soldiers did pales in comparison to any of the atrocities perpetrated by soviets or polacks against german citizens by far throughout the war
Gavin Parker
Nathan Bedford Forrest the III is the most Anglo looking person I have ever seen.
Mason Thomas
>sucking the dick of a faggot manlet with syphilis >being this undesirable to women and this much of a virgin Lmaoing at ur life faggot
Joseph Lee
Forrest himself was mostly Scots-Irish (and according to some very poorly sourced conspiracy websites, part-Jewish).
Alexander Hernandez
Holy shit he literally likes his great-grandfather but with a mustache and a haircut
Nathaniel Nelson
I love this copypasta
Jaxson Fisher
*tips stahlhelm*
Brody Ortiz
Early SS was shit because they got 2nd rate equipment. Dirlewanger was a special case composed of nutcases and rapers used in Anti Partisan operations - basically the lowest of the low, doing tasks that even regular SS troops wouldn't have the stomach for. Elite divisions like Liebstandarte, Das Reich, Wiking, performed exceptionally well
Ian Campbell
They are "Elite" when compared to the rest of the SS, which means about equal to your average Heer Panzergrenadiers division.
The actual elite unit in the Heer was Panzer Lehr, well, at least before it lost all it's experienced NCOs and Officers in the Falaise pocket.
Ethan Turner
> Liebstandarte
Stopped by a single infantry regiment from 1st Infantry division and a battalion of M10's.
> Das Reich Encircled by 2nd Armored Division, escaped with a grand total of 1 Panther and a Stug.
> "Exceptionally well"
Samuel Smith
>Also bonus question: What would happen if a nine month pregnant Anne Frank mysteriously teleported into the middle of a Confederate Army camp of Louisiana Tigers?
We'd be fist-fighting each other over who gets to fuck her first.
t. Louisianan
Ryan Harris
Huheuhheuh >fisting
Nathaniel Allen
Given the amount not mission they undertake you would expect a lot of fuck ups. That being said Navy SEALs have become huge Prima Donna's post 9/11 and especially post Iraq war. This can be blamed the shear amount of books released by former SEALs who want to be the next Richard Marcinko and the media who love a good propaganda piece and SEALs sound the sexiest to portray. The idea of the quiet professional who speaks softly and carries a big stick seems to have been lost to the past.
Nathaniel Rodriguez
>Bunch of edgy mcEdigintons lead by edge master Supreme vs a bunch of red necks that like to fight
