BCAA thread

can anyone explain what these are, what they do, how they work, and why they're worth paying for? are there vegan BCAAs? should i be taking them?

thanks!

Other urls found in this thread:

strongerbyscience.com/hmb/
examine.com/supplements/creatine/
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4033492/
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24284442
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19083472
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19356906
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28145418
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26388782
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27175106
reddit.com/r/bodybuilding/comments/5o4g2z/data_does_not_support_a_benefit_to_bcaa/
vocaroo.com/i/s0S0q0SBcWHw
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3424729/
genome.jp/kegg-bin/show_pathway?org_name=hsa&mapno=00280&mapscale=&show_description=hide
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8915400
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20832409
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22331997
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16554972
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22819803
twitter.com/AnonBabble

>are there vegan BCAAs?
brewer's yeast, the most underrated food ever, IMO

>should i be taking them?
yes

Save your money. Won't be a noticeable difference for a novice.

like why should i take them. them look expensive.

>vegan

BCAAs are a tax on idiots

are you an elite-level barbell athlete?
no? you're a mentally ill attention whore who's too anxious to go to the gym?
good. don't take them.

post feminine penor

i still go to the gym in spite of my anxiety lol. and no i don't suffer from mental illness.

but the more i read about BCAAs (try to stay on topic now plz) the more it seems they might be helpful for someone like me? my testosterone levels when tested in january were lower than the average cis female my age. and i've been working out but can't seem to affect any change in my appearance. think maybe it's because my body is struggling hard to put muscle on and keep it on. would BCAAs not help me?

you don't lift at all. so don't bother taking bcaas

>body dysmorphia
>not a mental illness
LOVING
EVERY
LAUGH

i do too lift. why else would i be here lol

i don't have body dysmorphia :P

now does anyone want to talk BCAAs for real?

>would BCAAs not help me?
you're beyond help

Imo basically the only time you'd actually need BCAAs is when you're taking insulin.
And no one but IFBB pros take insulin because it 1 makes you less aesthetic
2 doesn't make you that much stronger
3 will make you a diabetic and
4 stands a decent shot at fucking killing you

I wanna make love to you

>doesn't have BDD
>is trying to pass as the member of the opposite gender
So you're one of those autogynephiliacs I've heard so much about

are you cute?

i don't understand this at all and it never came in my readings. was does it have to do with insulin and diabetes? how is it killing you?

lol :)

no.

very cute yeah

omg i can't string together a sentence today. sorry for the errors :/

no you should not take them

they have zero impact on muscle growth or strength. their only effect is that it takes you slightly longer to fatigue during aerobic training so only take them when you are a competitive marathon runner but not when you do weightlifting

use that money to buy supplements which actually have benefits for you

okay. which supplements would best benefit me, then?

a lot of people in a facebook fitness group i'm in are talking about BCAAs which is why i made this thread. they seem to love that stuff idk

I take BCAA'S, but their only use is a very specific purpose, and that's keeping you from going catabolic while training fasted.

There's no other reason to take them, and there's no reason to train fasted. I'm only doing so because I'm on DNP + Yohimbine because getting to 8% is a pain in the ass to do quickly.

8% bodyfat?

is that you in the pic.

QTDDTOT. You dont get a special treatment because you are a degenerate attention-whoring faggot.

then your facebook fitness group is fucking retarded and bases their opinions on broscience instead of actual scientific data

number one of course is creatine. so you are actually retarded enough to be a vegan? I expect that you already take creatine but if not you should immediately start. only natural source for creatine is meat and deficiency can lead to more fatique and even decreased brain performance. so every fucktarded vegan shit should take creatine no matter whether they lift

apart from that you have to look at your diet, what you lack. maybe use your tiny vegan brain to figure that out. I personally take vit d, omega 3, occasionally magnesium, HMB during cuts and the only good multivitamin I have found

also let me redact my statement on taking BCAAs when you are a marathon runner. I was wrong:
>In regards to the anti-fatigue effects, it is highly plausible that this will only apply to untrained or lightly trained persons doing prolonged exercise. There does appear to be a difference between trained and untrained persons, and perhaps this is due to less tolerance to exercise-induced sedation (fatigue tends to set in earlier in newbies, so an anti-fatigue effect is going to affect them more)

HMB is the supplement foro cutting. do you have any evidence for BCAAs helping as you described?

Wouldn't the insulin response from the BCAAs defeat the entire purpose of taking the Y?

yea me in pic. Less glycogen depleted here.

Whey Protein for the sake of convenience, proper diet and Vitamin D if you're deficient as you probably are.

Yep, hence why I do the workout, which takes 1.5 hours and the bcaa is gone, then take the yohimbine which kicks in nice and fast and do cardio

Yeah I'll get the studies. HMB I don't rate since all the studies are funded by shills

>helping out a mentally ill skinny tranny
this board has gone down

>HMB I don't rate since all the studies are funded by shills
please tell me more about your thoughts on HMB

didn't even know creatine was a thing i should be eating. what does it do? is it just a specific protein?

and whey is not vegan obviously. is hemp a good alternative?

Greg summarised arised it better than me

strongerbyscience.com/hmb/

Yes, that or pea is fine

Creatine creates more ATP. ATP is what your body uses when training

no. creatine is not a protein

>Creatine is a nitrogenous organic acid that occurs naturally in vertebrates. Its main role is to facilitate recycling of adenosine triphosphate (ATP), the energy currency of the cell, primarily in muscle and brain tissue. This is achieved by recycling adenosine diphosphate (ADP) to ATP via donation of phosphate groups. Creatine also acts as a pH buffer in tissues.

examine.com/supplements/creatine/
scroll down to human effect matrix

it is by far the number 1 supplement for natties

I only read the beginning of the article but when it starts with the question whether HMB is more effective than steroids I am deterred already

of course HMB does not even come close to roiding in any way, especially because HMB does not even act anabolic. that's like asking, is vitamin d more effective than steroids just to make vitamin d look bad, especially because it has entirely different purposes

check out fermented bcaa from myprotein. it's vegan.

seems like you have more severe things interfering with your training. that doesn't mitigate the use of BCAAs but if my natty potential was capped at a 2plate squat I wouldn't see the point in taking them even if they got me there faster.

there are basically two uses for BCAAs. the most common is using it as a pre/peri/post-workout meal. BCAAs are ingested and metabolized nearly instantly. they will prevent muscle breakdown during exercise and give some extra fuel for your muscles, but the effect is quite minimal. especially so if you have already eaten a proper meal within 2 hours before working out.

post-workout BCAAs make a lot more sense. after working out, your muscle protein synthesis levels are likely down just cause you haven't eaten for a while. since this is also probably the most useful time for building muscle, getting your protein synthesis levels up fast is very useful. whey, even isolate or hydrolyzed, takes up to one hour to be metabolized. BCAA+simple carbs (malto, dextro, WMS, vitargo) makes for a quite optimal post-workout drink. but the MPS spike from BCAAs only lasts for 60-90 minutes so you need to eat a proper meal after that time.

another use is between meals. since BCAAs are metabolized so quickly, they do not affect the MPS refractory period and can be used to spike MPS when taken ~2 hours after a meal and 60-90 minutes before another meal. layne norton has some good stuff on this and lately, aragon too

you have a really nice body lol.

okay this is very interesting. remember this stuff from general bio. what kind of creatine do you recommend? is this like a powder that tastes blah?

>post-workout BCAAs make a lot more sense. after working out, your muscle protein synthesis levels are likely down just cause you haven't eaten for a while. since this is also probably the most useful time for building muscle, getting your protein synthesis levels up fast is very useful.
sounds like anabolic window bullshit to me

>there is no evidence post-workout nutrition raises muscle protein synthesis, muscle tissue protein breakdown is only an issue when fasting and glycogen does not need to be replenished right away

no it is taste neutral white powder. I take a tea spoon full directly into my mouth and swallow it with water

creatine is creatine so just take the cheapest most available, creatine monohydrate. I buy mine from bulkpowders but you can get it from myprotein or whatever you want. a 1kg bag is enough for almost a year so don't buy too much at once

Is that you, Trappy?

okay cool. a little more research and i'll probably buy some creatine. thanks so much! :)

no i'm not trappy. always wanted to talk to her but people just talk about her. not sure she's even a real person that exists desu

>Very cute yeah

Photographic evidence needed*

where is that quote from? i dont see why post-workout nutrition wouldn't raise protein synthesis

She doesn't exist, they're actually some faggot in Brazil called Rafael.

Only non shit argument here.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4033492/
Read and learn.

okay

people keep saying this but i never know what's true and what's lies. people were saying cheekie was trans too and she was like lol no.

see my other posts adressing BCAAs

also, supplementing BCAAs is inherently pointless when you take whey because the whey already contains those 3 amino acids in large quantities

still a dweeb in pyjamas

are you like following me around or something

Please stop.

whey also contains a lot of other shit so that whey is not metabolized nearly as fast as bcaa.

yeah and I doubt that it matters but if it would this would be an additional benefit for whey

read the other posts dude...

bcaa spikes mps higher than whey. bcaa is also not suppressed by the refractory period and does not affect the refractory period.

>>/qtddtot/
Now fuck off ugly guy with mental illness.

i don't know what this acronym means.

You're hard to look at.
Commit suicide because you're of no use to anyone.

Then go back to r.eddit/tumblr. You don't belong here.

Branched-chain amino acid supplementation is not a "daily dose" concept, it is a means of catabolic resistance and supplementing with it is to stop muscle breakdown. Yes, whey protein contains branch chain amino acids, but they must be digested in the peptides broken for them to be of any use. Non-bonded branch chain amino's skip this step and go directly into the bloodstream.

It's an initialism, not an acronym.

Questions that don't deserve their own thread.

Please stop posting on this website.

I have to say this is one of the better threads Veeky Forums has had in quite a while. Thank you for the stimulating conversation. If. It's not too much trouble, some Panty shots would be awesome, as it is mid afternoon for me and I'd like to get a quick fap in before I take a nap.

>bcaa spikes mps higher than whey
No they don't

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24284442
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19083472

They also impair brain neurotransmitter production and cause insulin resistance in vegans

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19356906
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28145418

> bcaa is also not suppressed by the refractory period and does not affect the refractory period.
In RATS. Layne's MUH RAT STUDIES are not good evidence. Even from your own paper

>It should also be noted that BCAA metabolism in humans and rodents differ and the results from rodent studies with BCAA’s may not translate in human models [175].

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26388782
>The addition of isoleucine and valine (the other branched-chain AAs) does not improve MPS (Churchward-Venne et al., 2014). This response is an underappreciated result considering many supplements contain combinations of the branched-chain AAs, which, based on our data, would not be advantageous to consume co-temporally because they share the same transporter (Hyde et al., 2003). Thus, as we speculated (Churchward-Venne et al., 2014), consumption of crystalline BCAA resulted in competitive antagonism for uptake from the gut and into the muscle and was actually not as effective as leucine alone in stimulating MPS. Despite the popularity of BCAA supplements we find shockingly little evidence for their efficacy in promoting MPS or lean mass gains and would advise the use of intact proteins as opposed to a purified combination of BCAA that appear to antagonize each other in terms of transport both into circulation and likely in to the muscle (Churchward-Venne et al., 2014).

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27175106

i don't get why some people here are so mean. i'm plenty of use to a lot of people. law-abiding productive member of society here so yeah :/

stop posting why? :)

some people have been nice and helpful. i'm gonna get crazy fit with your help and when you see my "after" pics you'll be hella impressed!

oh i don't think i added much to the stimulating conversation going on. i'm just a newbie with questions lol. but there is a lot of good discussion going on! so i'm glad i made the thread :)

since we are talking about supplements here I want to discuss something with you people

BETA-ALANINE

evidence suggests beta alanine has a minor positive effect on lean mass and also significantly increases carnosine which is great

however it competes with taurine and GABA as they use the same transporters. so beta alanine has an effect on the brain. in cats, for which taurine is essential, beta alanine supplementation can lead to taurine deficiency which can cause blindness, brain damage and so on. it also has a negative effect on serotonine? and supplementing taurine to compensate for beta alanine has its own problems since taurine is a depressant

does anyone here have some knowledge about this stuff? impact of beta alanine and maybe taurine on brain health

the brain is the most important body part. I dont want to take a supplement with small results that can potentially cause damage to my brain performance

I would fuck you.
BCAA's are useless,not worth your money.
just lift and eat right,dont spend any money on supplements except creatine/whey if your goal is to gain muscle even tho dont need them.
are you on hrt ?

They're about as useless as preworkout supplements, insofar as if one isn't eating like a complete fucking retard, they'd be supplementing a gap that doesn't exist.

Don't be nice to me when I'm being rude.

>they also impair brain neurotransmitter production
I looked it up and apparently BCAAs lower serotonin

SSRIs are the most common anti depressants and they increase serotonin levels by inhibiting reuptake

this increase in serotonin has been shown to increase neuro and synaptogenesis, basically making your brain ""grow"" and thus healing the brain damage from depression

so basically this goes hand in hand with this post here

does beta alanine or even BCAA lead to brain damage, pretty much the reverse effect of SSRIs?

this shit is so fucking complex and I am absolutely illiterate in biochemistry and neurology

so can that shit actually lead to brain damage or am I reading too much into this?

my goal is to get an ass and nice legs. does this mean muscle++?

yeah i'm on hrt

lol what

>i don't get why some people here are so mean

You're a vegan, a crossdresser, and a tripfag. All you need now is to use avatars and you're the perfect attention whore.

Trust me, this isn't your kind of place.

can you kill yourself you humongous faggot holy shit leave this fucking website you special snowflake syndrome ticking timebomb who can't go off soon enough

bby I can fill you up with protein

yeah you really look like a vegan

I suppose your testosterone levels are pretty low so you wont put on much muscle no matter how hard you try,using BCAA wont effect it at all.
dont waste your money on supplements,work your lower body hard + cardio.
thats it.

>ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24284442
i dont see pure bcaa ingested. 6g whey might be enough to nullify the benefit of bcaa.
>ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19083472
EAAs, not BCAAs

>In RATS. Layne's MUH RAT STUDIES are not good evidence. Even from your own paper
doesn't mean he's wrong. as said, more studies are needed.

>isoleucine and valine have been shown to compete with the same uptake mechanism as leucine if taken together.
"This doesn't matter at all, especially considering that in order to metabolize leucine you need 1 valine and 1 isoleucine each. In fact, if there is a lack of either of these, metabolism of leucine will drop."


reddit.com/r/bodybuilding/comments/5o4g2z/data_does_not_support_a_benefit_to_bcaa/

okay. i guess i'll go with this for now, since it's being suggested here and is also the cheapest option. thanks :)

>productive member of society
What do you do besides full time narcissism?

Get a new face and voice and shrink your man hands while you're at it, faggot.

okay. maybe i should pull back a little with the provocative posts and images. sorry if they bothered you :/

really i'm here to get fit and nothing else. and i work full time and go to school, as a lot of people here i'm sure do.

vocaroo.com/i/s0S0q0SBcWHw

your voice is ugly

okay this is downright silly now. please keep posting about bcaas guys but i'm gonna go exercise and clean now lol

Not having grown up a real girl you will never get the inflections and mannerisms correct, and you will always give off a tranny vibe. You should stop posting here and head over to Veeky Forums because you're just role-playing.

>6g whey might be enough to nullify the benefit of bcaa.
Yea and Russell's teapot might exist seeing that whey alone gave the greatest response. What evidence do you have to suggest this?

>EAAs, not BCAAs
BCAAs are EAAs and you need all of them to sustain MPS

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3424729/

>doesn't mean he's wrong. as said, more studies are needed.
Do you even science... every study ever says that more studies are needed. Good job admitting your previous claim
>bcaa spikes mps higher than whey. bcaa is also not suppressed by the refractory period and does not affect the refractory period.
is absolutely baseless however.

>"This doesn't matter at all, especially considering that in order to metabolize leucine you need 1 valine and 1 isoleucine each. In fact, if there is a lack of either of these, metabolism of leucine will drop."
Using reddit as a source? My sides are no longer natty. Easily disproved broscience

genome.jp/kegg-bin/show_pathway?org_name=hsa&mapno=00280&mapscale=&show_description=hide

Does your name start with "k"?

>mfw recognized someone irl on fit

> over 50g of high quality protein per 100g
> nature's BCAA + higher digestibility than even beef protein
> lots of chromium (very important for insulin regulation)
> lots of B complex vitamins
> ideal daily iron dosage per 100g
> adequate selenium supply
> cheap as fuck in bulk powder (costs 1/3 of whey powder)

>What evidence do you have to suggest this?
nothing, that's why I said "might".
>BCAAs are EAAs and you need all of them to sustain MPS
only for longer periods. no one's telling you to replace your meals with BCAAs.
>is absolutely baseless however.
sorry i dont keep studies available in a text file to argue on anonymous imageboards

your own links agree with the refractory period shit. BCAAs bypassing liver metabolism is basic stuff
>Using reddit as a source
that quote is from jordan feigenbaum.

i linked to reddit cause i couldn't bother copypasting those comments here and pretending they were mine. anyway, attack the argument not the author, dude.

>genome.jp/kegg-bin/show_pathway?org_name=hsa&mapno=00280&mapscale=&show_description=hide
sorry, i dont understand that.

>only for longer periods.
Where are you getting this from?

>your own links agree with the refractory period shit. BCAAs bypassing liver metabolism is basic stuff
The existence of a refractory period is not evidence that BCAAs overcome it or that they provide higher rates of MPS than whey.

>anyway, attack the argument not the author, dude.
Not seeing any argument but pretty ironic coming from the guy using an appeal to authority,

>sorry, i dont understand that.
You go through a series of enzymes (BCAT, BCKDH, DBT, IVD, MCC, AUH, HMGCL) that give acetyl-CoA to the TCA cycle. No valine or isoleucine required.

If you want to get fuck go the fuck somewhere else. Veeky Forums isn't for attention whore trannys.

no one's talking about that anymore friend. this is bcaa thread; stop making offtopic posts.

please :)

I'd imagine it isn't beneficial but the effect size couldn't be very large, else we'd be hearing many negative anecdotes given how long they've been on the market. I can't find any long-term safety data in humans to back that up though so long-term compensation remains a possibility.

Brain cells seem partially reliant on peripheral synthesis for taurine
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8915400

There's some speculation here that BCAAs could increase the risk of ALS but it's confounded by steroids, microconcussions from head bumping etc
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20832409

To be on the safe side, maybe stick with complete proteins for BCAAs or increase intake of other amino acids to compensate and consume beta-alanine during the day with an isomolar amount of taurine at night, since spacing the doses a few hours apart should be enough to avoid interaction in the blood and before significant intracellular depletion of either can happen
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22331997
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16554972

Caffeine might also counteract some of the depressant effects
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22819803

>no i don't suffer from mental illnes

I don't care. Bring your stupid questions to /qtddtot/ and take of your trip you mentally ill narcissist. You don't matter as an individual.

lrn2sage
you're complaining about this shit thread but keeping it alive as well