So I've been reading up on the Barbary Corsairs and I found a few cases of European pirates joining them and even achieving quite a status there.
For example, Ivan de Veenboer and Jan Janszoon both reach the Reis rank as foreigners.
We're the Barbary Corsairs particularly accepting of foreigners or we're these exceptional cases?
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Wasn't a literal German the sultan of Morocco or Tunis or something?
>We're the Barbary Corsairs particularly accepting of foreigners or we're these exceptional cases?
they didn't accept people like the french foreign legion, the europeans were taken as slaves and converted to islam or were muslim converts. the christian children taken as slaves by the pirates would be raised to become janissaries, elite soldiers, some of whom went on to become pirates that raided coastal cities for christian slaves. the most in depth book i've read about this topic is "the stolen village"
The two guys OP mentioned joined voluntarily at a later age after the 80 years war died down for 12 years of truce.
So you are pretty fucking wrong.
> they didn't accept people like the french foreign legion
They absolutely did.
We have records of captains switching sides and bringing entire ships with entire crews to their ranks.
>joined voluntarily
The two Dutchmen that OP mentioned had to convert to Islam to fly the Ottoman flag, and one of them was captured and converted, genius.
>They absolutely did.
And they had to convert. Reread my post.
>and one of them was captured
Which one? Reis joined voluntarily and Jan Janszoon stayed in Ottoman service after Reis saved him from lanzarote after his ship went down.
Looks like english sources claim he was captured while dutch sources claime he joined voluntarily.
>Reis joined voluntarily
You're arguing out of ignorance. Reis isn't a name, it's an Ottoman military title for sea captain, similar to how "Pasha" means governor.
>Jan Janszoon aka Morat Reis
The book, "The Stolen Village" details his life, he was captured as a slave and converted to Islam, that's how it worked. If you didn't convert you became a galley slave or were sold in the slave markets.
>You're arguing out of ignorance
Right back at you. Reis is a lot easier to type out then Veenboer.
But we are just talking about Jan Janszoon now. You claimed they did not take volunteers. Of the two examples we have been talking about one clearly was a volunteer.
So you are still wrong. De Veenboer was a volunteer as was most of his DUTCH crew.
>Reis is a lot easier to type out then Veenboer.
They're both Reis, genius
>You claimed they did not take volunteers.
Wrong, I correctly claimed that they had to be Muslim, whether by birth or conversion.
>De Veenboer was a volunteer as was most of his DUTCH crew.
And they ALL had to convert to Islam, genius.
I gave you a source, "The Stolen Village" The entire book is devoted to Jan Janszoon and other converts, the history of the Barbary pirates, their raids for Christian slaves and detailed information on how they came to serve the Ottomans. I suggest you read it.
Becoming a local North African corsair wasn't too hard for anyone, and there ended up being barbary captains from all sorts of backgrounds. But one didn't necessarily have to join the Corsairs or the Ottoman Empire to be a Mediterranean pirate either. Protestant English and French pirates operating in the Mediterranean were regulars in Barbary ports, and sailed under their own flags or used a North African flag to hide their origins.
Until the 18th century when Northern European powers started establishing themselves in the Mediterranean, you had two sides: Catholic and non-Catholic, and the non-Catholics generally worked together against Catholics.
en.wikipedia.org
>the eternal anglo strikes again
Ok not him but the fact that he had to convert does not change the fact that he could have very well voluntarily converted to voluntarily join the pirates.
>the fact that he had to convert does not change the fact that he could have very well voluntarily converted to voluntarily join the pirates.
Read my posts again very carefully. Notice where I say, "or were muslim converts"? If you have a deeper interest in this topic, read the source I provided, it's one of the most exhaustive and detailed that I've read. It explains the nuts and bolts of the slave trade, day to day lives of the pirates, and accounts of survivors of the abductions and subsequent enslavement.
The Stolen Village by Des Ekin
Wasn't one of those slave raids of Iceland led by a Dutchman?
>they didn't accept people like the french foreign legion, the europeans were taken as slaves
>Wrong, I correctly claimed that they had to be Muslim
No you claimed they had to be slaves
Barbarossa was Greek if that's who you mean
Italian
Born on Lesbian Island to a converted Albanian and a Greek woman, how do you figure he's Italian?
He headed a small pirate republic which wooped the ass of the sultan once.
wasn't lesbos venetian at the time?