Red Pill me on vegetarianism and veganism

>humans eat meat
>humans will stick cocks up each other asses
hmmm really makes you think

don't know shit about nutrition but:
>Risk of death
Really? I thought it was 100%, I thought we knew what we signed up for, so why bother with some veggie bullshit when you can take 4 scoops and leave the humanity behind?

a diet that contains
>no heme iron
>no b12
is inherently NOT NATURAL for human beings

Just eat like a normal person m8

Guessing a semi-vegetarian would only occasionally eat meat? Also, vegetarians can eat eggs, milk, and honey while vegans can not.

4 year vegetarian

Don't do it if you're not doing it for your own personal beliefs.
I found my state of belief didn't align with meat eating, so I stopped, but its definitely a different ball of worms when it comes to bulking and nutrition.
You CAN bulk while vegetarian - dairy protein and lots of oils - if you're pesco then fish. Don't forget, vegetarian doesnt mean healthy - you can still eat potato chips, french fries, tons of deep fried fatty shit if you want to go dirty.

Healthy is possible, but you have to do some research and acquire certain nutrients from different sources.
Also vegan and vegetarian are very different - dairy and eggs make a huge different in how you get your protein.

eh, homosexuality is found in all sorts of animals, from lions to giraffes.

>implying animals don't do faggot stuff

What we were built to do and what we CAN do are very different - bears were designed with omnivorous diets in mind, but Pandas have adapted to it, albeit a tad poorly.
Most mammals originated as insectivores, doesn't mean they have to be. Humans have this amazing capability to adjust and become more than their base survival instincts - why not use it to better yourself? You do anyway - you go to the gym, learn by studying, choose a mate for different things than just her ability to breed children. Vegetarianism is just humans using this ability to try and protect life, my personal beliefs tell me everyone ought to, but you're free to your own life. Still though, don't defend NOT being vegetarian with naturalism, life isn't natural anymore.

agree with this, but i still can't understand veganism/vegetarianism on a moral ground. unless we're talking about pet cats, i don't give a half-shit about the lives of non-humans. i don't get the bleeding heart mentality.

im nearing 10 years of being pesco (im 19) and i've been lifting a little over a year. i put on 30lbs so far with minimal hardcore bulking and my strength is decent so i dont think it affects muscle growth all that much. i have no idea the health benefits that come along with it but i rarely ever get sick. im tired constantly though, so idk if that's a product of the diet

I actually should cut out red meats, not completely but a lot

i'm not pesco or veg anything, but i survive off of oats, peanut butter, eggs, protein powder and the occasional canned fish because it's all i can afford. i'm not tired constantly... if you eat a lot of fish, you really don't have an excuse. something else is wrong with your diet if you're always tired.

>eat for protons
>mfw doesn't know about the HCl diet

Only sensible answer itt

>What did you eat for protons?
Matter, obviously.

>not natural
what is this even supposed to mean, it's literally a buzzword for "I don't like it", everything humans do, or any other animal, plant, etc. for instance is inherently natural, literally nothing on earth can be "unnatural"

>risk of death

>lower risk of death
>everyone dies anyways

That's only because by nature of being a vegetarian you are conscious of your diet. Remember, it's not hard to beat your competition when over a 3rd are obese. I bet when stacked against another meme diet like paleo they do no better.

>everything humans do, or any other animal, plant, etc. for instance is inherently natural, literally nothing on earth can be "unnatural"
fuck off you sophist fucking idiot

>lower risk of death
>everyone dies anyways
>of course but the question is how long will you live and what will your quality of life be you moronic trump pussy

You have to also note, in the short term (first few weeks) that a lot of that weight lost is also the swelling of your internal organs going down thanks to the increased amount of fiber. I looked flat-stomached as hell, and I still kept putting on weight. My secret? Shit tons of black beans, brown rice, and dark greens. Add a couple of servings of fish a week for health benefits and you've got yourself a good diet. Nowadays, I've weaned off of the black beans and eat equal amounts of seasonal fish and beans. I felt my libido go up, but I can't tell if that's because of a placebo effect.

youtube.com/watch?v=vifYelSTlMo

>higher chance of cancer due to malnutrition
W H A T

>most vegetarians are women
>women live longer

>beta males whom take less risks live longer
sounds abt rght

Its a LOT better for the environment tbqh, livestock is incredibly inefficient to raise from an energy perspective.

Beef in particular is awful for the pla et, like 6-8x worse than chicken.

Generally speaking, almost every argument comes down to "people like me are better than people like you"

Everyone basically argues like this. But within that there's fascinating mental acrobatics performed to keep your opinions safe and warm and tucked up in your cozy little head. God forbid your opinions would have to go out and work for you, and stand on their own two feet.

For example;
Someone might say; humans should eat a vegan diet.
And a rebutale might be; animals eat other animals, cats kill for fun, what we find in nature is 'right'
Which amounts to; If a man came into my house and shit on my floor I'd be okay with it, because dogs do that sometimes.

The other kind of argument that comes up all the time with vegans is this.
Vegan; he guys, I try to eat vegan and as ethically and responsibaly as possible
Opponent; oh yeah? Are those shoes leather?
Which amounts to; Your best efforts aren't 100% correct therefore, I don't have to make even 10% of an effort.
or
You're attempt at being good isn't perfect, therefore I can be as cruel, stupid, weak, as I like.

>percentage of vegetarianism varies greatly with class
>health varies greatly with class

My neurons have been set ablaze.

Typical liberal vegans bringing politics into everything

Your post is a rambling, incoherent mess.
You might actually have brain problems.

Thanks for the diagnosis buddy. I value your opinion dearly. And you have intrinsic worth.

I can tell you don't work in research or statistics. You should do. Niggas get paid!

>don't defend NOT being vegetarian with naturalism, life isn't natural anymore.
>Breeding and raising animals for the purpose of consumption isn't natural

This is your brain on vegetables

Pesco Vegentarianism isn't Vegetarian.

Fish is an animal, an animal made of meat, however you try to rationalise it, you're eating an animal same as those disgusting carnivores you bleat on about.

I eat a heavily plant-based diet, for many reasons. It's economic, it's easier to eat enough veggies for me this way, environmental reasons, and I don't think killing animals is cool if it's not necessary for survival.

That said, I eat a lot of eggs and whey to make up for the protein lost with meat. I have to supplement with B12 and zinc. I occassionally eat meat, maybe once or twice a month. I have no interest in being able to label myself as a vegetarian, let alone vegan.

No one has to give up meat completely. Many could do with less of it.

19% chance to become immortal! I'm going vegan!

>Studies show

Trashman.jpeg

>vegas arn't massive faggots
Nice try.

THIS

From experience, it helps with cutting. A friend incorporates it heavily or switches totally for about a month or two.

I got a few tips from a few vegetarian friends of mine regarding hitting calorie intakes.
I've also tried some of the vegan recipes also, they're alright, they taste good but its a lot of work to bulk. I find the community a bit odd in uni, so I can't really ask them for advice. I see them on elliptical/bikes/treadmill but on the weights a few times doing simple compounds

>Is it healthier for you too?
No.
>chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2010/07/vegetarianism-and-veganism-best.html
>chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2010/07/vegetarianism-and-veganism-are-as.html

You wanna get red pilled?!
So get red pilled!

youtube.com/watch?v=30gEiweaAVQ

sciencebasedmedicine.org/death-as-a-foodborne-illness-curable-by-veganism/

>Greger
My sides. You might as well link to Mercola.

>risk of death

is that one on the left a chicken leg with a lettuce hat?

Mine don't
Like i'm not vegan or vegetarian because i enjoy eating animal products and I can
I don't feel the need to rationalise my choices because i don't feel guilty about them
Like i've seen earthlings and climate change research
But i'm not livestock and i'm not in a climate disaster prone region
So it's unimportant to me

the link above says nothing and ist writen by who?? without any studies to Support it...

Why are you guys against something thats only good??
Even if a healthy diet with a Little bit of meat it is no Problem and cause no harm, you are supporting the big meat Industrie that does no good.
Why Support that if can get all tha you Need from Vegan Food?
And dont tell me you believe that a meat eater gain more Muskel or is stronger then a vegan, cause thats simply not true.
So you can fucking be strong and healthy with vegan Food, why eat something that cause harm to other living beings (animals, in a so big number).
I dont find it bad to kill an animal and eat it, but why Support the Industrie that cause so much harm....

>cause thats simply not true.
Who are these vegan athletes or bodybuilders?

>Support the Industrie that cause so much harm
You are using electricity right now to shitpost.
Guess where the majority of greenhouse emissions come from?
And I bet you don't own a car either.
Fuck off with your faux moral righteousness.

...you my friend are a Retard...

Well i know some Vegan MMA Athletes like
Mac Danzig
John Fitch
and manny other, like my brother and myself when i was active.
Well i dont know the Name of Bodybuilders but a Google search will give you couple of names...
Electricity and fuel ist not the same you moron!!! what the fuck are you talking about.
Its alot easier just not to eat meat and dairy products then not have a car!!!
and the majority of the greenhouse emissions Comes from the cows and bulls you fag!
Do a quick Research first before posting.
If the Meat Industrie were not so big, we may not have the greenhous Emission Problem.

Im driving a car and im not a Moral Apostel...
If you can do something good for you and the others do it, if not, dont do it. It good with me.
But dont prevent others from doing good.
Why so much autism faggots?

OP look up the book Nutrition and Physical Degeneration

basically all the primitives ate healthy animal food and lived longer and were healthier and more physically in shape

Primitives lived longer? Wat.
They died at like age 20 if they were lucky

Well they didn't really live longer. Even if we don't account for huge newborn death rate, the maximum was somewhere between 60-70 years, which is considered pretty early death for an elder man this days. It's hard to prove that they actually COULDN'T live longer, but at that age you were pretty useless back in days, plus any given disease could put you down easily, especially considering lack of medicine.

No, they could live longer if they haven't die from an accident or at war!
They were healthier and stronger.
Fucking Leonidas from the 300 Spartans was fucking 60 years old! and he was flying in the battle field like a Teenager.
They were capable to live longer but they died before, no one in the ancient days died a normal death.

>a lot of that weight lost is also the swelling of your internal organs going down thanks to the increased amount of fiber.

I'm calling bullshit.

on top of that... they eated animals like 2 time a year... just saying

Airing soon - "user asks for proof and gets told to look it up himself" episode again

>Who are these vegan athletes or bodybuilders?
Literally who's who were shit at their sports
>Well i know some Vegan MMA Athletes like
Mac Danzig
John Fitch and manny other, like my brother and myself when i was active.
>Famous Athletes?
>Wherever you find a vegetarian website, you'll find the same dumbass list of vegetarians and vegans trotted out for you. The list, as you can imagine, is just as wrong as feeding soy formula to a male baby is- horribly, horribly wrong. Bill Pearl and Andreas Cahling are held aloft as two bodybuilders who ate no animal protein and yet succeeded at their sport. These two men, however, ate a fucking boatload of animal protein at every meal. They might not have been sitting down to a steak that'd choke John Candy's fat ass to death, but Pearl ate a couple of dozen eggs a day and drank fucking GALLONS of milk a day, while Cahling ate nothing but open faced goat cheese sandwiches.(peep it) Mind you, Cahling was a shitty bodybuilder, but that's beside the point. Tony Gonzalez abandoned veganism after a month of sucking, and Prince Fielder became a vegan after reading SB promptly (only to be blasted in the press as his batting average dropped lower than his daily protein consumption) In addition to these guys, you'll find a comprehensive list of about ten other people, of whom you've likely heard of none, and for good reason- they've not done anything worth knowing about. Thus, the argument that people flourish on this diet is invalid, as they'd have much more than a list of ten people, and far more accomplished people, at that, to proffer as proof of the legitimacy of this diet. Oh, and to the ten people who are going to shout : "Mac Danzig could kick your ass!" SUCK IT. If a 140 lb vegan would kick my ass in the octagon, I suppose I'd deserve the beating I received.

>Mac Danzig
>John Fitch
So your argument is that 2 shitty fighters that never won a belt are vegan?

>I don't know the names blah blah blah
Well send them, then let me know how many are top tier.

>Electricity and fuel ist not the same you moron
Are you legit retarded? Where did I mention fuel?
Here is the fact patern:
>You mention not supporting industries that cause harm.
>While wasting electricity shitposting on Veeky Forums
>Electricity is the Number 1 cause of greenhouse emissions

>Im driving a car and im not a Moral Apostel
Yet you try to claim the moral high ground because you don't eat meat.

Christ you need some DHA, your mental faculties are failing.
I suggest Salmon.

For some reason it turns people into insufferable pricks so I avoid going full vetard. High plant matter with a little meat is GOAT.

> Salmon checked...

I meant the meat Industrie! not the other...

>Well send them, then let me know how many are top tier.
Well no faggot im not going to search for you.

>So your argument is that 2 shitty fighters that never won a belt are vegan?
Those two are no shitty fighters by any mean...

You dont Need a Belt to be good or even great.
There are some awful fighters that won belts like fucking tim Sylvia... and a not great fighter that beat a living legend (GSP) in devastating Fashion, Matt Serra...
Fitch and danzic are very good fighters.

>Where did I mention fuel?
Well you dont, but you mention car sooo...

why the fuck im writing all this... do what you want faggot, just dont prevent other from doing something good.

and just kys you are no good for no one in this worl, no one will cry, just do it.

>And a rebutale might be
you need to work on your brain gains kid

Checkmate atheists

Have you ever had a cock in your ass? It feels really good user

Can vegetarians eat insects? I've heard cricket protein is really good for you and inexpensive but I don't know if that goes against vegetarianism.

this guy gets it

Guys, a bit of an offtopic question, but still related to the topic.

Why is everyone obsessed with eating vegetables that taste like shit? You can get a mad amount of macronutrients from tasty foods like oats, groats, various cuts of meat, fruits, nuts, eggs, whole meal pastry, dairy and the list goes on, so why the fuck veggies are seen to be a remedy for everyone and avoiding them is a recipe to die before 30?

Consider the following:

1. We're documentably evolved as omnivores, not herbivores. Otherwise why do we have any teeth designed for ripping and tearing, and why do our bodies generate enzymes that digest meat successfully?

2. I personally have looked at trying to eat a strict vegetarian diet. You can't get a properly balanced mix of amino acids that way without getting way too many carbs and way too much fiber. Soy is not an option for various reasons we're all aware of.

3. You don't feed an infant or developing child a vegetarian diet unless you want them malnourished and not developing physically or neurologically properly, and in fact any pediatrician will tell you not to and will report you to Child Protective Services for abuse if you do. See pic related.

4. It's been found in more than one study that a strict vegetarian diet, because of the inevitable amino acid deficiency, over time causes a progressive cognitive deficit. Ever wonder why Vegans seem like their brains don't work properly? It doesn't work properly, and now you know why.

5. A strict vegetarian diet will kill your natural testosterone production, limiting your gains, and removing your natural male aggressiveness and effectiveness. In essence it slowly makes you more female. Don't think any of us want that!

6. Someone is going to trot out World Health Organization recommendations that we all stop eating meat. Understand that the WHO is more of a political organization than anything else, and has a socio-political agenda they're pushing that has little to do with anyone's health. They're happy to see their agenda for the world move forward regardless of it being optimal for anyone's health, if people are surviving then that's 'good enough' so far as they're concerned; you WANT optimal health (and gains).

Bottom line: Unless your 'goal body' is to become a Twink or a Trap, with the mindset that goes along with it,
I'd forget about eating a strict vegetarian diet.

How fat are you and what is your cholesterol?

Tuna from a can? Also other seafood like mussles.

Also lots of avocados , nutbutters and tempeh/tofu/saitan/etc. Harder than omnivore-mode but doable. I'm doing IF and I'm vegan.

Debatable. Most vegans I know eat honey. Those who don't are usually the whacky ones. It almost makes a good test of whether a vegan is somewhat reasonable or just a crazy asshole.

>Naturalist fallacy as always
Or I can just take this multivit that I would've taken otherwise and in fact HAVE been taking even back when I ate meat?

>vegetarians have a lower risk of death
So being a vegetarian is the way to become a lich

>A diet followed by 2% of the population has produced less elite athletes not because of how rare it is in general or because of the misinformation & prejudice about it that is abundant among athletes, but because it is inherently inferior and those who rely on it are sissies. I base this argument on absolutley nothing, but it provides a convenient excuse so you'll eat it up like a pig-corpse. Here are some strawmen, ad hominems and naturalist fallacies for effect.
OK.

No, jeez, stop mocking people in a serious thread about nutrition!

Vegetarianism is PART OF the long PROCESS of transformation to lichdom, but OF COURSE it alone cannot lead to it and you still have to do your damn ritual. Duh.

>risk of death

???