>Gosh it sure is great being a 50’s woman taken care of by my husband! And these labor saving devices give me so much free time!
>Should I study French? Learn the violin? Volunteer in my community? Take up an exercise routine?
>Wage slavery sounds fun!
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Well yea. Wage slavery = independence.
Have you ever thought that having someone else take care of you can make you feel helpless?
I know you think that the traditional social order is the solution to all of our problems, but have you considered that order broke down because it had problems of its own?
Are you a virgin? Chicks hate thinking about things
Confirmed
t. Lived with many women
>household slavery is better than wage slavery
How?
>only one traditional social order exist
tell us more dr broscience
Written by a fat self-loathing neckbeard living in his mom's basement
>t. Hillary Clinton
>All social orders are equal.
>Capitalist screw over everyone for profit
>B-B-BUT MUH FEMENISM MAKES ME HAPPY (even though i'm miserable at my job and clearly not happy)
>1950's America could survive when the Chinese have 12-year-olds working overtime in car factories
The issue is Economics... Very few men make enough money to be able to allow their wives to be housewives.
Women actually used to be happier decades ago.
>Freedom is slavery
>Ignorance is strength
That's right. Housewives reduced overall productivity by not working. More workers competing for jobs is good for capitalism.
Gosh, it sure is great being completely financially dependent on my husband, so that even though I am a grown adult I am basically similar to a kid or teenager in society.
Gosh, it sure is great feeling useless and depressed and gobbling pills and drinking wine every night.
Gosh, it sure is great when my husband starts seeing other women behind my back and I can't do anything about it because I don't even have the means to move out of his house, unless it is to go back to my parents.
How awesome!
Enjoy cancer and hair-dye whore
>its time to grow up by not marrying!
backwards hillbilly
wut
>living with family is childish
enjoy your debt. modern society is plague.
>being taken care of
50's America being a utopia is largely a propaganda meme. Only a small percentage of individuals experienced the White-picket fence ideal. Women being beaten by their men and men being emotionally abused by their women was common due to the fact that so many families bought into the propaganda and tried to make it work than trying to actively pursue happiness.
The U.S. economy was also under constant threat due to foreign influences like China.
>Only a small percentage of individuals experienced the White-picket fence ideal.
Levittown style suburbs are shit though, not ideal at all. designed for alienation and consumerism. Take the traditionalistpill already.
I mean FFS don’t you interact with many women on a regular basis? They’re simple minded creatures, even the ones with higher IQs aren’t ambitious or passionate about anything the way men are.
And I don’t really see what’s more noble about depending on a boss to give you money than a husband. Women just want to eat, sleep, buy things they don’t need, and socialize. And they hate making more money than their long term boyfriend/husband anyway.
Not him, but... I've met some ambitious, passionate women. Keep in mind that most men aren't ambitious or passionate either. Maybe you just don't interact with many cool women?
If they hate making money and being independent, why did they choose to make money and be independent?
indoctrination and social pressure?
It's another "people who think that the 1950s were just like old advertisements for suburban homes" thread.
And? Most household spending is done by wives in the first place. Why not stop bullshitting and be open about it? My sister works part time as an accountant for spending money, but her husband makes like 75% of their income.
>Gosh, it sure is great feeling useless and depressed and gobbling pills and drinking wine every night.
Women are more depressed now than ever before. Forcing them to act against their nature is cruel.
>Gosh, it sure is great when my husband starts seeing other women behind my back and I can't do anything about it because I don't even have the means to move out of his house, unless it is to go back to my parents.
Nigga don’t even front. Women don’t give a shit about affairs as long as it’s just sex.
>Implying alimony didn’t exist for this very reason
You’re out of arguments
>Should I study French? Learn the violin? Volunteer in my community? Take up an exercise routine?
>Nah, I think I'll just get frisky with the mailman while my husband is at work
Ftfy
This is the part that makes me laugh the most. People unironically think the US economy would be fine if all the women just stopped working.
Arbeit macht frei
Don’t misunderstand me. Obviously there are some exceptions, just like how there’s a few STEM majors who aren’t pretentious autists. But generalizations are useful for everyday living. Men are passionate creatures in general. Maybe most are not particularly talented at what they do, but passionate nonetheless.
Women don’t hate making money, they love having money to spend. But being treated as an equal in a relationship drives them nuts.
>Independent
What does this even mean? It’s pure propaganda
This.
The nuclear family is a flawed concept (extended family is superior), the food was shit, the only good music was country, everyone was boring and paranoid, and consumer culture was born.
Aesthetics were the only redeeming part of the era.
It'd be much better for the population. As for muh economy, I don't really care. Trickle down economics is a meme.
Yes, women were far happier and far more secure in America in the 50's than probably any other time and any other place.
Women are for bearing and raising children, and keeping the home orderly. That's it. If they couldn't bear children, if men had some other means to create offspring, none of them would be alive today.
>Women are more depressed now than ever before. Forcing them to act against their nature is cruel.
There's a big difference between the depression of someone who is helpless and the depression of someone who is fighting a tough fight, when things are hard. If women are more depressed now than before, it is because they are living more like men, and men are depressed because scrapping for money is hard. But it is not a bad thing that women are fighting for economic independence. I don't think you would suggest that men be reduced to domesticated animals. Why wish it for women?
>Nigga don’t even front. Women don’t give a shit about affairs as long as it’s just sex.
Some do, some don't.
>alimony
Not exactly something that would fill one with pride to receive.
Stop pretending that you know anything about women.
but women always worked historically
stay at home do nothing was a (good) anomaly
Yep. It seems that some people don't understand that even though fewer women were paid back in the day, they were still consuming resources. It's not like they were subsisting on sunlight and fairy tales. If women left the work force, it would significantly lower production while keeping consumption the same or slightly lower. The troubles of the US working class have a lot more to do with the rise of Asian societies as economic powers, and with technological advances, than they do with women in the workforce.
Women are unhappier than they were in previous decades.
>double the labor force
>no effect on the economy or worker-employer relationship
Good goy
First of all, how do you know? And second, even if it were true, so what? If independence makes it harder in some sense to be happy, does that make independence less worthwhile?
>Women are unhappier than they were in previous decades
Been watching Milo again?
This. More than anything else the fact that capitalists conspired to get women into the workforce and destroy the traditional social order makes me feel no love for this dogshit system. I’m not saying I’m a tankie but I certainly wouldn’t go out of my way to defend capitalism anymore.
You sound like someone who hasn’t managed many women before. Women don’t care about the bigger picture or abstract bullshit like pride.
Haha yeah, better indulge in mindless hedonism for twenty years and tell myself a career will give me fulfillment while I become a bitter alcoholic cat lady in my 40’s. At least I got to have a job! I’ll just import some brown people to help pay for my social security.
>First of all, how do you know?
>And second, even if it were true, so what? If independence makes it harder in some sense to be happy, does that make independence less worthwhile?
The stereotypical modern woman of pop culture is not free. Freedom involves more than money.
The traditional social order was the one in which 90% of human families had a hard-working peasant husband and a hard-working peasant wife all muddy doing manual labor. Why do you believe that the brief window in which women somewhat resembled sitcom housewives is representative of traditional societies? I have relatives in Russia. One of my grandmothers, who lived in a farming town, was built like a fucking tank.
>The stereotypical modern woman of pop culture is not free.
Translation: "The stereotypical young bimbo I lust after, and who I think is representative of women in general, is not free. Therefore, I will now proceed to make sweeping conclusions about successful professional women who I probably know virtually nothing of..."
I was speaking of independence, not freedom. Who is free? Sure, freedom involves more than money. It also involves more than being a fucking housewife.
No, I just know the research
But given my experience with feminists, I'm sure I will get an intellectually honest answer such as "wow, user, I didn't know that, thanks for showing me the data".
rising cost of living + desire for mass consumption + more job openings (US had very low immigration from 1924 to 1965) = more women in the workforce
In 1890 US census less than 10% of married white women worked a paying job. Stop being obtuse and thinking that working in the home; especially with children, is not working. There is however a big difference between staying with your children all day at home, on the farm, or in the family store versus abandoning them in daycare to make money for a Job Creator (TM) and live out your Wonder Woman career fantasies. Capitalism absolutely stood to gain from women working and pushed them into the labor force for better Q2 earnings.
Ya do realize that most professional women end up getting married, right...?
Actually, yes, it is better to indulge in hedonism while making money than to be a depressed housewife. My mom was a depressed housewife. Trust me, it would have been a lot better for her had she left the house and gotten a serious career. Maybe if she had done that, she wouldn't have become a hardcore alcoholic.
Gosh, isn't it just great to live in the suburbs while my husband takes the only car to work! I love being trapped in my house with 2.5 screaming children all day!!
Well ya know, women nowadays are free to find husbands, stay at home and be housewives IF THEY WANT TO. It's not like it's illegal.
>I want equality!
>*refuses to work on contruction sites etc*
I don't know if US 50s are overrated but I'm sure life was better when everyone was at his place.
Women were happier under communism. And I can actually source that claim.
Yes user, you don’t need to have kids, we have Syrian refugees and Pajeet for that.
Fewer women than ever are married. Women bought into the career meme and thought working for someone else was more fulfilling than raising a family. There’s no difference between your mom and your father if she dumps you in daycare all day. Might as well just put you in a state run orphanage.
>Translation: "The stereotypical young bimbo I lust after
What is the point of posting this?
>I was speaking of independence, not freedom. Who is free? Sure, freedom involves more than money. It also involves more than being a fucking housewife.
English is not my first language. Is there a difference between freedom and independence?
>Actively prevented from working in traditionally male jobs.
>When finally succeed at working male jobs the pay goes down and men flee to other occupations.
Yeah, and I've met guys who love taking care of kids, shopping and talking in a telephone.
I met enough cool women to know this guy is mostly right.
>Actually, yes, it is better to indulge in hedonism while making money than to be a depressed housewife.
Indulging in hedonism will make you unhappier.
I can imagine that.
It’s sure as hell harder because a few ugly, naive cunts bitched until we catered society to their needs. With women in the workforce employers don’t need to pay men a “family” wage anymore. The irony is this hits women who still want to be a professional and then exit the workforce in their 30s to be stay at home moms. They can’t find men who make enough money.
Fuck them, they wanted to live like men then so be it.
>Any woman who enjoys going out is a bimbo!
Nice freudian flip, you fucking /pol/fag
you forgot fucking
After they’re too old to have kids and eventually divorce their husband because he doesn’t make enough money
Seems like a comfy life. Also if the town/village square and basic necessitate were walking distance (as is in traditional societies) having a car isn't necessary.
Yeah all those women construction workers, oil roughnecks, and firefighters. We demand workplace gender equality for on the job deaths.
On second thought we’ll just work a cushy white collar job instead ;^)
>What is the point of posting this?
Sorry, don't mean to be rude. I was just trying to suggest that maybe you have a false idea of women because you focus too much on young pop culture women.
>difference between freedom and independence?
The words don't have firm definitions, but the way I was using them, what I mean is that you have independence if you are fighting for freedom even if you are not doing very well. Because at least you're fighting. On the other hand, some people actually break through into economic freedom.
>With women in the workforce employers don’t need to pay men a “family” wage anymore.
You don't get it. With Asia in the world economy and many simple jobs done by computers, employers don't need to pay Westerners a "family" wage anymore.
> With women in the workforce employers don’t need to pay men a “family” wage anymore. The irony is this hits women who still want to be a professional and then exit the workforce in their 30s to be stay at home moms. They can’t find men who make enough money.
If only there were organizations which could pressure employers to pay workers more....
Women love caring for children
That’s literally the reason they’re more neurotic than men are
It’s also why they love stress and drama
Fuck off
Dear god, this thread is full of idiots. The level of butthurt toward women wafting up from the thread makes it obvious that many of the opinions are not held for rational reasons.
>CTRL+f
>wage g
>0 results
It’s like they’ve never cared for kids before. Do they really think they’re some sort of screeching demons 24/7?
Yeah, the ones that kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.
Real bright, commie.
> The paradox is simply that despite women being over-represented in jobs that are worse by many objective standards—they face lower wages, occupational segregation into jobs with lower pay and fewer opportunities for advancement—they have historically reported higher levels of job satisfaction than men.
>Kahneman (1999) argues that people in good circumstances may be hedonically better off than people in worse circumstances, yet they may require more to declare themselves happy. In the context of the findings presented in this paper, women may now feel more comfortable being honest about their true happiness and have thus deflated their previously inflated responses. Or, as in Kahneman’s example, the increased opportunities available to women may have increased what women require to declare themselves happy. And indeed, Figure 7 shows that contrary to the subjective well-being trends we document, female suicide rates have been falling, even as male suicide rates have remained roughly constant through most of our sample. As such, from the early 1970s to the mid-1990s the ratio of female-to-male suicide declined
>women may now feel more comfortable being honest about their true happiness and have thus deflated their previously inflated responses
Uhhhh
>OMG I literally can’t even...
They're not. But there's a reason why for hundreds of years, anyone who could afford to had servants do most of the hard, boring work of childraising, while just focusing on enjoying the fun parts.
The Daily Mail is such a credible source /s
negotiating with employers =/= overthrowing them and seizing the means of production you fucking dipshit
look at the working conditions in a country like germany or sweden where you have cooperation between labor and management
Unfortunately, the suburbs ubiquitous in the 1950's were designed for cars to be necessary to get to basic amenities. Otherwise I would agree with you.
>Sorry, don't mean to be rude. I was just trying to suggest that maybe you have a false idea of women because you focus too much on young pop culture women.
By stereotypical modern woman, I mean someone who would follow the model set by Vogue, Sheryl Sandberg, etc. Someone who does follow this model will likely become unhappy.
>The words don't have firm definitions, but the way I was using them, what I mean is that you have independence if you are fighting for freedom even if you are not doing very well. Because at least you're fighting. On the other hand, some people actually break through into economic freedom
The point I will make is that freedom/independence is not about being able to have enough money to have a middle class life by yourself. Charlie Sheen is a millionaire, but he is not free. Some old great philosopher like Epictetus was much poorer, but he was free.
>while just focusing on enjoying the fun parts.
I mean....being a noblewomen or noblemen wasn't exactly "fun" in that that it carried responsibilities and risk of it's own. It's not like it was partying 24/7.
Just to be pedantic, there are a ton of women firefighters. They just tend to be in prison. And unable to get firefighting jobs when they get out because they have a criminal record.
>But generalizations are useful for everyday living. Men are passionate creatures in general.
Nice try, Mohammed
Fuck off reddit
I mean focusing on enjoying the fun parts of childraising, while letting servants handle the boring and annoying parts.
What an hypocritical state of mind. Equality means working as hard and doing the same tasks, but what women understand is "give me the same pay whatever". That's why men stopped to be helpful and kind to women.
Mom's been lying to you all these years. She hates having to take care of a man-baby living in her basement.
I mean, in today's society most parents send their kids to public or private school for 8 hours in the middle of the day until they reach 18.
So having a midwife for a couple years isn't really THAT big a difference.
Gentlemen, I am rather biased on this issue. You see, I was born in Russia. My mom divorced my dad when I was a kid because he was too traditional for her and wanted her to be a housewife. She then took the risk, in 1990, of leaving Russia with me and bringing me to the United States. Once she got to the US, she remarried, became an unemployed housewife, developed a serious alcohol problem, and died young. She was fine as long as she was independent and fighting, she died after she became a housewife. Not that there's necessarily a clearcut causal connection, of course, but still...
If my mom hadn't been independent-thinking, I'd be stuck in fucking Russia right now.
Doesn't equality extend to being paid equally for doing the same tasks and working as hard?
When did men start being helpful? When did they stop? Can you elaborate a bit on your last point?
Simply reading the abstract isn't "knowing the research", neck yourself.
>wow I love being free and working 3 jobs for 60h/w and being the most miserable female generation to date
So this... is the power... of... female empowerment... whoa!
I'm sorry about your mom user. If my mom ever became a housewife I think she'd end up the same way. Tbf if I ever became a househusband I'd probably end up the same way.
>being the most miserable female generation to date
wut
Admit it, it's just you who want to be a housewife
Thanks man, I appreciate it. My mom did an absolutely amazing thing for me bringing me to the United States. How could I ever possibly be against independent women? An independent woman gave me a great gift.
Too bad that survey doesn't go any farther back than the 70's cause I'm sure as hell that women of this generation are happier than women during the Great Depression.
