Religion

Does anyone else wish they could believe in one of the world's major religions in the same way "people of simple faith do"? Why must I be cursed with an overdeveloped tendency toward critical reflection? Doesn't matter whether it's Islam or Christianity (apostolic varieties obviously), or some other religion.

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>living in bad faith as opposed to realizing the ultimate nature of the dialectic and engaging in radical freedom

*molests you*

hello padre

If you aren't raised in a religious household it's almost impossible to become genuinely religious later in life. Believe me I've tried, but couldn't do it.

I was raised in a very religious family. I still have a hard time believing it.

What the fuck is wrong with you people. Why do you pretend that you want to believe things you don't actually think are true. This is just insane levels of meta self-deception.

Because atheism is nihilistic cultural marxism and religion is BASED.

So just start believing then

Isn't it scientifically shown that religious people tend to be happier?

As Pascal said, kneel down and you will believe. Just start practicing rituals even if you lack faiths, just keep an open mind and ask God for guidance even if you do not yet belive in Him.

I invite you to accept a hierarchy of the intellect.
Children need Santa Claus to lead good lives.
"People of simple faith" need God to lead good lives.
The reflective and the inquisitive need only themselves to lead good lives.

"People of simple faith" make up such a majority that it's difficult to separate your needs from theirs; the constant denigration of and condescending to atheists reinforces this disparity. Don't feel "cursed" though; just smile and say whatever lies will satisfy the people of simple faith—after all, they don't know any better!

Id rather kill myself than take Fagtianity seriously.
It is if your a dumbass.

you need to try harder to see the light at the end of the tunnel

>Pascal
kek'd

>justness is an objective standard that exists above God himself and can be used to juge Him

Watch the J. B. Peterson lectures on the psychological significance of religion, they're all on YouTube. It will make it easier for you to adapt religion and its values without actually believing in "the invisible man in the sky".

Or, you could try psychedelics. They definitely unlock the religious side of your brain.

No born again Christian believes in an "invisible man in the sky."

Stop hunting idiotic strawmen and start thinking for yourself.

Perhaps your arrogant narcissism is getting the way of admitting you are not the pinnacle of evolution that you think you are.

not sure if bait or retarded

Just means all crimes get punished. You give $10 to 99 homeless people and murder one of them, and you to to prison for murder.

Period.

not sure if child or mentally challenged

because its much more comfy to delude yourself into thinking you'll go to heaven after you die and be reunited with dead loved ones, than to admit that death really is the end.

>implying there isn't evidence that God exists.

I an atheist hurrr durrr me stronk mind!

>Good is whatever God says it is
>Goodness is determined simply by whoever is most powerful
>If god didn’t exist then ethics would be determined by whoever currently wielded the most power

Kill yourself christcuck scum

Yeah, but when people who were raised in religious households become non-religious, they tend to become retarded Alex Jones, Planet Niburu, anti-vaxx conspiracytards.
I have several friends who were raised in strict Catholic, Evangelical, and Islamic families and when they lost their faith as early adults/late teenagers, their spirituality was replaced with "THE ILLUMINATI IS CONTROLLING EVERYTHING".
They need a grand narrative for their lives but they're too dumb to actually study philosophy.

>Or, you could try psychedelics. They definitely unlock the religious side of your brain.

Psychedelics unlock a interconnectedness with nature and the ability to see reality for what it really is side of your brain. It's not so much religious but I guess it is somewhat of a "spiritual" experience.
There is a high chance you will become a dirty new age hippy though.

Give me evidence right now you absolute spaz.

Different user btw

The way the trees move, the way the birds flap their wings. The wind when it blows. The sun when it shines.

Love, how love develops.

Many other miracles occur everyday but for you to turn a blind eye to these things and run around with a videocamera saying "SHOW ME EVIDENCE OF GOD SO I CAN RECORD IT" is exactly going to make this evidence never show itself. You must have faith in order for your God to return it.

He is a good lender, and just too. Your life you should give back to him in due faith and mentality at least a little.

the most conceited shit i've ever read on this board

>I’m retarded

Well, I dont know what else I expected from a christcuck, but thanks for your input

t. Euthyphro

Just how it is, pal. God is as much of a coping mechanism as Santa is; there is nothing wrong with that.

>Or, you could try psychedelics. They definitely unlock the religious side of your brain.

This. If you really want to believe but have a hard time getting into it, dropping acid will help immensely. You don't even need to confront it, just let yourself go.

So I am someone who has fucked with a fair amount of psychedelics, and I once had a particular acid trip that landed me under arrest and in the hospital, but while unconscious in this hospital I had a very intense spiritual experience; I won't attempt to describe it here. Afterwards, however, I immediately became very religious in a way I never had been for several years, and indeed I've seen the same pattern in many of my peers who have used psychedelics as well.

The thing is, I'm not so sure anymore. I believe that there must have been a prime mover to begin the universe and I think there are many rules of this reality we do not yet understand and as such would label supernatural phenomena. But a LOT of people I know tha are religious got that way because of drugs, and I can't help but ask the question, why are we all so sure that psychedelics showed us the truth, rather than just spinning us the fuck out?

What religion did you start following after your experience?

Catholicism. My parents were new age types but dad's parents were Catholic. In the dream, God showed me the non-two-dimensional nature of time, brought me through some of my past, showed me what my life could be if I stopped fucking up and doing drugs and got my shit straightened out. Told me I needed to be Catholic right now.

The doctor said I was repeating "In nomine patris, et filii, et spiritus sancti" while I was out, which sounds like hollywood shit but it's what they told me. Either way, it stuck for a while but eventually it wasn't enough. Strting leaning towards Eastern Orthodoxy but a lot of Norse Paganism appeals to me very strongly as well. Now I'm not convinced that religion isn't just a way for us to dodge responsibility for and awareness of many hardships in this life. /blogpost

>Told me I needed to be Catholic right now
Then why stop?
You don't believe it was Him but just your brain acting up?

As I applied to myself to understanding the faith with the tenacity of a convert I eventually started arguing with fags on leddit over matters of doctrine and /pol/-tier shit, and found myself arguing that the faith decreed things that my rational mind disagreed with.

I was performing mental gymnastics in order to prove my points, and while I did it well enough to btfo retards on reddit, it left a bad taste in my mouth. Ultimately I think psychedelics just opened my mind to the possibility of spirituality and the first place my brain went to was the Church. All religions have their bits of truth, we hve to trawl through them in progression. By increasing the variety of perspectives available to us, we gain a more complete concept of the whole

>Does anyone else wish they could believe in one of the world's major religions in the same way "people of simple faith do"?
I don't desire being stupid.

>Why must I be cursed with an overdeveloped tendency toward critical reflection?
I don't think you truly are. There's a distinction between critical thinking (e.g., when programming and doing math) versus solitary contemplation (e.g., taking a solitary stroll during a reverie).

>Doesn't matter whether it's Islam or Christianity (apostolic varieties obviously), or some other religion.
You sound ridiculous.

That said, each religion is also an infinite rabbit hole in and of itself. You can spend a lifetime studying one path or studying all of them, or onl focusing on the material world. There's more than enough information to parse through for each of our individual consciousnesses to learn a lot. Like Veeky Forumstory, our recorded database of human trial and error

Come to think of it, acid really does help comprehend shit like this

Sounds retarded. You seem like you have some kind of brain damage.

You're just blabbering bullshit. I'm really tired of knuckleheads who trip out and think "they've got it". There's a difference between a fugue state with Infinity, brought about by frequent solitude in natural scenery, versus tripping out. People like you lead people astray and just add to the cesspool of madness. Deep down you know how what you're saying is bullshit and really helps no one, so stop it.

I actually agree with you that psychedelics generally do result in idiots spouting >dude weed lmao tier bullshit but this is actually a pretty rational position. Every religion is its parent culture's codified knowledge or intuition about reality and how best to both act within it and conceive of it. Each of these codes are obviously going to be both dense and deep and therefore warrant what could amount to a lifetime of study in order to extract the total of its wisdom, which is why we see so many very intelligent individuals live as monks or professors of theology. That you can devote yourself fully to one tradition is obvious, but it isn't that crazy to study multiple religions as you go in order to derive whatever principles most resonate with your own values and lived experience.

no u

>The way the trees move, the way the birds flap their wings. The wind when it blows. The sun when it shines.
There is no God beyond these. If you can't see Infinite in these, without positing a retarded first cause, then you are a scoundrel.

Agreed :)

Life is indeed a proof. So are people, and God raises your understanding so you can see that.

You're blabbering perennialist bullshit and trying to level all traditions as offering an equal pathway to "liberation". However, these are just the abstractions of others; when you cling to them, you become no different than the brain-dead rabble. You took drugs and became a bit megalomaniac, but ultimately, you came back right here, gaining nothing. The goal is to see the Infinite right here, right now, not through drugs, but through clear perception which solitary contemplation offers. Contemplation and wisdom are one and the same. The Infinite does not exclude 'what is not', that is your denial of 'what is', however.

The goal is to see the Infinite in "The way the trees move, the way the birds flap their wings. The wind when it blows. The sun when it shines." There is no God beyond these or their negation.

There is no God.

In a 1991 interview, Kuklinski recalled one of the few murders he later regretted committing:

"It was a man and he was begging, and pleading, and praying, I guess. And he was 'Please, God'n all over the place. So I told him he could have a half an hour to pray to God and if God could come down and change the circumstances, he'd have that time. But God never showed up and he never changed the circumstances and that was that. It wasn't too nice. That's one thing, I shouldn't have done that one. I shouldn't have done it that way.[5]"

You think because God lets a man die that he isn't real?

He intervenes all the time. In the way things turn out, how things are discovered, the way God fundamentally pushes society forward. In this way, God loves everyone.

Your argument is about as logically consistent as saying that because there are starving children, God isn't real. It doesn't make any sense.

God doesn't exist. It could be that if mankind survives long enough he will create a God via Transhumanism, but I personally doubt this will happen. There are alright arguments for this.

However, in this actual world, there is no bottom turtle. The whole Universe is one body breathing in fractal complexity, and the motion of fractal complexity cannot be separated from itself. It is only the motion and interweaving movement or blurring between opposites like real unreal. The goal is to bring the imaginative mind in identity with infinity, which is more real than the real. However, there is no "bottom turtle", "prime mover".

It is, ultimately, just your mind at the end of the day, aka epistemological solipsism.

Hey man, where's your argument.jpg

My argument is basically a mish-mash of Deleuze and Derrida that I don't want to get into. It'll get tiresome. Do you think the differential ontologists or object-oriented ontologists are more on target?

*tips fedora*

Bit unrelated but does Jesus have any possible Gnostic connections?

Read into Vaishnavism and texts like the Bhagavad Gita and Srimad Bhagatavam. You're not just told what to believe in Vaishnavism, but are expected to apply the teachings, investigate reality, and verify the teachings yourself. Thus you don't simply have faith in God, but knowledge of God.

>Does anyone else wish they could believe in one of the world's major religions in the same way "people of simple faith do"? Why must I be cursed with an overdeveloped tendency toward critical reflection? Doesn't matter whether it's Islam or Christianity (apostolic varieties obviously), or some other religion.

The Jews (and other Abrahamics) stand between evidence of God and public knowledge of that evidence because they insist on LARPing as God. Just because you redefine the word "God" to refer to "raping, pillaging, murdering lynch mob" doesn't turn God into a raping, pillaging, murdering lynch mob.

youtube.com/watch?v=guDtapkH7zM

What's so hard about?
The more I hear about the problems in thw world I understand that allah was right desu.

>The goal is to see the Infinite right here, right now, not through drugs, but through clear perception which solitary contemplation offers.
Yet nowadays most people wouldn't stop for a second to appreciate such things and even consider realities above their materialistic perception, especially in the western world. Psychedelics truly open your mind up for those things, and while it might be a lowly pathway to spirituality, its a pathway for people who would never take other, more respectable pathways.

>and I once had a particular acid trip that landed me under arrest and in the hospital
that is literally my biggest fear

>subjective concept that no human agrees on is objective and I happen to be the one who knows its objective definition

I've tripped plenty and I kind of get the whole "spiritual" thing, but it never inspired me towards belief in a god or even anything supernatural. I do think I understand how the human brain works a bit better, as well as the importance of myth or religious thinking in general. Kind of like how psychologists often use myth to explain the mind.

In general tripping does make me feel like I'm in some sort of myth. Sometimes it feels like I'm in a dream-time where time is gone and the world is strange and malleable. Sometimes in an Otherworld that is like a more perfect reflection of ours, and usually full of spirits; in this instance I feel a personal relatonship with the land around me. Sometimes it's like a mythic age of heroes where the land seems drenched in history and meaning and I'm generally filled with a sense of wonder and inspiration. And then sometimes when I'm really extra tripped out it seems like I can see through everything to the fundamental architecture of the earth, looks really griddy and planned out.


Note that these are when I'm on quite a lot of acid, normal trips don't elicit such strong sensations.

>difference between a fugue state with Infinity, brought about by frequent solitude in natural scenery, versus tripping out
as someone who's done both, there isn't as much of a difference as you think.

Yes, usually when you trip you'll just have a fun silly time, but sometimes you'll grasp something that's almost identical to what you grasp after long meditation

I laugh whenever I read these posts. I am so confused. What is this guy's position? I don't understand the pictures.

From what I understand, he is God or a god and judaism/christianism is an evil plot against the pharaohs of egypt and the true gods.

>do you wish to abandon sexual pleasure, freedom of thought and gender equality?

No thanks.

This. It's pretty sad. It's like releasing a zoo-raised lion into the wild.

It is impossible to believe in religion if you are reasonable, however, I have no problems with a simple belief in God, in fact, I think it's the default, and I think atheism is a cultural product of Christianity itself.

Hell isn't a literal place, and is certainly not a lake of fire. Hell is simply separation from God

>atheism is a cultural product of Christianity

Yeah because there totally aren't people who were raised extremely traditional Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Shinto, Zoroastrian, etc. who don't believe in religion. But you're partially right. In the West, it's accurate accurate because it's the predominant religion.

>and I think atheism is a cultural product of Christianity itself.
Damn, how did those ancient Greek and Indian atheists do it.

Honestly, I think it's less rare among those groups you mentioned than in Europe. Even in a country like Japan, where most people say they are "irreligious" on surveys, they still practice ancestor worship among other things.

I think Nietzsche's argument was essentially correct, that since Christianity stresses the truth so vehemently, and Jesus does it as well, it was simply a matter of time before someone used that idea as sword of truth against Christianity itself(e.g the scientific worldview and scientific skepticism itself).

biblical citation plz

Revelation 19:20 Then the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who worked signs in his presence, by which he deceived those who received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image. These two were cast alive into the lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Revelation 20:10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

Revelation 20:14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Revelation 20:15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.

Yes, God dictates what is good and what is evil.

Hence we have, and you do not, an objective basis for morality, and ours is enforced from above.

Here's some more

Mark 9:43 “And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:”

Mark 9:44 “Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.”

Mark 9:45 “And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:”

Mark 9:46 “Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.”

Mark 9:47 “And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:”

Mark 9:48 “Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.”

The bible calls the kind of drug trip you were on sorcery.

I get why he's saying this, because in Hell there is an absence of God (lack of water, blood, presence)
But user, good and evil are subjective moral scales. God doesn't deal in the subjective.

So your drug trip led to to become a Catholic.

You made a lateral move.

The dead man saw God the next instant, and the murderer will see God as the last thing he ever sees.

I like that. Mark quotes Isaiah.

Again, because you do not have God in your worldview, you have no objective basis for morality.

All you have are basically opinions.

>Again, because you do not have God in your worldview, you have no objective basis for morality.
Right off the bat with this? I'm Christian, user. God Bless.

>I get why he's saying this, because in Hell there is an absence of God (lack of water, blood, presence)

What did he mean by this?

Thanks. I'm an atheist, but biblical literacy is really important as cultural touchstone.

>implying the relativity of morals changes just because God commands them

It's still his opinion, my dude.

You have no proof at all that God shares your morality though.
It's nothing more than a belief.

Is something just because God likes it, or does God like things that are just?

>But user, good and evil are subjective moral scales. God doesn't deal in the subjective.

Things no Christian ever said.

It is indeed. And backed with his power.

You can rebel against God, user. You just cannot win.

This christian is saying it, now.

>No true scotsman

God bless you, regardless.

God does not share my morality; what a horrorshow that would be.

God is Just. If there were no God, there would be nothing Just.

>objective basis for morality
Uh-huh, that's why differing denominations/sects/cults/religions exist. It appears your divinity is really bad at getting the message across to humanity.

And how did you become a Christian?

What's it to you? You don't care about my faith, you care about your faith. Are you Christian?

Different Christian groups have God as the objective basis for their morality. Different religious groups have their own gods for a more subjective basis for their morality. Atheists have themselves as their own judges.

Color me shocked that you have no idea how a person becomes a Christian.

See, if I said I was a Freemason, and you asked me how to become a Freemason, and I had no idea, you, as a rational human being, could come to the conclusion that I lied about being a Freemason.

I didn't tell you how I became a christian, simple as that. What are you going on about, Jason?

Don't forget the biological inclination toward group dynamics that affects everyone sans psycho/sociopaths. This is a far more measurable and objective morality than the thousands of conflicting religious myths allegories throughout history.

>moving the goalpost

Daily reminder to ignore Christposting. It's LARPing at best, and dishonest apologetics at worst.