How and when did pedastry in greece and italy fall out of favour pacifically beyond man/ man-youth relationships?
How and when did pedastry in greece and italy fall out of favour pacifically beyond man/ man-youth relationships?
Colton Jones
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Logan Green
Pederasty was never accepted across the Greek and Roman world, how much you could get away with varied from place to place.
Hudson Gomez
I thought plato and all the generals and shit had boy lovers.
Zachary Powell
Pederasty was never a thing in Italy, and it stopped being a thing when Italy started ruling the world.
Samuel Reed
No, they mentored young men, not the same as fucking them. Ancient Greece had no public schools, mentorship was the usual method of education for aristocratic boys.
William Smith
Explain
en.wikipedia.org
>From the early Republican times of Ancient Rome, it was perfectly normal for an older man to desire and pursue boys
>As Edward Gibbon mentions, of the first fifteen emperors, "Claudius was the only one whose taste in love was entirely correct", the implication being that he was the only one not to take men or boys as lovers
Adam Gomez
Christianity or Germanisation perhaps. That said I'm pretty sure pederasty did continue in Italy well through the Christian era, just less publicly.
Luke Harris
It was. Marcus Aurelius wrote in Meditations that learning not to lust after young boys was a challenge.
Jason Flores
Marcus was gay?
Alexander Howard
Martial writes that a boy's arse is a million times better than a woman's to the point she should see it as a second cunt.
Ryder Ross
the absolute state of Veeky Forums
Julian Bennett
Everyone had a hard on for little boys back in the pagan days
Connor Lee
no. none of them were gay. They just fucked young boys in between the legs, and sometimes in the ass. Calling them gay is anachronistic, and makes it sound like the they have something in common with modern effeminate fags. Homosexual "lifestyle" is a modern invention.
Camden Anderson
so how would you call said boys being leg/ass fucked by older men?
Brayden Williams
when they said boypucci they meant 18+ boypucci
Connor Morales
Socrates was put on trial for having sex with boys and found not guilty. Who said that any prious greek would execute the person who abused their power in such a way. To this day, morons are swallowing cruel lies that Socrates was found not guilty of, and deciding that he did it anyway.
John Lewis
students? mentees maybe? They were just regular boys.
Cameron Roberts
I know homosexuality and pederasty are not the same thing, but it seems to me that the spread of Judaism, which led to Christianity, which led to Islam and Mormonism is what really sparked notions of, only men and women ought to be together.
Most cultures really didn't give a fuck about that stuff, from The Native Americans to Ancient China, it just was, people didn't really make a big deal about it one way or another, nor did they really think of things in terms of straight or gay but more in terms of dominant and submissive. There were men across cultures who would take the roles of submissives and they were pretty much treated like women, although dominants whether they were having same sex relationships or opposite sex relationships were equally admired. It was all about dominance and status, not who you were fucking, but what role you took.
Judaism started from a tribe living in adesert of paganism, naturally they would want to dissuade any same-sex relationships as it would not lead to more Jews, thus they encouraged only opposite sex pairings because they wanted more Jews.
That tribal idea of just wanting more of your own filtered down into christianity and Islam, etc etc as a moral precept when it was more a matter of pragmatism for the Jews as a tribe. Unless you're part of a tribe or really believe in promoting your own race there really isn't any more of a moral argument against homosexuality anymore than there is an argument against celibacy or joining the priesthood.
So I believe the notion of preserving one tribe just became tradition and by tradition it became "morality". There's actually no documentation of any Jews stoning to death Jews caught sleeping with other men, it was more or less hyperbole to get people in line.
So short answer is Tribalism and Judaism as well as the spreading of those ideas through the conquering of other nations as well as colonialsim is the answer to your question.
Asher Nguyen
Not really a modern invention, Hadrian, Elagabalus (arguably a premodern transexual), Nero, and Alexander the Great all took either lovers of the same sex or married members of the same sex, all except the last participated in the marrying of the same sex.
And it was even more common in ancient China and in Indian tribes to have men take on female roles who weren't exactly transexual, but felt submissive in nature.
So same-sex lifelong relationships/romances/lifestyles are not a modern invention. Antinous was afterall Hadrian's favorite lover, so much so that after Antinous died, he wept so much over hsi death that he demanded that Antinous be accepted among the people accept him as a god. A similar thing happened with Alexander the Great and Hephaestion, he tried but failed to get Hephaestion promoted to God-hood, I think he was promoted to a minor God or a mythic hero instead. But Hephaestion indeed was a lover of Alexander's as Alexander's mother bowed to him, which the Queen would have bowed to no one but one considered on equal footing as her, which if not a blood relative, would only be a lover/ wife/ husband of a royal.
Tyler Wright
Veeky Forums, /hm/, and /pol/ are best boys.
Christian Young
Errr, I mean best boards.
Liam Wright
>back in the pagan days
people fuck little boys even now. check those child molesting stats
but I presume people were peeved at the idea of some old greek fucking their kids enough to put a stop to the practice in open
Samuel Cruz
>Alexander the Great took male lovers
Literally the biggest meme in history that I've seen zero substantiation of. Anything I have seen, as in actual sources, would suggest he was just not concerned with sex in general. All there is, is the assumption based on the fact he's Macedonian/Greek, and the fact he had a best friend (who was the same age as him, not a younger child). Beyond that, there's only evidence against, such as the time he refused and was offended by the general who offered him some slave boys.