Is suicide immoral/cowardly?

>Implying the course of my life should be determined based on the feelings of others
>Implying I don't have the ultimate right to terminate my own existence whenever I please
>Implying bringing children into a world of suffering because muh feefees isn't selfish

>Actions taken against the will of others are the same as actions taken of your own will against yourself

There is no logic in your post.

>People without personal fortitude to plow through their hardships

You don't understand suicidal depression.

When you commit suicide (unless your under threat or a worse death) you are running from your problems instead of fixing them

No one gives a shit that someone you knew committed suicide. Get off your high horse

That's such a myopic and outdated view on suicide.

For the most part suicide isn't a rage quit on life, m8. It's the last stop on your brain telling you you're a piece of shit and the world would be better off without you in it.

Few people commit suicide just because life's hard and they don't want to do it. And even still how are you the authority on judgment for what constitutes cowardly? How is a person who is terminally ill a coward for wanting to end their pain sooner rather than later?

You're making a truth claim about a morality question, so you are by necessity invoking objective morality and exclusive truth.

Without God, there is no objective basis for morality. God says what is good, and what is evil, and enforces it from above.

Suicide is self-murder. Premeditated self-murder, and murder is evil. Suicide is evil. And immoral.

>your brain

You are incapable of discerning whether these thoughts are being generated by your mind or whether some other agency.

Well my god says murder is good and moral.

Checkmate, Abrahamists.

Well, you asked several questions, but im just answering your first one.

It depends on the context. For example, if I kill myself for the sake of curiousity for proving whethear god is wrong or not, it's not.
however, if its because of fear or something like that, its cowardly.

This is false
t. God

>You are incapable of discerning whether these thoughts are being generated by your mind or whether some other agency.
Lol

Yes, your god does.

You should seriously consider not having the devil as your god one more day.

"my life is meaningless and I should end it"

This, implanted in your mind, will make you think it is your own thought.

It is not.

Watch "Revolver". If you don't learn that entities can implant thoughts into your head, at least it's a good movie.

>revolver
>a good movie
Your opinions are worthless

The ancient Stoics were very supportive of suicide, particularly euthanasia.

>Some external entity puts thoughts in your mind
Who? Fuckin satan? Aliens?

>Watch a work of fiction to prove a point

Are you going to have me Invasion of the Body Snatchers next?

>implanted in your mind
Dude are you serious?

>This thread

We /x/ now

>Cowardly?
yes
>immoral?
shiggydiggy

>Matthew 4:7

Sure you'll find out, but at that point you'll either have completely ceased to exist or ended up in Hell.

Enjoy hell friend.

How can our thoughts be real if our brains aren't real?

>Suicide is bad and cowardly because you shouldn't do it
So this... is the power... of... Christianity

Its both immoral and cowardly. So is procreation. These are the two most absolute affirmations of the ego.

Whoever was the recipient of this "gift"?

>putting yourself out of your misery after a life of nothing but constant hardship is selfish and evil but forcing someone to live through life with constant mental anguish just so your feelings aren't hurt isn't

ok

I can understand a NEET like yourselves killing themselves doesn't effect anyone but explaine. For example how a man with a wife and children dependent on him killing himself is not bad and cowardly.

I believe I inferred that it was a fantastic movie.

And, just so you know, the opinion of worthless people is worthless.

That's like saying who? you? a human?

Sure, if you promise to an hero afterwards.

And since there is no option to completely cease to exist, that limits it even further.

then who was phone?

yes
a man is meant to be strong and not give up.
a man is meant to give his all for his family and tribe.
the individualism of the west will be its downfall. every mans a chief in his own mind.

It's immoral, but not unethical.

NOT OP but I was orphaned and have no close friends and usually the ones I do have only speak to me once every 3-5 months. Didn't socialize well because I was too focused on studying and trying to get a job, lisence, and apartment by the time I turned 18.

I think life is just a series of transient happiness and suffering. May I ask what there is in life which makes life a gift to you other than short lived fufillment or misery?

>immoral
According to what?

>cowardly
Can you take your own life right now? Taking your own life is one of the hardest thing a human can do. Even a small thing like pricking
your finger with a needle is hard for most humans. It requires courage, determination and resilience.

This, suicide is actually one of the bravest things you can do.

>entities
>hasn't even proven one entity yet making blanket assumptions about multiple entities

>filter themselves out of the genepool
Unless they have several children before they do it, like in the case of my father.

>suicide

Its kind of lame, I mean there are a lot of other things you could do (if you have some sort of incurable super cancer thats a whole different story) like fucking of to some other corner of the world a starting your life fresh.

Killing yourself (while totally your decision) can often be premature.

The coward part heavily depends on your situation, often people feel hopeless and paralyzed by things being fucked up in their lives and decide to bail on life rather than just the bad situation. That is hasty and somewhat poorly thought out decision making more than cowardice.

Morality is often over hyped, just try not to make shit worse for other people. With regards to Suicide that would be making sure its not messy, your not found by someone like a loved one who would be traumatized, you are actually found after the fact(dead bodies leave one hell of a stink and legal shit gets drawn out if you just get judged a missing person) and you ensure what ever financial shit there may be is sorted out so what stuff you care about is properly taken care of.

Most of the shit you see in movies like cutting makes or horrid mess or like the noose can be easily fucked up and either cripple you or leave you in horrific agony such as a poorly chosen bridge to jump off.

What is it that has you feeling hopeless?

Mental illness is a category error.

In my experience, suicidal thoughts come more from self-loathing rather than just being in a bad situation. Let me take you through the general thought process.

>Man this situation sucks
>It sucks because I suck and I can't fix it
>I can't fix it because I'm a piece of shit that can't do anything right and will always make the wrong choice
>Because I always fuck everything up and can't do anything right nobody is going to love me or want me, which makes sense because I don't love or want me either
>well fuck if I dont even love me or want me here, then why would anybody else want me here anymore? I better just die now

That is the headspace of most people that are suicidal. Now you can sit down and point out that there's several things wrong with that thought process, logically speaking, but the problem lies in those thoughts aren't really logical, hence suicidal depression being a mental illness. You're not thinking clearly. It's not just a "Well I'm going to cash out now" type of thing for most suicides. For most it's a warped frame of mind that has them genuinely believing the world would be better off without them.

I'd also like to add that suicidal depression generally comes from deeply rooted psychological issues caused either through trauma or repeated mental stress.

It's not something that just pops up at random or because you're having a tough time.

>Rebolbo gud moobie

youtube.com/watch?v=ooPdPYZpR2s

I just read Memoirs of Hadrian and in it the fictional emperor first considers suicide his right, but then cowardice, after asking for help affects two other people. His bodyguard nearly goes mad and his personal doctor kills himself to avoid breaking the Hippocratic Oath. He then considers how an emperor's suicide might affect the people.

The situation is a bit forced though. Old man not being able to do it himself (by drowning in a pond or something), the doctor being a fanatic in an unfair situation etc.

But are there not situations in which suicide is an act of great bravery?

To keep with the Roman theme, i would say Publius Decius Mus' sacrifice would definitely count as bravery. But killing yourself in battle doesn't really hold the same stigma I guess.

But I guess we're left with the boring answer that suicide can be both.

But this presumes that you have to care about things after your death. To some suicidal people the question is irrelevant.

>I was brought into this world against my will
You as a sperm had definitely the will to crush that egg ... but you forgot that as time goes by

The fiction clearly shows the emperor is a coward and can't commit suicide himself. Whether it was a narrative to paint suicide as a "coward" act or not, this is not a regular suicide.

A noble suicide or a brave suicide is filled throughout history in many different civilization. The whole japanese seppeku tradition is a noble act. The Romans and Greeks also had a similar tradition of noble suicide.

Socrates' suicide was entirely virtuous

>Is suicide immoral/cowardly?
absolutely not
>For example, I didn't choose to be born, I was brought into this world against my will, how could it possible be immoral for me to end my life?
it's absolutely not. In fact, it should absolutely be a legal right of anyone to get euthanized if they so desire for any reason they see fit. The fact that currently this is not the case and people are literally trapped in this prison called life with no way out is one of the most atrocious violation of human freedom and crimes against humanity i can think of. I

it's called the cowards way out for a reason.

Immoral probably not

>The fiction clearly shows the emperor is a coward and can't commit suicide himself.

good point

>Socrates' suicide was entirely virtuous

Because he was intodoctrinated into believing that state defines man... could he not have helped other people abroad?

No, I do. I was about to kill myself but decided to get my shit together instead.

I tried SSRIs but I found that 5-HTP worked just as well and started supplementing it regularly.

>implying it's all about you, you fucking narcissistic prick
Rousseau was a mistake

>being cowardice
Literally the only reason why i didn't an hero myself, is because im too fucking scared of actually doing it.
>wtf will happen after i die irl?
>wtf is afterlife?
>wtf will my friends, family and other people think of it?
>wtf will i miss to see after i die
>maybe there is still hope for me?

I wouldn't call it cowardly, it takes a lot to actually kill yourself

>it takes a lot to actually kill yourself
It takes lot more to stand up and fight like a man

>This
I know it's a bit of a meme to bring up, but look at the GGB jumpers. The moment they left the rail they realized every problem they had could be fixed but ow fug XD I already jumped. As a former suicidal faggot who nearly died from an attempt I can tell you it's almost always a temporary urge. That being said, I think Wendy O. Williams made a great argument as to a legitimate reason to end her life in her suicide note and that is one of the few cases I know of where I would argue it is rational and justified.

You know what's braver than that? Overcoming hardship and triumphing over the bitch that is life. If anything, live out of vengeance for all that has wronged you. The best revenge, after all, is to live well.

It depends on your method. If it's long and drawn out, there is a good chance you will puss out cuz it's everyone's natural instinct to want to live even if you are fucked up in the head. However, if you are on some drugs or choose a fast method (ex: gun to head) this instinct won't kick in properly. Hence why taking pills/bleach almost never kills you while gunshot or hanging will almost every time.

>The best revenge, after all, is to live well.
It's a wonderful expression. I just don't know how true it is. You don't see it turning up in a lot of opera plots. "Ludwig, maddened by the poisoning of his entire family, wreaks vengeance on Gunther in the third act by living well."

>>wtf will happen after i die irl?
you will cease to exist
>>wtf is afterlife?
a myth made up by scientifically illiterate humans thousands of years ago who couldn't either fathom, comprehend or deal with the FACT that they will cease to exist in an attempt to find solace in an imaginary place where you continue to exist after your body dies instead, that was further perpetuated and drilled into the heads of following generations of illiterate people and has unfortunately survived to this day despite our immense progress in science and reason.
>>wtf will my friends, family and other people think of it?
doesn't really matter
>>wtf will i miss to see after i die
you will die either way
>>maybe there is still hope for me?
Maybe. Wish you the best either way.

this but unironically

...

It's cowardly because you are running away from your problems. Most importantly, it's a mortal sin.

>worshipping demons

>is suicide cowardly
>nooo stop killing yourselves I MUST HAVE DOMINION OVER YOUR EXISTENCE

my niggas

>suicide
>cowardly

>cowardly
>cowardlyness/braveness values

>evil
>selfish
>muh others suffering

how more meme can you get
kys
sincerely

>have problem
>die
>problem still exists
!?!?

>immaterial supernatural beings exist

The overly intellectual types use their intellect to justify their mental illness(suicidal thoughts).

Make no mistake, you have a drive towards suicide, which stems from an unconscious part of your brain, and the rational faculties of your brain try to make sense of this drive. People are confused and think it works in reverse, which is the consequence of a blind ego.

Also don't confuse this mental illness(an imperfect term) as something that's permanent and incurable, it's very likely a temporary state of affairs.

It also might be your brain telling you "somethings gotta give".

>Making sure it's not messy

If it's worth doing, it's worth doing right. Do the Hemingway treatment. Double barrel shotgun in the mouth. Use slugs for 100% effectiveness lol

Cop friends have told me too many stories of people stumbling around in their driveway with half a brain, bleeding everywhere. I would have recommended suicide by shotgun, but honestly not anymore.
Helium is where it's at my nigga. Unlike an exit bag, you don't get the feeling of asphyxiation. You just have a about 15 seconds of deep breaths before you pass out, if you do it right.
The trick is doing it right.
The helium niggers have been adding more O2 to their canisters, to make suicide by helium harder. I think it's around 20%. I'm sure there's some process that can get rid of most of it, though.

I've heard that nitrogen is the same. Any inert gas, I guess. You exhale CO2 without replacing it with oxygen, so your body thinks everything is all good, while you just fall asleep and die, no pain, no panic, nothing. It sounds comfy. Less traumatic than finding dad's head sprayed all over the back of the garage lol

What a load of absolute trite. You aren't strong, you're a desperate fool.

It's simply not. For anyone.

It was a death sentence, not a voluntary act