Pump and Dump - Explained

This Conversation just happened in regards to XLM and in response to this comment.
>wonder where this will take us , volume is fading a bit

I just thought I might be helpful to some people. At the very least you can be aware this happens and take advantage of it or avoid getting caught holding bags as it dumps.

These P&D in no way take away from the value of the coin/token in question in real terms as they usually have products behind them (or they don't and are shit coins) but these spikes can destroy the integrity of a coin in the short term and cause people to buy high and sell low. Try to not do that.

Other urls found in this thread:

coinmarketcap.com/currencies/posw-coin/
twitter.com/AnonBabble

samefag fuck off

Clear signs they are shilling for a coin and threads to watch out for if you miss the buy-in humps.

>Threads saying 'I just made 100% on my investment in X coin. These will usually be smaller threads lower down the page but try to come across as genuine.
>Threads offering X BTC but also mentioning a coin. These are used to get the coins name to the top of the page (usually they involve a picture of the coin) so people will 'research' the coin by looking further down the page. Then they see the 'I made 100% profit' thread.
>Pure hype threads such as

There are more methods they use but you can usually tell it is happening by the appearance of 3-4 threads on the same coin that are not usually present on the board within a short time of each other.

there are also smaller groups who operate in the same way and who are harder to spot but the giant P&D groups like we just saw in XLM you can't really miss.

PIC: the wall they put up to throttle the trades, they had these on 3 exchanges for XLM. It is a good time to cash out. There was also 1mil+ buys bellow this that you can't see. The wall jsut fences off the price so they can offload their bags and it also makes people think 'wow look at all those people who want to buy! I better buy quickly' Do not, this is their peak and they will sell and leave.

PIC: Notice the bumps leading up to this. This is where the scammers will be buying into the currency. It is a good indicator something is going on and a great time to buy in yourself.

On coins where they are not being P&D then it can be an indicator of insider knowledge so it is usually worth buying into coins that do this anyway. Up to you, best to do research on that one as they usually have something in the works business-wise and its usually a wife or family friend of a CEO that gets the insider knowledge and buys.

Again, none of this means that the coin or token is worthless, in the long term many of these manipulated stocks will gain value and the scammers will be forced to move on to easier targets. It can, however, cripple a coins legitimacy as people lose faith in it (or they die because the business involved irl sucked). Which is one reason I am telling you this, also because I do not wish people to get scammed. If you can read it right then you can make a killing trading off these scams. But as you notice and sell into their buys when they put up the wall. You can quickly make big profits doing this, just don't waste it on shit coins after but that is your problem.

(you)
no

This is free money if you can spot it happening. Why should Pajeets and the chink bots have all the fun?

If any rich fags wanted to outsourcing it to China or India and paying them to do it for you might be a gold mine business wise. Or just get bots I suppose if you can write code.

As for me, I am just a poorfag passing on some info from my drug raddled autistic brain. Do with it as you wish and I hope it helps anybody reading it.

Err the drugs were years ago. I don't know why I said that. Oh well. I am probably mad anwyay :)

how do you tell the difference between a bump like this and genuine people buying? or does it not matter

Anybody who doesn't like that I've tried telling the fish about this then just remembers that you are essentially bottom feeders. There are plenty more fish in the sea.

good

If it's a pump and dumps then there will usually be a few threads about it by the end of the bump or as it starts going up. It will still give you a good profit, it is more about watching for the walls and selling when you see them.

Noticing the initial bump is luck really. Hit and miss. there are usually two bumps a small one and then another though from what I have seen but that is not always the case. Worst case scenario you bought something in a dip, as long as it wasn't a crashing crypto you shouldn't lose much and the rewards are worth it. It is up to you if you want to take the risk. I mostly do long-term holds, to be honest. I have just been obsessing over graphs and the exchanges for a few years, mostly in stocks before this where this doesn't happen as much as it is more regulated and illegal but this is crypto. It's the Wild West.

>pajeet puts up a wall on kraken
>everyone sees shocking kraken price, doesn't compare volume between exchanges
>wow arbitrage bots will quickly make up this difference, better buy
it's a self reinforcing cycle perpetuated by the distributed gambling networks known as crypto exchanges + social media

Aye, the social media is a big part. It would be nice if at least Veeky Forums was free of it. Or t least if everybody knew about it so we could capitalise on it. It is an impossible battle maybe as there will always be new fish. It is the ones who keep spamming the hype train shill threads because they have bags that gets old quickly, once the scammers have gone. Oh well, I have done my part I guess.

seriously though this cycle is fucking retarded and it's how whales draw up prices across multiple exchanges and unload their bags onto a new generation of people who have to market them to the next generation

The exchanges really are god awful, half of them if not more are based in China or India. It keeps the money flowing into Crypto I guess. There is no way to really beat them at their own game either that I can think of. Better to just go with it and sell your bags to them once it peaks. It really does mess up the markets though. XLM had 3 exchanges with walls on them earlier at the same time, what a shit show.

Is this a P&D?

Pyramid/ponzie schemes are like that I guess. That is all it is essentially. I don't really like it but maybe the (((banks))) getting in on it will help and legitimize it. There will still be a de-regulated crypto market though even if they do make a 'legitimate' one. That will draw normies money from the de-reg one. I guess that is ok as not that many venture into crypto anyway past the odd fish.

coinmarketcap.com/currencies/posw-coin/

It could be, there are two threads shilling it and a lot of 1post posters in those threads. Might be legit and just somebody shilling for their company. The graph does have a bump in it though... I doubt it will be a large scale one if it is. Might be worth a shot I guess. You are probably as good a judge as me.

The solution is simple. Just buy a coin no one is shilling.

You need a lot of capital to initiate the pump (and to put up the walls) and either bots or people to spam multiple boards to get an effective pump and dump. That might just be a dev shilling their coin or more likely imo it is a smaller group of people, maybe a Reddit group or something with 100 or so whales in it trying to pump it.

OFC It could just be a good product, I have never seen that coin before so I wouldn't know as I have not researched it. The threads and more importantly the people replying look a bit too full of hype to me though to be 100% legit.

1post

etc

they also seem to be selling a wallet? No idea to be honest. There are some posters on there with multiple posts who seem to know what the company is about but they could be shills also.

Ther are really obvious ones though so even if you miss out on 50/50 ones then I wouldn't worry. You won't lose a lot giving it a go but is it worth the transaction fees getting money onto the exchange? up to you. I wouldn't hang around waiting for a big spike for more than 5-6 hours though, have a look on the board for more threads popping up, if multiple PoSW threads pop up then its a good sign somethings happening. Also, check Reddit and other places they prey upon. The graph is spiking or looks like it is so it might be worth a dabble anyway.

this is a good solution but the problem is that the hard truth is that most people are too stupid to do their own research properly and just rely on the opinions of others for what they should spend their money on, because anecdotes can be more compelling than facts to some. what tends to work well for the average person is just look at everything that is shilled, but pay the most attention to the things that are shilled the least and the most honestly, and consider how well it could catch from real demand down the road if it were to actually do that. then people will be arguing about floors far above your principal, then you can finally feel what the "successful" pump group runners feel like, but in a morally clean way.

That is true. Don't feed the trolls or in this case, don't feed the scammers. The problem is when has don't feed the trolls ever worked? lol. There are way too many people to organize to not end up feeding them. Even if all of Veeky Forums stopped they would find more victims.

MEMEing them to death would work. If you could spread memes explaining this situation and get them viral so everybody knows.

"nice just bought 100k" was an early solution

I'm out, as you said I don't want to liquidate my LINK/FUN only to get dumped on again, but on another exchange. They're talking about running some sort of master nodes which they claim can yield ~$100/day, which is interesting.

Yeah, a lot of problems happen once the scammers have finished their dirty work. you get far too many people carrying on the shill once they have gone because they buy into it entirely. I think making MEMEs to warn people would e the only solution to get it into common knowledge around crypto investing circles so newbies get in the know before they get their assets wiped by a pajeet.

That user does have the answer though. Just stop feeding them your money and they will have to stop. I wonder how much of the crypto market would crash if that happened. It could wipe billions off it. It would be a short-term loss for the market which would recover and it would also make normies feel safer using it too which would ultimately bring in a lot more money.

Even abusing what they do you are helping them and taking part in the scam. Which isn't great. It is an if you can't beat them join them scenario. If memes would beat them though, the short-term loss would pale in comparison to the long-term market gains and we would all be early adopters. now the market has Tech backing it up too it is less of a pyramid scheme and slowly becoming legitimate. Removing the scammers would go a long way to securing the crypto market long term and would eventually make fiat currencies redundant.

I just had a thought as well, this is probably North Korea doing a lot of this. They buy a lot of weapons with BTC. We could literally shut down the NK war machine with memes and prevent WW3 while making ourselves rich in the process.

>In theory.
>citation needed.

Yeah, I noticed those. the problem is people new have no idea what the meme means. Even if they do realise it is a piss take of the scammers then it has no substance to it.

Doing a Screenshot of this thread would be a start maybe and making some decent memes up about it with a bit of info on them. Christ, it worked for /pol/ and their Nazi holocaust denial obsession lol.

Yeah, I wouldn't liquidate current investments for it, only if you have the BTC or some spare cash to invest in them.

I saw the node thing. I would have to look into it more and I cba really lol. It took me long enough to read through a few other coins white papers, if this coin even has one of those. I have my long-term holdings set in place for now and I'm saving for a car now.

true pyramids and unsustainable schemes will collapse on their, it's only a matter of time
i can't wait to see the fireworks from bitconnect, laser, bitpetite, hextracoin, regalcoin, etc. but who knows, they could outstrip madoff at this pace. i truly hope we have reached peak greater fool in this regard.
who am i to care about what other people do with their money, right? except they're not just burning it, they're giving it to people who often times have much worse intentions that they ever dreamed of doing with it.

good thread

we should really educate each other here

to bad we can't mod

I start far too many sentences with 'yeah' I must be tired. I'm out for the night. Feel free to take over the thread or whatever. Peace ladies n gents I shall be back in 8n hour-ish if it's still up.

Link this thread to any fish you see biting maybe lol.

Do you really need to PnD a company that just partnered with IBM? I think the news itself is enough for a sustained multi-week pump.

I think with XLM, it's simply a matter of institutional buying. The more the word gets out about this partnership, the more big money flows into it.

Thanks. Yes, more mods would help.

It may collapse at some point. Perhaps BTC will survive even if it does and be taken in by the regulated network of crypto to be used as a gold standard. It is ashame as the whole point was to be de-regulated but this is why people can't have nice things. They abuse them.
Yep, I bet more crypto money gets filtered into the pockets of dictators than your regular pajeet scammer. Event the pajeets are bad enough. I would bet that NK has heavy stakes in this game. If I don't wake up tomorrow I will know why lol.

Pic: I wish. I turned them off years ago.

They are doing it because it is cheap and has a rocket ship as the emblem. It is easy to shill. The actually coin will rise in value naturally in time, but these scammers are actually reducing the rate at which it will do this due to them making people loose trust in is as the P&Ds keep happening and those not in the know only see big spikes and crashes and an unstable market. The pajeets don't give a shit, they are jumping on it for the above reason and the IBM stuff only helps them shill it etc.

Right defo going now. Have fun kiddies.

Well, the holohoax is indeed a real hoax.

Yeah, reading and validating white papers takes too much time only to miss the P&D.

OP, I simply don't understand why you brought XLM into this PnD issue. Perhaps you're butthurt because you got burned. The hype is real. The partnership with IBM is real. The Paypal buzz is real. Imagine when Paypal reps are at the upcoming 20/20 conference. All these companies pitching them their products. Then Stellar steps in. These guys are already partnered with IBM. That's legitimacy right there.

there are whales that are begging for the liquidity to unload because they know we are at a fiat high but they are literally unable to cash out. people were saying the exact same things about the credibility a world leader like vladimir putin and the EEA could give to ethereum at the very top, too.

*Because they just want a quick payoff which they get by pumping and dumping, they can do it every night or several times a day if they play it right. the could be making millions a day or more. Especially if NK is involved.

Hopefully, this thread gets more added to it. Maybe a few memes would be good?

Get a clue, man. The crypto market is unstable because it's 1000s of companies with no real world applications. XLM just got that real world application and it sets them apart from 99.9% of the other coins. That's why you see such volume and upward movement. Look at the chart. XLM dropped just like all the other coins did when BTC was mooning. Then it started making legs up. Strong spike, then sideways movement, then strong spike, then sideways movement. There's absolutely nothing unusual about XLM's price movement relative to this market.

So, it's your opinion that XLM has been manipulated by a bunch of whales that got trapped in an altcoin? Wow, dude.

I have XLM for long-term holding. It was just a really good example that happened tonight. I have stated several times that it takes nothing away from the actual XML value (if anything these P&D plus the insecurity if fosters keeps the price down) and it's potential. It does, however, push unnecessary uncertainty into the markets. This was a way of explaining P&D and in no way bashing XLM. The market has problems and needs to get these scammers who manipulate the price out of the market for it to survive with any legitimacy.

By the way....BUY THE DIP.

it's unstable more because liquidity is the number one issue, institutional traders can barely function with how low it is.

they didn't get "trapped in an altcoin", it's a combination of whales who bought it long before the shitcoin boom of this year, bagholders from the boom looking for an exit, and the BILLIONS OF LUMENS THAT HAVE BEEN AIRDROPPED. Lumens are fine and there's nothing wrong with the underlying technology, but you're not seeing the forest for the trees.

Yes, but pajeets are causing legitimate currencies to suffer because they are operating the same way they did with the currencies that had no real-world application and that were essentially BTC knockoffs.

Deep breaths user, deep breaths. Right. I am buggering off. Enjoy, remember this was a P&D thread, not a thread to bash XLM!

Come on, man. You have hundreds of start ups with new ICOs everyday. These are companies with zero products, just ideas. How can you have a stable market with those kinds of companies? You can't. But you're blaming the whales? I don't get it.

Good good.
NOw how do I profit from this without perpetuating a scam?

Also, I can code, I can write something that can detect P&D but i dont have the financial background to do so, anyone wanna team up? THis would be for biz so we can all make it (instead of being crabs in the bucket), we can all drive lambos!

Write a program that can detect unusual volume/volatility in coins

so a sudden increase in volume is enough of an indicator? for a pump, ipresume

That's every single coin. Have fun with that.

Yes, but implementation of how much volume warrants an alert is up to you. For example, 10% higher volume in the past five minutes.

you're not going to get sound ideas about how to make a money machine on this board, and by the nature of it, it won't be a money machine for long. stop fundamentally misunderstanding the market, thinking that we can all have lambos and pathetic shit like that that just invites retards. lambo talk is one of the biggest red flags around.

You can always just monitor a few coins from a given exchange

We can always give the option to specify your parameters:

x volume change over y time

Is it really that simple to spot a P&D?

This was not a P&D, you were all just idiots. East coast burgers were going to sleep, so less and less people were trading. I told everyone to stop trading by 5:00 PST, but everyone kept saying
>muh 1000 satoshi ATH

no it's not that simple. you would need a lot more metrics and you need to group pairings/coins into categories where specific behavior would typify something like a pre-pump, where the same behavior in another could would be completely normal.

What do you think about ZEN OP

lol nope. Volume either way is truly unpredictable imo. There may be indicators but you never know when someone or a group of people with deep pockets can come along and completely shut down whatever your indicators were telling you.

Well, the code will have to identify volatile and non-volatile period by watching a specific coin, of course. But I think volume is a big indicator, though.

Volume and price? It would just alert of any major movements

Don't forget that any rational questioning or pointing out that their predictions don't pass muster will be met with responses that don't address or answer your concern but start off with
>Don't be a faggot

and remember pic related
>You're a fucking idiot

that and statements which are formed purely to foment FOMO. they're extremely common, and it's natural to get caught up in the optimism as we're (((supposed to be))) social creatures. manipulators of every kind are the most successful in this game.