Study history

For all the prosperity that neo-liberalism gives us it doesn't seem to make us all that happy.

Constitutional Monarchies with heavy Christian influence are the best form of government.

You can't be capitalist and democratic at the same time. Or, well, you can but the democracy doesn't function the way people believe it should. Private companies and wealthy individuals who control things like energy generation and the food supply can pressure the government to change was, can saturate the media with their ideology, can extort wage laborers by threatening them with poorer working conditions and reduced compensation and so on. Liberalism is inherently capitalist.

Upper-middle class in China is doing well. Obviously the poors are unhappy, but then again, the poors of any country are unhappy, unless you live in a welfare state. It seems like liberal democratic government become welfare states because political parties want to get these votes, but the longevity of welfare states still has to be proven.

Social democracy with a distributist tinge

t.soyboy fag

Eating soy in democracy > starving to death in totalitarianism

Liberal Democratic states that don't have extensive welfare states will either acquire them quickly or transition into something else sooner rather then later.

The poor must be appeased and bought off, otherwise blood will flow through the streets.

Not an argument snowflake. The state needs strong and masculine men in order to bring progress. We don't have time for ivy league weakkneed limp wristed libtards who like to reeeee about muh totalitarianism. What's so bad about totalitarianism? At least you're not a faggot under totalitarianism. At least crime doesn't exist under totalitarianism. Lolbertarian fags are just liberals in denial.

...

The democracy in liberal capitalism might be flawed, but it's more truly democratic than the democracy in any other system that's been tried on a large scale.

>The state needs strong and masculine men in order to bring progress. We don't have time for ivy league weakkneed limp wristed libtards who like to reeeee about muh totalitarianism
You're probably joking, but in case you're not...
Power in the modern world depends on technology. Strong and masculine men in totalitarian societies generally don't deliver the highest level of technological progress and competence. As a result, such societies end up being outcompeted scientifically and economically by liberal societies - and then, as a result of that, they get beaten down militarily if they start shit.

We are probably far more happy than poor bastards living under communist, Fascist, Feudal, or Slave owning states. Its probably due to atheism and a loss of purpose that postmodern man is unhappy rather than having rights, liberty, and not being maltreated by government.

The question is, how do we retain democracy and liberty while also keeping religion and purpose?

Why would you want to keep religion?

Well, instead of appeasing the poor with a welfare state, you could just do like Shang Yang and make a government that help makes poor people rich and rich people poor aka an actual meritocracy.

see

Nope snowflake, I am not joking. Liberalism is a degenerate disease that needs to be wiped out from society. Democracy is for faggots and losers. Totalitarianism is for a better society and for a happier one as well. You have real happiness under totalitarianism and when the state brings you everything you need. Fuck your faggot democracy. You lolbertarians are losers. Fucking losers!

The true GOAT ideology is Jacobinism: democracy with a moderate welfare state combined with an almost totalitarian sort of nationalist mass mobilization and a strong central state. The best of both worlds

The US is a republic

>study democracy
>realize that a checks and balances are a good system but there needs to be a check on that system itself

who /limited constitutionalism/ here?

>wur a republic not a democracy!!!
Amerilard detected

but it is, we're not a direct democracy, we have an electoral college

>>make the rich people poor
Ahahahaha, good luck with that. Money buys power and people with power do not like losing it.

>believing republic and democracy are mutually exclusive categories
>believing that direct democracy is the only form of democracy
stupid mutt

t. American false flagging in an attempt to make non Americans look retarded. It's so obvious when you fat fucks do this.

> best form of government
Its that why the Western World is slowly destroying itself?

t. American false flagging as a non-American mad about Americans false flagging as non-Americans. I can smell the grease from across the Atlantic

obsessed

Capitalism is self destructive by design.

Whatever you say Cletus

Let the individual figure out his own religion and purpose.

Yes.

Prosperous people eventually lose sight of the things that made them strong, and self destruct.

The Nordic countries, which had the best system on earth, are self destructing the quickest.

If you want to see the results of that just look at nihilism and apathy of any largely irreligious western country

>Prosperous people eventually lose sight of the things that made them strong, and self destruct
The thing is material prosperity, hasn't been exclusive to liberal democracy throughout recorded history

>study history
>realize Hellenistic Autocratic Satrapy with Military Colonization to be the best form of government

Yes, but liberal democracy, especially social democracy, is far and away the most prosperous form of human society yet devised.

Which is why they're ruining it.

> most prosperous form of human society yet devised
the problem with this argument is that the liberal democracy coincides with the modern era technology, I doubt the democratic city states of the past were far richer than the kingdoms of the day

>What is Representative/Electoral Democracy

Stop larping

>Why couldn't Commies, Fascists, and Monarchists just fuck off?
Social-Democrat/Communist here. Why do I think that you are wrong?

While Democracy is good, Liberal representative republic does not equal democracy at all. It may be more (Switzerland) or less (America, India, etc.) democratic, in which case power is effectively usurped by the Capital, and voting boils down to an empty legitimisation ritual.

Fascists and Monarchists have gone extinct. Marxism-Leninism - not so much. It works under a principle of meritocracy, and solves certain problems much better than Representative Republic does.

"True" democracy is overrated

You're a former republic. Nowadays the US are an oligarchy

But a democracy is always for sale

True democracy is anarchism

There is nothing further away from democracy than anarchism

gb2reddit

China is a shithole.

t. Ivan Ivanovich Ivanov

>crime doesn’t exist under totalitarianism
Except for, you know, all the crimes against humanity undertaken by the totalitarian regime.

>I can't compete with snowflakes in a free society, I need a big stronk government to give me everything
Hmmmmm...

>i need a strong state so i can get free gibmedats
a l p h a m a l e

>totalitarianism is great because the government gives you everything
Get a fucking job and pull your weight

Fascists are cowardly betas that long to feel a boot on their neck because girls don't touch them

>The state needs strong and masculine men in order to bring progress

>Oh chad take me with your strong arms, I am too beta to make decisions for myself!

Your life sucks because you suck. Get fucked beta

don't you mean 19th century

>Say that to China

China is disgusting and Chinese culture is a soulless insect culture where people walk over the dead bodies of their own countrymen and eat dogs because f their sheer lack of empathy.

Also their cities are filled with Trash. It's like a real life rendition of that book The Sheep Look Up

Should be noted that if you had 1.3 billion of your own countrymen you would probably care less about them yourself.

...

>birthplace of confucianism
>now has the most disrespectful, disgusting, ignorant people in the world

communism was a mistake

> Chinese culture is a soulless insect culture
and "Western culture" is just consumerism at this point

>cities are filled with Trash
and our's aren't

Ironically this dude would probably like the current state of China a lot.

If western culture is just consumerism to you then you chose to be surrounded by consumerists. Sucks that you decided plastic crap is better than people but that's how all you Veeky Forums geeks end up so eh

>and our's aren't

There's a difference between a reasonable level of trash like in western countries versus literal rivers of sludge and air so toxic that you need a fucking gasmask

He apparently doesn't understand that organic societies without welfare states have a social safety net provided by the chruch/community on an case by case basis
The Amish for example are more than willing to provide help to those who have genuinely fallen on bad times, but its not like they'll give you everything for nothing

In what world is the shitty excuse for welfare in America "Money for nothing"

>If western culture is just consumerism, you chose to be surrounded by consumerists
I'm not saying that it should remain this way, and I do to the best of my ability try to keep myself separate from what western culture is

>air so toxic that you need a fucking gas mask
point taken

Tell you what you try to enforce totalitarianism onto my country and i'll liberally apply my fist to your face in self defense you thug.

> Grow older
> Study political science, law and economics
> Support the status quo in a large portion of the issues, and emphasis the importance of legal traits and well functioning governance
feels kinda weird browsing political topics on Veeky Forums to be honest, where completely revamping the taxation of a country or shutting down immigration completely are considered to be moderate politics that are valid for parliamentary politics, and people seemingly honestly talking about abolishing banks, the world economy collapsing or genocide of certain groups being justified.

> He apparently doesn't understand that organic societies without welfare states have a social safety net provided by the chruch/community on an case by case basis
then why is the social safety net demonstrably worse in all of the developed economies without a strong welfare state, e.g US, UK, Eastern Europe and Asian Tigers?

90% of the people on here are surrounded by plastic anime figures and used food containers, Their phone is off because the only time they use it is to order Pizza, and the closest they have ever been to a real vagina was when they got called out by their classmates in community college for staring before they dropped out. You aren't talking to real humans who actually affect the world in positive way, you are talking to trash

>worse
what do you mean by this?
America alone puts 900 billion every year into Social Security alone, adding in other welfare spending in other federal, state and local programs. The welfare state in the US is about 25% of GDP

>shutting down immigration completely
well this one is probably the easiest to do, considering that immigration was brought to a trickle with the Johnson-Reed Act. Taxation laws are never really getting fixed because they're too convoluted to be solved within an election cycle.

Veeky Forums is a radical centrist board though.

>t. a person who didn't study the Soviet Union.

Did you know that Russia had an insane growth rate like China? You should check that

What part of soviet history, the part during the first few 5-year plans or the Brezhnev Era
if its the first that's something you can only really do once

>be passionate republican
>hate contemporary top-down >democracies
>hate classical liberalism
>hate neoliberalism even more
>hate illegitimate power attained through property
>hate illegitimate wealth claimed on account of property
>don't even know how to describe myself
>mfw

Japan literally had double the GDP growth and unlike Russia, they ended up as an industrialized country rather than a giant meth lab.

Once you're familiar with Japanese and Korean economic history, and know what convergence is, Soviet economic growth isn't even remotely impressive.

I'm at the "everything's fucked and there's no fix" stage of politics, and I only feel alive and hopefull about anything when I'm Church

> well this one is probably the easiest to do, considering that immigration was brought to a trickle with the Johnson-Reed Act. Taxation laws are never really getting fixed because they're too convoluted to be solved within an election cycle.
That's the case in US. In most European parliamentary democracies, immigration is completely a bureaucratic matter based largely on commonly agreed upon EU basic principles instead of something the minister of interior gets to magically control with some wand and quotas that say how many visas are given a year. Hell, most states still use immigration laws going back almost twenty years, and yet some parties have the audacity to say that they are stricter or less strict about immigration than the other one.

>when you hate marxists but you also like marxists
>when you hate liberals but you also like liberals
>when you hate conservatives but you also like conservatives
Heck.

Strangely enough, "convoluted and bureaucratic" describes our tax code to a T the federal tax code alone is some 7000 pages, and that's not even getting into weird devolution shit that's been passed in recent decades

Its not that i don;t have political views, I just know that change isn't gonna happen for a long while.

>that feel when you attain enlightenment and realize that governments and ideologies are just sideshows to the real things that make states work, which is a not-totally-dickish political class and an uninterrupted supply of food and distractions for the masses
>that feel when utopia is impossible because flawed humans can only create flawed ways of managing their society
>my face when god was a dream of perfect government

HURRRRRRRRRR HISTERYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY
Fuck off, alt-light retard.

cuck

>not-totally-dickish
Fucking hell you pussy just say "humane"
Why does everyone talk like this
>ugh you know religion is so simple it's just "don't be a dick" lmao
>le hitler was such a dick lmao

Democracy doesn't exist.
Holy fuck this entire board is filled with /pol/tards.
Good. Democracy is cancer, another disgusting authority.

>study status quo
>become brainwashed
>support status quo
Typical moron.
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Reading How Few Remain is so painful

>uninterrupted supply of food and distractions for the masses
but its around this time in the histories of great nations they're starting to pass their peak, depending on how much stock you put in John Glubb

because governments don't need to be humane, retard. idiom and jargon are used when they're actually applicable, but if you want me to be more articulate then I'll say that the political class has to meet a low and superficial threshold of concern for the state and those living in it.